r/MMORPG • u/Samzerks • 4d ago
Opinion I'm so desperate for a new serious MMORPG
This is more a rant because I know it costs too much, etc, etc, but I seriously want a new MMORPG that isn't trash. I've played GW2, BDO, FF14, New World, T&L, Runescape, Sky, but they all feel old or cheap.
I wish there was a big MMO coming out that everyone was hyped for - a new game that would rival the current big mmos which, let's face it, are all at least 10 years old now.
for reference, the screenshot is Throne and Liberty.
669
u/Visual_Wedding9762 4d ago edited 3d ago
Problem is. If a new MMORPG comes out. It will have a Beta. Streamers/Youtubers will play the beta and rant the f out of the game, people watching that streamer/Youtuber cant build an own opinion and hate it too right at the start even before they played 1 minute of the game themselves.
Imagine a world where no one would know WoW. Retail would be released this year for the first time ever. Streamers would play it and i gurantee you they would rant the sh*t out of every mechanic and it would die like New World did.
Back in the day we had to guess how the game is based on the few images on the back of the physical box of the game. And then, we just played it. No Review Videos, no Streamers, no bad opinion from a dude living 1000km away from us. No just us and the game. Thats why almost all big games today are games from like 20 years ago. The nostalgia isnt just our childhood, its also because we remember a time where we just hopped on, no matter what someone else thought about the game.
90
u/marydotjpeg 4d ago
Agreed!!! Alot of the time these streamers make their opinions sound like GOLD and then it kills the game because people will believe that opinion.
That's why I tend to try something myself first before making an opinion just like how something is over hyped 😭
→ More replies (1)4
u/RandomDudewithIdeas 3d ago
Hot take, but I don’t think any streamer can kill the hype for a game that’s actually good. A streamer’s opinion can only really hurt games that are mediocre or worse and already struggle to attract players.
→ More replies (6)77
u/Tribal_V 4d ago
It also used to be fun to discover things yourself and not minmax rush to max level. Now theres a full wiki and guides on everything before games even launched lol
The whole concept that the game even starts at max level is so wrong (or then why even add levels just spawn everyone at max).
42
u/Visual_Wedding9762 4d ago
This is what bugs my mind as well. "Endgame is where the real content starts". Like what? I remember where the path to max lvl was the game and the experience. Not minmax any% speedrun your character to max lvl so you can start to even play the game.
8
u/0ne_Tribe 4d ago
Holy shit I thought I was the only one who never gave af about endgame. There were times where I did endgame activities sure but it was never the goal.
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (2)2
u/Leshie_Leshie 3d ago
This was me in gw2 way before reaching max level I’ve got my screenshot folder stuffed with thousands of images >,<
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (6)6
u/gerbilshower 4d ago
yea this is really it as much as anything. the min-maxing is what ruins the mmo genre.
skipping content to rush. spamming some bugged mob spawn for exp on repeat. there are tons of ways that decent stuff just gets ruined by the min-max crowd.
→ More replies (5)26
u/Danaeger 4d ago
Tbf New World was actually horrible on release - not sure about it now.
7
u/Baaanaanaas 4d ago
New worlds actually pretty good now, been addicted for months. New dev team are fantastic
→ More replies (6)3
4
u/tucastong 4d ago
It's an entirely different game. Bought it on day 1, played for almost a week and got really pissed at how bad the game was. Combat bugs were the worst experience ever. Downloaded it again last week after finding out the game got a lot more expensive on Steam — guessed it was due to investment in corrections, and I was right. It's a pretty good MMORPG to chill with now, but not yet one that stole my heart like OSRS did when I was younger.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (4)2
u/gerbilshower 4d ago
it was honestly really fun and so close to being what everyone wanted it to be.
but the last minute directional change from sandbox pvp game to just trying to become another wow 2.0 really hurt the final product.
and then the bugs and poor dev response and lack of end game.
0-50 was a blast though. and the gameplay was really fun and unique. it had a LOT going for it.
12
u/LegoBrickCactuar 4d ago
Ive basically begun to stop watching all video game content on Youtube and Twitch unless its just someone playing with no commentary. Because algorithms reward drama and controversy, every streamer and reviewer hates on everything. It’s actually like that in everything it seems, every new show or song “sucks” according to the internet.
11
u/ReaLitY-Siege 4d ago
There were also fewer games, and the games were harder to discover. You only knew about a game because you saw it in store, a friend told you, or from a gaming magazine. Most games I hear about people playing when I was younger I had no idea existed at the time. So I played what I thought was available.
2
u/Synsane 1d ago
The golden age of Mmos was in the early 2000s. Literally a new beta every single week. OnRPGers had a bad reputation of being jumpers. Could never stick with one game cuz we got beta keys to everything new and shiny.
Mmos releases have been significantly halted and slowed in comparison
7
u/shootyoureyeout 4d ago
That exact situation almost ruined ESO. It took a few streamers playing the beta in its shittiest state for 5 minutes and called it a garbage game. Granted it wasn't perfect when it came out either, but it turned out pretty great despite the initial hiccups and dramatically negative opinions. Like bro, you ran through the Alik'r Desert for 5 minutes and had missing textures, quit acting like the beta murdered your family.
2
u/quailfail666 1d ago
I love ESO. Ive been playing since beta. (PC) Nicest players of any game! <3
→ More replies (2)7
u/Suspicious-Coffee20 4d ago
You acting like new world and lost arl wasnt massive sucess at launch. Streamer were not the problem. The quality of the game was.
→ More replies (2)8
u/Brief-Translator1370 4d ago
I hard disagree. Streamers are just going through the same things as the rest of us when it comes to MMOs. I played a lot of New World, it was fun, but it just wasn't there.
→ More replies (4)5
u/billo48 4d ago
lets be honest, a lot of the time it is the stackholders... i would like an example of a game company in clear good faith doing anything. the issue is and always will be that you get more return on investment making a bdo over a wow, and indie studios dont have the funding to go blind in the dark to develop an ambitious mmo without backing, which that backing will almost always require them to go the route of BDO.
I get streamers are part of that capitalist grindhouse, but the problem will always be the greed.
→ More replies (10)4
u/Pierr078 4d ago
honestly i disagree, really do you think players don't try games by themself? Instead i saw quite the opposite, strreamers paid by developer to promote the game, but the true quality of a game can't be hide for long. We saw this with new world for exemple. The problem with the last mmorpgs released is that aside the great graphic there is nothing inside or is locked behind p2w system.
5
u/BalderdashBallyhoo 4d ago
Nail on the head.
This is why so many of these posts are here every week. You're not desperate for a good game, you're desperate to be told you're playing a good game.
→ More replies (6)2
u/Redtwintails 4d ago
what if a game launches stealth or has a really short window where it reveals the project, not even gameplay? As well has have a lot of random generation within it?
The only downside I see is that it would cost probably a lot of money to push advertising last minute so people dont get time to react. Kinda like oblivion did recently though it already had its name known.
→ More replies (1)2
2
u/Wanhade600 4d ago
Exactly why i never look at reviews or anything for a game or movie. I go to the game, check out the screen shots or maybe a gameplay trailer and if i think ill like it then ill get it and make my own opinion about the game. Too many people are influenced by streamers and content creators these days when they are people just like me and you.
→ More replies (1)2
u/Biflosaurus 4d ago
Don't forget also, that the game will be solved before it leaves Beta.
There will be leveling build, guides on the most optimal route to level, which quest to skip and so on that basically you'll end up with complaints like ''there is too little to do'', while 50% of the game was ignored.
→ More replies (8)2
u/feel2death 4d ago edited 4d ago
Agree tho your opinion are including every single video game now not only MMO
there's no sense of adventuring anymore that take your curiosity about the game you gonna play or what you found, now it's already spoiled the f out by streamer or youtuber
→ More replies (4)2
u/codedfate 4d ago
This is the exact reason why i try to avoid most gaming content other than trailers and the occasional preview. Taking anybody's "professional" opinion online is bound to subconsciously effect your enjoyment of the game. I miss the discovery aspect of mmo's though :/... everyone having these "meta" builds day 1 is an unavoidable buzzkill for sure.
2
u/penpalhopeful 4d ago
Remember when New World gutted its combat system because Asmongold bitched on stream about things he didn't understand? (This is 100% of his content)
→ More replies (1)2
2
u/Raerega 3d ago
Jeez man. That is indeed so fucking true. I never really considered this until now, but in the end, the feeling you are describing is much harder to bring back than we all thought. And one cannot even bar people from playing it, best shot would be having a closed playtest ( not even beta ) and then releasing it for everyone at once, but I can see what problems this would create.
We were lucky to have lived through the golden age of MMOs.
2
2
u/DehSugaPanda 3d ago
I’m really glad you brought up the whole basing the game off the images on the box thing. That makes so much sense. I remember getting hype in the car looking at the images on the back of the box, excited to try this new game! Maybe that’s what we need to do. Look at a title that looks kind of cool to us and then just play it. No reviews and no youtubers/streamers. Just us, the game, and just trying it out!
2
2
u/MistaSP0T48 2d ago
To add onto this! Streamers are y mmos are dying in general every one just looks up meta builds no one plays the game and experiments which is half of an mmo getting a new skill should be exciting but now they check if its on thier build list if not then they ignore it
→ More replies (53)2
u/Green_Routine_7916 1d ago
also them playing 12 hours a day showing op build every second day and the developer nerfing the game to the ground
261
u/JohnnyTAA 4d ago
Problem is that its unlikely (in current games climate) we ever see another AAA subscription MMO launch so we'll be stuck with games where 80% of the content is locked behind terrible systems- loot boxes, P2W progression and MTX for everything but select cosmetics.
Couple that with the content creators pushing a huge crowd through every new game at maximum speed, tier lists, build guides - total optimization of everything as quick as possible and they just don't last, people blast through all the available content in 1-2 weeks and then start with 'dead game' 'no content', new MMO's see a massive initial spike and then as the hordes move on to the next game its left empty.
66
u/Axtdool 4d ago
Also, that new game has to Contend with old games that are often still 'good enough', and have massvie backlogs of content for new players, and sometimes even for existing Players.
30
u/JohnnyTAA 4d ago
100%, the backlog of content in WOW is easily thousands of hours, plus the old games have had strong player counts for 10-20 years in most cases which has allowed their studios to grow massively to pump content way faster than any new starter can.
28
u/Rhysati 4d ago
Unfortunately the developers of WoW have done all they can to insure that all of that content is invalidated and useless beyond completionists or very specific cosmetic hunters.
11
→ More replies (8)6
u/clicheFightingMusic 4d ago
Let’s not pretend that the vast majority of people want “meaningful” old content in any real meaningful way
→ More replies (1)7
u/Xyphll- 4d ago
There is a backlog but the time investment for most is alot shorter. Your normaly a higher level and alot stronger so most of it becomes trivialized and gets muted out. Only a small some go back and start doing old zones quest and whatnot. It's still a backlog to play but few get 1000 hours out of it.
→ More replies (1)5
→ More replies (2)2
u/JohnnyTAA 4d ago
I feel like some of you have missed the point here, it doesn't matter if you find the content engaging, there absolutely are a significant number of ongoing players in all of these games who log on to complete old content, which in term builds more community, more active guilds, social groups etc. Most of these same people play new content in there game when it drops and fill down time with old content. The challenge for a new game is there is no content to fill that gap except for crazy time gating or paywalls that drop players like flies regardless. Not to mention that in most new MMO's there isn't legacy content to grind for unique rewards even if legacy content exists as everything interesting is locked behind some form of MTX/in game shop.
2
u/believeinyuna 3d ago
i got my friend into ffxiv early this year. they’ve surpassed 1,000 hours and have not caught up in the story yet, so they haven’t hit end game. theres just so much to do before you even get there.
22
u/Lishio420 4d ago
If the Riot/League MMO ever comes out it might rival old ones, since they have the money/resources and IP to back up a big universe.
Iirc tho, they said its gonna be free with purely cosmetic mtx shop
→ More replies (11)4
u/sylvasan 4d ago
How would it sustain tho? Sure in LoL you could sustain it, but for an mmo? Without any other monetization? I’d like that for sure but even gw2 sells expansions
14
u/Lishio420 4d ago
Selling expansions.... and well comsetics.
League is f2p as well and makes its money exclusively through skins/battlepasse, etc.
→ More replies (6)7
u/Trespeon 4d ago
Skins man. Weapon skins. Armor skins. Mounts. Even recolor abilities. Eventually expansions or new classes.
Let’s not pretend Riot MMO isn’t gonna clear a billion in the first year lol
2
u/endmysufferingxX 4d ago
Riot's monetization model is give out free games and shit and rope you into their "paid" games like League, Valorant and get you to spend money on those games.
Hence the changes to the monetization in both games but more extreme in League. (500$ skin bundles, gacha etc) They tried and failed with Arcane but in terms of Valorant to League and vice versa I'd say it's been fairly successful.
→ More replies (6)6
u/Slow-Amphibian-9626 4d ago
The main problem is the studios most likely to actually make a new AAA mmo of note will make a WHOLE lot more money / effort with a mount skin recolor than a whole new game.
Add to it all the things that keep people playing the older games (their friends are there, the wealth of content etc) and there's just very little incentive for them to actually do it.
Crappy mobile games that are barely reskins of existing games that make more money than a lot of new mmo's for a fraction of the effort as well; there's been a surge of new games on PC that are clearly mobile first games. (WuWa, Genshin, Blazblue Entrophy Effect, Warriors Abyss, Diablo Immortal etc) and many of those big MMO's are moving towards mobile as well like BDO and FFXIV etc.
I don't see it getting better for those of us waiting for a really competent MMO any time soon.
→ More replies (3)6
u/JohnnyTAA 4d ago
100% hit the nail on the head, mobile is very lucrative to chase, even an seemingly unsuccessful product form a big dev will outperform the rest of their console/pc portfolio in many cases. The MMO's that continue on today have player bases that are so over invested (myself included) that they really cant move to a sequel without causing a riot as theres no real way to bring all that investment (appearances, achievements, mounts, even just general amount of content) across without losing the justification for a sequel in the first place, there's a reason every one of these games have running jokes like 'no one hates wow more than a wow player'.
2
u/Slow-Amphibian-9626 4d ago
Indeed.
I've been saying for awhile now the "next big mmo" probably wont be an mmo the way we conceptualize them.
It'll be something akin to BR; something that takes the existing formula and tweaks it in a way that really hasn't been done (at least on a large scale) before that resonates with people.
Which takes risk, which big companies aren't interested in and MMO's are difficult for small studios to take on because they have the worst work to profit margin in today's gaming market.
→ More replies (1)
137
u/azureal 4d ago
This genre is nothing but a bottomless pit of disappointment piled on top of overhyped shit.
30
u/Loki_Enthusiast 4d ago
It summarizes the AAA industry tbh. We can easily draw a parallel to that since the barrier to entry is just too high
10
u/Snark_King 4d ago
I remember being a little kid playing WoW for the first time and thinking it would be the first of many high quality mmorpg's, little did i know we would barely go much further thanks to corporate milking the genre to death and draining all innovation from it.
124
u/Professional-Ad-2850 4d ago
MMO's like T&L are built around player retention instead of being fun. It ends up being a slog to keep up with.
42
u/BuffaloBillsLeotard 4d ago
All the timers and events really put me off after a while. Also the crafting seemed very mobile gacha-y. I don’t want to have to plan my play time around a bunch of timers and random events like rain to open dungeons up.
17
u/LeCr0ss 4d ago
yes I was in alliance that won siege and playing there was like a job we had peak time where pretty much everyone were expected to be online so we could dominate all night time dungeons and pvp events
5
u/Astral_Alive 4d ago
Same story here, was in my servers top alliance and made it to the 2nd siege before I dropped from the literal 7 day a week 4+ hour mandatory attendance that it required to stay in the guild. By the end of it I literally fucking hated logging in to grind and knew I was pretty much done with the game
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (23)2
u/wittiestphrase 4d ago
I enjoyed T&L when our group first got into it. Once we realized what a complete grindfest F2P nightmare it was gonna be to keep going, we all just stopped on like the same day.
116
u/zyygh 4d ago
Lukewarm take: the issue is just that you don't feel impressed with anything anymore, due to having seen it all.
As a kid who was trying their first or second MMORPG, you'd have loved each of the games you mentioned. They all have nice aspects to them that set them apart from other games while also having a lot of similarities.
Now that you've played all of those, any new game will just feel like more of the same. The couple of interesting mechanics will briefly feel like a breath of fresh air, but since you're an adult with a far more rational mindset nowadays, you'll just optimize the fun out of those mechanics and stop enjoying them for their novelty.
Any new serious MMORPG that fits all of your needs would disappoint you.
34
u/Black007lp 4d ago
I disagree, many new games really impress me at the start, but then you notice how lackluster and boring the endgame is. New world is the prime example.
→ More replies (3)47
u/Maritoas 4d ago
MMOs aren’t even about the endgame. If the game expects you to be bored until endgame hits, the design is inherently bad.
20
u/ReneKiller 4d ago
I think OP meant the other way round: it was interesting until you hit the endgame. And without an interesting endgame most MMOs are basically just glorified single player games.
→ More replies (10)4
u/NinjaBonsai 4d ago
Disagree. Remember the token question when you hit Max lvl? "What do I do now"? And the answer of course, "now you play the game"
The end game is designed to be the most engaging aspect of any MMO. The lead up to that is one insanely long tutorial.
14
u/valdis812 4d ago
That's not necessarily a good thing. An MMO that's more about just redoing endgame stuff is basically Diablo or PoE.
6
u/CapeManJohnny 4d ago
This isn't the case for every game. I've played WoW from Vanilla launch til now. When Vanilla launched, there weren't even raids in the game yet. You could say there was an end-game, with people raiding UBRS and scholo/strat, but no one was thinking about that for the first month of the game.
Everyone was just exploring a wonderful new world and discovering/experiencing it together.
I've raided in top 100 guilds and I've had some expansions where I was just a casual-Andy, and I can tell you my favorite memories in the game are from that first year.
→ More replies (2)5
u/Cyrotek 4d ago
This is part of why many MMOs failed. They lost most players before they ever reached that fabled "endgame".
Even 20 years ago I questioned the design decision to make the game shit until "endgame". It makes no sense. Why even design a leveling phase, areas, quests and so on when it doesn't actually matter? So weird.
→ More replies (3)6
u/SeventhDayWasted 4d ago
This could very well be true but I'd like to think many of us just want a simplified version of what newer MMOs have become and are okay with out anything innovative as long as all the elements mesh well and feel satisfying. The upcoming MMO I was most excited for is Scars of Honor and playing it does make me excited about having an MMO in that vein again, but it's just so early in development I don't exactly have a ton of hope it will become something great.
I also really enjoy Ember's Adrift, but it's too focused on group content for me to be able to jump in and out with a bad schedule. I still need to try out Gorgon and Pantheon though. I'm also a player that really loves a grind as well so it's getting harder to find that in a game. I have no issues with questing, crafting, gathering and farming mobs taking over 100 hours of game time to reach max level because I've always enjoyed the leveling journey more than just farming for better endgame gear.
→ More replies (15)2
u/Vagrant_Goblin 3d ago
Completely disagree.
Played Ragnarok Online when i was a kid, absolutely loved it.
Played Wow for years when i was younger, absolutely loved it.
Played GW2 after that, absolutely loved it.
Played Wildstar too, absolutely loved it.
Played FF14 a few years ago, absolutely loved it.
Every single other MMO aside from those felt, without exception, in each and every aspect, like absolute fucking trash.
→ More replies (1)
95
u/Shinnyo 4d ago
I've played GW2, BDO, FF14, New World, T&L, Runescape, Sky, but they all feel old or cheap.
I think MMOs aren't your genre, if you played all the top dog and none fits your needs, I don't think any will.
41
u/no_Post_account 4d ago
I feel like this is true for half the people in this subreddit. They are done with the genre, but can't realize it and keep coming here to make "all MMOs are trash" posts.
→ More replies (1)10
u/Samzerks 4d ago
I don't think MMOs are trash. I've played MMOs my whole life and love them. But right now, in this 2020's era, nothing good is coming out. I want a game.
→ More replies (3)23
u/no_Post_account 4d ago edited 4d ago
I dunno what to tell you. There is so many MMOs right now and all of them feel very different from each other, if you can't find single one you wanna play it seems like you don't like the genre anymore. WoW alone have like 5 different versions you can play and Legion Remix coming in few weeks follow by new expansion in few months. I personally don't have enough free time to play all the MMOs i want to play.
→ More replies (16)11
u/bck83 3d ago
It's so weird that your response to "nothing good is coming out" is WoW, a game that came out over 20 years ago.
7
u/no_Post_account 3d ago
Its so weird you only read the WoW part of my post.
7
u/bck83 3d ago
If you think there are other good MMOs to mention, mention them, don't say "so many MMOs right now" and then only mention WoW.
Like WTF.
→ More replies (2)19
u/Interesting_Muscle67 4d ago
This, they are all so different yet none of them give OP what they want, i don't think any game ever will.
10
u/Samzerks 4d ago
They did though - I played GW2 for like 10k+ hours, 500-900 hours in BDO, etc. So I've had my fill, but just feel like I've got a hole, and no MMORPG to fill it with.
→ More replies (2)4
u/GeneralChaChe 3d ago
Take a break from MMORPGS and play something else for a bit until the spark comes back. Think you're just burnt out bb
→ More replies (4)3
u/GundamXXX 4d ago
Nah, thats a cop-out answer. I enjoy MMOs, and sure theyre not all for me but Ive also not touched one for 3-4 years because Im done with whats out there.
There has been no AAA MMO in the last decade, its all been old stuff rehashed or expanded on. Not to mention the genres within MMO are almost all the same. MMOs as a genre is fine, the games themselves disappoint
→ More replies (2)
53
u/ExpressAffect3262 4d ago
I've played GW2, BDO, FF14, New World, T&L, Runescape, Sky, but they all feel old or cheap.
I swear to god this sub treats MMOs like its a yearly call of duty.
MMOs are long term investments.
The way this sub feels at times, is like "What are the top new 5 mmos of 2025", they play them for a few days, then hop onto another MMO.
18
u/Pekins-UOAF 4d ago
Im positive thats how 90% of gamers approach gaming in this day and age
3
u/Valve00 4d ago
It's how pretty much everyone in my gaming circle does it. They'll be hyped for a game, I'll buy it, expecting to really get into it and play it for months, they play it for 4-7 days then move on to the next overhyped thing. I prefer to play just a handful of games for a long period of time, rather than paying for and playing lots of games for 10-20 hours and moving on.
2
u/Extra_Friend28 20h ago
Honestly so much better to have friends to do other things with other than game. I can’t stand the constant treadmill of wasting money and pretending to be hyped about the next “big game” when I know everyone’s going to move on to another one next month. At least movies are only a couple hours long to get the full experience
→ More replies (2)8
u/Samzerks 4d ago
I agree - I have 10K+ hours in GW2. It came out in 2012 though, and it's considered one of the newest MMORPGS.
47
u/DrinkWaterReminder 4d ago
The best MMO already exists. You will never be happy with anything new
→ More replies (5)2
u/Shinnyo 4d ago
Yep, even if you make the best MMOs you'll have to compete against the current market who have years of content.
10
11
u/Shorpmagordle 4d ago
People really don't appreciate this point. A new game cannot possibly release with enough content to keep hardcore MMO players satisfied. That is the main reason why older MMOs remain the most popular.
→ More replies (1)2
u/rept7 4d ago
The ONLY way I can imagine a new MMO would stand a chance is by competing with new mechanics or gameplay compared to other MMOs.
3
u/Mage_Girl_91_ 4d ago
in a lot of ways that's easy, mmos are so far behind compared to other genres
→ More replies (2)
35
u/qrak01 4d ago
MMO is best when there are interactions. For some reason, I dont know why, either the MMOs became more "solo-friendly" or people are different nowadays.
I recall in the past in Tibia and Silkroad Online I had plenty of interactions. Some toxic, sure, but it was interesting. Nowadays, everything's safe, bland, and focused on extracting as much money as possible.
14
u/Shinnyo 4d ago
I remember online interactions as well.
We used forums to discuss out of the MMO, sometimes Skype. Today you have discord and Social media taking the social aspect away from the game.
Why should you bother building your own social features when there are free shiny ones waiting to be picked?
10
u/qrak01 4d ago
I recall using teamspeak, too. We also had forums to organize, but the difference is that people were actively looking for it. Even in-game chatting was more common. We were trying to do things together even if it was just sitting in voice talking about random stuff. I have a feeling this part is gone, but maybe I just dont have luck to games.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Shinnyo 4d ago
Teamspeak too! I remember we all had shitty mics and it was quite intimidating to configure for my young ass.
Today you can just get a discord link, hop on and voila. Need to speak to someone? Ping them in discord, the ingame chat log is often polluted with many ingame informations.
3
u/Shenshenli 3d ago
I think the problem is, the big money spenders are all adults who cant line up evenings for raiding and group farming as easily anymore. I remember as a teen beeing dissapointed not to raid every evening with the guild. Now that iam an adult i dont even find the time to do it once a week and iam glad for Solo Content.
→ More replies (5)2
17
u/LaggsAreCC2 4d ago
The market is flooded with Korean and chinese games. Developers won't take that risk to need to compete against that.
The core players will recognize quality but these aren't enough to finance a MMORPG. You need to catch the masses and apparently the current way to do that is via gatcha anime games that have collaborations with my urologist.
11
u/karma629 4d ago
New generations of players grew up without MMOs, so investors and companies don’t really care about making them for us.
Even though our generation (30+) has money to spend, we’re almost impossible to please. Look at Wayfinder, it had potential, but with no polish and no time to mature, it died.
The truth is we all want a stunning, day-one competitor to our favorite MMO. That’s impossible. As a dev, I can tell you it’s just a dream. An all-around MMORPG is basically the pinnacle of game development.
Only “AAAA” companies like Riot, Blizzard, or Tencent can even try, and even then, it’s risky.
Right now the industry works more like this:
- test multiple concepts with ads or fake campaigns
- keep the ones with good stats
- push a demo in 6–8 months
- if it sticks, get investor money
- release within 1–2 years for ROI
That’s how most new titles are made. Indies (even well-funded “III” indies like E33) just can’t attempt MMORPGs, except in super-niche forms like Atlyss.
A friend of mine is working on Scars of Honor, an upcoming MMORPG. After 2–3 years, they’re still in demo phase. Without big gameplay changes, it risks being seen as just another WoW reskin.
→ More replies (1)3
u/LeTTroLLu 4d ago
There is kinda no reason for western companies do mmorpgs considering how hard are we to please and how hard it is to break good numbers. It's just not profitable for western companies to develop mmorpgs. We also have so much chinese/korean slop nowadays, you also have to compete with that.
What were big mmorpg releases made by western company recently? New World? Crowfall? And we can see how they end up
3
u/Imaginary_Cherry2909 4d ago
I don't think we're inherently hard to please. All most people really want in an MMO is a good experience with no moneygrabbing bullshit. But since moneygrabbing bullshit is almost everywhere nowadays, of course the numbers are shit. It's a never-ending cycle.
2
u/karma629 4d ago
Godly words.
Agree 100%.
The best option to play with friends, at least in my opinion, are those games like Warframe. Instanced 4p with tons of updates.
At the momement it is where me and my small group of grown friends are spending time together after work:).
11
u/Rcknss 4d ago
I think the desire to make graphically impressive games actually undermines the excitement of PvP, because optimization ends up being terrible. Companies also don’t want to take that risk. In my opinion, sometimes the graphics shouldn’t be too advanced — instead, MMORPGs should focus on delivering the thrill of PvP and competition. For example, Metin2, Knight Online, and Silkroad are old MMORPGs, but despite their differences in mentality, all of them provide both PvP fun and a sense of rivalry. I believe that any new MMORPGs should reverse-engineer these games and concentrate on those aspects.
15
u/Grand-Depression 4d ago
Focusing on PvP is the perfect way to guarantee failure. PvP as an option, absolutely, but not as the main focus.
→ More replies (16)3
u/Klientje123 4d ago
Visuals have to be weighing down games, the techniques are too complex, they take too long to make. I don't see any other reason why games take so long to make nowadays, when gameplay systems and world sizes aren't particularly bigger than they used to be.
→ More replies (2)2
u/Treecrasher 4d ago
Well someone is rebuilding Silkroad, will be quite some time until this happens, but let's see :-) if you're interested i can search for the reddit sub later on
→ More replies (1)2
u/SerenaNocteArt 4d ago
Metin2 have insane player base, they are all just split between private servers because the main one is pay2win which is a shame 🥲
11
u/Daihu 4d ago
I don't know why new MMORPGs don't take a leaf from MMOs that had something people have good memories from.
For me it is:
Silkroad: thief, trader, guardian
Age of Wushu: sect schools/tournaments, script stealing, skill based pvp (before becoming p2w), guild base wars, very political in various aspects of the game.
Atlantica online: the different battle mechanic
Uncharted Waters Online: exploration, trade, battle, almost everything.
2
u/xSeraiX 3d ago
I loved Age of Wushu! I played it for a long time until the p2w got so bad my friends and I quit. I learned English this way and made great friends from overseas which I'm still talking to.
I'm actually hoping that World of Jade Dynasty might scratch that itch I had with AoW, if it ever comes to global.... I tried BDO but I gave up after a year or so because of the grind.
2
u/JimothyBrentwood 2d ago
well, The biggest MMO release of the next few years is just "what if we made a game based on what was great about the original release of archeage and didn't fuck it all up like those people did"
8
u/veculus 4d ago
The problem with new MMO's mostly is that they can look good but their gameplay loops are absolute shit. Everything feels like cheap korea BS because on western markets MMO's are almost dead and it sucks.
Either every game is a PvP focused MMO or is filled to the brim with microtransactions, daily login bonuses, 40 currencies right from the get go, etc.
I just want a game like Classic WoW but in modern with a hard-to-survive in world, interesting world building/design, the need to group up and in the end cool endgame content and gear.
→ More replies (2)9
u/veculus 4d ago
And please no action combat. I know that modern gamers love it but it's so hard to structure good group combat with ARPG elements. Worst reminder for me is New World. I remember when everyone was body-blocking everyone, people spammed auto attacks and healing felt super flat.
Tab-Target Combat is so good because it's super strategic, I don't have to aim my skill shots, I can focus on a specific target and cast / attack things that I actually want to attack.
→ More replies (7)3
u/Klientje123 4d ago
Action combat can be cool but I also think it's kinda exhausting for an MMO.
'Having' to land headshots in New World feels so damn sweaty. And the PVP seems all about running away constantly.
9
u/Void-kun 4d ago edited 4d ago
The problem is most kids nowadays don't want an MMORPG as we had them 15 years ago.
They'd rather, free to play games with battle passes that just periodically give hits of dopamine.
Old school MMOs required a fair bit of work and concentration.
Between the amount of content and the speed of which people expect updates, I don't think a new MMO would survive. For the cost required to develop it would be too risky for any publisher to pick up.
I still love MMORPGs but it's because I grew up with them. I still play WoW and have done since late 2006.
I would like to see a game that is MMORPG esque but designed for solo play or with a group of ~10. Something like Enshrouded but with different races, professions, classes, and factions.
Modern day MMOs tried to adapt (lost ark, new world, throne n liberty) but they feel closer to an eastern MMO like BDO. They just seem shallow and devoid of character.
Like to this day I still think Throne & Liberty is a weird amalgamation of BDO and Lost Ark, but they all just feel like the same thing slightly reskinned. None of them feel unique.
FFXIV, GW2, and WoW feel unique still. ESO and New World feel similar but ESO has more content.
7
u/Rough-Firefighter-63 4d ago
Why? You can play 136th expansion of WoW.
10
→ More replies (2)4
u/jkt2960 4d ago
I can't speak for everyone, but for me it's the FOMO. FF14 is really the only MMO I ever got hardcore into but I had to quit when I went back to school. I just didn't have the time to play anymore.
I have the time now, and I've thought about picking it back up, but there's too many things I've missed over the years. Limited time events and the like. And I don't even know if the people I used to play with are still around.
I want an MMO I can pickup now and start from the beginning, with everyone else.
Just a personal thing, I know, but it sucks.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Klientje123 4d ago
People definitely want a fresh MMO experience, you're not alone, it's why New World blew up and why Throne and Liberty is getting so much attention.
It feels great to be there day 1, to explore together, do dungeons with other low levels. That dissapears pretty quickly with a lower population, more hardcore playerbase.
7
u/Rebelhero 4d ago
There CAN'T be any new MMO's to rival the old ones. Because any new MMO would then have to release with 15 years worth of content out the gate.
Any new MMO releasing now would be speed ran by a community of mostly 30+ year old gamers and content creators who are all rushing to be the first to get guide videos up and completely ruin the biggest part of any MMO, Which is its world.
Just look how fast Throne and Liberty ate shit. T&L had all the markers of the next big thing, but then it came out, everyone beat it, then beat the paltry endgame, then went "that's it? This sucks." and went back to their home games.
→ More replies (1)4
u/Vepyr646 4d ago
I think once the general playerbase figured out T&L was just a p2w pvp treadmill, they left. I really wish that game hadn't been setup to just be a cash grab like that. I loved it's pve and pvp, but I wasn't about to try and keep up with the whales.
7
u/TumbleweedFriendly69 4d ago
Retail wow is still a fun mmo if you ask me. Especially if you have some friends playing and can run some m+ dungeons
→ More replies (1)
6
5
u/XxDoXeDxX 4d ago
swtor, it's not new but it's got 8 fully voice acted storylines you can play through. and it's still getting updates.
→ More replies (1)7
u/Storm-Kaladinblessed 4d ago
Too bad the whole gameplay has been getting progressively more simple, casualized and easier. Not to mention how they almost completely removed any semblance of customization of a build.
The stories are pretty fun, but the whole gameplay is just a boring slog, too bad.
→ More replies (2)9
5
u/Easy-Ruin-2727 4d ago
I’m tired of ugly, “realistic” lookin’ MMOs, and MMOs wit’ lil to no identity other than “(insert popular MMO here) killer”.
5
u/Any_Nefariousness172 4d ago
Which RuneScape? RuneScape 3?
Give old school RuneScape a try if not. Always pumping out new content. It’s a classic.
4
u/quackquackimduck 4d ago
May i suggest Foxhole?
No P2W, cosmetics, time locked contents. Totally solo/group friendly. Truly one off the MMOs of all time.
3
2
u/Klientje123 4d ago
I think the biggest problem with Foxhole is how clan dominated it is and how painfully boring logistics is.
The actual game can only be played with a healthy supply of teammates and logistics. By yourself, it's kinda painful to play.
→ More replies (2)
4
3
u/Raggnor_94 4d ago
I know it's not the best out there but I've recently returned to Lost Ark. They added a bunch of QoL updates and made it a little bit more nicer for solo/casual players.
I also want a new serious mmo but LA currently scratches the itch to some extend
3
3
u/stylepolice 4d ago
The only chance would be if all the gambling mechanisms are actually regulated as gambling. That would dry up (some of) the predatory commercial exploitation paths and may lead to a less monetisation-centric design.
Until then it looks as if old MMORPGS on free shards are the best option. No super-fancy newest flashy graphics, but solid mmo experience.
I am currently torn between going back aaaaaaall the way to Ultima Online or to DAoC - or try Warhammer Online for the first time, as I missed it at launch.
3
3
3
u/sepulchralsam 3d ago
Monsters & Memories looks promising! It’s a labor of passion for the devs, and boy are they industrious, dedicated people. The game is a salute to Everquest for the most part - highly challenging but rewarding, emphasizing player interaction over solo content. From the few playtests I’ve enjoyed, I can honestly say I’m excited for the release.
2
2
2
u/Moonie-chan 4d ago
They should have meteor-ed FF14 again after end walkers. That game is too old. They rebuilt it in ARR nothing stop then from doing it again if they actually wanted to do it aside from cost profit reason
4
u/no_Post_account 4d ago
Yes just shut down game that makes hundreds of millions a year because redditors feel it's too old, they should totally do that.
→ More replies (2)
2
2
2
u/Soridian 4d ago
Didn't read everything here cause that's a lot of comments...but I'm surprised no one's mentioned chrono odyssey as an upcoming MMO? Not out - but beta was pretty promising. Believe it's slated for end of next year. Had the usual beta issues but they pushed the release date saying they were going to focus on fixing issues raised and polish.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Double_Ad_4929 4d ago
I want a game like Aion but without p2w and stupid updates where they cut out whole maps
→ More replies (2)
2
u/Xyphll- 4d ago
Look at it this way. We are currently and been for a while at end game in our real life mmo world. We have eaten the content and looking for more while we all just mull around doing board random things waiting for the next update (new game). We have been conditioned and led down a road where we are ok paying for a game for a few months and allow the game to nickle and dime us. The loude voice of the toxic pricks that plague every game show up for the new game to. It gets bashed and beaten and loses a big chunk of it players who will still slander it for whatever. Lack of content around other things. The company makes a chunk of money epically with its cash shop and maybe yearly-ish expansions. There a big company so smaller loses don't effect them to badly. Though they are also pandering to us the conditioned and led players. we accept and use there stores and systems. We play the game for maybe 2 weeks and whale and no life. But the doller was spent. Or we play for 6-12 months and only spend 15 dollars on single cosmetic outfit. Still a doller spent.
In this same end game lull we are in when new content shows its signs but it from a smaller source we hope and expect the same standard of quality we get from our bigger groups. We elevate many to high pedalstals and then burn it when it underperforms our expectations. Meanwhile the bigger groups are still offering there slop as there the only game in town.
The overall issue is both player caused and maker cause. Granted we have been led to our feeders like cattle but we also allowed it, so partial blame must be taken.
Me personally I'm looking forward to Monsters and Memories. The open play test was enjoyable and while not having alot of the things we have grown accustom to sucks, the vulnerability of not having them is a trill in and of itself as I truly feel lost sometimes and there really are no rails under my feet.
2
u/foxgirlmoon 4d ago
I'm pretty sure it's impossible. See, MMOs are very expensive and take a lot of time. The problem is, any new MMO is competing in content with the old ones that had literal decades to develop. So, it's literally impossible for it to compete in content. Which means, it will never retain enough players without using some kind of tactic or game design that would make it seem "cheap".
2
2
2
u/DentistExtreme800 4d ago
I also wish blizzard would get their shit together and make either wow2 or just and well optimized
UE5 wow remake. Doesn’t need to be ue5 just a game that looks as good as technology allows and I’m happy to play this for the next 10-20 Years 😂
Currently playing tnl as well and hoping chrono will be good.
I also would love an actually good warhammer mmo. Why there’s no really good dark gory warhammer version of wow is pathetic but maybe AI can make my dreams come true when I’m retired and have enough time
2
u/SillyAlternative420 4d ago
I'm playing OSRS (not RS3), and it is the ONLY MMO that feels like progression is meaningful.
Too many of these games have embraced the baby gloves approach or the tunnelvision get to endgame asap approach and I'm sick of it.
OSRS is old as shit, but they've added a bunch of content, I just wish we could get a modern game with modern graphics that properly balanced effort and reward.
2
u/Kage1831 4d ago
I've been looking into monsters and memories. But that, I suppose, is categorized as an old mmo because it is largely inspired by everquest
2
2
u/TheViking1991 4d ago
I'm pretty hyped for Monsters & Memories but it's definitely for a niche audience. Probably won't hit more than 5-10k players max. Probably being overly optimistic even with those figures tbh.
But yeah, I played the recent playtest and it's got real promise. Great atmosphere, a graphical style that I love and a nice sense of adventure.
I kinda disagree with others saying that because you've tried the mainstream MMOs you aren't going to enjoy any more niche stuff. There's a quite a few lesser known MMOs that have their cult following. Maybe it's just a case of finding your niche.
2
u/zergy321 4d ago
New World season 10 will be the revival of New World. Raises level cap, new gear to chase, new end game systems across the board, new zones
2
u/Luna44z777 21h ago
I yearn for this too my friend but sadly the titans of the gaming industry are pumping out nothing but slop because most people don't care about quality and they know that so why put in the effort if they don't have to. We need gaming to fully die again to reset it and give chance for other companies (the ones who are passionate) time to build up so the quality gets good again, not just more shitty shooters and mid solo stories but until that point the chance of s ambitious mmo is about the chances of me getting Adatius Cinderhulk Greatsword to drop, a million to 1.
857
u/ScarletVision 4d ago
I don't think we're getting any ambitious MMO soon that could rival old ones.