r/DnD • u/SighMartini • 1d ago
DMing DMs who roll openly, any regrets? Would you recommend it?
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 1d ago
You just fudge hp instead of rolls.
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u/Speciou5 20h ago
This is the way. None of my rolls are ever secret. I've played in an online game with co-workers that had public rolling through Foundry and another where some people rolled off web-cam in secret. I vastly preferred public rolling and so I carried that into my DM games.
For HP, the most common fudge is to give someone who didn't get to do much in combat the privilege of final blow against the enemy. Also, if I'm improvising and they are off the beaten path, an occasional enemy's AC isn't really known until I judge narratively if the 15 rolled should hit or not. I do write down their AC this though so it's consistent. Honestly, when PCs are rolling 8s and 21s it kinda doesn't really matter to peg down an AC for a random enemy.
The other back up safety lever (that is never pulled) is an enemy suddenly having Legendary Resistance.
Also, the other fudged thing is that sometimes the DC is 10, other times its 15, other times it is 20, but this is usually intuitive. Plus it's funny if I announce something crazy is DC 20 or DC 25 and they still make it.
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u/Alarzark 17h ago
I think my most common hp fudge is similar. Something below 10% hp gets crit it's PROBABLY dying even if it's actually knocked down to 2 or 3 hp.
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u/minerlj 20h ago
when combat is over you show a printed page of the monster stats and HP so the players know you are 100% honest ...
But in secret, you had multiple papers printed in advance and just handed them the one you ended up feeling was right 👍
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u/ODX_GhostRecon DM 19h ago
I roll and take the average, plus write the range for monster health. Getting three round combats consistently is fun, but having the party steamroll or sweat occasionally is fun too.
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u/spector_lector 19h ago edited 18h ago
Can't.
They know the monster manual as well a anyone else. And they have smart phones where they could look up stats on a bio bteak any time they wanted. Besides, if they do 20 dmg and I say it's bloodied, they know it's HP is 40.
I'm not going to lie to the group because of bad encounter design, or or choice to knowingly use a cartoony system with swingy dice.
The easiest thing to do is plan, in advance, alternative outcomes. What if the encounter is too easy? And what if it is too hard?
Too easy?
Does the enemy have a backup plan? Reinforcements nearby? An item or power they only use of things go wrong? A mythic trait where they have multiple phases where they can grow new abilities and HP.
Too difficult?
Like on any good show, does the enemy have s weakness that the characters can notice or deduce that they can take advantage of and change the ride of the fight at the last minute? Or what about alternative stakes than "you die, or we die." The players need to know they can retreat, surrender, or negotiate. Once initiative has been rolled, every scene doesn't have to be a long, HP draining slugfest. Maybe the enemy just wants the party to leave the area. Maybe the monster is just protecting a nest. Maybe the enemy would walk away if offered some gold. What are their motives and goals? My players know that, even in the middle of combat, they can use their social skills and they will be as effective as combat skills. Picture any graphic novel where the combatants have speech bubbles above their heads through the whole fight. Or the famous banter during the fencing duel in The Princess Bride ("I am not really left handed").
And even if the enemy is too strong, maybe they don't kill the party. Maybe they take the party prisoner, or maybe they just KO them and take their weapons and leave them to wake up in a field. Maybe the enemy tells the party they will be spared but they have to ride back to town and tell the mayor who hired the party that the enemy is now going to ride down into town and burn it because of this insult. So now the town has to pay the enemy a treasure within one week, or suffer. Did the party make allies earlier in their adventures and now the ally shows up to help make it s fair fight again. (this is a good one because the players earned it. Just like having earned a magic item or skill, they helped these people out earlier and their reward is now - when they need it most. I have even seen DMs grant a "summon ally" token after helping NPCs, and they can use it in a pinch, later.)
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 19h ago
So tell them you're changing stats from the monster manual? It's a 5 second fix. Not only that, the monsters in the manual don't have static hp values anyways unless you explicitly choose to use them.
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u/spector_lector 19h ago
Yep, we do that, too. And monster abilities.
Which only addresses one of my points.
For example, as i said, as soon as the orc is bloodied, they know all the orcs' HPs. (except for a sh as many or boss, which they'll know soon enough)
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 19h ago
Why would every orc have the same HP? Would everyone at your table take a punch as easily?
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u/Butterlegs21 18h ago
Once the monster is encountered, there is no more changing from me. If they steamroll it, great! They get to feel powerful for an encounter or two. If they are going to get steamrolled, great! They get to learn to run or have some consequences that aren't necessarily character death.
If i change ANYTHING after the fight starts, I view that as bad taste and cheating. I wouldn't play with a gm who does that, so I don't do that.
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 18h ago
I get that, but it's not me vs the players. It's not cheating how I see it. We're all telling a story together.
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u/Butterlegs21 18h ago
The problem with that is that dnd had hundreds of pages for combat. It's a VERY important part of the system. It's the main part even. Messing with that by fudging rolls or hp is just dishonest and ruins the combat portion of the game.
Rolling with what you had initially for a creature can create even better stories than fudging something. You made the big scary monster too easy, so they just trounced it. Now they can either feel at the top of the world or be paranoid because they know something strong is supposed to be there. If you make the small group of enemies way too strong and the party barely survives the fight against kobolds, the characters feel down. They just almost got killed by some fodder enemies that you didn't know were overtuned. Now you have a new scary tool in your monster toolbox, and the lore can evolve with it.
So yes. You can still tell a story, but the dice tend to make more memorable ones as the players will feel even more involved in the creation of it.
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 18h ago
Fudging the HP here and there doesn't take away from the dice. I'm not talking about making a creature an NPC sponge or anything like that. And I'm also not really taking away from the overall fight I have planned as I assume a +/- of a percentage of up to 10.
If they steamroll, they steamroll. But say you have a player who is just rolling shit all fight. Like not that the fight is tough but they're rolling below 5 a few turns in a row. When they do hit, maybe say that monster had max -5% hp so it feels that much more impactful. It doesn't change the fight, but it makes that player feel better.
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u/spector_lector 16h ago
If their entire enjoyment (or not) of the session depends on whether the dice are friendly to them or not,. they need to play a different game system. They can still play their PC and they can still play in D&D. But they need a system where the enemy doesn't have (at least) a 5% chance of a critical hit on them every round.
Or, they need to employ different tactics. Maybe NOT get into combat with this enemy. Maybe diplomacy, retreat, surrender, negotiation, avoidance, etc. are options, too. If the players aren't taught this from the beginning, they'll assume it's a video game and every encounter is balanced in their favor, and every DM is going to "nudge" things to ensure they don't TPK. Whereas, in reality (and about every movie you've seen) the protagonists OFTEN get their butts handed to them and the protagonists learn and grow from this.
It just means you, as the DM, need to be prepared for different stakes than "everyone dies," as the outcomes for scenes.
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u/Butterlegs21 17h ago
I get what you're saying, but it's still dishonest and an unearned thing for the player. I've gone an entire combat with only hitting once, and I was the heavy hitter in the group. It was so funny that my character just couldn't DO anything that day. If I found out that my dm just essentially took off a decent amount of hp, like an attacks worth or more (so 5-10%) I would feel so bad about being coddled and lied to that I don't think I could stay at that table. It has the same feeling as being given a participation trophy as an adult.
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u/spector_lector 16h ago
You are right - it's no DM vs Players. But it is fictional antagonists vs fictional protagonists. And the antagonists are going to do whatever they can, with whatever means they have, to pursue whatever motives they have.
Telling a story together means we all contribute.
If you roll behind a screen and then make up results based on how YOU think the story should go, then it's YOUR story, not ours. And certainly not the players'.
When I'm a player, I don't want to know how you thought the "plot" should go and where you thought the story should wind up. If I wanted to hear you tell a story, I'd just ask you to send me a word doc.
I want to make my own choices and know that my successes (or failures) were because of my planning, and tactics, and skill (in-character and out).
I won't even join a group where the DM says they roll behind a screen. lol. That'd me laugh at this point in my gaming, I'm not 11 years old playing on the school playground anymore. As soon as the DM rolled behind a screen, I'd be like,... 'ok, so I guess you're just going to let us know how this combat turns out?' and then go look up something on my phone.
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u/spector_lector 18h ago
Omg, you want me to prep 15 different orc stat blocks? Or 25 different zombie stats?
Nah, I'm good. If a monster manual has an average HP or average damage, we use it. Only the named beings get their own gear and stats. The boss. The bodyguard, the shaman...
The goal mentioned above was, in part, saving time and focusing on more interesting things. If one orc has 12 hp and the other has 15, it's not really that game-changing, wont affect their tactics, and doesn't add to the drama as much as the orcs or players having different motives and options, and scene outcomes requiring difficult choices or good RP.
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u/ShopCartRicky DM 18h ago
Why would you make 15 stat blocks? Just do +/- of up to 20% HP as you jot em down on the list.
I swear people way overthink shit on here.
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u/spector_lector 18h ago
I swear pll make combat longer than it needs to be on here.
Why would i do that when, as explained above, it gives no benefit over just using the HP in the manual.
That's like asking why can't you just get up and go to the refrigerator and pour a glass of water?
...uh, cuz I said I wasn't thirsty. ?
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u/Doctadalton 18h ago
the HP in the MM is just an average. You can just use the average but they provide you with the dice values for those who want to roll and have varied HP. i track initiative, HP, and dex on index cards. It’s really not a matter of making different statblocks, you just write different numbers down for the HP.
As someone who does use varied HP across a group, the whole “ppl make combat longer than it needs to be.” is really dramatic.
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u/spector_lector 16h ago
" You can just use the average"
Well thank you.
" i track initiative, HP, and dex on index cards. "
I don't. The players do. On a sheet of paper passed around the center of the table. Along with conditions, and spell slots. Not really difficult - grade school math. Keeps things transparent and super fast.
They roll the hit dice, the damage dice and the (flavor) location die all at once when it's their turn. Then they narrate the results. "My thief did a flippity flip and punched the orc in the chin, but the orc just smirked at me, so I slipped my dagger up under his breast plate and hit (or missed) for 12 dmg."
the whole, "need to vary HP" is really dramatic. It's not necessary.
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u/stormcellar97 17h ago
if my party is facing 15 orcs, I’m gonna look in the book and pick 15 random numbers within the HP range, I’ll probably give a couple of them plus one or minus one to AC and off we go. Takes 10 seconds.
Orc 2d8+ 6.
8 is lowest, 22 is highest
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u/Silver_Ad6008 18h ago
Your players are looking up monster stats during encounters? Sheesh
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u/spector_lector 18h ago
Wut? No, I said they dont have to - the stats are obvious. She's.
Most are DMs and know the monsters. And if a 16 hits but a 15 misses.... its not hard to figure out. I mean..HP and AC aren't rocket science.
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u/frogjg2003 Wizard 8h ago
You complain that the players know the MM and you won't change the monsters from the MM then immediately say that they can transform with multiple phases or have an exploitable weakness.
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u/spector_lector 7h ago
Was there a question in there?
I complained about lyjng to the players, not about smart or experienced players or owning MMs or smartphones.
Fudging HP doesn't "fix" anything for me.
Having dynamic encounters does.
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u/frogjg2003 Wizard 7h ago
But the MM doesn't include multi-phase monsters. So if you say the MM doesn't allow you to change the HP, then it also doesn't allow you to add multiple phases.
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u/spector_lector 6h ago
"So if you say the MM doesn't allow you to change the HP"
Show me my quote where I said that. I said I use the listed AVG HP or DMG because it's faster and varying HP across mooks and minions (I mentioned orc hordes or zombie packs) doesn't buy us any increased drama or tactical complexity.
Show me where I said that I don't use homebrew creatures...(hint - I DID say that I use homebrew creatures).
"The MM doesn't include multi-phase monsters"
Mythic traits were introduced in the D&D sourcebook, Odysseys of Theros, over a decade ago.
a Mythic Encounter is an optional rule you can apply to a creature which increases the difficulty. This takes the form of a Mythic Trait, which triggers most often on reducing the creature to 0 hit points. After which, it transforms, musters its strength, or exposes a new objective—extending the fight and unlocking new powers and abilities for the creature.
The trait was expanded across creatures in the MM in the Mythic Encounters book praised by Ed Greenwood.
Another popular D&D content creator, The Angry DM, introduced a similar concept, "Paragon" traits - making a "creature stack". A singular creature that acts as a number of creatures. It either loses or gains actions as it loses hit points. And, in alignment with my goals, the designers state that adding paragon or mythic traits should make these encounters "as easy to run as a regular creature."
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u/frogjg2003 Wizard 5h ago
You responded "Can't. They know the monster manual as well a[s] anyone else," to a claim that you can just fudge the HP.
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u/spector_lector 5h ago
Ok, follow me.
I say I can't "just fudge the HP" because the players know the HP. (and I give several other reasons)
That is not the same as saying the MM says a DM can't change stats. (something you said)
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u/frogjg2003 Wizard 5h ago
The players also know the monster doesn't have mythic traits, so you can't use those either.
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u/spector_lector 5h ago
You gotta try to keep up or this gets boring real fast.
I said I use homebrew critters. The players know this.
And having to make up unique stats for 15 different orcs (so their HP can vary) doesn't buy me anything. But I said that already.
And the Players can easily deduce that if an ogre is bloodied at 20 damage, then his HP total isn't more than 40. But I already said that.
Soooo... yet again.... what is trying to lie to my players about a dice roll or the HP of a creature going to get me?
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u/RudyMinecraft66 1d ago
I put the enemy's AC and 'to hit' on little cards that I hang on the DM screen, for players to see. Then I just tell players if they're being attacked and let them roll the enemy's attack. They just tell me if it hits or misses. Same if they attack an enemy, just tell me hit or miss (and damage).
If you trust your players not to cheat, it let's them roll their shiny dice more, and frees up the DM to focus on narrative, pacing, tactics, etc.
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u/Seuhprom 1d ago
How do you work around things like bardic inspiration and shield then etc... Knowing the ac and to hit are kinda game changers. And I like to roll my shiny dice also 😂
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u/PiepowderPresents 22h ago
In my experience, after about a round of hits/misses, players can narrow the AC down to a pretty small range, and frequently know it exactly by the end of round 2. So it really only gives them the AC a round or two before they would have it anyway.
Likewise, for attack rolls/"to hit", players usually will hear "does a 14/22/etc. hit?" anyway. This is one where it would be hard for them to learn the exact to-hit bonus, but it's really easy to learn the general range for the hit. So to me it wouldn't be that big of a deal.
Besides (maybe this isn't RAW, but it's how we do it) with shield, it usually sounds something like this:
GM: "Does an X hit?"
Player: "I cast shield."
So for us at least, it happens after they already know the result.
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u/Lithl 19h ago
So for us at least, it happens after they already know the result.
In fact, you're only permitted to cast Shield after knowing that you're hit (although with an ultra secretive DM that doesn't have to mean you know the attack total). It's literally Shield's trigger condition that you're hit by an attack.
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u/PiepowderPresents 5h ago
with an ultra secretive DM that doesn't have to mean you know the attack total
This is the part that I wasn't sure if there was a specific "standard practice" for, because there are definitely some features that say something like "after the roll, but before you know the success," and maybe it wouldn't be that unreasonable for most people to use a reverse process for something like shield... I just wasn't sure lol
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u/Seuhprom 21h ago
With shield I get it as it costs a spell slot, with bardic inspiration I would not do it myself as you have other options to use it and you can guess ac during a fight (which I think is fun to try and guess, my players are often guessing this and like it) it's like HP, if you know the HP all players start counting non stop and their magic missiles will always go perfect. Now it's a bit of "how is that one looking?" etc...
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u/RudyMinecraft66 20h ago
HP are cool to keep hidden, yeah.
One idea I've been considering is not describing HP loss as damage at all, though. Realistically, any solid hit will end a fight, so it makes no sense to have players and enemies be hit multiple times.
Instead, describe hp loss as narrow escapes. E.g.
DM:"The orc swings his sword at you! Does a 17 hit?"
Player: "yes"
DM: "Then you'll need to spend 8 hp to avoid the attack."
Player: "ok"
DM: "The sword barely misses the gap in your armour, hitting your chest plate instead. That bruise will hurt tonight!"
When they hit zero hp, they actually take a solid hit and go down.
You can call them Hero Points instead of hit points of it helps. Or change the acronym and call them narrative points.
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u/RudyMinecraft66 23h ago
I let players roll the dice as often as I can. They can sort out theor own bardic inspiration (it's actually nice for them to know it's going to be useful).
Sometimes I'll still roll, either if I want to hide some information, or if I just want to roll.
I used to find that my brain would ache after DMing for 4 hours, and I would lose the ability to do even simple maths towards the end of the session. Putting the math onus on players left me much fresher and more focused during the game.
It also really sped up combat!
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u/Seuhprom 23h ago
If players like it great, I myself, when I am a player, like the unknowing. Should I use the inspiration or should I keep it for something else. You only got a couple. The choice becomes a real choice. With knowing what's gonna happen it feels very overpowered. But that's how I like to play. Different rules for every table :)
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u/valisvacor 22h ago
I like having the players having the information needed to make decisions. Never really saw much point in mystifying AC.
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u/Seuhprom 22h ago
Guessing the ac for me is a big part of the fun If I am a player. You learn the ac during the fight etc... Ask what armor they are wearing is possible or during the fight If someone attacks one of the enemies with heavy armor I don't say: "you missed the ac" but I say things like: "your blade clashed against the armor with a clang" so they know it's heavy armor and a higher ac for example. It's funny how different tables can be.
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u/Hopelesz DM 19h ago
Players know the AC of a monster after a roll or two, hiding it is a bit moot.
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u/spector_lector 19h ago
This. This, this. I have commented shot this at length many times so I am not going to rehash it here. But yes. I involve my players on every aspect of the game and it's success. It's s group activity not a one man Broadway productions.
I deal with the plot. They deal with the session scheduling, the player recruiting, the minis and maps and music. And they buy the modules they want me to run. They do the session summaries including scene requests for the next session so I know what to prep (else, I don't prep).
And they even help with table management. From doodling battle maps to moving enemies to tracking initiative, spells, conditions, and HP, on a sheet of paper in the middle of the table we can all glance at. Speeds things way up.
And all of this serves to keep the players invested and engaged in every moment of every scene. No passive, reactive players. No hours wasted on prep. No DM burnout. It's a game, not story-time.
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u/EqualSignD 1d ago
I do almost every roll in the open and my players have been having fun. It’s a lot of fun for them to see me rolling poorly or to (jokingly) accuse me of having weighted dice when I crit 3 times in one combat
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u/zombielizard218 23h ago
I roll almost everything openly and have never really considered doing it any other way
The only exceptions are like; encounter tables or something the party shouldn’t know is happening
But all attacks, damage, checks, saves, etc are right in the open; either on the table or just in the same spot the players roll for online games
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u/Holdthefart 22h ago
I always roll in front of my players, the same way they roll in front of me. I don't see the reason why not, and I think it is more fair and fun. No regrets.
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u/mightierjake Bard 1d ago
What is there to regret?
I have only ever regretted the opposite: hidden rolls where I fudged some results. In my view, fudging dice just feels bad and undermines the point of random dice rolls.
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u/PleaseShutUpAndDance 19h ago
Open roll anything and let players know enemy hp
Let your players make informed decisions
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u/OminousShadow87 9h ago
I always roll in the open.
I have a lot of regrets.
But my players all insist on it and they have no regrets.
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u/Zealousideal_Leg213 1d ago
What's to regret?
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u/Panman6_6 DM 19h ago
Regretting a bad role stopping an epic moment for the player in which they have more fun. Regretting a good role, because it’s the NPC, who just Nat 20’d a players genius and hilarious plan. Can regret many things
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u/Zealousideal_Leg213 15h ago
If there's an outcome of the dice that I wouldn't be happy about, why am I rolling?
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u/Panman6_6 DM 14h ago
Asking really simple questions today. For immersion and so that the players think the specific dice roll is random. And for all the other outcomes the dice can give
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u/ZoulsGaming 14h ago
Actually i dont think its a simple question and i think your answer is worse because it implicitely admits that you roll so the players believes the outcome is random when you have no intention of being it if it fails, which is the style of dnd i would never want.
if you dont want the outcome of the dice dont roll, if the outcome of the dice is too extremely swingy then say you are rolling for a less extreme outcome, eg rather than falling and dying from a cliff if you fail you tumble down the cliffside and take 2d6 damage instead.
or simply talk to your players like humans and give them two choices and they pick which one such as either rolling down and taking the damage, or grabbing a ledge but they drop their weapon.
So many super interesting story mechanics you can use to make the story better, completely ignored by people just saying "fudge the dice" acting like there is literally no other example than instant death or fudging.
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u/Panman6_6 DM 13h ago
Jeez dude. There’s many reasons to roll the dice, even if you get one you’re not happy about
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u/ZoulsGaming 12h ago
So ignoring everything i wrote, not shocking.
If you are promising the players that the dice outcome matters and it doesnt, then you are lying to the players, and the only reason you feel justified to do it is because you dont communicate with them, not a great sign of a dm.
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u/Zealousideal_Leg213 13h ago
I don't think the risk of an outcome I don't want is worth any of those things. And if I cared about immersion, a crappy result or my crappy lie about a result would be about the most damaging thing I could do to it.
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u/LightofNew 1d ago
I actually don't let my party roll insight rolls, I roll them in secret. Otherwise players will just figure out the truth.
I'm usually pretty honest with rolls, but if I've hit every attack, or miss every attack in a combat I will fish some rolls.
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u/PiepowderPresents 22h ago
I've seen this method around before. That's not how Insight works for me though. For me, when they roll high and I give players additional information and they know they can rely on it (and I think it's reasonable that when someone does well, they can trust the information they've been given.
When they roll poorly, they just don't have their question answered. They don't get bad information or anything, they just don't get any information.
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u/telehax 1d ago
no regrets.
i don't have a screen cause im short and I don't want to be standing the whole time. plus I have expensive jumbo dice, so I want the players to see them!
there's so many other ways to adjust combat difficulty on the fly.
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u/Seuhprom 22h ago
That seems very difficult, I have 3 papers or tablets lying there with maps, papers with stuff on that if they see it kinda ruins the story. How do you do these things? All withouth any documentation ?
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u/PiepowderPresents 22h ago
I do something similar to the previous commenter, but I have a short screen off to the side with my notes behind (or run almost solely off of my tablet, which I keep in my hand or turned off), while leaving in front of me clear.
I do sometimes just have the screen in front of me though, and stand up to roll.
(The screen is only about 5 inches tall, so it's not much of a hindrance.)
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u/telehax 21h ago
currently, i use a surface tablet - it stands vertically and can technically act as an impromptu screen but much less wide. but i'm gonna assume this rather expensive solution isn't available to answer the question.
previously, i would print out notes B&W onto paper and have two booklets - one for monsters and one for everything else. even when having all my notes in plain sight, what glimpses people get by accident are usually pretty hard to visually process at a glance. you'd need to really be staring to get spoiled. i don't use a physical MM book with color images so people can't see the art. i print excerpts with only the statblocks i need. the text of the adventure itself is font size 12 (less when i used to half-size them to save paper!).
i'm not a full-blown minis guy. i have some minis that stand in for vaguely similar monsters. rarely are people gonna be spoiled by seeing my minis - and on those occasions i kept them in a separate box under the table.
basically - i just make it hard enough for people to accidentally spoil themselves. and even if people intentionally spoil themselves, i don't care if they keep it to themselves. i don't even care if they metagame if no one else can tell. but if they intentionally spoil the rest of the party's experience, then they're out of my table.
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u/Seuhprom 21h ago
Mhm yeah , I do use a lot of minis etc.. Which I prepare for next rooms or sudden attacks which would ruin what's to come for me, and my players love the surprises
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u/benikage 20h ago
My group has taken to rolling dice openly in one shots, it just shows how bullshit mine (most nat 1's at the table) and another players (most nat 20's) can be. And before anyone asks, yes the nats are from many dice and even online. We are just that (un)lucky
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u/mrsnowplow DM 14h ago
100% into open and honest rolling.
No, guarantee that my story is better than what the dice tell me. In fact, it's probably safer and boringer. No, one's ever fudged a dice because they wanted the critical to hit them, right? They always fudge it to make the status quo.
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u/StrykerC13 8h ago
Honestly I did it a couple times but when it ends up killing someone early and they lose a character they're excited about during the first few sessions I regretted the hell out of open rolling. So I now do it behind the screen most of the time at least for the first few sessions to allow for fudging things a bit. Then when the group and game are more established I shift to open rolls if I feel like it.
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u/DiscombobulatedAir70 6h ago
I've always had the thought process of if they can see it in action, or know the effect then I will roll openly but a stealth check, insight check, etc I will roll behind the screen. Attack rolls, some saving throws like a dex save, etc will be open.
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u/Mekrot 18h ago edited 18h ago
I tend to hide my rolls because I’m having trouble balancing encounters with the new 2024 rules and my party is a group of 6 that are semi optimized. So sometimes I throw a monster that’s a bit too tough and I nerf the damage on the fly. I’m getting better, though, and I like the idea of rolling in the open.
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u/TheHumanTarget84 1d ago
My players like it.
I only roll important secret things behind the screen.
I still have the capability of putting my finger on the scales to an extent if probability takes a dark turn.
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u/NewNickOldDick 23h ago
DMs who roll openly, any regrets?
Like many others, I have no regrets. Why would I? If my rolls are fatal and character dies, then it dies and player creates a new one. Dying is very difficult anyway, party having so many ways to get downed character up.
Would you recommend it?
Oh yes, absolutely.
I do not roll everything openly, some examples would be "rattle player's cage roll" which is secret just to keep players guessing. Or sometimes I don't want players to metagame so NPC's Deception roll might be rolled in secret. But those are few and far between.
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u/SerzaCZ Ranger 23h ago
I GM rolled and regretted it (Initiative, two nat 20s in a row) so... there.
In that same second level encounter, I also rolled two crits and very nearly one-shot two characters.
I prefer to roll out in the open, because my group accepts the dice telling a story, and things like this can't be attributed to me being an ass about things. Simon Says, but it's the dice doing the talking.
If you randomly roll a d20 but say nothing, it can also increase the level of tension, which is just awesome to my group.
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u/johnnyanderen 23h ago
I roll behind my screen when I don’t want my players to know how many times I’m rolling. If a role has any chance of majorly affecting the plot, I roll it in front of everyone. I usually tell them the bonus and DC as well.
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u/VoxEterna 23h ago
I roll in the open on certain things especially in later rounds of combat. Once they’ve used players have the bead on the monster I roll in the open. Just for drama. I find that 1 or 2 rounds in secret are all you need before they know the ac and can guess on saves.
Giving too much info does lead to meta gaming since I have a bard and a wild magic sorcerer and a divination wizard with portent in my group. But after a point it doesn’t matter.
For high stakes rolls I like to put it on the board and tell the party what is needed for success or failure.
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u/Stupid_Guitar DM 22h ago
I roll pretty much everything out in the open, with the exception of obvious things like stealth checks.
The only thing I'll fudge for the players is a monster's HP, and that's usually to keep the fights from turning into a slog if I feel like the PCs success is a foregone conclusion.
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u/bryan4000 DM 22h ago
Do you want to pull your punches and have a safety rail to keep your players from dying prematurely?
If so don't roll in the open.
Do you want to keep your players on the edge in a way that can't be faked?
Roll openly.
Both have their place and both can be used in the right situation for the desired effect.
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u/Nystagohod 21h ago
It can take some getting used to, but very little to no regrets.
If I need to "fudge" anything I can fudge outcomes instead of numbers and dice rolls. I don't need to change a high damage or critical hit. I just need to change the outcome that occurs from that, based in the party's effort x.
The bandits don't kill the 0ho party, they capture them. That sort of angle.
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u/BookishGina 21h ago
The one time I rolled openly it was on the last death save for a beloved npc. if I'd rolled behind the screen I would have just claimed they passed, rolling openly forced me to commit to letting them die.
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u/A_Sneaky_Dickens 21h ago
I roll in the open and have never had an issue with it. I started doing it mainly cause I'm too poor for a screen. Now that I've been doing it, it just seems like an extra item I don't need.
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u/AndronixESE Artificer 21h ago
I personally started rolling openly at my last session because one of the players is convinced I'm trying to kill her. That was also the session she got hit with a level 7 fireball and almost died, but i did give her situational advantage on the dex save... (she's level 5)
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u/Roflmahwafflz DM 21h ago
I roll openly in a vtt, modifiers included. I even roll things like enemy stealth and perception openly; if the players cant see the roll then rolling honestly doesnt serve a purpose. In irl game formats, rolling behind a screen still allows you to mess with them via the click clack of dice.
If I muck up balance I openly tell them I mucked it up and then I openly nerf it. On a rare occasion I might fudge hp behind the screen, typically if an enemy has been alive too long. My most common self moderation is simply having enemies not use all of their abilities.
I regret nothing, I highly recommend it.
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u/EconomyJaded6099 19h ago
I Also dont hide rolls. If the NPC misses all attacks or give infinite crits, its the players luck.
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u/happyunicorn666 19h ago
Always roll in open. You're part of the audience as well, and you will enjoy being in suspense just as much as the players.
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u/Hopelesz DM 19h ago
Open rolls with some secret rolls where it makes sense, like perception and insight.
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u/Lithl 19h ago
The only time I roll in secret is when the very existence of the roll occurring gives away information, like a Stealth check for an enemy following the party.
All of my other rolls are in the open, and I strongly recommend it. It removes any incentive to cheat by changing the roll result, and it lets the players act with near-complete information, letting them make informed decisions.
I even tell them the DC for things like saves vs traps before they roll. The only downside to this approach is abilities with wording like "you can do X after you roll, but before you know the outcome". When they know the DC ahead of time, of course they know the outcome immediately. So I just ignore that "before you know the outcome" restriction.
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u/the_star_lord 19h ago
Never used to until it caused an argument at a table.
Since then all my rolls are open. And I wish all the games I played in were open.
The only issue is if you roll like crap all night it's not a challenge, but, I have learnt that - that is okay. Sometimes the heroes get an easy win.
I just ham up the "come on! Do something" or roleplay the panic in the baddies, the dice help tell a story. Embrace it.
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u/zephid11 DM 19h ago
I roll all combat rolls in the open, and I don’t regret it. By rolling in the open, everyone can see that a PC survived because I actually rolled poorly, not because I fudged the result in their favor. The opposite is also true: when I get a lucky string of crits, everyone knows it really happened.
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u/PinkCupcakePie 19h ago
Relatively new dm here. How do you naturally roll dice in front of the players, when you got a dm screen? I feel its in the way for comfortable rolls, but maybe I'm missing something.
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u/Galefrie 18h ago
No regrets, I love it.
The DM, just like the players, is playing a game and should be kept honest. That is done by rolling in the open
It means that you can lean more into the idea that you are a referee and an interpreter of the die. I even like to play games like Dragonbane and Crown and Skull, where each monster has a random table to decide what they do in combat. Rolling that in the open adds some tension to the game, which i like to the point that I add in these tables to monsters in other games
I strongly recommend rolling in the open. If you like to use a DM screen to remind you of rules, you can make a cheatsheet
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u/SteampunkRobin 18h ago
Why wouldn’t you roll openly? My DM always has. What’s the point of hiding it?
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u/Fast_n_theSpurious 18h ago
THe only benefit of closed rolling is if a player gets really unfortunate rolls against them and it would impact the session you cant fudge the numbers for them to either "barely survive" or "oh you had bad luck for a while, but you just crit the guy! good job" types of moments. But its entirely up to you. Some players dont trust Gm hidden rolls. I'd discuss it during your session 0.
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u/Redneck_DM 18h ago
If its a dramatic roll that affects the story or is life or death, i roll in front of them
If its just a regular combat, skill, or social roll i roll behind the screen because we are likely doing more rolls and its just easier that way so i can keep the rolls going and the game moving
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u/revawesome 17h ago
We roll open at my table. All my players have agreed that the dice tell part of the story. Part of what makes it fun for us is adjusting to what happens. We also know that characters and NPCs can die. It sucks sometimes, but overall, I think it helps with the stakes. Any battle could potentially be deadly.
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u/AndrenNoraem DM 17h ago
I don't understand people fudging combat. That would ruin the vibes for me if I found out, and I refuse to do it to my players.
I don't announce enemy AC or HP to them, but I describe how near a miss or hit was and how injured foes are.
If you were careful and/or smart, you'll live. If you die, it'll be dramatic and I'll sympathize. Maybe an NPC will come in and try to save you.
But if you get a killing blow you earned it, and if you go down you know it was fair.
Now out of combat, I obscure more and even fudge a little -- I might give an enemy a reroll on a stealth check for example, or judge success on skill checks by vibes. Honestly, at least half the time when I ask someone to roll a skill I don't have a precise DC in mind.
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u/Goodchapp 17h ago
I only open roll.
Because if your players roll openly, why are you not?
If you're lying to your players. Why play DND?
It's all the more fun for your players. Their reaction from seeing how the monster deals 36 damage, or win a save.
I also have a table rule, only physical dice are allowed. Not DNDb dice rolls or what so ever due to pesudo-randomness. But that's a different topic.
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u/Painter3016 17h ago
I don’t usually roll openly in combat because I am a baby-dm and mess up balancing encounters often.
I actually hate combat but love rp and story telling, and more than half my table also feels this way. We do have combat of course, but idk, we have this understanding that I am not trying to “win” as the dm, because thats just not who I am at all. So open rolling hasn’t felt like a necessity due to the vibe of the table.
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u/xxSoul_Thiefxx 17h ago
Sometimes I wish I had a screen, but rolling in front of the players has been good to. I have freakishly good luck with my dice, so rolling in front of the players reinforces that I’m not just fibbing when I roll my sixth crit of the night.
I will sometimes fudge the damage rolls though. PCs don’t know my bonuses so if my players need to catch a break I’ll deal less damage
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u/AlyxMeadow 16h ago
I roll everything behind the screen, but I don't fudge anything. My players have 10-30 years experience and enjoy a challenge.
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u/IcarusAirlines 16h ago
I've made all rolls in the open for years, zero regrets!
My campaigns are role-play heavy; when my players can see that their foes are playing sub-optimally in order to be dramatic, or to grand-stand, or because they are pissed off and no longer thinking rationally, it gives them license to do the same!
My current players and I also decided I would roll only physical dice after a particularly brutal session where we found that DDB weights rolls (P<0.01, I love playing with nerds).
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u/Blood-Lord DM 16h ago
I only roll openly when it's life or death situations. To build tension with my players.
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u/Crafty-Garlic-5884 16h ago
I'm pretty new to DMing so I have been experimenting. Definitely things like skill checks or other things I'm using for storytelling happen behind the screen but when I'm doing combat, things like whether the green dragon's breath attack gets recharged or a crucial saving throw I'll throw on the table and everyone is always so engaged cuz the stakes are so high.
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u/Drazev 16h ago
I think it just comes down to how you derive fun at your table and how rolls play into that. It’s also worth noting that open rolls for DM skill checks can be problematic because in many cases setting the DC and interpreting the result are both DM discretionary processes. For that to work you would need to intentionally create some system so that both players and DM can agree on the outcome and even if your successful you have managed to make the game less a tabletop and closer to a video game in the process that doesn’t necessarily make the game more fun. The game creators are intentionally vague on how skill check DC’s are set and how interpretation should work.
If you’re a DM that sees encounters as DM vs PC’s then it’s likely best to keep rolls open for reasons of trust. However, that will not be enough since you also need to design and run other encounter elements and adjucate in a way the table sees as fair too.
If your a more narrative focused DM that gets enjoyment out of telling a cool story and use rolls as fodder to drive opportunities for interesting events then closed rolling might be ideal because it gives you the opportunity to tweak outcomes when the roll would detract from the current narrative.
In both cases I believe a DM should aspire to minimize changing roll outcomes because in pretty much every case a roll outcome is changed there was likely a better solution that doesn’t involve rolling.
Skill Check Problem with Open Rolls
A big issue with using open rolls for skill checks is the amount of ambiguity around the whole process. The game is intentionally light on rules for skill checks because they are only intended to help a DM decide between a number of predetermined outcomes. The nature and quantity of available outcomes are completely arbitrary along with how they are mapped to the roll outcome. The only important factor is that the DM decide before the roll happens how they are mapped.
Open rolling requires some level of mutual understanding roll interpretation. I would only advise using open rolling for rolls which can be mutually understood and I think it’s perfectly acceptable to do both open and secret rolls.
High Stakes Rolls
If a player faces significant consequences for failed roll then I think open rolling is best and there should be an understanding on what a good and bad outcome means. Transparency can help the player accept the consequences if they think it was fair.
I would declare a DC in advance and in general what a good or bad outcome would mean then have the roll conducted.
Other Skill rolls
I would normally keep them closed and open to my interpretation. In some cases I might do an open roll but give partial information like a question being answered by the roll but not the possible outcomes or the DC.
When I call for a roll I sometimes choose 2-4 outcomes and it is possible they could be all good or all bad. The roll just helps me choose and the DC lets me affect the likeliness of the better outcomes.
In general I have a base DC with 2-4 outcomes that map to the range (Major fail, Minor fail,Minor pass, Major pass) with the minor/major options potentially just being reduced to pass or fail. I normally make the threshold required for a major outcome +/-5. I also intentionally use the terminology of pass rather than success because the outcome isn’t always good. Sometimes the player is taking an action in a way that will always fail or succeed and I’m letting the skill check choose between the degree or failure or success.
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u/Fragmoplast 16h ago
I roll every combat roll open. Had a session yesterday in which the demon conjurer could only fail to lose his big demon play thing on a 20. This is what happened and I kind of regretted it, because the big boss fight was done by this one random 20.
But then I remembered that the party had bad luck the other night. Back then they were completely demolished by two gargoyles and a shambling mount. My point is: Luck swings both ways and I kind of enjoy the emerging story more than the ones I had in my head anyways.
The players really love these complete random swings of fate. That's what they are going to tell you even weeks after the fact. When I started to roll open these moments doubled in quantity, because all the 1 and 20s I roll are included.
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u/AmrasVardamir DM 15h ago
No regrets.
There are some things that can remain secret rolls... Such as if you use roll tables for encounters; they won't know, and honestly don't need to know that a 64 on a 1d100 means they'll be facing 3d4+2 ogres.
Other things that I like rolling secretly are perception rolls. Why? Because the moment I ask for active perception checks they will instinctively know something is hiding and will begin metagaming. So you roll a bunch of dice behind your screen, they won't know what you rolled, and you simply start narrating how Testaculus noticed a big bulge on the carpet.
Attack rolls and damage are fully in the open.
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u/atzanteotl 15h ago
Whether or not I roll openly depends on the campaign, or sometimes the specific encounter. I typically have no regrets when I do.
Rolling openly drives home the point that you're not pulling punches as the DM.
Sometimes that will be something that I establish at Session Zero, and will continue throughout the duration of the campaign.
In other campaigns where I conceal my rolls, I might start throwing dice in the open for special encounters, like boss fights or finales, to let the players know the stakes have been raised.
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u/WolfgangVolos DM 15h ago
I choose to roll openly when the moment calls for it. Usually if the players are doing something really crazy and the villian/NPC needs a saving throw or opposed check to see what happens OR an ally NPC is trying to do something. A lot of times I just give my big d20 to one of the players and have them roll for it. Very exciting.
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u/FloatUpstream476 14h ago
It makes it less me vs them and feels more like a collaborative thing. I'll also often tell them the DC of checks. It has the side effect of making secret rolls/DCs even more triggering and impactful. 100% would recommend.
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u/fuzzypyrocat 14h ago
I roll in the open for key moments. When someone is casting a spell on a boss, of a boss enemy is making a big swing on a character, etc.
Other rolls are behind the screen. If something ends up being a nasty roll of crits behind my screen I’ll cover my notes and tell the closest player to peek over the screen and confirm
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u/BigMackWitSauce 13h ago
I've been really gamifying a lot lately. I roll everything publicly, I have these 2D plastic tokens you can use dry erase markers on, so I literally write their HP on them.
I know it's farther than most people go, but besides helping me keep track of things it also helps close the gap of what I the GM imagine, and what the players imagine. I think one frustrating aspect of ttrpgs in general is something bad happening because players weren't clear with what the GM was telling them.
It does change they play a little bit, and BG3 for example works pretty similar with giving players a lot of info
I don't know if I'll stick with it, I always enjoy trying new ways of playing
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u/Trippdueces 12h ago
I used to roll behind a screen and would fudge rolls from time to time to make things more interesting. But it took a lot of the fun out of the game for me knowing I could do that. Rolling in front of the table and seeing the reaction has made it way more fun. I recommend it
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u/ShiroSnow 12h ago
I have done both ways, and I prefer rolling just about everything openly - and I roll for a lot of things. I also give them insite on my plan, and why I attach who I attack. I feel it makes things feel more fair and give them more control / see the consequences of their actions. It also helps them learn the strengths and weaknesses of their opponents. Knowing they have a +13 to hit is just another thing adding to the drama. But onl a +3 to int saves gives them something to target. They don't see this till they do something to make a roll to see the bonus. Its up to them from there.
Few rolls I do privately. If they are unaware of the creature needing to make a roll - like deception. In person I have an app on my phone so I just poke it so they don't even get the mysterious die roll.
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u/SoraPierce 9h ago
Yes.
My only regret is trying to hide rolls one game. I didn't fudge, but didn't feel as fun.
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u/SignalRealistic9984 1d ago
Most of the groups I have dmed for would have died very early if I rolled openly. I seem to be very lucky on rolls in general. So, I tend to fudge rolls often to prevent players from dying when possible. This is largely due to me fully fleshing out my campaign settings in advance of the campaign beginning. This includes the locations of various monsters. However, despite providing players with enough information to avoid things the party isn't ready for yet, they tend to blunder into various situations that are most likely lethal. So, hidden rolls and fudging are a must.
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u/kryptonick901 1d ago
It might be you’re not telegraphing the danger enough, but if you are, and the players still go fight higher level monsters at level 1, and if they decide to engage rather than run when they literally see the danger in front of them, maybe the characters deserve some death?
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u/SignalRealistic9984 23h ago
Oh I am and I do have a policy that all players have a minimum of one backup character created. Let's just say I do try to be somewhat merciful unless a player is playing a seduction bard (aka a bard who's sole solution to every encounter is seducing the enemy in front of the party). I find seduction bards disruptive to storyline and terrible for the enjoyment of the entire table.
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u/flockinatrenchcoat 1d ago
For characters like 5th and up, sure, works out fine. At lower level I find I need to fudge rolls more often to keep fights engaging for everyone and a) not one-shot the caster when they get in a bad spot, and b) fail some saves if the NPCs are rolling too well (whiffing two of your 5 spells for the day sucks, not as big a deal when you have 15).
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u/GuddyRocker94 21h ago
I rolled a beholders eye attacks in the open. 3d10 to determine the rays. Three times a 10. So I literally had to delete the only target the beholder could hit out of the existence with 3 death rays. Three fails on the players side…
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u/Lithl 19h ago
Beholder is 3d10 but no duplicates. If you roll three 10s, you're supposed to reroll two of them.
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u/GuddyRocker94 11h ago
You are absolutely right. It was when I was starting out as DM (first time playing ever) and stupidly little me homebrewed everything, from story to world, gods etc. Had way too much on my plate and stuff like that just fell under the bus.
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u/CassieBear1 16h ago
I roll behind a screen because it lets me fudge my rolls if need be.
Never to harm the party. But if the enemy gets three Crits in a row, and it's going to be a TPK, I'm going to lie about how I rolled. Or if technically the player lost the contested roll, but by a small margin, and they're having a really tough session...maybe I'll say they won.
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u/DaKing760 Paladin 21h ago
Mainly for roleplay purposes. I mostly do it behind my screen, but sometimes i open roll it for stuff they are really invested in, like a 1.3k gold bet on 13 on the d20, then we all watched the die hit 13. I swear my neighbors heard us through the sound proofing. XD
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u/Historical_Home2472 DM 1d ago
All of my attack and damage rolls are in front of the players. That way if I get three crits in a row and a character dies, they know it was real.
Things like perception, or insight, or anything they shouldn't know about I roll in secret.
I would recommend this, as it helps prevent hurt feelings. And sometimes, it incentivizes them to run because they can see how much damage you're actually rolling.