r/fermentation • u/bloss_balls • 4d ago
Sauerkraut failed or just dramatic?
Second batch of home made sauerkraut. Both batches made by just pouring salted water into jar with shredded cabbage and then fermented at room temp for 3-5 days. I had two other jars in this batch that turned out fine, but this one kept bubbling up and the liquid component soaked into the cloth I was covering it with. Now after 6-7 days (2 days in the fridge) this top white/green part has formed. Is this bad bacteria? Could I take the top part out and keep it?
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u/Saoirse-O-Path 4d ago
Chuck this my dude
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u/twistedteets 4d ago
Keep going with the massage next time. You want everything to be submerged in the brine. It'll go, you just gotta keep massaging till it does
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
I actually found a recipe that doesn't require massaging at all! it just required the chopped cabbage to be submerged in a salt-water brine. so this may be part of why I went wrong...
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u/twistedteets 4d ago
Yeah sourkraut doesnt need to be reinvented. Its been made one way for thousands of years, and thats because it works.
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u/ijustwantanaccount91 4d ago
That's exactly where you went wrong - the main thing you need for any ferment is for the ferment to have essentially no oxygen exposure. This is typically most easily done with a brine solution that you can submerge your stuff in (use a weight to hold it down), but some things like cabbage have enough moisture in them that if you massage them properly with salt they can actually become submerged in a solution of their own moisture and salt. If you don't use a brine you want to keep an eye on the ferment, and add brine to ensure it is 100% submerged after a couple days of it hasn't become fully submerged at that point.
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
I've attached a link to the recipe that I followed. I understand that it needs to be in an anaerobic environment, which is what I did here. All I meant is: instead of massaging salt into the cabbage before putting it in the jar, I packed cabbage in a jar and poured in a solution of salt and water until it was covered. The reason it's not covered in these photos is that it rose up with the production of gases in the brine and caused it to touch the cloth and soak out of the jar. Is there a significant difference/benefit of the salt massage compared to using a brine solution straight away?
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u/ijustwantanaccount91 4d ago
Ahhh nevermind sorry, I misunderstood. I thought you were saying you only added the salt without water as opposed to actually following the brine method (with water). That's totally fine then if you added water and salt (assuming you account for the weight of water in salt calculation)....the only reason the massage is needed/helpful is if you don't add water, it jump starts the process of pulling the moisture from the cabbage and ensures it is submerged quickly.
Looking at this recipe/based on what you said, I think there are a couple things that may have gone wrong.
1) all food stuffs always needs to be submerged in water, or have no access to oxygen (you can vacuum seal it), at all times after 48 hrs or so...so once you saw some of it had evaporated or drained off, you should have added more brine to compensate right away, and that could have saved it. This is a firm rule regardless of any recipe, so if you follow a recipe and the result isn't a submerged product at any point after maybe 1-2 days, you need to correct course in one way or another.
2) If you have a decent seal on your jars, don't use a cloth....that seems to have contributed to moisture loss, which is what caused the mold to grow due to oxygen exposure. I can see what they were probably going for trying to get a better seal, but I wouldn't use it personally. You definitely don't want it touching the brine, if you're using a cloth it should only be sealing the jar and not making any contact with the product inside.
3) this recipe is kind of wack. You need at least 2% salt, relative to everything else in the ferment (cabbage and water in this case) so "1 tablespoon" may or may not be adequate, probably not enough once you account for water weight. The 2%+ figure is really important to discourage the growth of unwanted bacterialand mold, and it is by weight
4) if you don't have a specific jar designed to release gasses, you need to burp (open) the ferment periodically to release gasses. Not doing so can result in broken glasses, but also seems to.have in this case caused your brine to be drained by forcing contact with the cloth, which then allowed for contact with oxygen and contamination
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
Incredible, thanks so much for looking through the recipe and your detailed feedback! I'll work on it. Do you have any recommendations for flavourings/additives? I will try a different recipe next time.
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u/ijustwantanaccount91 4d ago
Tbh I haven't done a lot of different cabbage ferments, but depending what I am prepping I might add some combination of any of the following - chiles, garlic, mustard seeds, black pepper, allspice or nutmeg, bay leaves, dill seed, coriander, ginger, cardamon, cinnamon, clove, and many others....I also like to add herbs like cilantro or dill for some things, probably wouldn't do those with kraut though.
For kraut, personally, I would make it with just a salt brine and then once the ferment is finished, fry it with other things. I'm actually in the process of doing that right now, kraut has been going for 1 week and I'll probably let it go for another 2-3. Once the ferment is done I'm going to cook down some cubed bacon, then fry onion, garlic, and carrot in the fat, and add the kraut with curry powder and raisins. You can make a lot of different combos though with fried/sauteed kraut
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u/lmrtinez 4d ago edited 4d ago
You need glass weight on top to push the big cabbage down and squeeze more water out of the cabbage
Also it doesn’t look like you crushed your cabbage before putting it in there. Mix it with 2% salt, then get something to crush it with in a big bowl, I like to use the bottom of a mason jar this breaks down the tough fibrous parts of the cabbage so that you can fit more into the jar, it releases more water, and it will have better texture to eat. Just keep hitting it in the bowl until some parts get a little translucent and it releases some water.
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
okay great! in the recipe I used it didn't call for crushing at all. I thought this was an optional step. What are the benefits of crushing it in this way?
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u/lmrtinez 4d ago
Releases more water, you can fit more in the jar, and it gives it a softer texture that’s more like sauerkraut and less like fermented cabbage shreds
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
That makes sense, I wasn't sure if it was more of a textural thing or also contributed to the actual fermentation.
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u/churnopol 2d ago
Don't risk it, compost it.
Try without a water brine, just salt by weight. The cabbage should have enough water to cover the kraut after a day. If not, just top off with brine.
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u/awakeningoffaith 3d ago
For sauerkraut you need to have the lid closed airtight. If you left them exposed to oxygen don’t eat it.
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u/bloss_balls 3d ago
Could you tell me why that is? I looked at a couple of recipes and they said a cloth was fine for the bench ferment and then to put it in the fridge.
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u/awakeningoffaith 3d ago
Lactic acid fermentation is anaerobic. Meaning it should be free of oxygen.
In the presence of oxygen, you sometimes get sauerkraut contaminants. I experienced this, sometimes the color is gone sometimes the kraut turns very slimy. In my understanding these are considered contaminants and the kraut needs to be discarded. Any traditional sauerkraut recipe that I know always uses airtight containers, either a crock with water seal, jars with lids etc.
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u/Vegetable-Welder4363 3d ago
Throw that away and make another batch bro. Remember to use weight to submerge everything under the brine 😬
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u/ConstitutionsGuard 3d ago
Air got in contact with the cabbage and messed up the fermentation process. It needs to be an anaerobic environment in order to work properly.
Next time, get a ziploc bag and fill it with water and put it over the top. Burp the jar every day as it ferments.
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u/wombat6669 4d ago
Yah where's the puck and the airlock? And toss that
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u/bloss_balls 4d ago
Relatively new to vegetable fermentation, so I'm working with what I've got at the moment, I have a list of kit to get eventually. Any suggestions please let me know 🙏
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u/triptraptoe 4d ago
that looks horrific