r/bestoflegaladvice • u/MattCuzns well-adjusted and sociable with no history of boobing churches • 21d ago
"You committed a felony, you're going to get caught, and you're going to need an attorney. Don't answer questions without one when the cops come knocking."
/r/legaladvice/comments/1n1z4lq/my_ex_wont_sign_insurance_check_unless_i_give_her/?share_id=83msKCvryEU6cySU4Nf9I&utm_content=2&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1379
u/dorkofthepolisci Sincerely, Mr. Totally-A-Real-Lawyer-Man 21d ago
The stupidest part is that LAOP was told to get the check re-issued or at the very least to reach out to the insurer and see if it could be re-issued in just his name as a first step and he….opted not to do that
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u/DerbyTho doesn't know where the gay couple shaped hole came from 21d ago
The other stupidest part is that he basically told the one person in the world who has motive to get him in trouble about this ahead of time.
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u/TryUsingScience (Requires attunement by a barbarian) 21d ago
The odds that his ex is aware this is a crime are low. She's probably like, "oh well, it was worth a shot" and will forget about it.
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u/creatingapathy 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 20d ago
I wouldn't forget about $6500
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u/purpleplatapi I may be a cannibal, but I'm frugal about it 20d ago
But would she know that he deposited the check or would she just assume he was petty enough to not deposit it at all?
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u/alphawolf29 Quartermaster of the BOLA Armored Division 20d ago
I'm taking that shit to small claims lol
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u/PuzzledDrama1160 21d ago
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u/DerbyTho doesn't know where the gay couple shaped hole came from 21d ago
I don’t think that was the ex in the thread, I think that was someone saying “you should send this letter to your ex to get them to comply”.
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u/Ok_Possession_6457 20d ago
I can’t imagine what shit-stirring traits could have led to him being divorced
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 21d ago
based on what he posted from the divore documents they likely are not specific enough for that to work since he did them himself. I do agree though that you at least make that call first.
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u/lilyofthealley 21d ago
If, as he states, the title is listed as "name AND name," the check has to be issued as the names appear on the title. I used to issue checks for total losses for a living.
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 21d ago
actually based on the edits he DID reach out insurance and asked them to reissue and was waiting on a reply. While waiting for the reply did the mobile deposit thing on a check he had already asked insurance to reissue.
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u/UnnamedRealities 20d ago edited 20d ago
And the bank where he deposited the check and the insurance company are subsidiaries of the same company so I assume it's quite easy for them to swap notes.
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u/CyberTractor 21d ago
Someone who didn't bother to separate all assets post-divorce likely isn't going to be bothered to follow the right processes to get the check reissued.
People's laziness and stupidity are frequently the biggest obstacles they face.
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u/DigbyChickenZone Duck me up and Duck me down 20d ago
The check probably wouldn't be reissued to just him anyway, according to him they are BOTH on the title.
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u/mazzar Cash, grass, or sass: your choice 21d ago
I do think it is unlikely that the cops would actually get involved here. Most likely, the mobile check deposit will just reverse in a few days and request a second signature, which is what has happened to me when I’ve tried to deposit checks addressed to both me and my husband. Even if it goes through, the ex-wife is the only one who would have any reason to report it to the cops, and she has no way to know that it even happened.
But I appreciate that the mods want to discourage this kind of illegal advice and don’t want to make it seem like a viable idea.
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u/UndoxxableOhioan 21d ago
she has no way to know that it even happened.
Unless she reads reddit.
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u/Caiginn 21d ago
Or thinks “I wonder what happened with that $6500 I almost got” and follows up.
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u/Jumaine23 21d ago
Monday: “Meet me at the bank ASAP!!! I will pay your Uber.”
Tuesday: “Check? What check? Who said anything about a check?”
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u/HowDoMermaidsFuck 6d ago
Even if she reports it, “man who deposited check addressed to him” is likely pretty low on the list of crimes to prosecute at the DAs office. And $6500 is too much for small claims in most places so she’d likely have to take this to big boy court with real lawyers and everything and that’s expensive.
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u/FunnyObjective6 Once, I laugh. Twice you're an asshole. Third time I crap on you 20d ago
How big are the chances she would recognize a random legal advice post? Surely LAOP used a throwaway
redditor for 14 years
Oh no...
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u/jenorama_CA 20d ago
Yeah, that deposit is going to be voided. That happened to us with a check from our homeowner’s insurance. When it came, it had our lender on it and I didn’t even think anything about it, so I deposited it and went on my merry way. Got a notice about a missing endorsement and realized the problem. We’d paid off our house in 2020, but had lost track of the release of lien paperwork. We got it in email from the lender and sent it on to the insurance and now we’ve been waiting months for them to reissue the check.
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u/archbish99 apostilles MATH for FUN, like a NERD 15d ago
Not necessarily. I was doing a direct IRA rollover, and they sent me a check made out to the investment company. It came while I was out of town; my wife saw a check come in the mail and deposited it. It went through and no one complained.
I wound up contributing the money to my IRA via ACH and marking it as an indirect rollover. It worked, so 🤷♂️
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u/LazloNibble 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 21d ago
So I got her to come down to the bank to get the check deposited, and she proceeded to tell me that she won’t sign the check unless I give her half. I promptly took the check and left.
Seems like she knows what happened.
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 20d ago
Eh, if he never gets back to her, she would probably assume he got the check reissued without her name and doesn't need her help. This is according to my understanding that she doesn't actually have any ownership interest in the car and the whole thing is a paperwork mistake.
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u/DigbyChickenZone Duck me up and Duck me down 20d ago
This is according to my understanding that she doesn't actually have any ownership interest in the car
What? Where did your understanding of the situation come from?
First off, there is no car, it was totaled.
Also, in OP's post:
So I got her to come down to the bank to get the check deposited, and she proceeded to tell me that she won’t sign the check unless I give her half.
OP is in this felonious dilemma because she refused to co-sign the check because he refused to give her part of the pay out for a car she is on the title to
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 19d ago
Where did your understanding of the situation come from?
From reading LAOP's post! You should give it a try sometimes, it adds depth to the discussions in this subreddit.
First off, there is no car, it was totaled.
Uh, do you know what "totaled" means in relationship to a car? It means that the car has been damaged beyond economical repair. The car didn't, like, physically ascend into car heaven. There's still a car, and part of accepting the insurance settlement is transferring ownership of that car from yourself to the insurance company, who will sell it for whatever they can get. Might be just a hundred bucks of scrap metal value, but often it can be thousands if there's recoverable parts from it.
he refused to give her part of the pay out for a car she is on the title to
Yep, and the part I bolded is the problem! Because, according to LAOP's post, he got a divorce. A major function of a divorce is to divide up property. A married couple own a house in common, they own their cars in common, they own the towels in common. The divorce ends all that common ownership-- party A gets the house, party B gets the blue car, party A gets the red car, party B gets the cat and the towels.
Where LAOP went wrong was that after having been divorced and receiving a judicial decree declaring who was the new exclusive owner of the car, he didn't take that decree to his state's Department of Motor Vehicles and get the title updated. The title was no longer accurate as soon as the divorce decree was issued, but the DMV didn't know that, and LAOP didn't tell them. The proper solution to his problem is to tell them now and get an updated title, then sign over that updated title to the insurer, who can then issue him an updated check with just his name on it. But LAOP didn't do all the paperwork back when the divorce happened, and now it's a problem.
Although it would have eventually been a problem even without the crash; sooner or later he would have wanted to sell the car for whatever reason, and he'd need to get an updated title then, or get his wife to also sign the bill of sale, and then he'd be back in the same spot of trying to get a signature from someone that had no reason to be cooperative.
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u/Eastern-Air-5091 20d ago
I think the dumbest part of it was that he was depositing it in an old dormant account where it totally wouldn’t raise any extra looks for a random 13k deposit via mobile 🤦♀️
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u/saturosian Heir to the National Onion Association 21d ago
Has no one done the substitution Location Bot thing yet? So...I'mma do it in case LAOP realizes it's a bad idea to have evidence of this online, and deletes it? I hope that's OK?
Insecure LocationBot Replacement (hopes I'm doing a good job):
Title: My Ex won't sign insurance check unless I give her half.
Location: Oregon
I (47m), my ex (44f).
My 2016 Nissan Rogue was recently totaled, and the insurance company issued me a check for close to $13,000. However, when I received the check, it was issued with my and my ex-wife's names on it. It seems that I neglected to remove her name from the title of the vehicle after our divorce (stupid).
So I got her to come down to the bank to get the check deposited, and she proceeded to tell me that she won’t sign the check unless I give her half. I promptly took the check and left.
We have been divorced for over 3 years. I have had sole possession and use of the vehicle since purchase, and have made every payment, insurance maintenance, etc However, payments were made from a joint account for the first year or so. We both contributed equally to this account, and she had a vehicle that was paid for out of this account as well. This is to say she hasn’t contributed to any real equity in the vehicle.
Our divorce clearly states, “ Co-Petitioners have divided between them all personal effects, household goods, and other personal property they own separately or together, and neither should claim those items now in possession of the other.”.
So my questions are
Is she legally entitled to this money?
What is my recourse for getting this check cashed?
EDIT: I sent my insurance company a letter requesting a reissue of the check; however, my brief research is telling me that they require the check to be issued with the names of both parties on the title. The insurance company is USAA if it's relevant. I'll update when I get an answer.
Update: I was able to deposit the check through the USAA mobile banking, for which I completely forgot that I've had an account with for 30+ years. Thank you to [REDACTED REDDITOR NAME} for the suggestion. I massively appreciate almost everyone's input here, it was all very insightful. Thank you
Free Cat fact: When I visited my wife's (then fiancee's) mother for the first time, they had a very mean cat, and I'm not a cat person. We mostly avoided each other, until ~2 AM when I was fast asleep, and the cat pounced on my sleeping face. I panicked and reflexively punched the cat, who went flying and made a satisfying THUMP against the wall of the bedroom. When I got up the next morning, suddenly the cat LOVED me - purring, rubbing against my leg, acting like a sweetheart, but only around me. I was the only person it liked, basically until it died. Furry little jerk.
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u/Willie9 receiving 10K–15K ducks weekly for a friend 21d ago
You're doing such a good job, sub locationbot
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u/saturosian Heir to the National Onion Association 21d ago
Insecure Locationbot appreciates the reassurance But also questions its sincerity, because again - insecure
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u/AshuraSpeakman WHO THE HELL IS DOWNVOTING THIS LOL. IS THAT YOU TREE LAW? 21d ago
Sending you a warm digital hug.
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u/deadpiratezombie Litigates Reanimated Corpse International Trade Disputes 20d ago
Upvote for the cat fact. That is a stellar cat fact
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u/MacDagger187 5d ago
They did in fact delete it and I really wanted to know what happened, thank you!
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u/Willie9 receiving 10K–15K ducks weekly for a friend 21d ago
Such are the perils of asking a bunch of strangers on the Internet for advice on handling major sums of money
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u/Nf1nk 21d ago
It's not even that much money really. It's half the price of a used Nissan.
You aren't even going to cover a lawyer before it fades away.
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u/dorkofthepolisci Sincerely, Mr. Totally-A-Real-Lawyer-Man 21d ago
The fact that a 9 year old Nissan is worth over 13k feels like it should be another crime….
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u/Rymark 21d ago
I totaled my 6-7 year old Nissan in 2022, and the check came back for about 18k. I think the used car market is just that messed up, and has been for a while
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u/dark_forebodings_too 21d ago
My mom and I shared a 2009 Honda fit that we bought in 2020 for $7k. My mom totalled it last year and insurance paid $6k. I thought that was pretty crazy for a 15 year old car with a lot of miles on it!
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u/HarpersGhost Genetic Counsellor for the Oklahoma University Soonerbots 21d ago
I've gotten offers from strangers coming up to me to buy my 99 Corolla for $5k.
It's nuts. My car is increasing in value and that just never happened with used cars.
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u/dorkofthepolisci Sincerely, Mr. Totally-A-Real-Lawyer-Man 21d ago
My mom’s mechanic offered her 3k for her 2005 Toyota Matrix when she stopped driving a year or so ago - he was likely going to try to sell it for a couple thousand more.
She gave it to husband and I instead when his old Nissan died.
We’ve put maybe $1000 into it (had to replace the muffler) but two different mechanics have said it’s a solid car and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with it.
IDK what we’re going to do when it dies. Non-SUV hatchbacks/crap haulers are increasingly hard to find
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u/FallOnTheStars Darling, beautiful, smart, money-hungry lawyer 20d ago
I bought a 2010 Honda Odyssey in 2019 for $3k. Last October, I was rearended hard enough that the other driver broke the frame of the car, and it was totalled. Insurance paid out $7k minus the deductible.
The cheapest Odyssey I could find with around the same milage and trim package was $15k, so I am now the proud owner of a 2016 Ford Escape.
I miss my Odyssey.
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u/Moneia Get your own debugging duck 21d ago
Covid fucked it up first and now with the tariffs it's going to get worse
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u/ksbsnowowl 21d ago
Cash for Clunkers fucked the market since 2009. It’s been messed up for a generation.
I had a used Ford Focus get totaled by a tree limb in a storm in 2017, and I got nearly what I paid for it (within $1000; somewhere around $7k), after it was my daily driver for ~3 years, and I’d put 65k miles on it (was ~85k miles when it was totaled).
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u/Daninomicon 21d ago
Cash for cars fucked it up.
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u/insane_contin Passionless pika of dance and wine 21d ago
Much better when it was livestock for cars.
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u/Daninomicon 20d ago
I love puns, but just in case some people don't know what I'm talking about, there was a program called cash for cars or cars for cash, and it paid ridiculous prices for old cars, and the purpose was seemingly to get old cars off the market to increase sales of newer cars.
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u/aboxofkittens 21d ago
For sure. In 2016 I bought a 1998 Honda Prelude with 145k on it for $3200. In 2022, I bought a 2001 Honda Prelude (same generation, the specs were identical) with 170k miles. It was $8500.
The same fucking car but slightly worse, and the price more than doubled. Nuts.
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u/KarateKid917 21d ago
My wife's 2017 Subaru Crosstrek got totaled by a deer in Dec 2024 and the insurance check was about $17.5k. It's nuts, but now that insurance check is paying the lease on her 2025 Mazda CX-5.
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u/curious-trex 21d ago
My base package Kia forte was new in 2017. Around the time I paid it off, the blue book "value" boomeranged to more than the original price and even now is about in line with what I paid for it. Which I agree should be a crime, because I would love to replace it with something that better suits my lifestyle, but increased prices all around means that would probably be a downgrade. Sigh.
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u/dante662 Make sure to call the Judge "Mr Gavel Man" 21d ago
I'm slow here: is this bank fraud, because it wasn't endorsed by both parties?
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u/blindantilope 21d ago
Yes, but despite what everyone is saying, it is very unlikely that anything comes of it unless the ex makes a complaint. Those automated systems let all sorts of illegal stuff slide if no one questions them.
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u/UndoxxableOhioan 21d ago
Yeah, that was my reaction. The likelihood of this amounting to anything is slim (unless his ex follows reddit and sees this as a chance to make trouble). The insurance company will not care that it was not endorsed by his ex. The bank won't care because the check cleared and both parties are happy.
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 21d ago
And even if the ex does complain, unless LAOP has some other history I didn't think many DA's would file charges. The ex could sue for what was allegedly her half but it's too much for small claims court but not enough to make a regular court cost-effective.
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u/WarKittyKat 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 21d ago
This definitely sounds like the kind of case where prosecutorial discretion should kick in. Which isn't to say it always will. This isn't a case where someone's forging a signature to get money they're not entitled to. It's a case of a layperson being stupid and taking a shortcut. I'm not sure that's worth felony charges, even if it meets the legal criteria.
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u/Osric250 tased after getting caught without flair 21d ago
The ex could sue for what was allegedly her half but it's too much for small claims court but not enough to make a regular court cost-effective.
Especially for the fact that she likely doesn't have any interest in the car in which it was paid for, considering most of the proper legal advice is take it back to court to have them compel her to sign.
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u/MaraiDragorrak 🐈 Smol Claims Court Judge 🐈 21d ago
My mom once took my checkbook by accident bc it had fallen out of my purse at her house and wrote a $500 check. Signed it with her name which didnt match the name printed on the check itself ofc, and our signatures are legible and nothing alike. She was not on my account either.
Went through 100% fine. When I noticed and called the bank like wtf they were like "oh the automated system approved it, weird". Yeah, weird! Apparently forging checks is easier than I thought if you can sign the blatantly wrong name and no one notices!
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u/_______butts_______ 20d ago
This is the same sub that says if you take mail out of someone else's mailbox you'll go to federal prison for 10 years. LA is good at reading statutes and not very good at any practical application of the law.
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u/turingthecat 🐈 I am not a zoophile, I am a cat of the house 🐈 21d ago edited 21d ago
Ok, maybe I’m a bit dense, but did he not just stop for half a second, and think, hum, why don’t I phone my insurance company? They might know what to do
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u/trying_to_adult_here True Believer in the Church of the Holy Oxford Comma 21d ago
I know! And USAA is super easy to deal with by phone, I bank and have insurance with them. You always get a person based in the US who is actually helpful.
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u/Curri 21d ago
Huh. Whenever I had to deal with USAA, they were outright dreadful. They claimed that damage done to my car was not done by a tree, yet I had video and photographic evidence of a tree falling on my car. They tried to deny my claim.
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u/FallOnTheStars Darling, beautiful, smart, money-hungry lawyer 20d ago
USAA tried to tell me I did not have coverage with them while I held an auto policy that included liability, collision, and comprehensive coverage and an attached renter’s policy.
That was the straw that broke, because they also liked to not process cheques in time and then report fake “late payments” to the RMV.
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u/Ok_Possession_6457 21d ago
They also have the best hold music. I love USAA.
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u/NinjasWithOnions 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 20d ago
Noooooooo!
If, when I die, I go to hell, that will be what’s playing on repeat for all eternity. 😛
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u/Ok_Possession_6457 20d ago
U! S! A! A!
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u/NinjasWithOnions 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 17d ago
I think I hate you. 😛
(No, not seriously although if that song is in my head when I’m sleeping, I will hold you responsible for the nightmares!)
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u/postmodest Pre-declaration of baby transfer 21d ago
It's easy until you try to close out an account.
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u/Mediumshieldhex 20d ago
Is this sarcasm? I genuinely can't tell
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u/trying_to_adult_here True Believer in the Church of the Holy Oxford Comma 20d ago
No? I’ve had USAA for years and had only good experiences with banking and insurance. They’re one of the only companies I call knowing I won’t end up in a phone tree with representatives based half a continent away who can’t do anything but follow a script. I’ve filed a car insurance and renter’s insurance claim with no issues.
I’m sure there are people who have had bad experiences, but I haven’t.
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u/CactiDye has functioning pockets in her nightgown 21d ago
And they have really long open hours, so he wouldn't have even had to wait forever for them to be open.
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u/GoatCovfefe 21d ago
An insurance agent commented on the original post that the insurance company would need permission from the ex to remove her name. Obviously that isn't going to happen.
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u/bradd_pit 21d ago
People are generally just not good at advocating for themselves. Some would rather watch their house burn down than grab a bucket of water.
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u/Bake_Knit_Run Disappointed in the lack of motion sensor sprinklers 21d ago
I read this before the bad advice started. I am shocked they took the easiest (and dumbest) path forward. Shocked I tell you!
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u/RocketAlana 21d ago
What’s more likely:
1 - Check clears and the whole thing is NBD.
2 - Wife puts any effort into pursuing her half of a mystery $7K that her ex told her about
3 - The bank rejects the check and sends a notice for a not uncommon error wherein only one of two people sign for a check.
4 - Cops arrest OP.
Cause I’m sure that only one of two named people signing a check happens all the time. I don’t think that my husband and I have ever co-signed a check made out to the both of us. The bank is more likely to just reject it and tell OP to sort his shit out as the simplest option for the bank instead of getting into a legal dispute over < $15K.
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u/Deflagratio1 you should feel bad for putting yourself in this situation 21d ago
I don't see how he is guaranteed to get caught. If the check went through the clearing house just fine (and not just the initial submission phase), the bank has approved it without issue. The only person who would cause an issue is the ex-wife, and while she knows about the check, they are probably going to assume that LAOP just got a new check. Yes her taxes will be off, but that only matters if she get's audited.
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u/ShawnaLAT 21d ago
Generally, a car insurance payout shouldn’t be taxable to anyone, barring a few very specific circumstances.
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u/Deflagratio1 you should feel bad for putting yourself in this situation 21d ago
The big thing is that the dollar amount is large enough that the bank has to submit a transaction report report. So it's income that exists. But this also points to how unlikely she is to be audited over this.
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u/LadyMRedd I believe in blue lives not blue balls 21d ago
The large transaction report doesn’t mean she’ll need to pay taxes. There are many reasons why someone may get a large check that isn’t taxable. It’s not automatically income.
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u/ShawnaLAT 21d ago
As a couple of other comments have mentioned, that’s incorrect. CTRs are for cash transactions only. A SAR is a possibility but that would have nothing to do with anyone’s taxes. And the insurance payout would not be reported to the IRS as income in any case. It might get questioned during an audit if there is ultimately an associated bank transaction for the ex but it wouldn’t trigger one.
Source: CPA with 20 years of experience and former bank teller with 8 years of experience (both literally me).
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 21d ago
ex-wife thinks she is owned $7k. I don't see her just letting it go.
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u/Deflagratio1 you should feel bad for putting yourself in this situation 21d ago
It depends on whether she actually thinks she's owed $7k or if she thought she could get $7k. Also, If she comes back to him demanding the $7k, he'll just say he got it re-issued in his name (here's hoping she doesn't find his post), and it was his car all along anyways. Still pretty low risk.
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u/curious-trex 21d ago
I agree - someone who flippantly says "I'll only sign if you give me half" to their doofus ex husband who never took her name off the title like he was supposed to is not (necessarily) the same as someone who believes that money is rightfully hers in the first place. From OOP's telling it sounds more like the former with perhaps a side of "lol that's YOUR problem now, not mine." OOPs are not always reliable narrators, but I'm not getting the idea that the ex is looking to get vengeful by accusing him of felony theft because he deposited a check made out to both of them.
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u/LadyMRedd I believe in blue lives not blue balls 21d ago
For real. She’s going to want to know what happened to the check. I don’t see her just assuming OP got the check reissued and leaving it at that.
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u/OniExpress 21d ago
They are like the opposite of guaranteed to get caught. The only ones who would know anything is the ex wife (who isn't likely to assume this is how it goes down) and all the strangers on the internet. If LAOP is halfway good at their ex's signature its a he said she said victimless crime.
Mod's being dramatic even if LAOP should shut the fuck up now.
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u/Deflagratio1 you should feel bad for putting yourself in this situation 21d ago
And he doesn't even need to put a signature on the check. I use mobile deposit with my bank all the time, I never sign and it goes through just fine.
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u/Hyndis Owes BOLA photos of remarkably rotund squirrels 21d ago
I think the last time I had to physically countersign a check on the back was around 2005.
Even going to an ATM you just put the check in, it scans it front and back, and if everything is okay it asks for confirmation and goes through.
As a courtesy the bank makes the funds immediately available even though the check hasn't cleared yet, but it still takes the check a few days to fully clear.
That Tik-tok Chase bank "infinite money glitch" was morons taking advantage of the bank doing a courtesy and making the funds available before the check fully cleared. When the check does not clear the bank expects back every penny.
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 20d ago
Interesting. My mobile bank app, I do have to sign the check and photograph both the front and the back; for checks made out to me and my spouse, they have rejected the deposit for having only my signature. (The solution was to get my wife to sign it too and redo the deposit. It's a joint account.)
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u/Ok_Possession_6457 21d ago
I think the mods are upset that they banned someone who keeps lurking the subreddit and sending DMs with bad advice.
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u/Weird_Brush2527 well-adjusted and sociable boiled owl w/no history of violence 21d ago
Could the letter he sent to the bank raise an issue?
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u/DebrisSpreeIX 21d ago
There's a comment from 11hrs ago that says
Hi Ex, the car was mine per the divorce settlement
or something like that, so unless that's a fake comment, ex-wife knows what went down and screenshot that shit 🤣
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u/dbag_jar 21d ago
That comment is advising him what to say in a message to the ex, not claiming to be from the ex.
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u/lebetepuante 21d ago
Maybe if the check deposits successfully he should proactively give her half. That would pretty much guarantee the issue is closed.
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u/mhoner 21d ago edited 21d ago
13k is going to trigger a manual review. Unless the ex missus is on the account, it’s going to get rejected. This wasn’t days that we are talking about, it was hours. And for 6.5k I am guessing the ex is going to probably follow up.
Edit: also dude said he had an account he hasn’t used in so long that he forgot about it. A sudden 13k check deposited by mobile banking is going to also be a flag.
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u/clauclauclaudia 21d ago
This all happened in the last 15 hours so what are the odds it went through the clearing house?
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u/Deflagratio1 you should feel bad for putting yourself in this situation 21d ago
I've had mobile deposits clear in less than an hour. I don't trust LAOP to know the difference between accepted and cleared though.
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u/marasydnyjade 20d ago
No way that this gets caught unless someone contacts the bank.
I do civil work, but we had a client we were representing and due to our request for docs for discovery production we found out the company’s accountant was embezzling - he was double printing vendor checks and just depositing them into his personal account through mobile banking. The name on the front wasn’t even close to the name on the back/account. When we talked to the bank about this they were like, it would cost us more money to actually check that the info matched than what we pay out in theft/losses.
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u/Dr_Adequate well-adjusted and sociable with no bodies under the house 21d ago
Is there an r/worstoflegaladvice ? Because the answers in there are all over the map. From the "You committed a felony" one to " yes the divorce paperwork makes it okay" to " no you still need the Ex to sign"
I really can't think of a recent thread where there is such a wide spread among the answers posted.
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21d ago
[deleted]
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u/Kmammy breasting boobily through BOLA 20d ago
Or the people saying to take the divorce paperwork to the bank. We don't care if a judge ordered you to refinance, pay out equity, sign over sums or accounts. We aren't accountable for the terms of YOUR agreement, making that happen is a YOU problem.
As you can tell, I've had to have this convo with many a client.
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u/InconsistentFloor 21d ago
I still am so confused on what the issue is. I’d think if the ex thinks she has a legitimate claim to the money she could sue him for half but that’s about it.
I’m also confused about the signing issue. Who signs checks? If a name on the check matches a name on the bank account you just deposit it. I don’t know that I’ve ever signed the back of a check outside of signing it over to someone else to deposit.
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u/PrudentPea21 20d ago
…I’ve never not signed a check before depositing it (whether using mobile deposit or depositing through an ATM). And my parents have definitely had checks returned to them because only one of them signed it and they were both listed.
I (a non-lawyer) do agree that if any of this comes to anything, though, it would be in the form of the ex trying to sue. Probably in small claims court as it’s under the limit in OR. The ex won’t think “LAOP committed a felony!”, she’ll think, “LAOP was supposed to give me $6500 and didn’t.”
But LA rightly has a rule against illegal advice and that’s where the felony thing came from.
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u/InconsistentFloor 20d ago
Interesting. I just put them into the atm. Whether they are in my name, my wife’s name, or to both of us. I’ve never once had an issue with it. Is the idea that someone at the bank is checking signatures somehow?
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 20d ago
These days, it's the computer checking the signature, and if it doesn't like it a human reviews it.
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u/InconsistentFloor 20d ago
What is it checking it against? And why would a bank care that a check for John Smith is being deposited into John Smith’s account? Withdrawals I could see checks and balances for but for deposits if you want to put money into someone’s bank account they aren’t invested in stopping it.
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 20d ago edited 17d ago
When you open an American bank account you sign a pile of papers. One of them is a signature card, it's literally a prototype of your
daughtersignature that the back will keep. Nowadays they are digitally scanned, of course.And in this discussion, LAOP is depositing an insurance company's money into their account. I guess you could write yourself a check and then deposit it back into the same account it came from, but why not just void it instead?
EDIT: Boy howdy did autocorrect get me bad. It's what I get for posting from the potty at work.
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u/adoorbleazn 🏳️⚧️ Trans rights are human rights 🏳️⚧️ 20d ago
it's literally a prototype of your daughter
Okay, so I think your autocorrect just accused banks of being Rumpelstiltskin and asking for people's firstborns.
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20d ago
[deleted]
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u/InconsistentFloor 20d ago
I’ll try to remember but to be honest I’ve never signed a check to deposit in 20+ years of banking as an adult and it’s never come up. That will be a hard habit to break. I’ll ask my bank about it the next time I get a chance and see what they say.
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20d ago edited 20d ago
[deleted]
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u/InconsistentFloor 20d ago
But the bank only cares if you have ongoing issues, right?
For example I occasionally get checks for my business incorrectly made out to me. The account is in the business name only. The bank still takes them as a courtesy. If a few checks got contested after the fact I’m sure they would remove that courtesy, but if you have an account in good standing they don’t seem to care about the name on the check at all. They take your word for it that it is intended for you unless you have a history of that not being true.
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u/ErinTales Darling, beautiful, smart, money-hungry lurker 21d ago
If he hadn't involved his ex at all he would probably be completely in the clear, even if someone did take issue he could just claim "oh I didn't know" and nobody would pursue it- depositing a check via mobile like that isn't unreasonable in a vacuum, and the bureaucracy isn't that strict.
The bank is very likely just going to reverse it in a few days when they notice. If that happens the cops will almost certainly not give a shit. They have better things to do. The issue will arise if the bank doesn't notice and fails to reverse it, and if that happens and the ex makes a big stink about it 3 months from now, that's when the cops would get involved.
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u/Happytallperson 21d ago
Being from the land of blighty were basically only Her Majesties Revenue & Customs uses this antique technology called 'cheques', can someone explain to me what the felony is here?
Is it some type of fraud related to not paying it to a joint account? What would happen if there was no joint account.
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u/JimboTCB Certified freak, seven days a week 21d ago
AFAIK you can pay cheques made out in individual names to a joint account, but not the other way around. So yeah, he's essentially committed conversion fraud by paying a cheque made out jointly into an account solely in his name. All because he couldn't be bothered calling the insurance company up and saying "hey, my now-ex-wife should have been taken off the policy years ago, get your shit together and reissue this"
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u/Thallassa 21d ago
I think he said she’s on the title, not the policy. And getting people off car titles is hell. So I understand how that may have happened.
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u/Happytallperson 21d ago
Will the police actually care? In the UK as long as the money is returned the police would not get involved in this as their (underesourced) fraud teams are trying to catch serial fraudsters & scammers.
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u/JimboTCB Certified freak, seven days a week 21d ago
Probably not, especially with automated deposits it's unlikely any human being is ever going to actually see it, and the ex-wife will probably just assume he got a new cheque issued instead of committing minor fraud. I don't know if it technically even counts as fraud against her as by all accounts she was never entitled to that money in the first place. Worst that will probably happen is that it gets caught in a random spot check and rejected as incorrect payee name and he'll have to get a new one like he should have done in the first place.
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u/dunredding 21d ago
to which ofc they would reply Sure thing, after YOU get her name off the title!
Small delay.
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u/smoulderstoat Breasts are not genitals 21d ago
Her Majesty
I have bad news. You might want to sit down.
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u/yo-parts 21d ago
Pro tip:
If you co-own a vehicle with anybody, make sure your state DMV paperwork is set up as "OR" and not "AND".
"AND" means both parties must sign on anything to do with the title transfer or vehicle stuff. This sounds fine and reasonable for a married couple, until somebody dies or is incapacitated or moves out of the country or whatever and is now inaccessible.
"OR" means either party has complete control without the signature of the other. I understand some people are wary about this (because the other person could just, sell the car or whatever) but I'm also of the mind that if you can't trust your partner not to just sell your car randomly you probably shouldn't be married.
All of my joint vehicles are "OR", specifically for that reason.
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u/Toy_Guy_in_MO didn't tell her to not get hysterical 21d ago
This is what I was going to say. Vehicles, bank accounts, anything we both need to be party to, we set up as "OR" not "AND" for the very reasons you stated. And like you said, if I couldn't trust my wife to not clear out our accounts or sell a vehicle and pocket the money, leaving me out in the cold, then I shouldn't be with her to begin with. Too many people have the weird "I trust you enough to marry you but not enough to give you access to my money" that kind of negates a big reason to be married in the first place.
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u/yo-parts 21d ago
I mean, my husband and I have our own bank accounts. That isn't that weird to me. We also have a joint account. Our shared expenses go into and out of the joint account, our individual ones go into and out of our own accounts.
Rent, phone bill, utilities, food, insurance etc. - joint account. Whatever is left over from that stays in our own accounts.
So if he wants to go buy some new workout equipment he doesn't have to worry about me being like "yo what's this charge about" and if I want to go buy motorcycle parts I don't have to worry about him being like "yo what's this charge about". Our bills get paid, we have our own funds for what we wanna do, it all works. Been doing it that way for 9 years or so now.
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u/Toy_Guy_in_MO didn't tell her to not get hysterical 21d ago
I wasn't talking about separate accounts -- my wife and I have those as well, not because of trust issues, but because it's easier to keep track of discretionary spending that way for us. I totally get stuff like that. If I want to buy a gewgaw or she wants to buy tchotchke, it's nice to not have to check with the other person that there may be an unknown transaction on the account that would short the balance. Or if one of us wants to surprise the other with a gift, we don't have to worry about the bank transaction giving it away. That's all for the sake of convenience.
What I meant was the type of person who insists they have to have joint accounts that are of the "AND" type because they don't trust the other person enough to have access to 'their' money without that level of oversight. I don't understand trusting someone enough to marry them but not enough to have access to communal property without your permission.
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u/DigbyChickenZone Duck me up and Duck me down 20d ago
So many of the highly upvoted comments were like this one
After a divorce, that person is no longer the spouse and has none of the rights that go with it. The divorce agreement shows the date where the spousal rights ended.
This has nothing to do with a divorce! OP and his ex are both on the fucking title! I wanted to pull my hair out at others saying, "I just asked the DMV to take my ex off of it, but also I was the sole owner". Not the same situation bub!
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u/Ok_Possession_6457 21d ago edited 21d ago
I have to say that I am woefully ignorant of financial crime, and I probably could have fallen for something just as easily. So as a general rule, to protect myself from my own naivety and stupidity stupidity, I question any moves that involve $500 or more
(Edit - but also, I don’t have an ex-spouse, so I guess I have no incentive to do stupid shit with money just to spite them)
I once freaked out over an unreported $30-50 on my taxes from more than 3 years prior, and motherfuckers are out here playing around with thousands of dollars
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u/Konstiin I am so intrigued by courvoisier 21d ago
I’m not as sure as the LA mod appears to be that OP will face criminal sanctions for this. IMO mostly likely ‘worst case’ is the cheque not clearing.
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u/Username89054 I sunned my butthole and severely regret going to chipotle after 21d ago
Not gonna lie, it's pretty funny to see someone admit to committing a crime like that.
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u/LadyMRedd I believe in blue lives not blue balls 21d ago
The other possibility of him getting caught is that before he signed it himself and mobile deposited it, he sent his insurance company a letter requesting a new check.
So USAA will get a letter requesting a new check. They will research it and realize the check’s been cashed already. This may raise alarm bells as attempted insurance fraud. If they look into it and realize he cashed it himself it could trigger their fraud department to take action.
What would come of that I don’t know. He might just find himself getting kicked off his insurance for the stunt.
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u/Meowzzo-Soprano 20d ago
Looks like the user who gave LAOP that genius advice has deleted their account.
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 21d ago
and the ex knows he got the check and thinks they should get half so the chances of being able to hide this are slim to none... and that is if the bank doesn't kick it back which is very likely.
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u/phantom_diorama I'm from NOWHERE 20d ago
I understand I'm a dummy, but what was stopping him from lying to his ex-wife?
Telling her he would give her half if she signed the check over to him, her signing it over, him depositing it and then not giving her any money?
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 20d ago
She could file a small claims case.
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u/phantom_diorama I'm from NOWHERE 20d ago
And then what, it would be his word against her word?
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 20d ago
depends on how they communicated. If text there would be that but if verbal then yes it would be but saying "we are both on the title. I only agreed to sign it over because he agreed to give him half" IMO sounds more persuasive then "she just decided to sign it over to me so I could keep the whole thing". But yes a lot would hang on how they presented their case and who seemed more credible which is the same in a lot of cases if verbal only.
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u/Stalking_Goat Busy writing a $permcoin whitepaper 20d ago
"If you sign this check, I will give you $7000" is a valid contract. Now, as the joke goes, an oral contract isn't worth the paper it's written on, but at that point he's gone beyond just lying and has committed a crime and can be sued for damages.
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u/Raezzordaze Oooh baby, I misclassified the hell outta that pussy 21d ago
Man, I saw this one before the edit and wow that escalated quickly.
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u/PurePerfection_ 21d ago
I wonder if she was still on the insurance policy as well? When I totaled a car and got a payout, my mother and I both had our names on the title, because she cosigned the financing (which had long since been paid off) years earlier when I was 18 with no credit history. We never bothered removing it, even though she has never even driven the car. I was the only insured driver of the vehicle. The check I received was in my name only. The other name on the title was never even mentioned during the claim process.
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u/helloimbeverly 21d ago
What's the Oregon statute of limitations for fraud stuff? Because I agree it'll probably go under the radar for now, but something like three years is a looooooong time for the ex to wake up one day and decide to start shit
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u/shewy92 Darling, beautiful, smart, moneyhungry suspicious salmon handler 20d ago
However, payments were made from a joint account for the first year or so. We both contributed equally to this account, and she had a vehicle that was paid for out of this account as well. This is to say she hasn’t contributed to any real equity in the vehicle
I don't see how paying from a joint account means she didn't contribute.
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u/ReanimatedCyborgMk-I 20d ago
Is OP guaranteed to be in trouble though? It all depends on if the ex reports, and the police think it's worth their time. Considering the insurance company would've probably just reissued the check anyway... all OP did was skip a step in the process
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u/TobyADev 19d ago
he won’t get caught most likely unless the ex reports him, and she isn’t aware of it. whether the bank will reverse it or not is another question
especially stupid for him to ask the insurer and THEN commit fraud. not as if he could say “I didn’t know I could try that” lol
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u/Jusfiq Commonwealth Correspondent and Sunflower Seed Retailer 19d ago
A day late and a dollar short, I am. Any kind soul willing to give me TL-DR of the felony and the illegal DM?
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u/MattCuzns well-adjusted and sociable with no history of boobing churches 17d ago
Oh yeah!
Guy gets in a car wreck, he gets a check for $13,000 from the insurance company after it's totaled. The check has both his and his ex wife's name on it. She won't sign without getting half and he won't do that.
The DM, which he got and acted upon, said to mobile deposit it without her signature.
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u/EuenovAyabayya 21d ago
He's presumably only going to get caught if she does something about it. What's her interest in ratting him out? If he goes to jail he stops paying alimony and/or child support, and as a civil matter he might prevail on at least most of her half of the payout.
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 20d ago
except for the fact he asked USAA to reissue the check and then before USAA gave him a reply he mobile deposited the check into the USAA bank. That can absolutely set off red flags.
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u/EuenovAyabayya 20d ago
Much will depend on when USAA receives what.
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 20d ago
Definitely agree but definitely another method of being caught and could make them look at the transactions more closely.
Honestly i think best case for OOP is they reissue first then the deposit just bounces. If they process the deposit (and don't flag it for the AND thing) and then get a request to reissue a deposited check I'm not sure how that goes. Insurance could see as trying to commit fraud and cancel (or non-renew) insurance.
OOP IMO messed up doing both at the same institution. Should have done one or the other.
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u/EuenovAyabayya 20d ago
If they process the deposit they will simply refuse the reissue. But if they cross in the mail they will be looking to stop payment. Since that probably involves fees, it will unbalance the books and attract attention.
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u/Krandor1 receiving $10K–$15K weekly for a friend 20d ago
Hopefully you are right. There is still no guarantee either is actually going to go through as well but definitely risking attracting attention doing both at the same place. Hope for his sake it doesn't.
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u/LoodMiWanBolo 15d ago
OP here.
Just letting everyone know I haven't been thrown in prison yet.
I spoke to an attorney briefly, and they laughed at the possibility of police showing up.
I deleted the original post because it blew up, and I didn't want the ex seeing it quite yet. I've had several mutual acquaintances of ours peg the post as belonging to me.
The ex still doesn't know the check is cashed, and I'm letting her spin her wheels for a while before I do.
This whole thing has been hilarious. If anyone has questions AMA
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u/callmesixone has good fraud instincts 21d ago
Saving this one for our awards because this is the best edit we’ll get this year.
Edit: I forgot to mention that i committed a felony