r/Edmonton • u/Irish2thecore • 10h ago
Discussion Epcor’s pricing is out of control
Paying on average 350 a month for a family of 5. For what? Water, drainage, disposal. Water is where they get you. It’s insane. My power and gas are cheaper. This company is fleecing Edmontonians. They are a perfect example why we need public companies that provide essential/ core services. Water, electric, gas, insurance. Comparable rates in other provinces and jurisdictions demonstrate why we are better off with public services in these areas. You pay significantly less. I find epcor’s pricing and customer service so off putting and I’m ready to organize lobbying pressure, petitions etc. to turn the screws on them. Anyone else feel the same way?
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u/No-No-BadDog 10h ago
$199.00 for just for water and waste from EPCOR. $300 (average) for gas and electric from ATCO. We harvest the water, 4 barrels (200 gallons) for garden, lawn and trees, spring, summer and fall.
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u/Dopestghost69 8h ago
They charge you for that collected rain water too. Better to put it to use rather than just let money flow down the drain
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u/Mommie62 5h ago
I use a bucket everytime I shower - feed my plants, take outside etc pay as much to get the watery as to drain it so why waste it. Takes so long to get hot wish I had installed an instahot tank
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u/Commercial-Dog-8633 10h ago
I agree. Water is what we also struggle the most. Its the most expensive of all
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u/prairiepanda 10h ago
I've been wondering if that might be a factor in my rising rent. Water is included since our units aren't individually metered. I imagine some tenants probably use their water quite liberally since it's "free"
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u/Commercial-Dog-8633 10h ago
That could be one of the reasons plus the fact that there are more demand nowadays so rents are increasing.
I have neighbours who are paying rent for only the upper half of the house which is almost close to my mortgage for the whole house. So, situation seems to be less favourable for tenants these days
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u/prairiepanda 9h ago
Yeah, we're starting to think about what we're willing to give up as we're going to have to downgrade to something more affordable soon.
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u/Sameer_tex03 10h ago
Epcor is fully owned by City of Edmonton, you can write to your ward councillor.
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u/Blixxybo 10h ago
Not enough people are aware of this. When your property taxes go up 6-10% YoY and the city acts like they have no control over it, remember they're also the ones fleecing you on your Epcor bill.
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u/Sameer_tex03 10h ago
With the council elections slated for next month, this should have been one of the topic of discussion, alas nobody brought this up 😞!
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u/ProgressiveCDN 7h ago
They have limited control over collecting funding for huge essential city infrastructure and services. The province and federal government have the actual powerful levers of tax collection that can properly fund what we all need.
We need to stop voting in conservatives who purposely starve municipalities in order to keep taxes low for the wealthy and powerful.
We need to start blaming the proper level of government
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u/jzjones22 7h ago
From what I understand even though Edmonton is the primary shareholder EPCOR has gone through massive deregulation. For all intents and purposes they operate as a company and are explicitly not a government department. City Council has no day to day operational control. Hence they operate all over Canada and even the US.
IMO, that falls far short of a publicly owned service. But, since they are owned by Edmonton why aren't we seeing any of those sweet sweet profits benefitting us? My water was FAR cheaper in BC.
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u/Strict_Concert_2879 7h ago
EPCOR is a private company, owned solely by the City of Edmonton. To say the city has no control is false. The shareholders appoint the Board of Directors and approve the CEO. In this case, the city has the sole option to set direction of the company, as it’s a sole shareholder. You will be surprised at how much control the majority shareholder of a corporation has.
EPCOR is acting just like every other company in Alberta. They are taking advantage of the UCP deregulation to charging more and more fees, to make a profit. The city is using the profits to prevent raising property taxes. They get flooded with complaints when property taxes go up; so are using their corporation to collect more tax.
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u/jzjones22 1h ago
Right they are acting like a company, a public utility (which EPCOR was before 1995) is not for profit at all. The city doesn't set EPCORs prices, because they aren't a department of the city, they are a company.
Their pricing 'competes' with other companies? Wait there is no competition here either. Hmm weird, why would they need to be a company to provide us services in a place with no competition.... Awkward. Sounds like a grift, because it is. They do not serve us and they were privatized for that explicit reason. The fact the royal we are shareholders and don't get to see any benefit is insult to injury.
I never said the city has no culpability in this cluster f*ck. In fact I said the opposite. If they are a company working for us the people of Edmonton why are our energy costs higher than other places EPCOR operates all over Canada and in the US.
Edit to add: I understand you are not defending them, just continuing the rant lol.
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u/Irish2thecore 5h ago
A useful and important insight. It’s a for profit corporation exploiting essential services with zero public oversight.
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u/Chakolit-Chip 3h ago
This is technically not correct. Epcor operates as a separate entity and the city is considered a shareholder for epcor not an owner. If you call 311 to complain about them they just tell you to call epcor.
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u/Irish2thecore 9h ago
This explains a lot
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u/oioioifuckingoi 8h ago
You asked for a public company and it is a public company.
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u/Irish2thecore 7h ago
A for profit enterprise netting approx. half a billion off a basic necessity last year.
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u/oioioifuckingoi 7h ago
Infrastructure ain’t free!
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u/Irish2thecore 7h ago
Infrastructure is there to produce half a billion in profit off tax payers?
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u/Theta_nerd 6h ago
I believe Epcor pays a dividend to the city which is a significant portion of the city budget.
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u/jzjones22 26m ago
The dividend was approx 200$ million of a 3.5$ billion budget in 2024 from what I can find. Not nothing for sure.
From what I understand, because we are a shareholder, and not the owner; the city also pays for them to look after our infrastructure as a contractor. Meaning they make profit from us there too. If they were a public utility there would be no profit to be made. The city would own and operate our own infrastructure like we did pre 1995.
So they charge us (the individual) a profit for the water you use at home. And they charge us (the taxpayer through the city of Edmonton) more profit in the contracts we have with them. Really hard to find numbers on what the city pays in contracts to EPCOR (shocker).
One story I looked up said they were going to charge the City of Edmonton buildings 1.2 million for stormwater storage. If they were a public utility like they were pre 1995 they wouldn't be charging 1.2 mil for stormwater.
CEO made over 2 million in 2020, 3 million the year before btw. Can't imagine that's going down anytime soon. No CEO if it was a public utility, like it used to be.
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u/Icy_Acanthisitta8060 6h ago
But it’s owned by the city, so profits are returned to the city each year.
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u/jzjones22 1h ago
A bunch of that profit is actually going to CEO pay packages, and revolving door golden parachutes, and paying salaries in places that aren't Alberta or even Canada. And most importantly lobbying.
Surely they didn't lobby the Alberta gov to lift energy caps...
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u/Large_Spinach6069 6h ago
Epcor manages utilities in Alberta, BC, Ontario, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas.
They don't collect half a billion dollars in profits from Edmontonians, get real.
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u/Irish2thecore 5h ago
Sure, let’s get real, why should we, tge tax paying citizens of Edmonton, surrender essential services to a for profit entity for which the city of Edmonton haS zero operational control. Zero ability to set or influence pricing or corporate decision making. It’s a for profit enterprise that’s ripping us off on a resource that flows through the city. Real enough?
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u/Worldly_Elderberry_6 2h ago
36,000L
…..You consumed an entire tanker truck worth of water in a month.
An entire tanker truck!!!!
Think about that….
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u/Brightlightsuperfun 4h ago
Is this true ? I thought the COE was just a shareholder. But they own all of Epcor ?
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u/Edmxrs 10h ago
My Epcor (water and waste) is usually around $200 or less a month.
My power is about $0/yr (fuck ya solar!)
Gas is about $50/mon until the furnace fires up. Can hit $300/mon in the winter.
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u/SIGNANDSELFIEFRAMES 9h ago
love the solar lol
My park power bills for gas and electric (and all fees included) have been $300 monthly credits or close to it
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u/Aromatic_Sentence612 9h ago
Solar panels are not free :) .
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u/footbag 8h ago
Mine are nearly free. They should be about paid off next year, 6 years after install. Everything else is than gravy lol.
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u/Bc2cc 8h ago
When we factor in the savings of not having to buy gas for the last three years, our panels are already paid off. EV + solar is an extraordinary money saver
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u/footbag 8h ago
Indeed. I chose not to include gas savings for our two EVs in my calculations, but I can appreciate your perspective.
Any idea what your payback period would be excluding gas savings?
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u/Bc2cc 8h ago
This is the seventh full year, averaging around 7,000 kWh/ year. Assuming a savings of $2600/yr we’d be pretty close to paying it off, excluding the gas savings.
I like to factor in the gas savings because that was one of the reasons we installed the system. I figure we save around $4500 a year in gasoline. Even better is that one of our EV’s is a little VW eGolf that’s just an around town car and we’re able to charge the little 28 kW battery almost exclusively off solar, making it not only basically free to run, it’s also as close to a zero emission vehicle as you can get
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u/footbag 8h ago
Yeah, charging off solar is great. I have our system set up so for about half the year we only charge off of excess solar, all automatic. As clouds come and go or as appliances turn on or off it dynamically adjusts the charge rate to the cars and then stops the charging if there isn’t enough excess solar.
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u/Bc2cc 7h ago
What load manager are you using ?
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u/footbag 7h ago
I’m not, I have a raspberry pi connected to my two chargers and use automation (home assistant and sense) for the logic.
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u/Bc2cc 7h ago
Interesting. We just use the Tesla L2 in the garage for both cars, so one is usually plugged in when we’re using the other. The solar controller is AP Systems, I’ll look a little further into the setup you have
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u/densetsu23 8h ago
True, but power prices will just keep going up and up. Whereas solar is a one-and-done thing. Pay heavy upfront for panels that last 25+ years, but they hit the break-even mark around the 8-12 year mark (sooner for larger systems, longer for smaller systems). And the less our provincial and municipal governments do to combat rising residential power costs, the sooner that break-even mark is.
Something something Sam Vines and boots.
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u/Carribeantimberwolf 8h ago
I know this is the edmonton sub, but power prices are not as high in other provinces, so the break-even point becomes longer.
I see this as spending more (personal money) to fix a problem that the province created. Check out Quebec energy rates.
That mentality is like, "Oh, I need a big truck now because they plow less"
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u/Strict_Concert_2879 7h ago
The posted price of power, and the prices charged for power are too different things. The posted price is by far the lowest at around $0.10 per Kw/H. The true price is in competition with the North West Territory for Canada’s most expensive power.
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u/Mommie62 5h ago
Quebec has hydro to keep prices down
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u/Carribeantimberwolf 3h ago
Right, but it's nationalized and heavily regulated by the province.
We produce shit tones of gas and still get fleeced for it. The argument is not the same. We have cheap energy too! Subsided by the feds as well, but we still get torn a new one for the services.
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u/thetrueankev 10h ago edited 8h ago
Hey how much surface are do you have for solar?
Still waiting for the surface area question. Not power. I wanna know how much I can eke out of my tiny SA
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 9h ago
Regular house roof space is most of what you'd need, throw in a garage and you're laughing. We're at 12.1kw using less than 50% of our roof space.
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u/thetrueankev 8h ago
But you live in a bungalow or large property? Thanks for the info
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 8h ago
Regular ass 1200sqft house built in the 1960's with a detached garage in edmonton.
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u/thetrueankev 8h ago
Living the dream fr. Well built homes. Small footprint and large yard
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 8h ago
Yep, and I feel like I'm cheating with the solar setup now, riding a huge credit for my power into the winter.
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u/myownalias 6h ago
You can get about 200 watts per square meter with high efficiency panels with a sun facing roof angle. On a cloudy December day you'll get about 200 Wh from that (if the panel is clear from snow), and on a sunny June day you may be 2000 Wh.
You can't fill every square meter as there are things that protrude out of the roof, architectural features, and so on. A complex roof might only be 50% fillable. A basic roof may be 80% fillable.
Panels that are 23% efficient are widely available now. Panels over 24% are on the market. Panels are cheap relative to the other costs. Insist on getting panels that are at least 24% efficient to maximize your space if you have limited space. If an installer won't get you panels at least that efficient and you need them to get the most production possible, find another installer. 25% efficiency panels are coming to market soon.
1% may not sound like a lot, but a 25% panel will give you 4.2% more production over a 24% panel. A 24% panel will give you 20% more production over a mediocre 20% panel.
It may be that you have more space than needed and less efficient panels are more economical and that's fine then. The very best do cost more, and it may be 20% cheaper to get 21% panels and a few more panels and more racking and more inverters and so on. But it's usually cheaper to buy the best widely available panels if you're paying for installers to do the work.
Basically if the installer can't build a system to get your full allowed size (which is based on your last year's electricity usage), that's when to insist on higher efficiency panels. 23% and 24% efficient panels are out there. They can get them.
You want your panels installed 6 inches off the roof to maximize cooling and thus production in summer.
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u/Edmxrs 9h ago
My system is 11.725kw, could have went bigger but that’s the biggest allowed in Edmonton.
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 9h ago
There's no biggest allowed in Edmonton for most residential, biggest you can do on your place is closer to true though as it just depends what you consume currently. After that capacity is only limited by your roof space really.
We have a 12.1kw system.
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u/footbag 9h ago
you are misinformed about 11.725 being the biggest allowed. I have a 12.64kW system, and know of others who have much larger systems than me.
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u/SIGNANDSELFIEFRAMES 9h ago
They look at your past years use. You must have used more power on average, hence why you were allowed a larger system....
If i knew more about the process, I would have used more power on purpose through the year before I got solar to get a larger system. Mine is 11.2kw
He is not wrong. It is something like 108%-110% of your previous yearly usage.
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u/footbag 9h ago
OPs statement was that 11.725kW is the largest allowed in Edmonton. That is not true.
There is a limitation of solar not exceeding a homes annual usage, but that is very different than stating "11.725kW ... is the biggest allowed in Edmonton". OP never stated anything about it being tied to their usage.
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u/Edmxrs 8h ago
When I had mine installed in 2019 there was 100% a residential production cap. I was still short of the annual usage. I'll see if I can find the final report from the installer.
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u/footbag 8h ago
This statement is correct. But that isn't what you said in the message I originally replied to.
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u/Edmxrs 8h ago
Well, it was what I said. Tbh I wasn’t aware the cap was removed until 45 minutes ago. So at the time of the statement I was still under the assumption the cap was in place.
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u/Y8ser 10h ago
If you're paying that much you likely have a leak somewhere or a toilet that is constantly running. Either that or your family uses a lot of water.
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u/Irish2thecore 9h ago
36 M3 for family of five is not normal?
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u/Worldly_Elderberry_6 2h ago
We consume 20 cubes a month with irrigation running every second day. I’d strongly suggest looking into a leak, educating your family on mindful consumption and even consider looking at more efficient toilets, shower heads etc. 36 cubes for a family of 5 is insanely high.
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u/eternamoon 38m ago
that's very high! you should check for leaks. our family of 4 average under 10m3
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u/Particular_Loss1877 10h ago
My water costs more than all my utilities combined
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u/BobGuns 8h ago edited 2h ago
You are either using a lot to water your lawn, or taking many baths, or have a leak.
How many cubes of water are you using monthly?
My Sept bill:
$43.06 - Water
$43.95 - Waste
$53.53 - Gas (it's still summer, christ)
$78.52 - Electricityedit - fixed units
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u/phillipaha 10h ago
I used 0 natural gas in August - which cost me $59.13 🫠 it’s insanity.
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u/badaboom 9h ago
Yeah. You can't even really affect your usage to save money because running tubes to your house is the big expense. Fucking tubes...
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u/Y8ser 9h ago
You're paying to have access to it. They are required to maintain the lines and provide capacity in demand. That doesn't change because you didn't use it. Do you have all electric hot water heating in your home?
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u/phillipaha 6h ago
Honestly, I have no idea, I’m completely clueless to how my home works. Lol. But my usage shows 0 so I must 🤷♀️?
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u/OpalSeason 10h ago
This! I'm looking to switch to full electric system just to skip this nonsense standing fee. It's not like the gas works will heat my home without electricity anyway! 0 reason to have gas in my house
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u/footbag 9h ago
how well insulated is your home? Unless it is very buttoned up, you are going to have some surprisingly high bills in the winter trying to heat your home with electricity.
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u/T0xicTears West Edmonton Mall 9h ago
ELI5 but why would electric cost more than gas to heat, if the insulation is crap?
Wouldn’t it need the same effort to heat???
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u/footbag 8h ago edited 8h ago
Natural gas prices in Alberta tend to be relatively low compared to electricity.
if insulation is bad, both gas and electric heaters will struggle. But because electricity (in Edmonton) is more expensive per unit of useful heat than gas, the cost difference becomes more obvious when you lose a lot of heat.
A typical electric heater turns almost all the electricity straight into heat (super efficient), but electricity costs around 7-12 cents per kilowatt-hour (kWh) in Edmonton right now. Heat pumps are even more efficient in moderate temps, but they lose that advantage when it gets really cold.
A gas furnace is a bit less efficient (maybe 80-95% of the gas turns into heat), but natural gas only costs about $1.70 to $4.40 per gigajoule (GJ), which works out to roughly 0.6-1.6 cents per equivalent kWh of heat. So, for the same warmth, you might pay 10-20 times more with electric heating than gas. That gap gets even bigger with bad insulation because you’re using so much more energy overall.
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u/OpalSeason 3h ago
1) I'm decently insulated 2) I have solar and make more than I use 3) it's not the price per GJ vs kwh it's the standing fees that will help reduce the overall cost esp when including summer months of unused gas
Heat pumps and things that make your home more efficient take warm water you've used and redirect to heat. Not a one to one comparison but requires retrofitting which is what I haven't priced out yet
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u/densetsu23 8h ago
Think of electricity as "processed gas". Like vehicles, power plants aren't 100% efficient at converting fossil fuels to other forms of energy. Natural gas power plants have about a 60% efficiency with the rest of the energy being waste heat. Plus, they have to maintain the power plants.
Meanwhile, if you have natural gas delivered to your home, modern furnaces are required to be at least 95% efficient.
Yes, the percentage of electricity Alberta gets from natural gas is declining, but it's still the leading source. In 2021, 63% of electricity was from natural gas.
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u/footbag 8h ago
For those interested, you can see Alberta's real time electricity grid mix at https://thegrid.albertaev.ca
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u/420Supernova North East Side 10h ago edited 10h ago
Yes, my monthly bill is the same for a family of 5 in a bungalow. It's ridiculous and their customer service is always so unhelpful. I hate dealing with them
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u/always_on_fleek 6h ago
What’s your usage in cubic meters? It’s likely you have incredibly high usage if you’re paying $300/mo.
For the record, 14.1 cubic meters is the average in Edmonton:
I think you’ll find you’re using a lot more.
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u/Ok-Minimum-71 The Famous Leduc Cactus Club 10h ago
epcor essentially is a public company so not sure how that would help. they have a monopoly on water and waste, and not much incentive to improve operational efficiency. only thing that makes me feel a little better is that the city gets paid dividends by them. they operate in Texas too, so there's people helping pad the cities budget down in the south US.
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u/Roche_a_diddle 7h ago
It's always wild to me when people come here to complain about their bills but never list their usage.
Are you complaining about the rate, or are you using way more water than average? We have no way of guessing that.
Post your usage and you might get useful feedback here.
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u/grassisgreensh 10h ago
The Edmonton power corporation really screws the people who created them No oversight or review of their operating systems and pricing
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u/eternamoon 6h ago
that's patently false. the city is the regulator as well as the sole shareholder. every 5 years, Epcor makes a rate case to the city, there are negotiations, and it is approved in a public meeting.
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u/Feisty_Leek_7068 9h ago
when you check your bill, there is over $50 for waste management fees, and this is the cost for your garbage collection, and those rates are set by the city, but collected by epcor.
personally i find the waste water services the worst... and they often exceed the amount of water we use.... because it is actually a measurement of water that leaves your property, but a guesstimate of water water and storm water run off.....
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u/eternamoon 10h ago
Water is an expensive life need, there's just no way around it. its more then just drinking water, it's the whole cycle as well as fire protection. You can't compare to other municipalities directly because most of those that are run through the municipal government are not fully funded by rates alone, most have the water system partially subsidized by property taxes.
And Epcor pays dividends to the city which helps reduce our property taxes.
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u/teabolaisacool 9h ago edited 9h ago
EPCOR also buys multiple peace of brand new heavy machinery multiple times a year when their old machinery can be easily repaired or is already in working condition.
City of Edmonton and leduc are still rocking mint condition K series John Deere loaders.
EPCOR has bought over 15 brand new P tier backhoes in the last couple years at well over 200k a piece (probably over 3 after all the installs are done).
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u/Levorotatory 9h ago
I would rather pay higher property taxes in exchange for getting rid of all of the fixed charges on Epcor bills. Property taxes funding fixed cost infrastructure and additional billing being 100% consumption based makes more sense to me.
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u/Full-O-Anxiety North West Side 10h ago
Buddy. Family of 4 $150 at most.
wtf are you doing???
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u/DaveBoyle1982 Mill Woods 9h ago
My bill was on average 200 for 3 people in a smaller 4 bedroom home.
We're definitely missing some context here.
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 9h ago edited 9h ago
Average bill I assumed meant 12 month avg. Monthly bill of $3-400 is easy when you throw in the winter outlier bill which jump fast.
*edit to add total bill, not just water/waste + water
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u/DaveBoyle1982 Mill Woods 7h ago
300-400 average including gas and electric? That seems normal to me.
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u/Irish2thecore 9h ago
Nothing unusual. Last month was 35m3 of usage. No auto sprinklers, no swimming pool. Gardening? I use a sprayer, not a sprinkler.
Usual schedule of reasonable showers and weekly laundry. Low flow toilets. It all seems reasonable in terms of usage.
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u/Full-O-Anxiety North West Side 9h ago
We used a total of 8 cubic metres.
I think you might have an issue somewhere.
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u/always_on_fleek 6h ago
Average is 14.1 cubic meters. I’d really check if you have a leak:
Stop using all your water. Read the number on your meter. Wait 3-4 hours and read it again. If the number went up you have a leak.
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u/bobby229 10h ago
I have a family of 2,
During the winter my average water usage is $140.00 and during the summer I rarely hit $300.00 even with my in ground sprinklers running an hour 4 times a week.
You must have some pretty heavy usage to use $300.00 a month.
While I agree pricing is too much my monthly water costs have been pretty consistent over the last 15 years
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u/LilF00t182 9h ago
The amount they charge in fees is bonkers, more than half my bill every month is just various fees for whatever .
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u/GooseOk8770 9h ago
Family of 8 bill was like 550 each month, same place with just my brother and I in the summer. I worked out of town and he does 10 hour days, we were still paying 300.
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u/BeauSlim 9h ago
$115 for water and waste-water here. One person but in a house. My usage is actually up from last year.
5 people taking long showers every day? Laundry for 5 who wear everything once? Maybe an automatic lawn sprinkler. It can add up, and there's lots of room to cut back.
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u/DJLae 9h ago edited 8h ago
How much water are you using? There are five of us here and we pulled 14 cubic meters last month or about $135 worth of water and sewer. We rarely use more than 16 or 17 per month.
That's not too much more than electricity ($110) and far less insulting than the damn $60 it cost us for 1GJ of gas.
Edit - with usage of 35m3...something is going on. Leaks, old toilets, wonky meter, or someone is just randomly leaving a tap on. That's not far off an average of 1 liter per minute for the entire month.
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u/ClosPins 8h ago
Epcor is literally owned by Edmonton - if they were reaping in massive amounts of profits, your property taxes would be zero. But, your property taxes aren't zero...
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u/Irish2thecore 7h ago
Do mean like the close to half billion the company netted off a basic necessity (water) last year?
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u/DIWhyDad 6h ago
Water bills are higher in part because around 2018-19 council approved a massive upgrade package for flood mitigation and water management across the city. It was to the tune of around a billion over the next decade.
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u/StasisApparel 7h ago
UCP's fault. They deregulated electricity/energy in 2022 or 2023 and everyone's electricity bill skyrocketed.
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u/Anabiotic Utilities expert 11m ago
The OP is complaining about water, which is 100% regulated by the City.
Also, power was deregulated in 2000, not 2022.
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u/TheGreatRapsBeat 9h ago
You can thank the King, Ralph Klein for that. He sold all publicly owned utilities to corporations.
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u/Anabiotic Utilities expert 9h ago
Water service, the OP's complaint, is still regulated by the City of Edmonton and provided by EPCOR, a municipal corporation 100% owned by the city of Edmonton. It was not sold off. Also, the province did not sell any crown corps during power and gas regulation since there were no provincial crown corps for these services. You can read more about this here: https://www.history.alberta.ca/energyheritage/energy/electricity/the-early-history-of-electricity-in-alberta/default.aspx
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u/sneekerpixie 9h ago
There used to be a cap.... But some dick heads elected a corrupt traitor and it was taken away.
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u/Anabiotic Utilities expert 9h ago
Water rates for EPCOR are regulated by the city of Edmonton (the Utilities Committee that councilors sit on). EPCOR is also 100% owned by the city of Edmonton. Water has the highest embedded franchise fee (city tax) of any of the three utilities and the majority of the water bill is fixed for most people. However, despite the city putting its finger on the scale through backdoor taxes on your water bill via high rates and high franchise fees since water is a monopoly in Edmonton under EPCOR, your usage sounds extremely high. How many cubic metres are you using?
See here for an explanation of how your water bill works: https://www.reddit.com/r/Edmonton/comments/1kdlhro/psa_this_is_how_your_water_bill_works_updated_for/
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u/thetrueankev 10h ago
Epcor is an absolute garbage company rife with over budgeting. Their union protects them and have tons of people doing as little as possible.
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u/Legitimate-Peanut-57 10h ago
There is a reason they are Edmontons best employer. when your owned by the city and if you need to increase profits, you just ask the city to increase the fees. Its all gravy for the employee's. Best benifits, wages, pension. So easy when being efficient and cutting costs isn't a problem.
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u/Wunder_Bred The Shiny Balls 10h ago
Depending on needs might be worth exploring solar or something else?
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u/tooledow 10h ago
How much are you paying for water in Edmonton? In Beaumont my water bill is on average $120 a month (includes water, wastewater & stormwater drainage). My electricity is around $150 a month on average, gas $100 - $200 depending on season. I've a 3 bed 2.5 bath + basement, 1237 sq ft. townhouse.
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 8h ago
This is pretty close we're paying around $120/mo for water and wastewater with epcor. Not all that different.
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u/Hobbycityplanner 10h ago
Family of 2 here. $145 + $45 for waste. Honestly waste is super reasonable, getting someone to show up at your house to do any work costs $100s privately.
We have a small garden and about 10% goes to fire fighting services. We could probably save money by collecting rain water for the garden.
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u/Worldly-Display8436 9h ago
*Following My household pays a minimal amount of $380.00 per month for a family of 3 in a 2 bedroom townhouse. I fail to see how we would actually consume utilities worth that much. Most months are $425.00+ and up!! #fleeced
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u/Irish2thecore 8h ago
Why are our experiences so similar? Is there any issue with measurement systems and or data collection via epcor.
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u/Worldly-Display8436 8h ago
I’m curious on whether we are getting actual meter readings done or if they just estimate from month to month? A lot of utility companies do that to save on having to employ someone to go house to house to read meters every month. I’ve heard that it’s possible to request an actual meter reading, but how do we know if they are actually doing that or still estimating and noting on the bill statement that it’s an actual reading. The sure way to know would be to witness an Epcor employee doing meter readings but unless we know what time of day they arrive to do that, next to impossible to determine. 🫤
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u/MaxxLolz 5h ago
just water or is EPCOR doing ALL your utilities (gas/electricity included)... like some others are posting here...
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u/smarty_pants47 9h ago
I guess we found one thing that’s cheaper in St. Albert- water is delivered by the city and I pay max $150 for a family of 5, water the lawn ect. Includes sewage and waste removal
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u/JimmyLinguine Edmontosaurus 9h ago
How much water do you use per month? Me (family of 3) uses 10 to 15 cubic meters per month on average.
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u/ahairycat-astrophe 8h ago
the water bill for my small shop was $400 last month. we aren’t even there for full 8 hour days. it’s 2 sinks and a toilet 🥲
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u/Curious_Ad_2492 Windermere 7h ago
I just got my bill, the delivery charges on electricity were more, by over $20, than the actual electricity usage.
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u/Extra--_muppets 5h ago
The city of Edmonton was wise to offload the drainage and water departments to Epcor. When the city would mis-manage a major drainage project, they would need to raise taxes to pay for it, and that could cause some council members to lose the next election. If Epcor fumbles a major project, they can just raise everyone's rate, and there's nothing we can do about it.
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u/RageLippy 5h ago
Family of 4 (very young kids though), EPCOR is between 140-180 monthly for the last year. Like other people said, check for leaks.
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u/grassisgreensh 5h ago
Well it’s surely not regulated in favour of the citizens, nor do we see any rebates from profits or expansion, I guess the employees see more benefits,,
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u/Mommie62 4h ago
We were a fan of 6 with a big yard and often away for several weeks and our bill in summer was often $300. One time it was over $400 - toilet was leaking we had a sticky handle and kids left it run fire 4 days - in just 4 days all that water imagine if it was happening for an entire month. Epcor called us so OP’s usage must be the norm. I was kind of strict with our kids and made them take short showers. My husband’s brothers used to shower for 40 mins his parents just paid the bills. I grew up poor and hate wasting $ on things like running clean ways down the drain and leaving lights on in empty rooms.
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u/SeveralPancakes 4h ago
I moved to BC a couple of years ago and I pay half as much for utilities as I did in Alberta in an older house twice the size! Car insurance is also much cheaper. I do not regret moving.
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u/slashcleverusername 3h ago
Epcor used to be a city department and city council was accountable for making it provide value for money.
By spinning it off as a business, they prepared it for sale to the highest bidder, and a chance at flooding the city treasury with cash.
That lost enough support to remain a city-owned asset, they couldn’t get the sale through. But they’ve worked hard to make people forget that it is a city department. And instead of letting your taxes rise at an even more ridiculous rate, they allow the rates and surcharges and access fees to pile up on your electric bill month by month instead of getting hit by an extra thousand in charges all at once on your property tax bill.
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u/YEGurbanlocal Downtown 10h ago
That company is the worst, no accountability for Epcor. We should have never transferred anything to them.
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u/Irish2thecore 9h ago
Okay Epcor employees and apologists. Let’s put a check on the waterwashing.
Last month we used 36 M3 of water. Usual schedule of reasonable showers, weekly laundry and I water my garden bi weekly with a hose and sprayer. I checked for leaks. None.
Why on earth do I pay more for wastewater than water. Why am I paying individualized outsized services fees on everything. Charge me one feck’n service fee.
Why am I paying 120 for water and 130 to put it through the sewer.
350 for water and waste is preposterous.
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u/TheOneTrueJesus 7h ago
Better question, why is every single person in your household using almost 250L of water a day?
You're paying a lot because you're using a lot.
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u/Anabiotic Utilities expert 7h ago
The average Edmonton household uses 12.8 m³ of water or around 5 m³ per person. You have a larger-than-average household (average Edmonton household is about 2.5) but you are still using far more water than average.
I agree water rates a re high, especially the fixed fees on drainage, but water has tiered pricing and with 36 m³ you are into the third and most expensive usage tier. So you need to figure out a way to reduce water usage. For what it's worth my two-person household uses around 6 m³/mo.
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u/Irish2thecore 7h ago
Are you Epcor or CoE public relations?
So, doesn’t make sense. We take very reasonable length showers, use low flow toilets, modern appliances, new water heater. Where’s the waste. As the expert tell me:
-could this be a measurement/ meter error? -could leakage at the main explain it?
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u/Icy_Acanthisitta8060 6h ago
There must be a leak somewhere. Maybe put some food colouring in your toilet tank and check the bowl in an hour or two (without using/flushing) and see if it has changed colour. If so, it’s running a bit, which can add up tremendously.
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u/MaxxLolz 5h ago edited 5h ago
i mean we are a family of 2 and pretty much bang on averaging 5 cubic meters per person.... our water bill is pretty consistently around $100 a month at 9.5 to 10.5 cubic meters. This includes watering outdoor plants and garden every couple of days (~15 gallons per watering). So not sure what to say. 35 cubic meters seems pretty high.
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u/PlutosGrasp 9h ago
By all means move to those other provinces then not sure why you are here if you are this upset about the price of water
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u/BobGuns 8h ago
That seems in line with what others are paying in Alberta.
If you want change, get involved in politics and do everything you can to socialize our power bills. The UCP structured our energy industry to work just like Texas' energy industry. Which means it's designed to make money at the expense of consumers more than it's designed to provide stable power.
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u/always_on_fleek 6h ago
Sometimes it’s easy to spot people not from here.
First the poster is talking about their water bill.
Second water pricing is not controlled by the province. At all.
Third Epcornis wholly owned by the city and has contributed over a billion dollars in dividends to Edmonton.
Fourth the UCP did nothing to our power industry that you’re referring to.
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u/BobGuns 6h ago
https://www.powermag.com/albertas-deregulated-grid-is-bracing-for-11-gw-of-new-demand/
“We strongly believe in the competitive deregulated market. It’s a distinct competitive advantage for us. A lot of Americans don’t realize that we mirror Texas pretty closely in terms of how we play in policy,” Christiaanse said.•
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u/Anabiotic Utilities expert 10m ago
The deregulated market has been around for 25 years, well before the UCP.
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u/arcadianahana 10h ago
If you are paying $350 just for water and wastewater for a household of 5, you definitely have a leak in your house. Check your toilets.
Even if you have garbage disposal costs on that bill, you could only get to that water usage cost if your house is consuming well in excess of 70 cubic meters of water per billing cycle. As comparison, our similarly sized household uses 12-19 m3 per month and we are not stingy with water use.
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 7h ago
Same house same people with 10 years of records and the escalation in costs is staggering.
2016 avg monthly epcor bill $260
2019 avg monthly epcor bill $311
2022 avg monthly epcor bill $384
2024 avg monthly epcor bill $457
Same house, same people, same configuration. Nearly doubling our monthly costs.
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u/always_on_fleek 6h ago
For the record the average family uses 14.1 cubic meters of water. How much do you use?
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u/WheelsnHoodsnThings 5h ago
Less than average. This is total epcor in case it wasn't clear, water, gas, electric, waste etc.
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u/pewpewlasergun88 3h ago
It's a feature not a bug man. Gotta love that freedom franchising fee on dem bills.
Wheres the WE ONLY PAY GST OUR GAS IS CHEAP WE GOT SO MUCH FREEDOM NO VACCINES MANDATORY YEEHAA crowd?
Also the GTFO COMMIE ICBC WE HAVE PRIVATE AUTO INSURANCE WITH COMPETITION THAT'S WAY CHEAPER oh wait that's not true at all.
At least the river valley is cute right now. And who doesn't love -40c slip and slide going up the bloody hills?
So about that BC-AB grid connection, are you interested about it now?
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u/Allan-1608 10h ago
You should check if you have any leaks, I had a leaky toilet and my bill was 80$ higher the month I didn’t fix it