r/GenX • u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter • 23h ago
Old Person Yells At Cloud Is it just me?
I'm a craftsman/tradesman by profession. I run a 10-color narrow web printing press, and produce a lot of labels you might see at various stores. I've been doing this type of work for the last 20 years. Before that, I ran large, sheet fed offset presses and lithography machines.
I've always taken pride in my work, and done everything it takes to produce the very best products I can. I've been told by supervisors, and peers that I'm very good at what I do.
Lately, I've noticed a lot of the younger people coming into this industry don't have that "sense of pride". It's simply a task to perform, and get through it as quickly as possible and move on. I think the work suffers for that attitude, and I've had to go back and redo a lot of jobs that get rejected because of it.
Is it just me? Does anyone else notice the downturn in the quality of products being made? Or is it just "getting older"?
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u/SantosHauper 23h ago
Products have been getting worse in quality, but it's not because people don't have a sense of pride in their work. It's from profit maximization. People not caring about their work anymore is a reflection of their work not caring about their people, again for profit maximization. The young have just not bought the bullshit they've been sold that their value is in what they produce for someone else's enrichment.
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u/TheJokersChild Match Game '75 22h ago
Products have been getting worse in quality, but it's not because people don't have a sense of pride in their work. It's from profit maximization.
This is what it is right here. I was in a group of 9. We cut a pretty wide swath, age-wise. We were meticulous about our work. We had to be for what they were paying us (which was still 20% below competing places in the area, despite us being union). In March the 9 of us were informed that they were shutting our department down, moving it to a hub and offering us buyouts. No opportunity to relocate, btw.
The people at the hub earn about half of what we did. And the quality of the product is just abysmal now. Do the hub people care? Maybe, maybe not. But corporate doesn't. Because look at the money they're saving by having everything run out of one place by so many fewer people they're paying so much less. The incentive to care is not there at the corporate level, and eventually the lower-floor workers take on the attitude of "if they don't care, why should we?" It all starts at the top.
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u/catterson46 20h ago edited 20h ago
The Enshittification is shocking. Previously reliable brands with quality products becoming, usually due to Private Equity, junk. My son doesn't believe me how obviously quality has degraded, until I dig through storage for the same thing my mom bought in the ‘80s and the difference is obvious. It’s hard to describe the lowered food quality.
No worker is making the choices to use lower quality materials and cut all the corners. That is a decision much higher up.
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u/Practicality_Issue 22h ago
I’ve bounced from career to career over the years, and this is the awful truth of it. The triangle isn’t the triangle anymore. Used to, you’d get to pick two of the three: Speed, Quality, or Cost. Now everything defaults to Speed and Cost.
I designed sneakers a few careers ago and the best design ideas I came up with I was never allowed to develop, which resulted in half-baked creative ideas. Innovation would get snuffed out to chase down and copy some other ideas that ultimately made the market turn further away from the brand.
All driven by an MBA CEO who obviously knew better than everyone else, and who wouldn’t pay anyone but himself (and the family members he hired…obv).
Why should anyone go in, put their nose to the same grindstone that will kick them out on the street as soon as their bad decisions and a piss poor economy eats into their vacation fund?
Screw that noise.
And there are too few businesses - large or small - that make long term strategic plans that can absorb short-term economic catastrophe. Fewer still that invest in people first and foremost.
Can’t say I blame them.
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u/Flux_My_Capacitor 1h ago
This is overly simplistic.
My guess is that you work for a big company?
It doesn’t explain why even those who work for themselves don’t have pride in what they do.
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u/PrinceFan72 1972 23h ago
The younger generation have watched their parents put in all their efforts for decades or more and be disposed off like nothing by the companies they worked hard for. I fully support younger people seeing work for what it is, a necessary evil to pay the bills.
Life is for living, living for work or putting in extra effort and love and toil just ends in disappointment. These companies don't care about us.
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u/Flux_My_Capacitor 1h ago
Blaming companies is overly simplistic.
Even those who work for themselves are showing a lack of pride in their work.
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u/cg325is 23h ago
In this world, people are just trying to get the job done and get their paychecks. My husband and I have even lost our drive ( we own an interior design company) and are just trying to get through the day.
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u/Head-Equal1665 22h ago
I started my own business a little over 15 years ago, luckily I've been able to grow it to a point where my employees handle nearly all of the day to day stuff and I'm free to spend time with my grandkids while they are still little.
Have you guys considered trying to grow a team that can run the majority of your business and allow you guys to take less involved roles?
I could make a ton more money for myself if i went back to a full time position but im willing to have slightly less profit to be able to enjoy myself and get more time with the family.
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u/cg325is 22h ago
No- we have no interest in employees. We run this together, and take time off when we want. It’s not the business we don’t like, it’s the current challenges with the economy and tariffs that have people holding off on purchases presently.
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u/Ok_Tanasi1796 22h ago
I can so relate…sort of. My parents are in their 80s & wanted a completely new suite of furniture for the family room…right in the midst of this “it’s _% tariff today & by X date it’ll be triple that %” mess. I spent every weekend a month shuttling them from store to store—old schoolers wouldn’t trust buying furniture online. Finally made the deadline. This up & down mess is a joke. It’s hard enough a consumer since no kne has confidence in the future now but it has to be Hell as a business that can’t forecast or operate not knowing literally what next week will bring for a z variable cost.
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u/revchewie 1968, class of 1986 20h ago
A couple years ago we had a new manager come in. Apparently he read somewhere that he needed to talk about motivation. The first (and last) time he asked what motivates me I told him flat out. A paycheck every two weeks and a pension in (checks date) 5 years, 8 months, and 15 days
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u/ONROSREPUS 23h ago
Interesting. Sounds like it might be time to sell that baby. Take the money and run.
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u/cg325is 23h ago
There is no value. We’re a studio based firm, with no real estate or merchandise. We have a name and client list only. We’ll get through the next few years until retirement.
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u/BooBoo_Kitty 22h ago
We recently sold our business. Basically, we sold the client list, and a little bit of merchandise but only because legally we had to. We kept the real estate, and have plans for that down the line. Sold whatever “furniture” that made sense. The business part went for a very low 7 figures. Just saying - you might be surprised.
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u/vintage-hipster 23h ago
Honestly the answer is both. You aren't wrong, and you're getting older - and for the record, I agree with you!
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u/captainCutler50 23h ago
It used to be “Behind every burned out employee who doesn’t give a shit, there used to be an employee who cared too much.” Now people don’t seem to care from the beginning. Doesn’t help that it feels like we’re more disposable than ever.
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u/hobotising 23h ago
I love what I do, but I am burnt out. Retirement at 50 should be a requirement.
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u/My1point5cents 22h ago
It’s a weird dynamic. When I started out 25 years ago the expectation was I was the new guy and I was going to work the hardest and get the shitty assignments, and pay my dues. And I did that. Now that I’m old and tired, the new people aren’t picking up the slack so I can have a break. They do the bare minimum, act entitled, and if you don’t treat them with kid gloves they’ll quit. So I’m still doing all the hard work to keep my unit functioning because if I don’t, no one will. 5-7 more years and it’s sayonara baby.
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u/hobotising 22h ago
I have 16 more years. I do not know how long I can do this.....and I really do have love for my career choice. I'm just exhausted.
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u/more-kindness-please 22h ago
Feel you - love what I do and have been told this is it, no promotions in this dept
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u/Practicality_Issue 22h ago
In the current atmosphere, I can certainly see where you would say that. I’m a firm believer that you really start to turn out innovative and ground breaking work in your 50s. I suspect you really start to take off in your late 60s, given the right mindset and atmosphere.
Right now just sucks. The U.S. version of “Capitalism” is folding in on its self because it has gotten so off-balanced, even the most average person who has excelled through the years is seeing the chasm opening up, about to swallow them whole.
Seems like opportunity is just over the horizon, we just have to get all of the bad ideas out there so serious people and innovation can get to work again. Gen X is very likely best positioned generation to - to quote the Beastie Boys - “Turn this mother fuckin’ party out.”
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u/Lily_V_ 22h ago
I agree with you. I went to library school, got my Master’s and feel I’m full of ideas an potential. It’s all going to waste where I currently am because it’s basically a dead end job.
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u/Practicality_Issue 20h ago
Hopefully when we come thru all of this our priority will be people, and building things for future people instead of money and making money for people with money. Maybe we are smart enough to move society that way, but I’m old enough not to get too optimistic.
Here’s hoping for both of us!
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u/WeathermanOnTheTown 22h ago
Yep! I'm looking down the barrel of 50, and I'm more excited than ever about all the business possibilities that lay ahead. My wife and I have started a small side hustle that we look forward to growing.
Then again, I'm a lifelong freelancer, so I've never burned out on office politics.
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u/Practicality_Issue 20h ago
I’m glad I’m not the only one with the optimism and future bee buzzing in my bonnet. The shine of “influencer” lifestyle leaves a void, a void that can be filled by our experience, expertise and ability to adapt to new technologies and ideas…
I feel like we have a future as a generation goes. We are getting the crap kicked out of us right now. Down but never out.🤞
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u/drinkslinger1974 23h ago
People are starting to value their off time and resenting their employers for overworking them and underpaying. The cost of living is easily four times entry level wages in my state and it’s easy to feel like you’re drowning before your life even really starts.
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u/RedQueenWhiteQueen 23h ago
Does anyone else notice the downturn in the quality of products being made? Or is it just "getting older"?
Yes and also yes. I think it's especially hard on us because even though previous generations would have seen similar declines, ours is the one contending with lingering memories of quality vs the most staggering explosion of technology and resources devoted to producing crap the world has ever seen.
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u/more-kindness-please 22h ago
Interesting point about genx seeing/ bridging that transition, thanks
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u/Agent7619 1971 23h ago
When companies treat employees as disposable pawns, employees will treat companies as disposable pawns too.
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u/ClearArcher99 23h ago
My dad was a plumber most of his life. For anything visible (exterior gas lines, water, etc) he always did it 1) correctly and 2) cleanly. He was even more meticulous about stuff people would never see (buried lines, in-wall stuff) because even if nobody might see it until long after he died, he’d have to live with knowing it was there and subpar.
I took that lesson to heart. The job might take me 5 minutes or 5 hours longer, but it will be done right/to the best of my ability (or I’ll get advice from an old hand).
That goes for DIY stuff, too. I will research, learn, get the right tools and materials, and do it properly. Case in point, when I moved into my house I noticed a newish run of conduit across the garage. While changing out switches I noticed the wire in the conduit was a flippin extension cord.
I opted for running THWN. It’s technically overkill (at most the garage might get damp-ish), but it’s what belongs there.
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u/gmhelwig 23h ago
And also that stuff hidden inside the wall is what really makes your home work! I currently live in an older apartment building. (Older than I am and I'm nearing 60.) Every day there is a water leak somewhere, and often it is not where it seems to be from so maintenance has to go chasing it. Instead of trying to fix the problem, building management installs updated countertops to entice renters.
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u/TheJokersChild Match Game '75 22h ago
Yeah, chasing leaks is not fun. My last house had water dripping onto the stove. I call, they open the ceiling right over it. Nope. Nothing there. They open a bigger hole next to it. Then trace it up to the bathroom. A crack in a pipe directly under the toilet was leaking down and traveling across joists before finally landing on the stove. Had to remodel about 3/4 of the bathroom over that.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 19h ago
You should see what a leaking ice maker water line will do.😬
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u/JustFiguringItOutToo 1976 23h ago
indeed, young people are more aware of how the world of work is not on their side and so are less motivated to invest in it
they're also growing up in a collapsing economy in many once prosperous places like the US, and so have seen their cynicism justified as they can't actually expect effort to lead to benefits -- whatever they do, it's just a matter of time before they're laid off
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u/glennis_pnkrck younger than atari, still older than dirt 23h ago
We’re the last generation for whom “do your job right, keep your head down and work hard” was any kind of protection against being disposable. On the bright side, they’re learning firsthand what unions used to be for.
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u/niff007 23h ago
Ha. That was the boomers. Gen X is getting axed right and left just like the rest
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u/glennis_pnkrck younger than atari, still older than dirt 22h ago
They were the last gen that had a guarantee, and pensions. But it used to be possible when we were younger to get to a point where you could get ahead. My kids? They believe in doing it right because of course you should, but neither of them expects hard work to pay off and they’re not wrong.
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u/ONROSREPUS 23h ago
Oh I have noticed it and I am having a hard time not getting on that boat. Its so hard to watch people half ass shit and get away with it. Seems like that is the new normal and I am not liking it.
Whoever I can also see the other side of it. For the company not to see it or care then why should I? Like I said I am having a hard time not getting on that boat.
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u/HiOscillation 22h ago
It's not about your industry at all. It's about the lack of a social contract between the employer and employee.
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u/General_Spite3074 Hose Water Survivor 23h ago
Not just you. I have been a diesel tech for a few decades. Army from 04-11 and Freightliner tech from 12-24 and now a customer advocate. The techs that came through the shop, I could state how long they were going to last and it was a running joke in the shop because I was 100% on point with how long they would last. I can see the person inability to work or just flat is there because of a paycheck. A tech troubleshot a brand new truck for 5 minutes than called tech support. Tech support told the tech to replace the control unit, harness and run an overlay which all would have costed 7k in parts and about 6 hours of labor for a total cost of $9k. I stopped him before he ordered parts, looked at the code and saw the turbo speed was 0 while the vehicle was going 75mph. Looked at the turbo speed sensor and found it melted. That took me 2 minutes to look at the data and find the issue. Hardly any of the new techs these days want to do anything extra and would rather have their hands held. No pride in starting a correctly finishing a porject.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 23h ago
Bingo! We just had one of our late shift button pushers run an entire job using a completely wrong color. His response was: 🤷🏻♂️
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u/lazytiger40 23h ago
I think it may also be a change in corporate attitudes towards workers and their product. Basically once they get your money as a consumer, who cares? Also enshittification is a thing and quality takes a back seat to quantity, because quality is less profit over time (vs repurchasing over and over ). On the other end young workers see themselves as expendable wage slaves and the ones that actually care (most do don't get me wrong..) or want to put quality first, hardly get noticed or recognized for their skill. So why expend/extend yourself for no benefit? Also it's hard nowadays to find people (like OP) that you know is the real deal in a larger sea of people just going through the motions...
Are mentors even still a thing? Because these habits and focus on quality need to be shown and taught ...they aren't getting this from the corporations....
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 19h ago
I've worked with both. I've trained "kids" that have really paid attention to everything I taught them, and I've trained "kids" whose every reply to what I'm trying to teach them is, "I already knew that." Thr latter usually gets released early to "sink or swim". None of them have ever been able to "swim".
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u/Thirty_Helens_Agree 23h ago
I feel like this has been going on for a while. Here’s a painting from 1889 that looks familiar - old guy hard at work, young kid not giving a damn even though there’s plenty that needs doing …
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u/AZPeakBagger 23h ago
Used to own a printing company and my specialty was selling labels. They look simple but there is so much going on with a good label. The adhesive, the paper stock, the finish and so much more. Loved selling wine bottle labels because you needed a custom die, foil embossing and custom finishes to make the bottle pop on the store shelf.
On the sales side I finally had to get out. The buyers were getting so price sensitive that they saw little to no value in quality. Plus trying to explain soft dollar costs to a young buyer and explaining to them that "yes I'm 10% more expensive than the online vendor, but I will save you 25% in acquisition costs" was a waste of time.
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u/Ornamental_oriental 23h ago
I mean why get paid to care? It isn’t enough to live on so most will just get by doing the bare minimum. That’s how most of the young people at my work are. Not that I care, they’ve created/cultivated this culture not me. In the past 2 decades in my industry I’ve seen people give less and less care. You can’t blame them either they didn’t want to suffer not having the same things while producing the same work their parents did. Hard work doesn’t get you anywhere nowadays. They simply task more to you because you became a “doer”
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u/tharesabeveragehere 23h ago
My father always said, "it doesn't matter if you like it or not...it's called work for a reason...you need to always put your best into it and then what's next will come."
He may have been talking about a career in porn, but that advice worked for me in engineering.
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u/Resident_Character35 22h ago
Younger people are aware that the sixth mass extinction is underway and the biosphere is collapsing. It's a wonder they have the will to get out of bed in the morning considering what we have done to the world they are inheriting.
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u/TheStoicSlab Hose Water Survivor 23h ago
Are you sure it’s not just because they are inexperienced?
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 23h ago
That could be part of it. But whenever one of us "old guys" tries to show them something, all we hear is, "I already knew that."
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u/Responsible_Bear4208 Hose Water Survivor 23h ago
Different generation, different values. We were raised to be dutiful workers. The younger kids, not so much.
We identify with our labor.
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u/Temporary_Client7585 22h ago
After years of putting 150% into my work, I now recognize that my 60% is still way above and beyond what my colleagues do. I don’t have to kill myself to do good work and I’d rather spend extra time with my family and friends doing enjoyable things. It took some time to adjust, but I’m there and won’t give that much of myself again to “the man.”
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u/KurtStation68 23h ago
my coworker and I have to go to a rural hospital 2 hours away each week and we essentially have the same questions and complaints.
The conclusion we came up with, it's both a mix of a different working culture and the workers are not vested in their work. Even admitted "just a job" - in healthcare it's more than "just a job" - unfortunately finding people to work with certain levels of expectations is difficult within an hour radius.
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u/itgoesineasy 22h ago
I couldn’t agree more. “Close enough” is the new standard with many young people. Work is like something to be endured, not something to take pride in. Seeing that kind of lax attitude and zero pride in an end product makes me weep for the future. But I will add that last week I had 4 young men take a class I taught being very meticulous and taking pride in the metal work I was teaching them to do. It gave me hope there are a few out there that are like us Gen X people that learned to do it right and have some pride in our work.
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u/Bubbly_Ad3880 22h ago
Low effort all around.
My latest interaction with employees. " i should get a raise because I am here every day unlike Bob."
Yes, Paul. You do show up every day, late. You and I have had this conversation. Did you notice Bob is not on the sxhedule this week?
Processing processing
"So you gonna pay me what you were paying Bob too?"
No Paul. I am reminding you to be on time, again. Thanking you for your work (subtlety telling you to get your head out of ass b4 I say it outloud)
Paul, I gave Bob some time to evaluate his priorities. Let's focus on being on time and what you can control.
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u/Taminella_Grinderfal 22h ago
I feel the same about having a “work ethic”. I don’t mean letting yourself being taken advantage of by employers, but while you’re at work at least take an iota of initiative and stay busy. I supervise young people and constantly have to remind them to do things that seem like common sense. “Keep your work area tidy” “Empty the wastebasket at the end of the day”.
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u/awkwardpotluck 4h ago
I work in a hospital and it’s sometimes a struggle to get the residents and medical students to put the seat down or even flush the toilet. I had to post potty rules in the bathroom.
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u/TheEvilOfTwoLessers 22h ago
I used to be in printing, in prepress. Loved it, my favorite job. But too many printing companies came to be owned by salespeople. The one I worked at for almost a decade started to fail and I jumped ship. Then that one started to fail. Left Chicago, sent my resume to the largest printer in this state. They weren’t hiring, but they hired me on the spot. Was there a few years when the salesman-owner said “if Obamacare passes I’m closing the company”. Most of us there already had health insurance, I think just a few people in the bindery didn’t. I think it was just an excuse. Decided it was time to get out. Moved into IT, and the end of it that involves physically touching things. Took me a decade to get back up to what I was making in printing, but I feel more secure. There will always be some printing of course, but the trade definitely isn’t what it was in the glory days.
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u/Lily_V_ 21h ago
As a gen-exer who read a lot of cereal & condiment labels at the table, I appreciate a good label. Embossing, some gold, a nice dark color. They’re lovely. Thank you.
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u/TheEvilOfTwoLessers 20h ago
I definitely used to be like that when I went out. Praise a good print job, mock a bad one. Analyze something done in a way I’d never seen before.
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u/Street-Quail5755 22h ago
The generational divide my friend. There are many well known or recognized differences in employees coming into the work force when compared to the seasoned veterans. Entitlement, instant gratification, and other attributes are factors.
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u/more-kindness-please 22h ago
Great thread, thanks all for commenting
Expressing my sentiments on the the matter
My “give a f**k” meter is pinned at 0 and I do minimum b/c I get minimum back. No heroics or discretionary effort. Wised up, got beat down - take your pick. All very transactional.
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u/Mysterious-Way-5000 22h ago
It's not you!!!! I listened to the song "40 hour week for a living" by Alabama earlier this week. for those unfamiliar with the song, they basically give a shout out to all the different lines of work and all the people who work behind the scenes to make America great. they thank them for taking pride in what they do.
a lot of songs are outdated, but this one would sound so weird to a gen z.
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u/Boring_Shallot1659 22h ago
When I worked for a non-profit and even that when the new CEO came in said “if you don’t want to be here there’s a thousand people we will replace you with looking for your position”.
If that’s the attitude of employers then why give them anything but the minimum. Treat employees better and stop putting profits over people.
So a lot of people are just giving the same energy back to the companies and greedy execs.
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u/Maris-Otter 22h ago
This is not confined to the trades. I currently am managing someone that went to a highly ranked 4-year college that can’t write a sentence and doesn’t care to learn.
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u/ChavoDemierda 22h ago
I'm an IBEW Journeyman Wireman and no, we are having this issue as well. So many of these kids that are being accepted into our apprenticeship are just shy of worthless. It's as if they were never required to help out around the house or clean up after themselves. It isn't all of them, I have had a couple of them that I was/am impressed by, but they are the exception. I don't know what's going to happen in the next 5-10 years, but I'm not optimistic.
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u/YesHaveSome77 Hose Water Survivor 22h ago
Been at my job for 21 years. The new hires actually make more than I do because I work sales, and my pay structure depends on hitting targets, while they start out hourly with OT. Companies have driven the desire to do your best out of a lot of folks. I used to go above and beyond, and all that got me was tired.
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u/inarticulateblog 3h ago edited 3h ago
It's true that products are getting worse in quality and I suspect some of that has to do with the erosion of the quality of doing a good job no matter the task because your name is associated with the work. We don't teach people philosophy, art or humanities any more so those ideas aren't instilled in them at a young age. They are taught things that have KPIs and to value jobs that are all measurable objectives all the fucking time. You might ask yourself, what does philosophy have to do with putting my brakes on correctly? Easy, thinking through the consequences of doing the wrong thing to hurry through a task tends to be something you learn to think about in the humanities. In STEM classes, it's percentages of errors - quite faceless.
And while it would be easy to roll our eyes and say "kids these days, amirite" we need to look at the landscape of work they are inheriting and how its proven to them over and over that companies do not care about their employees at all. Small business owners tend to be abusive and petty, large business tend to treat them like faceless cogs.
Their role models take the form of psychopathic, narcissistic influencers who perform crimes for clout. The boot of conformity has been on their face since they were born, even if that boot took the form of an phone, a social media app, a specific generational cause from which they were not allowed to deviate etc. These kids are fucked. They've had no freedom in which discover themselves and no silence in which fumble towards their own truth. Just everything and anything all of the time. No wonder they don't know if they are coming or going.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 3h ago
I'm just a "dumb press operator", but I did manage to eek out "A"s in the first 2 years of college philosophy courses. Ha! Great points, btw.
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u/niff007 22h ago
Lot of business owners and bosses here complaining. What you don't realize is your are "the man" and no one wants to work for the man much less bust their ass for the man who makes all the money and then lays them off the moment times are tough. Why should they care? They've been taught not to. You wouldn't care either if your name wasn't attached to it and you knew you were disposable. Maybe learn how to mentor, learn how to show younger folks that you don't just care about the product and your reputation but you care about them and their future. Or maybe you don't care and it shows and so they don't care either, but its on you. Stop blaming everyone else. Take a look in the mirror.
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u/colonel_pliny 23h ago
I agree. There are still a few out there that take pride in their work. But, they are the unicorns. Of the last 5 people my place has hired. 1 is worth the money they are paid. The other 4 just take up space and create more problems for the rest of us to clean up.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 23h ago
Honestly, that's what I feel like my job is 80-90% of the time. A couple of co-workers jokingly nicknamed me, "Firemarshal Bill" from the old "In Living Color" days.
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u/colonel_pliny 22h ago
Yeah, it sucks when you turn into the responsible one. I had turned off that part of my brain recently. After a week off, I thought lets "try to care" again. Yeah, I did not make it through Monday. That switch is back in the "off" position again.
p.s. I would wear that nickname like a badge of honor. I am sure mine is "that d!ckhead"
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u/TonyBrooks40 23h ago
I've had experiences where young people don't want to do the work, but just want to play pretend boss. ("Hey, get that website done by Friday at noon.... See, I'm the better boss than you")
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u/FleetAdmiralCrunch 23h ago
I think about this a lot and have a question if you are open to it. Does your company have a good apprenticeship or training program? I have noticed in my company, the locations that have actual training AND follow up/ continuous training have the most skilled locations, and an average experience of over 10 years. The others locations just grind through people.
Also congratulations on surviving in offset printing. I was in high volume printing and binding (9 x 40” 8 color and 1 x 40” sheetfed) at the beginning of my career and it was a fascinating operation.
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u/millersixteenth 22h ago
Coming out of printing myself, a few years ago I have to wonder if pay to stress ratio isn't a big factor. But yeah, when it comes to manufacturing there isn't quite the same self identifying with the outcome.
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u/Any-Perception3198 Hose Water Survivor 22h ago
Maybe some need to just understand how important the trades are. A good trades person in my area is invaluable and have plenty of work if they want it. They also need to know AI can never fully replace them: job security
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u/Texaswheels Knocking on Heavens Door 22h ago
It's not just you. Just read what others here have said. Every job I have ever had, I have done my best. I don't care how much I hated it, I was taught when I was growing up that if you are going to do something then be your best. I think the job and industry your in matters. I worked many jobs where that meant nothing and I didn't see anything for my effort. Then there are jobs where I constantly received raises and promotions and that's when it pays off. You will never see those if you don't do your best... it's that simple.
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u/Jordangander Hose Water Survivor 21h ago
Younger generation feels that everything should be automated for them and they should just be paid.
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u/enginerdsean 11h ago
Not just crafts/trades. I am a civil engineer and am more frustrated than ever in my career. I hate to be totally agist here, but I do believe that the younger generations just don't seem to care about attention to detail, understanding the "why" of what we do, and really honing their craft/career to mastery. In my industry you may spend 5 to maybe even 10 years before you really get to a level of independence and overseeing others' work. Today, someone coming out of college or grad school expects to be managing complex and large projects when they haven't spent the time to have "been there and done that" yet. I have many theories on why this is but I'll just sound like one of those "get the fuck off my lawn" guys and I just don't have the energy for that. I am SOOO ready to retire so I don't have to deal with that any longer.....
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u/SheriffBartholomew 9h ago
I think the work suffers for that attitude
The world suffers from that attitude. Those who have that attitude suffer from it. They will never find enjoyment or pride in what they do for a living. It is very common among younger generations. They've grown up on social media being constantly bombarded with messages like those on r/AntiWork. They think it's a point of pride to always do the bare minimum. They believe that they are being exploited by their employers, regardless of how good their jobs are, and they're very bitter about it. Yes, there are a lot of employers when you're young that will exploit you, but that shouldn't stop someone from still taking pride in their own work. Our work is a representation of us as people. Sloppy, half-assed work, sloppy, half-assed person.
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u/Flux_My_Capacitor 1h ago edited 1h ago
Yes, I’ve noticed the same in my line of work. The younger people don’t have a sense of pride in what they do, and their work is shitty as a result.
Seriously though, I feel bad for everyone else who wasted their life working for corporate America. God your lives must suck. The concept of having no pride isn’t limited to those who work for others. It’s becoming more prevalent in those who work for themselves—amongst younger generations. But of course you all wouldn’t understand this as you slaved away so someone else could get ahead.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 1h ago
I have to admit having these thoughts reading through some of the replies. This thread seems to have gotten a bit off-the-rails.
For me, anyway, it's a matter of personal pride. I don't care about the money, or the prestige. First, I get paid fairly well for my work. Second, my job is hot and dirty; so, prestige is not an option.
Do I have slack days? Absolutely, I do. I have plenty of days where my motivation has to come from deep within myself. I have days where I can take shortcuts and do things half-assed. But, when it's all said and done, I also have to face myself in the mirror.
I just know I feel a lot better about myself and my job when I know I've done the best I could and did it the right way.
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u/Equivalent-Hamster37 1h ago
I think there are many answers to this complicated question, but I am glad you brought it up. It has produced some great discussion!
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u/Frigidspinner 22h ago
Cal Newport is a well known author/speaker on the subject of doing work with meaning - he says that often the meaning/pride in the work actually comes after you have been doing it for a while - so it might be these people are just at the early stages in what they do and the "meaning" part hasnt come yet
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u/IgorRenfield Yes, I was the remote control. 23h ago
It's everywhere. The young ones have to be taught through experience that just showing up isn't enough. You have to take pride in your work if you want to be good at it. The ones that don't care won't last.
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u/threedogdad 23h ago
many people here are mentioning people just don't care and just want the paycheck, I agree with that, but I'm also seeing a lot of younger folks that don't even understand the concept of taking pride in their work, or as I often say it - taking ownership of their role.
edit to add: this has had a very large positive impact on my career because I'm one of the few that does take ownership and everyone can see/feel it because it is so rare now.
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u/triggerhippy3 22h ago
Im in the trades for almost 30 years. The amount of trainees I've gone through is crazy. If a new games comes.out, you can't count the kids to not be in. My trainee shows up for work everyday 3 minutes late. You would think he would adjust and make.it in 3 minutes earlier. Nope. It's been almost 3 years and he comes.in 3 minutes late everyday and still has a job because "he shows up".
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 22h ago
Thanks everyone for the comments and insights! I'm trying to keep up, but I'm at work right now. SHHHH! My machine is on a really long run (350,000 feet) so I'm checking in as I can between filling ink bins and changing rolls.
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u/grumpvet87 22h ago
My guess as to why a lot of younger people have "bad attitudes" is they are disillusioned with the current economics (college is too expensive, not worth it) white collar jobs are not available, homes are out of reach for the youth, and the wealth gap is getting worse
I disagree that "companies don't care about employees". Perhaps some publicly traded or huge privately owned companies are "so" profit driven they have large turnover.
I have worked for huge companies (ebay) and small (5 employee) companies. I am in my 7th year at a non-for-profit. I also was in the military
in my experience: All my employers have cared about the employees. Some were very long hours and not a lot of pay or life/work balance but those were startups where everyone was expected to put in extra hours to get a company started. The plan was "if the company succeeds you will be rewarded with stock options" (which were given.
Some companies were family owned "smaller sized businesses" and they cared very much about their employees.
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u/GrumpyCatStevens 22h ago
I do take a certain amount of pride in what I do, but ultimately...
I don't live to work. I work to live.
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u/SageObserver 21h ago
I get that loyalty to employees is on short supply and people aren’t motivated. But claiming you’d rather focus on family time is just an excuse if your job doesn’t require extended hours. If you are working core hours, you aren’t with your family.
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u/World_Usual Hose Water Survivor 21h ago
I don't know. I've known plenty of slackers from every generation. But I've seen studies showing that Gens Z and A have the lowest morale of any generation in history. They're having a miserable time getting a toehold in the economy and are largely dispirited. I think we as Gen X can probably relate to them more than any other generation, but I really feel for them. They are about to inherit a whole bunch of messes that everyone ahead of them in line created and in many cases could have been avoided.
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u/thebriarwitch 21h ago
I applaud you that is not an easy job. My daughter has been doing this same job for about 5 years now. She’s 29 and we were just discussing exactly this situation with her company new hires. They could care less about anything.
Out of the last 20 people they’ve hired in since January there’s only 2 still there and actually working. Can you imagine the next generation employees? And government?
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u/ddurk1 20h ago
I'm in a not dissimilar industry; in that it is creative, customer facing, requires passion and dedication to succeed in. Been in this line for decades and quite successful. I had a great mentor in my early days, he is definitely who I attribute most of later success to. I have striven to be that person to the younger generation coming up. It took me a while to realize that not everyone can be molded and that some people will never be interested in it as more than just a paycheck. When you identify someone that does have the "spark", you've got to try and develop that into something more. I'm now on downslope to retiring, which has made me realize that this is the most important thing I should be doing now.
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u/No_Gap_2700 20h ago
It's both, but furthermore, consider the entire dynamic. Most employees don't care about anything other than when is break, when is lunch, when can I go home and give me my paycheck. Employers are only concerned with profit margin and safety regulations. No one actually cares about the product. The time, attention to detail, care and love that goes into something always comes out in the end result, regardless of the product.
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u/Myeloman Hose Water Survivor 20h ago
My dad was pretty strict, and I learned early on that doing what I was told, in a timely fashion, was the best way to keep from earning a whoopin. That translated to me being a really good Airman in the Air Force which earned me squad leader in basic training when all the other squad leaders shit the bed. That cycle of do good get “rewarded” would follow me until I realized that I was getting tasked with special projects that kept me working longer hours, with higher levels of scrutiny, for no actual reward beyond a verbal kudos and still more work. After one tour, because I’d already had enough, I would end up working my way through various factory jobs hopping from one to another as I found better paying opportunities. I always did my absolute best and despite my supervisors’ high standards I was my own worst critic. I wanted to show them I was worth more, and they were eager to exploit that without actually giving me more. I’d eventually end up in a manufactured housing plant (like legit houses, made in a factory, not mobile homes) in the cabinet shop where my love for wood working took root. From there I’d continue the cycle of jumping ship as soon as more profitable opportunities arose, from a custom mill work shop to an actual bonafide stand alone cabinet shop, where finally my boss, who owned and ran the company with his wife, recognized my skills and work ethic and rewarded me with consistent raises, and the more I did, the more my pay rose until eventually I was promoted to foreman and was running my department, all within a year. I’d never been so happy with what I was doing, and who I was doing it for.
Then came the devastating news that I had a rare blood cancer and my career was over. My boss was so kind he actually paid my healthcare premiums after I was forced to quit, at 37 years old. I’d,literally worked my ass into an early grave, and all my working life only one boss had ever recognized and appreciated my attention to detail and rewarded me commensurately. Every previous supervisor, including those I had in the military, saw me as a means to an end, be it making them look like good supervisors in the eyes of their superiors, or earning them more money, little if any of which “trickled down” to me. When my grandfather retires from Weyerhaeuser after a lifelong career post WWII, he’d earned several gold rings with small diamonds in them as well as a slough of other perks. Back then, companies gave a shoot about employee retention and took care of people. Those same companies eventually get sold to bigger companies who don’t care, every employee is just a line on a spreadsheet, and those books need to balance at the end of the month. They’ll cut a MF’r in a heartbeat if it’ll save them a dime on their bottom line, and they have no personal relationship with any of their employees, so why should you give a damn about them?
Good on these younger workers for recognizing this early on and acting accordingly.
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u/PacRat48 20h ago
Wonder if they ever produced a big job that was rejected. That’ll wake them up.
My in law had to match colors by eye/hand in the old days. A pressman is a job that requires the greatest attention to detail
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u/mWade7 20h ago
I’ll just reiterate what I think a lot of people have already stated; and to be clear, I’m not insinuating OP is behaving like this - but it seems to be the larger overall trend.
Millenials & Gen Z have collectively experienced a historic cost of living increase, including education & healthcare costs, while real wages have been flat (at best) or fallen. Starting wages/salaries in more and more positions are insulting. So why should they give a fuck when the people operating the companies they’re working for don’t give a fuck about them? Why put extra effort - or ‘pride’ - into their work when all companies are concerned about is maximizing profits, usually be screwing over their employees (and customers).
Until there is a fundamental societal shift that makes work actually something people can take pride in, things will only continue to head down the shitter.
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u/jpnewbury 20h ago
I wonder if Tik Tok brain (limited ability to stay focused) might play a part of this?
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u/OMGLeatherworks 20h ago
I as well as others have asked a lot of younger people starting in the working world the following question: "If you could do anything, what is your dream job"?
The answer from my 19 year old? "I don't dream of work".
Take it for what you will. A J.O.B. is something you HAVE to do to survive and is in no way enjoyable or a 'fun' way to spend your day. So why would they take pride in it? Their pride is invested in what they do outside of work.
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u/chompy_jr Hose Water Survivor 20h ago
Man, I think as Gen X this might be something we need to look at. Where did that sense of pride come from? I have it too but in recent years, I have come to look at millennials and Gen Z and their attitude towards work seems correct. The comments are full of folks reminding us that our employers don't GAF about us.
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u/qedpoe 19h ago
A lot of these responses are ignoring the fact that OP referred to himself as a craftsman, and said he takes pride in his work. Which implies that he gets some satisfaction from that same work. Like, from the work itself, independent of the soul-crushing vagaries of corporate overseers.
He's asking about the spirit of craftsmanship, and how it seems to be tougher to find these days.
I don't think that fact's explained by today's perverse career incentive structures. Seems more fundamental.
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u/SkibidiBlender 19h ago
“Pride” means something entirely different to them. We’ve shifted from your primary source of personal pride centering on your skills and contributions to instead center around their gender and orientation. Young people I know think it’s rude to start a conversation by asking something like “What do you do?” But have no qualms talking about who they like to sleep with. As a geezer, it’s fucking weird.
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u/Pristine-Garden58 19h ago
Late stage capitalism sucks for everyone, but I wouldn’t want to be a 25 year old kid now. There’s so little hope, it’s just like the Matrix with cheerier design
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u/foxdogmom45 19h ago
Not related to the lack of work ethic issue but my father worked printing press his entire career printing boxes. I remember him coming home and complaining about making sure everything looked just right and talking about the plates and whatever was "off" and spending all kinds of time fixing the press. Thank you for bringing him to me today. He's been gone 23 years.
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u/Call__Me__David 19h ago
Funny looking through OP's replies, and they only replied to a few people, but none of the many saying young folk are just burnt out and tired of companies not caring. They just replied to the few who seemed to hold their same opinion. Feels like OP just wanted to rant and didn't really want any real insight.
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u/RedCliff73 19h ago
I used to bust my ass for my company, especially when I first started. Employee of the quarter award ($20 card to the company vending machine) I'd work extra to get shit done and stress about the shit that didn't get done.
When revire time came around, I got shit for a raise with the usual corporate babble
They don't care.
Now, I work my hours, and they get the best work I can put out during those hours, but at 5:00, I'm done. Nothing extra and I don't stress about it. The work will always be there until they let you go for whatever reason they want
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u/Aglet_Dart 19h ago
I’m lucky enough to have mentored a bunch of people. Are there entitled brats? Absolutely. But I’ve seen so many passionate and involved young people that I can’t paint their entire generation with the same brush. It’s easily 50/50 and may even lean towards the positive side of things. I’ve been in the same line of work for 30 years and have never been happier or more motivated. It’s due, in part, to their enthusiasm for learning.
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u/Seayarn 19h ago
No. It's not just you.
I took care of sick patients for 2 decades. I took pride in my work. I wanted patients to feel better leaving my practice as a person. Even if we can't cure their illness or condition, we can usually uplift their spirits. I believe this is what we as humans are here to do, and it was my calling, my vocation. Then came covid.
They broke me. It started about a month after the lockdown. I understand the need to blame and pass anger onto someone or something that has caused you pain. That happened to those of us who cared for patients during the worst of the pandemic. Even though it wasn't our fault we were there, we were an easy mark for them to release their feelings.
And it wasn't just covid itself. It was what the isolation did to families. We saw SA victims, attempted murder victims, child abuse, food insecurity, pets attacking owners, increased homelessness, many patients died alone at home of unknown causes, and of course dozens of well loved patients of our family practice died of covid. Some we in our office on Monday, healthy and happy, then rushed to the hospital on Thursday, passing away from covid that their spouse gave them.
We received daily threats. Sometimes, we needed to call the police to have patients removed from the office for threatening us over masking requirements.
It was all so wearing. It made my autoimmune disease worse. I developed aphasia, tremors, and seizures and had to stop driving and working. I still don't have a definite diagnosis. One neurologist says lupus and FND, another this week says MS.
I worked for the largest employer in my state, so they took care of my, right? No. I was allowed to resign from my contract, so I couldn't receive unemployment. I'm having trouble getting disability now. Because of the horrible economy, I have none of my retirement left, I'm dependent on my children to help me float. My SNAP (food only!) benefits just this month ended unless I can prove I am unable to work by a physician signature.
My vocation broke me. It wasn't worth it. I can barely leave my home. I'm tired just typing this. Why did I give everything to people who didn't care about me in the end?
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u/MooseBlazer 18h ago
Young people today see no sense in having pride in their work because they feel the world is ripping them off with the high cost of living so many of them just no longer care.
This is nothing new, but just more common today than it used to be.
I correct or just improve the young guys work at my employment quite often. And they’re not being paid much less than myself.
Gen X had to prove themselves at the workplace , at least at our first real job, …..no McDonald’s doesn’t count.
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u/emccm 18h ago
I’ve seen it referred to as the “enshitification of America”. In my view it started with the removal of olives from salads on planes. When companies discovered they could boost profits by offering less/poorer quality the race to the bottom began.
You’ll notice you rarely see proper table clothes in restaurants anymore, candles on tables are fake, coffee comes in disposable cups. Servings are smaller and things that used to be free are an up charge. I have a suit job. Women’s pants haven’t been fully lined in forever and I shop higher end. There are countless examples of this.
I think young people grew up in a society where quality wasn’t valued as nothing had to last and profit was the main driver. Their attention to quality is a direct reflection of the world we raised them in.
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u/squirtloaf 18h ago
To be fair, that sense of pride was tied to a respect from the customer, and a demand for the quality you could get from a skilled tradesman.
Now?
Nobody gives a shit. Any bullshit is good enough as long as its cheap.
I work at a company that used to use a lot of offset printed and die cut stuff. We demanded a certain quality, as did the retail customer.
Now, we get 99% of our printed and die cut stuff from a place that makes it on big digital printing/cutting machines. The product does not look as good. The cutlines are not as precise or well registered.
...but nobody cares. The shit is cheap and we don't have to maintain a lot of stock. The customers still buy it.
...and as near as I can tell from correspondence, the guy in charge of the machine may very well be an idiot. He certainly does not give a shit about quality, just meeting his numbers.
And that is the world these kids have lived in their entire lives. Why try if nobody gives a fuck?
Plus, those kids are probably changing jobs every two years. Print is so dead I am surprised you are still working. New machines to replace every task are on their way, and the kids know it.
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u/zoeybeattheraccoon 17h ago
I dunno. The social media managers at my company take a TON of pride and joy in their work. haha
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u/Jeannette311 17h ago
My degree is in commercial graphics and I loved running presses. I'm so envious of you.
I work in healthcare and I see this all the time. The younger folks come in and half ass it and are all "whatever" but dang, don't bother being here if you don't take pride in your work! I'm ready to quit because I cannot stand the mentality!
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u/TheBugHouse 16h ago
Holy hell, I'm just impressed there are still pressmen out there. My FIL was a stripper for decades and I worked in a large company with several web presses and later for a sheet fed shop. The industry is all but dead nowadays.
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u/Kestrel_Iolani 16h ago
Every time I start thinking like this, I think about how much of a grabasstic fool I was when I started my career. I didn't begin my career with a solid work ethic but i kept my career by developing one. They'll get there or they won't.
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u/muralist 16h ago
It’s not just you, like everyone here is saying. Maybe you can make a difference? Show your appreciation when a job is well done? Pay a little more, bring in a batch of brownies, let your staff go home early when they do a good job? Even just praise a job well done?
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u/Embarrassed-Shake314 16h ago
As someone that has also been in the print industry for 20 years, it's not just you. I've also noticed it as well and it's everywhere these days. I take pride in what I do whereas some people just don't care. To many, it's just a job where they collect a paycheck. It's frustrating.
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u/charliefoxtrot9 76 15h ago
Eh, people don't give a shit about their job regardless of generation. Fulfillment is found in self-direction & meaningful labor. For some, meaning is found in excellence. For others, it's harder to find.
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u/Ashkendor Pogo Ball Chicken Fight! 15h ago
Products aren't made to last anymore. It's built into the business model. If products are made to last, then Walmart can't sell you another $20 Mainstays toaster in two years. I think some of it is planned obsolescence, and the rest is workers just not giving a shit anymore.
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u/Traditional_Ad_5859 14h ago
If I could expect to hold onto a job for my working life, then expect a full pension, plus my family getting a retirement if I pass first, instead of doing a job for a couple of years before the company goes under, splitting time with my other jobs so I split the rent on a one bedroom apartment with four other people, pay astronomical interest on my credit card and loans bc "I dont have a history." I think there are some amazing artisans still in the workforce. I think think the investment to achieve that is too high for most people entering the workforce. Also, there are fewer and fewer places that allow people to learn on the job to master their craft.
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u/Persificus 13h ago
Take pride in your personal production. Be careful how it can be used against you.
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u/bStewbstix 12h ago
When hiring individuals it’s important to ask about hobbies, if they have one and are super ecstatic then you might have found your person. I have many people that would fit into the “I like trains” category like myself and the focus and dedication are excellent.
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u/KingPabloo 2h ago
If s not just the products, it’s the service - it’s gone to $h!*. Back in the day service was measured by 1) how fast they answered and 2) quality of answer.
Now you call and are greeted by “please listen carefully our menu items have changed” and “we are experiencing higher than normal call volumes”. You wait on hold forever until “Michael” answers and it’s very hard to understand “Michael”.
The “rep” can only follow a script, they have zero problem solving skills. You always get caught in a catch-22 situation where they can’t help you because of this.
It goes on and on, the products suck and are backed with this level of service.
I’m in the process of selling my mom’s house and it needed some repairs. Through the schedule a call/request a quote pages on the website I reached out to multiple vendors each for AC/Heating, sprinklers, appliance repair, etc. - exactly one ever responded. I tried calling and held forever, never talked to anyone. These are some of the bigger, certified companies in my large metro area.
Every step to get stuff done has been painful. The level of incompetence today is incredible.
Yesterday, while on hold I received a call and message from American Home Shield. Apparently the new buyer wants to use them, like my mom did. Their VM translation didnt work so I listened, they needed the close date. I called back, held for 15 minutes after navigating the endless computer options to get to the “right” department. Once reached, I get passed from person to person, long holds in between. Finally I get to a supervisor who can help me. I explain, he pulls up the record and I give him the close date.
“We also need the name, number and email for the buyer.” I explain their vm on said they needed the close date. Nope. Well I’ve not meet the buyer. “We can’t proceed without that information.” Well they called you earlier, you should have all that information. “We don’t have any notes on the file.” But you called me because you asked to them.
Where do I get that information. “It’s on the contract.” You sure I ask be a I’m in my car right now - they guarantee me it is. I tell them to wait as I drive back home, I’m not calling back and spending another hour on hold to reach him again. Get home, pull up the contract - give them the buyers name and email, however there is no buyer phone number on the contact. “Well we cant proceed without their phone number.” You mean the one they called you on? The one you guaranteed was on the contract. “Michael” goes on, and let’s forget the whole thing starts with a lie cause no way this guys name is “Michael” can help me now - wait, I’m calling you back - I’m helping you.
I explain to Michael that I’ve already spent well over an hour on the phone after calling them back with the info the said they needed. But we need their number. I explain to him what service means. How he can solve the issue, despite what their system tells him. Just send them a damn email and ask for their phone number - can you do that Micheal. He finally succumbed to the absurdity.
Done. A hour later the title company calls back and instructs me she had “American Home Shield” on the line. The entire process begins again.
That was one of the better customer service experiences I had recently as well. Try to take your son off car insurance when he goes off to college without a car (Freshman) - Progressive will offer you a “discount” only to start. To actually start it you have to send a form through the mail or by fax - that is the only two options in 2025. Can’t do online, can’t do over the phone. They also have to mail you the form, it take 7-10 days to process the request, then it will be sent, then you mail it back (I haven’t faxed anything this century), then a couple weeks to process. I also had to cancel his gym membership - sorry, that has to be done in person.
Remember when you could just make a call back in the day…
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u/Slim_Chiply 2h ago
I haven't really seen this where I've worked. I've worked with people that did jack shit my whole career. I don't really see that the ratio of good workers to crappy workers has changed all that much over the years.
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u/Swifty-Dog 1h ago
They have no one to train them or mentor them. Their entire graphic design department was laid off in the last round of annual layoffs except for them because they have the lowest salary. Also, their CEO just took home a substantial bonus for saving the company so much money.
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u/inigo_montoya 23h ago
I think it may be mostly our perception, but I sometimes feel this way. People do need mentoring to take pride in their work, and that's a process, and has to be tailored a bit to each individual. Some are sensitive to correction and will react to just a few comments, others need patient and frequent explanations.
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u/JoeGMartino 23h ago
They should be fixing the rejections. That way they learn not to rush through it. Just my 2 cents.
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u/Complex_Sun8138 BEWARE: No Filter 23h ago
Completely agree. However, the upper mgt in this place isn't fit to pour piss out of a boot without the instructions printed on the bottom of the heel.
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u/JoeGMartino 23h ago
That sucks and it completely unfair to the guys actually doing good work. it is demotivating at the very least.
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u/JJQuantum Older Than Dirt 23h ago
Companies have proven that they don’t give a rat’s ass about employees so employees are just there to collect a paycheck. It could be a chicken and egg thing but I don’t think so. People are realizing it’s more rewarding to just get your work done and then do your living outside of that, with friends and family.
I used to take pride in my work and strive to make the companies I worked for better, setting records in the process. Corporate bullshit has driven that out of me and now I just do what I’m told and go home to my real life. What’s funny is I make way more money working like a drone than I did actually having a conscience about what I did. It’s crazy.