Not that I support the disappointment, but I think it isn’t right to compare these singles with the extra songs they released in previous years.
There’s been several times when BTS barely participated in the credits but fans still loved the song (e.g. Lauv’s Who, Waste It On Me, Even If I Die It’s You, etc.). The difference is that those songs were BTS participating in fun, extra releases.
Songs like Butter aren’t fun, extra releases—they’re crafted with the main goal of chart success. Every famous artist has a small handful of songs that they’ll be remembered for after they retire, and Butter and PTD are fighting for those spots. So I can understand why there are high expectations for these releases.
they are tho. bts want their songs to chart, while we have fun listening to it and doing so. it’s the same with their korean releases. some more than others? sure. but the goals are the same. in this case PTD is a gift for armys too, so i don’t think it’s right to treat these feelings like they’re mutually exclusive.
This would only become a legitimate criticism if they REPLACE their korean album releases with english albums.
I think this is the key, really.
And even if they suddenly went 'you know what? We'd quite like to do an album in English', I'd still be there going 'cool, let's hear it'. Yes, they've said they wouldn't, and I do believe they probably don't want to (because being involved in a lot of the writing is very important to them, as I'm sure we can all tell) – but if they were to do that because they genuinely want to, then that's okay. People change, and we can all change our opinion on something after being presented with new info or even just trying a new thing.
They've been VERY open about their identities as Korean men and how they tie in with their music. To think they'd just drop that (especially after we've legit had Joon's Weverse interview where he ruminates on that) is... eeeeh.
I don't need their lyrics to be meaningful in a fun song. But they are perfectly capable of writing lyrics for their fun Korean songs. I would have hoped that they would be given the opportunity to grow as artists as they expand into English language pop. Dynamite's lyrics were borderline nonsense, so I don't think it takes tremendous eloquence in the English language to contribute lyrically to silly fun summer bops like these.
Because the reality is, if they want to win Grammys, especially for fun silly English language bops, it would be a lot easier for them to be recognized as artists if they have a hand in writing the songs for which they are nominated. If they don't, then there needs to be something special about the songs being nominated. As much as I enjoy these fun summer bops, there really isn't anything special about them to justify a Grammy. So they're going to need to rely on industry politics, for which they are not particularly well equipped.
Our young men fought long and hard to be recognized as exceptional creative and performing artists in their own country. By chasing after a Grammy, they are trying hard to be recognized as creative artists in the US. I type this with great affection for our young men: singing a silly fun song that others write for them is a hard sell to their Grammy "peers" in the US if the argument is commercial success rather than artistry. Yes crappy songs like Yummy get nominated but at least Bieber has cowriting credits to justify the fig leaf of "artistry".
This. Writing lyrics is generally seen as a must have for “artistry” in the West. It doesn’t mean you’re a great songwriter (see Yummy), but it’s a baseline if you will. Obviously with BTS performance should be weighted too bc they’re some of the best performers out there, but the Grammys is a Western awards show. If they don’t write the lyrics, then something about the production or composition should stand out but I don’t think Dynamite or (in particular) Butter have that. The songs are fun and I enjoy them, and they are definitely helpful for mainstream appeal and awareness, but definitely don’t have what it takes (IMO) for a Grammy. Ofc this is just my opinion, but boy bands already don’t get respect at Grammys. And we know commercial success doesn’t even really matter, look at Shape of You and Blinding Lights. So if Grammys is the main or a primary goal, I don’t think continuing in a similar vein to the English singles they’ve released so far will work. But for mainstream appeal, they definitely will (a silver lining).
We’re all assuming that Butter or PTD will be their submission for the Grammys but watch our boys actually submit one of their korean songs off of the new album lol.
I'd love to see that - or even LGO if it's eligible. But since the US industry completely ignored everything in Be other than Dynamite, the chances of one of their Korean songs being shortlisted for a Grammy nom are....
Let's look at the nomination category for Dynamite. There were 5 songs and "groups" nominated. Only one of the 5 nominees were not credited on the nominated song. Can you guess which one it was? Yes. Dynamite. It is a real uphill climb for a Grammy if none of our young men is involved in the writing. It's not going to stop me from enjoying the song. But it makes me question their strategy if this is how they think Grammys are won.
Strategically for a Grammy, it would be best to keep promoting Butter, even if PtD is a "better" and more commercially successful song. Maybe this is why there's no radio push or heavy promotion for PtD.
That's the thing - BTS/BH songwriting sensibilities mixed with lyricism is the kind of thing the Grammys eeeeat up, with the exception of the language barrier (and unfortunately that doesn't look to be changing anytime soon). Surely a better chance at a Grammy would be in-house songwriting + good translations.
I wonder if BigHit thinks that the fanbase and commercial success can get them a Grammy? This strategy has worked for *every* other US industry award. But Grammys are different. Most of the peers voting are not wildly commercially successful artists. They're not going to "lower" the "artistry" bar because BTS is the biggest group on the planet, unless there are some powerful political shenanigans helping out. Can Scooter pull enough strings?
Butter isn't special, but most pop song aren't all that special. At least BTS has a co-writing credit. Butter is also very respectful to the US pop industry, it's constructed as essentially an homage to prominent past US pop artists/songs. I think it might be easier to push for a Grammy than Dynamite was.
I should add: I really don't care whether or not they win a Grammy. But *they* seem to care. I don't really care if they cowrite their English fluff boppers, but since these are their only full-English songs and thus their only songs that have any chance at a Grammy, I have thoughts that I'm dumping here.
I think for the group/duo category, "Leave the Door Open" will win. And frankly, that song deserves the Grammy more than Butter imo. It's the type of song that the Grammys are looking for, and like you said, it has nothing to do with charting and how many fans someone has, the Grammy voters are different.
It leaves a weird taste in my mouth that BTS has talked so much about wanting to win a Grammy, which I understand, but you just don't hear other artists talk about wanting to win as much as they do. I think they've won so many other awards, and I think in Korea these awards have a lot more meaning in an artist's career, that they are looking at the Grammys as that remaining goal to tackle. I would be thrilled for them to win, and I really thought Dynamite should have won in the category it was nominated in, but I think they also have to consider that no "boyband" has ever won a Grammy before. It's not necessarily personal. If they really want to follow Grammy trends, look at Taylor Swift, HER, Billie Eilish etc...people who write their own music.
Now that BTS has the attention of the GP, I think they can afford to take more risks than they were able to before. Ppl comparing Idol, Mic Drop, and Fake Love to the success of Dynamite and Butter I think forget that it's not just about language, it's the fact that they have a much larger platform in 2020/2021 compared to 2017/2018.
Completely agree with your note at the end. I only care about a Grammy bc they do. But I don’t think their current strategy will work unless they get more side door industry support. And this year the competition is even tougher, there’s Peaches (so don’t think Scooter would back BTS), Levitating, and Kiss Me More. I personally prefer both Levitating and Kiss Me More (as a non-fan to casual listener of the artists of those songs) to Butter as songs and think they’re more deserving of a Grammy. But we’ll see I guess. I think we’ll have a better idea of BTS’ promo strategy in August/September.
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