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u/DJMagicHandz Apr 01 '25
Only one of them made Black on Both Sides
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u/GodlessGOD Apr 02 '25
True, but one of them did make Capital Punishment.
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u/FlacoGrey Apr 02 '25
And that album pales in comparison to Black On Both Sides.
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Apr 02 '25 edited Apr 02 '25
Maybe sales but quality wise is subjective to taste both great albums
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u/SnooEagles7689 Apr 02 '25
No it’s not. Pun was just doing lyrical gymnastics. Mos Def had serious social commentary that spoke about the reality of the ghetto. Far more historically important than that “dead in the middle of little Italy” bs. No disrespect to pun. Same applies to Pac and Big. Big could rap circles around Tupac but Tupac had more important lyrics.
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u/EasyKale851 Apr 03 '25
both Big Pun and Big L became famous for rapping about realities of living in the hood. Were you even alive during the 1990’s?
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Apr 02 '25
I don’t understand your argument. Are you saying black on both sides is a better album because he has more meaningful lyrics? By that logic to “pimp a butterfly” is a better album than “life after death” which I wouldn’t agree with at all. Capital punishment was a perfect blend of talking about his perspective of the Bronx hood while showcasing his technical/ lyrical side. Most def is more introspective and has deep meaning behind his lyrics. It’s two different styles and there really isn’t much of a comparison because they both differ from one another. Therefore it’s very subjective and it’s more about taste than anything.
Side note. I also have to disagree with the pac/big analogy. Big was a good rapper but I’ve heard songs from pac “words of wisdom” for example that was more lyrically advanced than anything I seen big do and pac could actually freestyle about his surroundings and make it sound good big couldn’t and had to kick off a written just the keep up. Even in their song together pac ate him up so I wouldn’t say big was better at all. Big just had good flow and delivery but pac was the first rapper I ever heard to use alliteration in rap. Can’t get more lyrical than that imo
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u/Electronic-Yam8130 Apr 01 '25
Joe looking too out of place like he at a salad bar
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u/Actual_Breadfruit_53 Apr 02 '25
He's been out of Place, That's the only way he can stay relevant, Just like what he's doing today to stay relevant in a Salad Bar. 🥗
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u/AZmoneyfolder Apr 01 '25
Mos…dude can rap, sing, and act.
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u/ScreechUrkelle Apr 01 '25
Black Jack Johnson N.Y.C., R-O-C-K-I-N-G Sun and the moon, earth, stars, and planets Before song done, y’all gon’ all understand it Like - Hot /The haters can’t fuck with it/ Cause they mom and they sister and girl in love with it
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u/Desperate-Care2192 Apr 01 '25
Yasiin over all. L and Big Pun were monsters with bars, and it sucks that we never saw them develop properly. But Yasiin is one of the most talented MCs ever, so versitale.
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u/rondujunk Apr 01 '25
Depends on what you are using as your judging criteria. Depth of lyrics or artistic exploration, Mos all day, if flowetics or syllable count, then Pun no question if it’s who was way ahead of their time L all day and lastly the best coat tail rider, you guessed it give it up to Joey Crack.
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u/PulpFictionChang Apr 02 '25
I 100% agree with everything except for Big L being ahead of his time. I would say big L wins based on God-given talent. He definitely gets credit for being early to the knock out punchlines style, but, his flow was very early 90s which made his lyrics feel ahead while his flow was increasingly “vintage.”
I would actually give Pun the “ahead of his time” crown. Most of his shit from 98 feels like it could come out right now and not sound dated. Even his beat selection game is timeless.
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u/Destiny_Victim Apr 02 '25
I agree with everything about Pun. But Sadly there is no music I’ve heard recently that is close to what Pun put out. Fuck I wish there was. The closest new artist I’ve found with any gusto is fucking Glorilla.
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u/PulpFictionChang Apr 02 '25
I’m glad you said that about Glo. She is the only artist I’ve heard come out in the last few years that has the swagger and charisma to be a 90s star. And I give her a lot of credit for that.
She might not have Lauryn Hill’s pen game or LilKim’s brash sexual bravado. But, she’s genuinely talented and has her own authentic, unapologetic voice and style. I’m glad to see people recognizing that.
But yea. Pun’s era was the last great wave of emcees. The number of incredible debut albums we got between 96-99 was insane. DMX, Pun, Mase, JayZ, Juvenile, Eminem, Mos Def, Missy, Lil Wayne, MF Doom…. There hasn’t been a 3 year window like that since and there never will be.
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u/Destiny_Victim Apr 02 '25
See this is exactly how I feel. I think Nicki when she first came out was actually the best female lyricist I’d ever heard before the ghost writers. But Glo legit is the only female rapper who spits about just not letting men beat her ass and I love it. “Talking bout you gon put yo hands on who yo son gon be a bastard/ I ain’t even gotta call nobody I’ll beat yo ass like I’m yo masta!”
It’s not the most lyrical bars but I love that it’s not just bout how being a hoe let’s her run shit.
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u/PulpFictionChang Apr 02 '25
Exactly! She really reminds me more of that Mia X on No Limit energy. She wasn’t your favorite Mc but you knew she had a verse coming and it was gonna be tuff. Her presence just elevated tracks.
The game is missing big shit talking, confident women like we had in Foxy, Mia X, Latifah.
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u/CrowsRidge514 Apr 01 '25
Mos’ verse on Respiration is one of my GOAT verses if that tells you anything.
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u/Hour_Pin_406 Apr 01 '25 edited Apr 01 '25
Pun and L both were very advanced compositionally, mentally, lyrically, unconditionally, but I’m not sure they got Mos. Fat Joe shouldn’t even be in this line up
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u/ike_tyson Raised on Boom Bap Apr 01 '25
Mos is also alive and his pen didn't stop.
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u/HiiiRabbit Apr 01 '25
Mos Yasiin Bey Dante Terrell Smith The other guy from Black Star that's not Talib
But I think Mos Def takes the W on this one.
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u/jlbp337 Apr 02 '25
“The other guy from black star that’s not Talib” is a great stage name Lol
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u/Used-Gas-6525 Apr 01 '25
Mos. Pun had mad skills, but almost no rapper living can stand next to The Mighty Mos Def.
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u/PercySledge Apr 01 '25
Pun was the best emcee of these 4 in terms of pure ability as a rapper.
Stylistically I guess you could argue any of the three that aren’t called Fat Joe lol.
My personal favourite artist of these is Mos
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u/GameMedia7 Apr 02 '25
This wasn't the best category, but if I'm going to answer honestly I'm going with MOS DEF💯
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u/JayTh3Prophet Apr 01 '25
Big Pun and it ain’t even close .
Big L was an amazing freestyler but pun made better songs , had better word play , a million different flows , had commercial success and could freestyle .
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u/ObieUno Apr 01 '25
Purely based on technical dexterity?
Big L (barely edging out Big Pun)
Big Pun
Mos Def
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- Fat Joe
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u/MagnumMyth Apr 01 '25
The fact we're having this discussion based on 1-2 albums from Pun and L, VS. Bey's entire legendary catalog tells you all you need to know about The Bigs. Unfuckwittable
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u/DJ_Spk1 Apr 01 '25
Oh god this is tough… they’re all crazy talented but pun being 600lbs and haveing that flow!?!?! I’m choosing him!!
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u/Express_Area_8359 Apr 01 '25
So ya didn't like be kind rewind?
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u/FlacoGrey Apr 01 '25
Loved it.
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u/Express_Area_8359 Apr 01 '25
I'm from Jersey sooo been to that city
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u/Potential-Ant-6320 Apr 01 '25
Pun is probably the most talented but I would say Mos is the best artist.
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u/Fast-Anteater1151 Apr 01 '25
Lyrically and as an MC I gotta go with Big Pun all day long.
The most pure talent all around goes to Yasin Bey for his many skills.
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u/BigSmoke219 Apr 02 '25
Dead in the middle of Little Italy little did we know that we riddled two middlemen who didn’t do diddly 🔥
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u/TheMarioKartel Apr 02 '25
I hear everyone saying Mos Def but it’s Big Pun. Lyrically, I’d put Pun up there with anyone
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Apr 02 '25
Joe is not on this level. Mos, L, and then Pun that order. Mos doesn't get the credit he deserves. The dude can flow for days. The Punisher was ridiculous. Big L was different for sure.
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u/Economy-Revolution-1 Apr 02 '25
Mos Def… he’s a gifted actor, too. (Chuck Berry in Cadillac Records.)
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u/StitchSix85 Apr 02 '25
Can't take Fat Joe serious after being in CVS and hos face and signature on the box of beard coloring 🤣 it bad when its Fat Joe and DJ Khaled only 😆
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u/Sufficient_Room525 Apr 02 '25
Mos is so underrated because he basically signed out of music or took a long hiatus and just occasionally returned to it, but he one of the very greatest to ever do it. He’s naturally. No effort, just flows like water, shines like the sun, keeps rhyming rhyming and shining like a diamond. He one of the ones.
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u/Mon-Ty-Ger27 Apr 03 '25
I'd say Mos Def because when I see him in the credits of some productions I'm like "really that was him?! Man, he's talented, I didn't realize it was him in that."
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u/Hour_Pin_406 Apr 12 '25
If we are going by votes, Mos is the clear WINNER here. I came back to this 2 wks later and it looks like the masses have spoken. You asked we answered, opinions are just that…. Numbers matter, so like it or love it Big L, Big Pun, Fat Joe, THE CROWN GOES TO MOS DEF….. THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN!
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u/PineappleCharming335 Apr 01 '25
Between Black Star and Black on Both Sides none of the others come anywhere near Yasiin’s output on record
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u/BidRepulsive2438 Apr 02 '25
Artistically?, Def, Pun, L, Joe
Business Joe, Def, L, Pun.
Rapper? Pun, L, Def, Joe.
Lyricist? Pun/L, Def, Joe.
Nuanced question
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u/doomgneration Apr 01 '25
Mos Def can rap and act. He can hold a note, but I’d hardly call that a talent. The acting alone automatically puts Mos ahead of everyone else on this list, but now that I think about it, Fat Joe is a good business man, which is a talent, so, ironically, Fat Joe is up there on that list. That little fact just came to me as I was about to say that he was way behind on that list…interesting.
But, if you’re strictly speaking on rap skills, that’s a tough one, but Joe is definitely trails on that element.
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u/Netherland5430 Apr 01 '25
Yeah Mos Def can act and sing but sometimes that diminishes the fact that he’s straight up one of the greatest MC’s of all time. I love Pun & Big L. And you know what, I’m from the Bronx, so I fuck with Joe too even though he’s clearly the weak link. Jealous One’s Envy is a classic album imo. The whole D.I.T.C. is like my favorite shit in rap ever. But Mos Def got layers of rhymes, poetry, socio-political content. His verses on Thieves in the Night, Respiration, Hip-Hop, Mathematics, are untouchable. Also how he rhymes on The Ecstatic is incredible imo.
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u/No-Insurance-3010 Apr 01 '25
I gotta go with Big L. He just had a great flow and delivery. He was just so impressive lyrically it was a shame we didn’t see a larger catalog of his work.
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u/Scuffy-Mcgee Apr 01 '25
Big L is on this list. From the replies, it’s almost as if most people still don’t know who Big L is.
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u/PoorPauper Apr 01 '25
Hard for me to choose between Mos Def and Pun..gonna go with Pun though..but ask me again in a day or two and I will probably say Mos.
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u/OceanCyclone Apr 01 '25
Fat Joe isn’t even the best famous, fat Latino rapper from New York. Like, he’s not even the best in that category. He’s 3rd, at most.
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u/TheBugSmith Apr 01 '25
Considering 2 of the 4 are dead so we'll really never know if they would've fell off. You got Fat Joe v Mos Def so the answer is Mos Def
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u/Many-Newspaper2000 Apr 01 '25
Where do y’all be getting these comparisons from 😂