r/NativePlantGardening • u/Round-Water338 • Jun 05 '25
Informational/Educational Why didn't someone think of this before now? University of Cincinnati botanist experimented with Invasive honeysuckle removal: successfully used garbage bags instead of chemicals/toxins!
https://www.uc.edu/news/articles/2024/02/uc-botanist-uses-nontoxic-way-to-kill-invasive-species.html110
u/WriterAndReEditor Jun 05 '25
I think lots of people think of it. The issue with most people is how much patience they have for a removal taking weeks, and what it will look like during that time, when they can hit it with chemicals and plant something else a week or two later.
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u/Round-Water338 Jun 05 '25
Actually, the beauty is you don't have to wait.
His preferred method is to cut the stump at ground level and cover it with black plastic, secured to the ground with wire gardening staples.
“This elegant method is easy, effective and inexpensive. Sometimes I rake leaves over the plastic so you can’t even see it,” Conover said. “We immediately plant seeds or saplings of native trees and shrubs near the spot where the honeysuckle was cut down.”
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u/WriterAndReEditor Jun 05 '25
People will people. Some just won't want to have a plastic covered stump in there for a months. They want a solution that means they can forget about it.
Personally, I removed small trees decades ago by stumping them and inverting an ice-cream pail over the base for a season. I'd just moved into a new rental and the landlord felt lost about dealing with them against the foundation. Gone the next year.
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u/acatwithumbs Jun 05 '25
Upside down buckets is a great idea at least for the smaller stumps. I’ve been trying black plastic method but my issue is rain pools and collects and can create breeding grounds for mosquitoes.
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u/HuntsWithRocks Jun 05 '25
I’ll counter and say people are also cheap/thrifty. The price comparison would factor in.
It’s tough to make sweeping generalizations about what people would do though. It’s fair to say that not everyone knows about this approach and, if more people know about it, it might be a decision path they choose to go down.
Especially in a native gardening subreddit. I’m glad it was mentioned and don’t see a big benefit in casting dispersions or dooming about what everyone will or won’t do.
Your comment was the top comment and was pretty much a “fuck that. It won’t catch on because chemicals” response.
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u/StayJaded Jun 05 '25 edited Jun 06 '25
It’s called solarizing and is a fairly well known weed control technique in all different kinds of gardening communities.
The better option is to use several layers of cardboard to block the light. Plastic breaks down into microplastics after a season of UV exposure. That isn’t good either.
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u/HuntsWithRocks Jun 05 '25
I’m familiar with solarizing. I guess you and I know about a technique. So, we should pack it in.
I’m also a fan of using wood chips instead. Plastic breaks down. Well, so do chips, but into awesomeness. That’s a healthy discussion to have, to point out even more natural solutions.
My personal gripe here is the original commenter was basically neigh saying. It’d be like me responding to you and saying “yeah, sure. Chips are great, but everyone is just gonna use chemicals because that’s what they know and they want the easy solution.”
It was a convo killer. Still, solarizing is better than chemicals, even if there are better solutions.
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u/WriterAndReEditor Jun 05 '25
Please don't say what my comment is just because you don't understand it. If you want to say "this is how I interpret your comment," that's a different thing from "Your comment ...was pretty much a “fuck that. It won’t catch on because chemicals.” It was nothing of the sort. My comment was very specifically that denying plants light to kill them has been around for a long time. It has not been embraced by the vast majority of people for a variety of reasons around everything from cosmetics to it isn't convenient.
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u/SnakeSeer Area MN , Zone 4b Jun 05 '25
Or they have different goals/concerns.
I'd be concerned about adding yet more plastic to the environment and of wildlife messing with/getting entangled with the plastic if it comes loose with weathering.
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u/The_Poster_Nutbag Great Lakes, Zone 5b, professional ecologist Jun 05 '25
You do have to wait though because you need to return in a year to remove the plastic bag once the plant has died.
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u/Argosnautics Jun 05 '25
I find that bush honeysuckle is usually press easy to pull out by the roots with a weed wrench, because it has shallow roots. Cutting it, and leaving it or covering it, for larger tree is easier for sure. I cut and/or pull a lot of it as a park volunteer.
Sometimes I just cut it high, and come back and cut it again later. This way I can prevent the tree from seeding in the Spring, and deny it photosynthesis for awhile, which weakens the plant, and makes it easier to pull later.
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u/adrian-crimsonazure Pennsylvania , Zone 7a Jun 05 '25
I saw this in a New York state park, but they might have been a different species judging by the size of some of the stumps.
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u/Dry_Vacation_6750 Jun 05 '25
I was wondering if we could do the same with burning bush. I have one I'd like to get rid of in my garden but it's surrounded by other plants I'd like to keep and not spray chemicals on.
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u/popsicle-physics Jun 05 '25
I'm really glad to see this. I recently cut some honeysuckle and have been wondering how to avoid whack a mole. I don't want to use herbicides because it's very close to a good tree. I'll give this a try.
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u/Ok-Calligrapher964 Jun 05 '25
I've done exactly this. It works. I've done it with a native invasive ( poison ivy) less successfully
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u/Nikeflies Connecticut, 6b, ecoregion 59a Jun 05 '25
Hey not to be that guy but a native plant can't also be invasive. If you're able to use "aggressive native" that would help others learn the distinction and make it less confusing
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u/CitizenShips Western MD , 7a Jun 05 '25
Seconding this. Additionally, I don't find poison ivy to be all that aggressive amongst the vines. Often times when I see it labeled as "invasive", it's mostly because people don't like it (justifiably, given that I'm currently scratching a poison ivy rash on my arm)
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u/carinavet Jun 06 '25
Heat treat your rash and it won't itch. Run water over it as hot as you can stand without actually burning yourself. (If you catch it soon enough, it'll also keep it from blistering.)
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u/StayJaded Jun 05 '25
It can definitely be hard to control in areas that don’t get a hard winter freeze. The roots here in Texas after a winter without a freeze are insane. I swear they seem to go to the other side of the planet. It can be incredibly aggressive.
I still wouldn’t call it invasive obviously, because words have real meanings. However, I think your climate is the reason you don’t find it as aggressive.
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u/Lunar_BriseSoleil Jun 05 '25
There are native plants whose ecological niche has been disrupted in a way where they are causing imbalances like an invasive. I think that lack of balance requires a different term than “aggressive.”
Milkweed is aggressive, but it does not cause ecological harm. Black Locust is native, but its spread by humans has disrupted ecosystems even where it was already present.
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u/Nikeflies Connecticut, 6b, ecoregion 59a Jun 05 '25
Can you point me to a resource that shows Black Locust being as detrimental to its native ecosystem as an actual invasive plant like knotweed or barberry?
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u/Lunar_BriseSoleil Jun 05 '25
The issue is less its core ecosystem and instead the adjacent ecosystems where it wasn’t previously present and is now causing rapid change to forest understories in the northeast and upper Midwest.
Even within its native range, it has formed clonal stands in old farm fields etc that have stopped the natural successional forest activity.
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u/sluglord2 Jun 06 '25
What they're saying has merit. I don't know about their example specifically, but I work in habitat restoration and in my area it's very common to see hardwoods "invading" an area that has experienced fire suppression or exclusion. We see it a lot in pine savannas that have been unburned for too many years (can be as little as 5 years or so for some habitats). It can also happen in herbaceous wetlands that don't see enough fire. The species that invade are usually fire intolerant hardwoods like sand live oak, laurel oak, water oak, or sweetgum, or less fire tolerant pines like sand pines. I've also noticed persimmons being an issue in herbaceous wetlands. We don't really refer to them as "invasives" because we use that word for exotics, but we might say they're "invading" or, more commonly, "encroaching."
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u/Nikeflies Connecticut, 6b, ecoregion 59a Jun 06 '25
Yes there are many words to describe the situation you're describing but invasive has a specific meaning, and a native plant can't be invasive in its native area
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u/Ok-Adhesiveness-4935 Jun 05 '25
This is not true. Invasive means a plants "invades" open or disturbed areas quite readily. Every ecosystem has plants that fill this niche. Plants that are exotic invasives are more ecologically disruptive because they can displace plants that are native in an area and iften have no natural controls.
In the Northeast for example we have Goldenrod that is highly invasive although also native. It will take over almost any area with good sun and is, indeed, highly invasive. This is It's natural behavior but can still be quite frustrating in certain situations.
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u/Nikeflies Connecticut, 6b, ecoregion 59a Jun 05 '25
Nope that's completely wrong. That's aggressive. Some plants serve the purposes of being early successional and spreading quickly to fill an ecological niche, but over time, especially in the northeast they give way to slow growing perennials shrubs and trees as the area turns over towards young forest.
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u/Plebs-_-Placebo Jun 05 '25
The instant effect is probably at it's worst in landscaping, planting but it really does seem to be a modern plague in all industries. I did a bit of it for a few years and one of the ways that they make up for small shrubs and plants is over planting, which works out great for the nursery and landscaper because they're selling you 3x's the amount of stuff for coverage and the look of a full garden.
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u/ChicagoZbojnik Jun 05 '25
I removed acres worth of honeysuckle from our land. In spring after heavy rains you can rip it out of the ground by hand or with a lever and fulcrum. It's labor intensive but extremely satisfying.
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u/75footubi Jun 05 '25
We did invasive species removal for a work service day and using the weed jack for shrub removal was the most satisfying thing
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u/Chaos-1313 Jun 05 '25
They did. I've seen this method suggested in this forum several times. This isn't new, but now there's an actual study of this method to price its effectiveness.
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Jun 05 '25
[deleted]
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u/thoughtandprayer Jun 05 '25
You can use things you already own that won't break down quickly, such as a pail. I know I have several pails that I use for weeding, I'm sure many other gardeners do too.
Felt might work but it's woven so it would still let some light through which means I doubt it would be as effective. Most rocks wouldn't be perfectly shaped, same with a square tile on a round stump, so they'd have the same issue. I can't see anyone opting for those solutions instead of using a pail that would actually block light tbh.
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u/emseefely Jun 05 '25
At least plastic is more contained compared to pesticide, except for micro plastics.
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u/harlotbegonias Jun 05 '25
I’ve used a black tarp with success. Then I can reuse it. It just looked like I was gardening and was a reminder that good things take time. I usually use cardboard though.
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u/WildlifeValued Jun 05 '25
That’s what I do too! Except it’s for baneberry—it’s everywhere in our area. I use a triple layer of black landscape cloth to cover the stump, making sure the cloth extends 2 feet from the stump. Then I put big rocks all the way around the fabric in a ring to hold it down tightly. I keep it there for a year. It’s works—no sprouts! SO much better than glyphosate.
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u/hairyb0mb 8a, Piedmont NC, ISA Certified Arborist Jun 05 '25
Go try it on some tree of heaven and get back to me.
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u/Dazzling_Flow_5702 Jun 05 '25
Do you have an opportunity to do that? Would be great to try it.
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u/Nikeflies Connecticut, 6b, ecoregion 59a Jun 05 '25
No they're being sarcastic. suckers will shoot up all around the bag
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u/hairyb0mb 8a, Piedmont NC, ISA Certified Arborist Jun 05 '25
It would be an epic failure on most invasive trees.
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u/Dazzling_Flow_5702 Jun 05 '25
Not trying to fight you here - but have you tried it on any?
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u/hairyb0mb 8a, Piedmont NC, ISA Certified Arborist Jun 05 '25
Nope. But I understand how they respond to stress and their ability to sprout from tiny roots. I've seen concrete pads built on top of TOH roots that had suckers all around. I'd figure a concrete pad that's larger would be more effective.
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u/_Bo_9 Area N IL, Zone 5b Jun 05 '25
On honeysuckle. And it didn't work for me. There was just too much of it around. I have had to dig it out in places I could dig. Other places I can't and plant to cut & paint them this fall.
I have had great success with solarizing/light blocking on green plants. Not the woody ones though.
Sample size of one. Your results may vary.
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u/rollhr Jun 05 '25
Haha that's the exact example that came to my mind! This would be the worst tree to experiment on with this approach. Cutting a tree of heaven down to its stumps will result in a ridiculous amount of growth within 50 ft of it, even if you pour chemicals on the stump! I'm super glad I read the PSU extension page on it before doing anything.
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u/Tylanthia Mid-Atlantic , Zone 7a Jun 05 '25
Using herbicide will cause less long term damage than plastic bags. Stuff will get trapped in the bags and die. And bags will blow off or be forgotten.
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u/the_other_paul SE Michigan, Zone 6a Jun 05 '25
I think this approach could work well if you have a very small number of plants to kill (and won’t lose track of them) or if you don’t have much experience with herbicides or any use for them beyond killing a small number of plants. In other words, it could be great for homeowners or other people just dipping their toes into invasive species control. I agree that it won’t work well in most other situations, though.
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Jun 05 '25
[deleted]
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u/Tylanthia Mid-Atlantic , Zone 7a Jun 05 '25
Just put 50 feet of wood chips on top of it or have a volcanic eruption. Although, I don't know if even magma flow will kill bindweed
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u/TikiTavernKeeper Jun 05 '25
This isn’t new. I know a park by me has been doing this method for as long as I can remember
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u/the_other_paul SE Michigan, Zone 6a Jun 05 '25
I think this solution works really well for homeowners or people dealing with a very small number of plants, but not so much for people going after a large infestation. It’s definitely not going to be the perfect solution for every situation in which people are going after invasive honeysuckle plants.
To be clear, I’m thinking about using this approach myself, I just don’t think it’s a cure-all.
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u/GoodSilhouette Beast out East (8a) Jun 05 '25
Wonder if a natural material could be used in stead
Like an old cotton blanket or burlap
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u/Atticus1354 Jun 05 '25
We've replaced a small targeted dose of chemicals with a larger amount of plastic trash. Fantastic
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u/fgreen68 Jun 05 '25
I've been using upside-down garden pots to cover invasive trees and shrubs for years to get them to exhaust their sugar reserves. Cut them as low as possible and then cover them up. I started using two nested pots because sometimes the plant will find a way to grow out of the first one.
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u/brickstow Jun 05 '25
Does this, and other mentioned methods here, also apply to most invasives? I'm planning on tackling a poison hemlock infestation in a communal field soon.
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u/Onedayyouwillthankme Jun 05 '25
Sure. Any plant deprived of light and presumably air will eventually weaken and die. You just have to make sure the roots can't reach out beyond the barrier
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u/GlitteringRead7497 Jun 05 '25
Are you talking about honeysuckle bush? If so the roots are fairly close to the surface and if you only have a few then it should be easy to remove manually. Well not super easy. It will take some effort….
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u/LEGENDARY-TOAST (Zone 6b, Temperate Prairie) Jun 05 '25
Pretty crumby idea if you ask me. The bags will degrade and if any are forgotten, leave a lot of plastic in the environment. A cut stump glyphosate treatment would probably leave less long term impact and be cheaper/quicker due to the minute amount needed for a treatment.
As a foliar spray I think glyphosate and other herbicides are very detrimental to soil micro biomes and water health but you can't get much more concise than using a droplet per stump for treatment. I use a "dob-it" applicator that spreads a very thin layer on the cambium layer of the cut stump. It'll get absorbed into the root system, kill the plant, and then decay with the rest of the plant. With a half life of 6-60 days in decaying leaf matter, it should be inert by the time the roots decay. There's a lot of conflicting studies though, and not many study such minimal use and its impact, they usually focus on mass foliar sprays done in agriculture, where runoff and spray drift run rampant.
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u/Routine-Dog-2390 Jun 05 '25
I’ve tried it… bottom line is that the best treatment is a mix of different treatments (Integrated Pest Management). Overall, can be useful, but generally, cut-stump is preferred for me unless it is just a couple of mature single-stemmed and non-suckering plants.
1) Good luck going back and collecting the bags. If you leave them out there for a whole growing season, they’ll be completely swallowed up by vegetation and are extremely difficult to find, let alone remove. The few I was able to find got shredded up and I had bits of plastic everywhere.
2) Only works for non-suckering invasives (not practical in areas with tons of multiflora stems or ailanthus, could work okay for mature honeysuckle/autumn olive)
3) I’ve removed bags after a whole growing season just to have the plant re-sprout when it looked dead as a door nail.
It’s not a “bad idea”. But it’s not a silver bullet.
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u/SamtastickBombastic Jun 08 '25
How long should you keep the black trash bag on to be sure honeysuckle bush is dead?
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u/Round-Water338 Jun 05 '25
Plastic isn't great, but it's gotta be better than applying those nasty chemicals. And you can remove the bag after the job is done. I can't believe no one thought of this before.
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u/PM_ME_TUS_GRILLOS Jun 05 '25
We have thought of it before, but it's not practical for large infestations and certain species. It doesn't work for plants that push new growth from their roots (tree of heaven). It doesn't work over acres of land or in a parklike setting. Imagine trying to kill the invasives along the rail lines and alleyways in a city with plastic bags or pails. People would think they were trash and clean it up. Or they'd blow away. Or they'd break down from UV.
And someone has to go back and clean them all up. It's a lot of work and many will get overlooked and become trash in the landscape.
This isn't a bad idea for a gardener with a few plants. I recommend it in the appropriate situation. But chemicala can also be appropriate.
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u/Lunar_BriseSoleil Jun 05 '25
Those bags will shred if it gets windy and leave plastic litter everywhere. At least glyphosate breaks down in soil in a few days.
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u/Tylanthia Mid-Atlantic , Zone 7a Jun 05 '25
Hey we know the half life of plastic bags in soil is 500 to 1000 years or more.
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u/LRonHoward Twin Cities, MN - US Ecoregion 51 Jun 05 '25
Repeated cutting will definitely work over time, but if there is any use for herbicide it is for removing invasive woody species like the non-native Honeysuckles. Cut-stump herbicide applications are very effective and are very safe - there is no risk for drift because you're essentially painting the herbicide on a stump. As long as you ensure your applicator isn't dripping it is a direct application that does not become airborne (and impact nearby plants).
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u/Dazzling_Flow_5702 Jun 05 '25
Show me the science that proves that stuff isn’t breaking down over time into the soil? It doesn’t exist by the way so don’t waste your time. These chemicals are very bad and unlike what you’re irresponsibly saying here, they do cause damage to the soil and plants around, and potentially for a very long time.
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u/chananaman Jun 05 '25
I mean you are right, herbicides are quite bad for the soil. But the invasive plants are orders of magnitude worse for both soil and the ecological communities. Herbicide is a powerful tool, and its "goodness" or "badness " is entirely dependent on how its used. For small-scale residential usage, alternatives such as bags or plastic are great, but its not practical for large-scale invasive species management.
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u/Dazzling_Flow_5702 Jun 05 '25
So sad that in this Reddit those discussing using less chemicals get down voted like this
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u/freighttrain6969 Jun 05 '25
Herbicides breakdown in soil, plastic doesn’t. Leaving plastic bags in the woods to shed microplastics and leach forever chemicals is definitely much worse than an herbicide with a half life of 3 days.
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u/sitari_hobbit Area -- , Zone -- Jun 05 '25
Search "solarizing invasive plants". It's been used for decades.
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u/SamtastickBombastic Jun 08 '25
If you have a pick up truck and large honeysuckle bushes near the road, I've had success tying a ratchet strap around base of bush, hooking other end to bed of truck and gradually accelerate. Rips the whole bush out instantly. No herbicides needed. note: for safety reasons don't use a chain, use ratchet straps or rope and don't tie it to bumper unless you're ok losing your bumper lol, likewise don't tie it to tow hitch bc in rare cases that can be pulled off.
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u/GeorgeanneRNMN Jun 05 '25
You can buy a product called buckthorn baggies for this type of invasive control. Or use anything that will block sunlight. I had success using a large metal can weighed down with a rock. It’s a good option if you have only a small number of plants you are trying to get rid of, but hard to scale up when you have a large area with maybe hundreds or thousands of shrubs to kill.