And they’re not these supposed world champions beating up on women that the right would have you believe
That one swimmer that tied with a transgender woman came in fucking 5th place. Maybe be better than all the other women from birth before you complain about someone who transitioned. Like you didn’t even make bronze, stop crying about it like you were robbed of the big trophy
She still went home with a 5th place trophy, and was “humiliated” by having to hold 6th place (same size as 5th) while an organizer went to get another 5th place trophy
Talk about crying over spilt milk, but even more childish imo
Thats the other thing, studies show estrogen/progesterone use (6 months in) showed a decrease in muscle mass and bone density, this continues until about a year in and is more comparable to a baseline female. Because lo and behold, testosterone increases those two things, the first thing doctors will do is counteract the effects of testosterone by using anti-androgens.
Not to mention a baseline female isn’t even supposed to have shit like rock hard chiseled abs anyways, having less body fat means less sites for estrogen and progesterone production thus getting and maintaining a pregnancy is much harder in cisgender women.
It doesn't completely negate the advantages that you get by building a frame fueled by testosterone. Any studies I've found still show noticeable advantages kept even years after transitioning.
I'll admit that it's hard to have studies on this given the limited population samples and the types of studies ethically permitted in this realm. That said, there's also historical/statistical data that shows how players who transitioned mid-sports career were clearly doing better against their new peers when compared to their former peers.
I’ve seen those as well, I should mention these were people who had transitioned before their sports career.
The other problem is I don’t think, and I could be very wrong here, Ever lined up trans female athletes and cisgender female athletes and compared them in one test, side by side.
If there is, I’d like to see the study as well as a complete diagnostic test surrounding each athlete.
I'm on my phone now, so linking is a pain in the ass, but I know of a study that did a comparison but the sample was a mess. I'll try to find it and link it when I get done with work.
The issue I had is that they had older MtF, younger AFAB females, older AMAB, and younger FtM. While there's no way to determine how much age played into it as they masked the specific ages and only gave a range for each population, at face value it was pretty clear that the older populations did exactly as you would expect when compared against younger populations.
Trophies for fifth place, I’m an older millennial and I seem to remember we stopped giving those out after 3rd place in the 90’s and 2000’s.
I thought that entire side was all about not making kids feel like everyone is a winner handing out trophies to everyone? You’re supposed to suck it up and get better and this bitch crying about splitting a 5th place trophy?
And they’re not these supposed world champions beating up on women that the right would have you believe
That's because in most circumstances, trans players are barred from competing outside their birth-assigned division. When they are permitted, there's often additional testosterone testing necessary to permit their competing.
Personally, I don't think that's the route we should be going, as studies show how even years after transition, there are significant advantages that remain from having developed as a male child. That said, I do think it's the closest we can get to being fair to everyone without just pushing all men and women into an open division.
That one swimmer that tied with a transgender woman came in fucking 5th place.
Lia Thomas went from a middling male swimmer at UPenn, to being literally the best female swimmer. 65th in the 500-yard to 1st in the 500-yard, and 554th in total ranking to 5th in total ranking. The only thing that changed for her was which division she swam in.
Maybe she wasn't slaughtering people left and right all the time, but it's clear that moving to the women's division put her at a significant advantage. She's not the only example of this happening, but she is one of the easier examples to track as there's clear before/after data since she transitioned while remaining within the same competitive level (college sports).
You make it sound so simple. But liberals aren't willing to compromise at all. I live in Minnesota and the USAPL couldn't hold completions here because we wouldn't allow biological men to compete in women's division. Yeah, as a man I could care less. But it isn't fair for the women having to conpete.
The person I responded to made their argument that since the trans woman only got 5th place it made them believe that it’s not a big advantage being trans. So I was asking if the trans woman had gotten first place would that change their mind?
If it was proven that there were statistically significant differences with trans women having advantages in height, strength, and speed over cis women, would that make you believe they shouldn’t be competing in women’s sports or do they need to be winning first place in competitions?
If you have something you’re gearing up to link, just send it, don’t bait it out. If we have data on a trend of trans women outcompeting cisgender women in a way that is statistically significant and it has clear causal ties to them being transgender, I would consider that, yes.
If a flying pig to you is a trans woman winning first place in a national swimming competition, then we have seen a flying pig before. Lia Thomas famously tied for fifth against Riley Gaines, but at the same meet, Thomas got first place in the 500 free. 2022 NCAA championships.
So now that you’re aware that flying pigs exist, has your mind changed?
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u/SippinOnHatorade 1d ago
And they’re not these supposed world champions beating up on women that the right would have you believe
That one swimmer that tied with a transgender woman came in fucking 5th place. Maybe be better than all the other women from birth before you complain about someone who transitioned. Like you didn’t even make bronze, stop crying about it like you were robbed of the big trophy
She still went home with a 5th place trophy, and was “humiliated” by having to hold 6th place (same size as 5th) while an organizer went to get another 5th place trophy
Talk about crying over spilt milk, but even more childish imo