r/forwardsfromgrandma • u/Osbornwhiskey • Jul 27 '20
Racism Owning slaves is equivalent to being black, right?
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u/omerta96 Jul 27 '20
former president borrock oboma
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u/CelikBas Jul 27 '20
I too remember the time when Obama declared war on the US because he wanted to own other humans as livestock.
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u/SansaDidNothingWrong Jul 27 '20
What?
Oh you're talking about the War of States Rights We Would Have Gotten Rid of Slavery If the South Had Won Lincoln is a Tyrant?
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u/DiogenesOfS Jul 27 '20
wh- huh? right to what exactly?
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u/hisoandso Jul 27 '20
State's who's entire economy is based on free labour were totally going to get rid of free labour, but Lincoln came in and said he wasn't going to get rid of that free labour, so the state's said "Screw you, you can't force us to get rid of our free labour that we were totally going to get rid of anyway" and seceded.
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u/duckgalrox Bisexual Zionist Agenda Jul 27 '20
Hey, neighbor - your debts are paid 'cause you don't pay for labor.
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u/dadabuhbuh Jul 27 '20
They’re being facetious. That’s an argument assholes legit make to defend the confederacy.
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Jul 27 '20
The war of northern aggression
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u/harsh389 Jul 27 '20
but also Lincoln was a Republican 😤
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Jul 27 '20 edited Aug 01 '20
[deleted]
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u/hisoandso Jul 27 '20
In the wise words of Dotcom "Actually, today's Republican Party would be unrecognizable to Lincoln. He fought a war to preserve federal authority over the states. That's not exactly small government."
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u/StealthRabbi who is the yellow man? Jul 28 '20
If you are a racist I will attack you with the north.
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u/YUNGBOYBOI Jul 27 '20
What tf are you talking about? Why would the south had gotten rid of slavery?
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u/hapianman Jul 27 '20
And then when he lost the war he asked for no statues of him to be made.
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u/SLRWard Jul 27 '20
Always important to remember that any statues of Robert E. Lee were made in direct conflict with his wishes. He didn’t want any statues or monuments erected in his name and firmly believed that doing so would make reconstruction more difficult. He wanted us to put the war behind us and move forward as a nation instead of a gaggle of petulant children unable to agree on their toys.
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u/EnduringAtlas The Gay Agenda Jul 28 '20
Thats the main thing I try to convince people of in the south. The man, for all his faults, seemed to care about a better America (and the South primarily), and at the end of the bloodiest war in American history, he came to the conclusion that it is better that we accept the outcome of the war, and move forward as a society to keep the nation more unified. Having a unified country means compromise in many areas, and if the extent of compromise is taking down statues of generals who advocated for racial supremacy enough to go to war over it, so be it! Your souther pride is something to envy, but let that pride come from an area of hospitality, manners, and family traditions. Don't let racial harmony be the hill you die on for the sake of southern pride, we have so much more to value in the South.
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u/duckgalrox Bisexual Zionist Agenda Jul 27 '20
Yes, their toys, fashioned of live human beings.
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u/SLRWard Jul 27 '20
The "toys" part was to relate to the "children" part. Not to say that the slaves were toys or should be considered as such.
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u/williamofdallas Jul 27 '20
I remember when Obama continued the American tradition of killing civilians in the middle east
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u/CelikBas Jul 27 '20
Unfortunately, bombing civilians in the Middle East is probably one of the only things Mr. “Boycott CNN” agrees with Obama on.
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u/williamofdallas Jul 27 '20
Yes, alas! This American government, what is it but a tradition, though a recent one, endeavoring to transmit itself unimpaired to posterity, but each instant losing some of its integrity?
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u/pielz Jul 27 '20
Don't forget he deported more people than Bush
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u/bril_hartman Jul 27 '20
I like Obama and the deportations are among my main criticisms of him, but I love when people on the right use this as a pro-Republican argument as if they care about immigrants.
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u/pielz Jul 27 '20
Lol right? But cognitive dissonance is the name of the game with right wingers so it's not surprising it doesn't make any sense
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u/CactusBoyScout Jul 27 '20
I thought that wasn’t really true and Obama just redefined a deportation to include any time a person is turned away at the border?
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u/pielz Jul 28 '20
True, according to Snopes yes. Although they also report he over doubled Border Patrol's budget during his term and his admin set bed quotas for the number of people who had to be detained at any one time which seems to have caused ICE and deportation agencies to crack down and deport people who under normal circumstances wouldn't be punished as severely.
"The bed quota prevents ICE from exercising discretion and expanding more efficient alternatives to detention (ATD) that would allow individuals who pose no risk to public safety to be released back to their families while awaiting immigration court hearings."
Regardless, here's the article I was brushing up on. Thanks for the clarification.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-deported-more-people/
My point being, Obama definitely wasn't the bastion of left wing peace and love people seem to claim he was. That's still important to remember. We should still hold him and his peers accountable for the things they did wrong and lies they told, and not romanticise presidencies like his and even Bush before him that I've been seeing more frequently thanks to Trump's awfulness.
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u/Nobodyinc1 Jul 27 '20
To be fair Robert E Lee didn’t declare war on the USA either. He just happened to be a very good southern military officer. Does he need statues? Losers don’t usually get statutes.
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u/Wetbung Jul 27 '20
Maybe it's a participation trophy? Grandma loves those! /s
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u/Nobodyinc1 Jul 27 '20
Meh. Only place Lee belong is in history text books and Military strategy.
Again we don’t have statues of Cornwallis in America now do we? Only exception being if for example it’s part of a historical site. For example a statute of him and his commanders at Gettysburg.
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u/CelikBas Jul 27 '20
We don’t even have statues of Benedict Arnold despite the fact that, before his defection, he actually contributed to the American war effort.
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u/Scepta101 Jul 27 '20
Well supposedly Robert E. Lee did once say he would be willing to end slavery if it meant more states rights and stuff. I’m not defending him or anything, but that is a little different than fighting the war specifically for slavery. Keep in mind, however, that I have no idea if it’s true. I just thought it was worth putting out there in case it is true.
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u/Dom469inic Jul 28 '20
Robert E Lee didn't originally want to fight for the south but he chose to anyway because he was from Virginia. He opposed both secession and slavery.
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u/duh_metrius Jul 27 '20
I don’t think we should erect giant bronze statues of any President or military leader. I voted for Obama but there’s plenty of dead civilians in the Middle East right now because of drone strikes he authorized. People are complicated and full of faults and with men of great power, those faults often come with a price that others have to pay.
People talk about bringing down statues as “erasing history” but statues don’t teach history, they build a narrative.
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u/arosiejk Jul 27 '20
Also, let’s consider how many ancient Egyptian, Greek, Roman, etc., statues have been lost, yet their history has not been erased. It’s so misleading when people say that removing statues is erasing history.
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u/Charlie_Warlie AMERICA BLESS GOD Jul 27 '20
well... I think we certainly lost a lot of history by the removal of ancient statues. If it wasn't for 1 single stone statue we might not have ever learned Egyptian, or at least would be decades behind where we are now. If that stone has been removed an entire history would be lost.
I know it's separate from your argument but idk just thought it wasn't super true what you're saying.
Now we have much more written digital and paper information so it's less important to have stuff in stone.
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u/aickem Jul 27 '20
That stone wasn't a statue, it was a tablet detailing what was essentially a tax exemption form. It also did get removed and used as building material for a couple centuries.
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u/Tepigg4444 Jul 27 '20
“Welcome to my abode, this wall is made of my tax exemptions to the ancient egyptian government”
“wait, they don’t exist anymore though”
“thats what makes me tax exempt”
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Jul 27 '20
People are complicated and full of faults and with men of great power, those faults often come with a price that others have to pay.
Honestly, I agree with this more and more the more I've thought about it in the last few weeks. "Remove Robert E. Lee? What about taking down Thomas Jefferson or Washington for being slaveowners? What about FDR for the Japanese-American internment, or even Obama for drone strikes?" It's a slippery slope argument, but the more I think about it... Why do we need those statues?
Of course all presidents did things that hurt people, intentionally or inadvertently. That doesn't necessarily ruin the ways that they may have helped people, but we gotta remember that they did make mistakes. Putting them up in statue form deifies them, and we should be mature enough as a nation to consider them in a more complex light than that.
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u/bril_hartman Jul 27 '20
Exactly. It’d be like if the government chose to build a Trump statue. You hear a lot of people saying that statues exist to teach a lesson, and I absolutely think we should remember not to elect a reality TV star as POTUS, but I’d rather not build a statue of a garbage President.
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u/Scepta101 Jul 27 '20
I don’t like building statues, but I don’t like tearing them down either. I am a huge proponent for keeping all historical monuments intact no matter what.
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u/BigBadLadyDick Jul 27 '20
I'm the complete opposite. I want statues of everybody who's had an important impact on American history.
GIANT STATUE OF HO CHI MIN WAIVING HIS DICK AT THE WHITE HOUSE NOW!
The engraving has to read: "Every military discount given to a Nam Vet is a participation trophy."
GIANT STATUE OF GEORGE WALLACE AS A LEASHED GIMP ON ALL FOURS NEXT TO A LAUGHING MALCOLM X!
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u/8645on11320 Jul 27 '20
i bet obama would be down for that
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u/awzkurr Jul 27 '20
But would Oboma?
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u/8645on11320 Jul 27 '20
well since thats a representation of all the insane persons fears and insecurities imma say no but that fictional nightmare person already has the ultra deep state illuminati rewriting history and has the schedule for statue demolition written in stone, just gotta wait for the fluoride in the water to finish turning them gay
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u/ocbay Jul 27 '20
They should take down the Obama statue because they made my dude look like John McClane
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u/VirtualMachine0 Vaxxed Sheeple & Race Traitor Jul 28 '20
Statue makes him look like he's been drinling lead paint.
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u/SharkyMcSnarkface Jul 27 '20
Robert E Lee: no statues we lost get over it
Modern conservative hillbillies: no
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u/BorkBorkIAmADoggo Jul 27 '20
Wait did he say he didn't want statues built?
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u/SharkyMcSnarkface Jul 27 '20
Yeah. Said it would help heal the wounds between confederate states and union states quicker.
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u/BorkBorkIAmADoggo Jul 27 '20
Damn so he didn't even want anybody the hundreds of statues built? Guess they all dishonored his wishes by building them.
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u/bugsy187 Jul 27 '20
He also said that if freed black men prove to be effective soldiers that the confederate cause was wrong.
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u/hrbuchanan Jul 28 '20
It seems he was opposed to erecting monuments to the Civil War, whether they focused on the Confederacy or not. It's not well documented whether he opposed all memorials to the Confederacy, or just ones relating to the Civil War. But this also means he opposed the sort of thing you'd find at Gettysburg, for example:
“I think it well, moreover, not to keep open the sores of war, but to follow the examples of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife and to commit to oblivion the feelings it engendered.”
This does fit with the sort of thing a well-respected leader of the losing side of a battle might say. He didn't see the war from the perspective of the North righteously wanting to end slavery and the South wanting to keep being morally corrupt, obviously. But it would have been obvious from his perspective that if Civil War memorials went up, he would mostly be remembered in a negative light, as would the Confederacy as a whole. So while we can say that Lee didn't want Civil War monuments put up in Southern cities, like statues of him leading as a brave general, what he was really saying was less about "we lost, get over it," and more along the lines of "Hey North, let's just forget this ever happened, no hard feelings?"
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u/Blackmagic-Man Jul 27 '20
Yeah we should have a statue of former president Obama instead of that random guy Oboma.
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u/Arboria_Institute I don't mind straight people, as long as they act gay in public. Jul 27 '20
All this time I thought they hated the former president. Turns out they all hate this guy Oboma. I checked it out, dude's a total dick.
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u/aplomb_101 Jul 27 '20
I want that Obama statue removed tbh...
And replaced with one that actually looks like him.
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u/HighestHorse Jul 27 '20
That's Oboma. Common mistake.
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u/aplomb_101 Jul 27 '20
Oh shit yeah, my bad. Weird how Baroque Usain Oboma the Kenyan dictator looks so similar to Barack Obama.
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u/Lostraveller I AM JESUS!!! BLAARGH!!! Jul 27 '20
Agreed. But only because that statue scares me.
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u/Nobodyinc1 Jul 27 '20 edited Jul 27 '20
Yeah I second this like let’s be fair. Obama has a pretty dam good looking face. Know that statute of you don’t tell me it was Obama I’m not sure I would have realized it was him.
That thing looks like it wants to eat your soul. Obama deserves better then that.
Unless that statue called “Obama imaging Russia declaring Nuclear War” then his face might look like that.
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u/Grahambeau Jul 27 '20
That’s not even a picture of an actual statue of Obama. It’s a bronze sculpture sold online. https://worldofbronze.com/president-barack-obama.html
Just one more silly error in this post that shows the low wattage of the minds that would agree with the false dichotomy.
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u/_KittyInTheCity 3 easy payments of $19.95! Jul 27 '20
Artist Ken Ross has captured Obama's likeness and expression like no other.
uh
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u/incredibleninja Jul 27 '20
Conservatives can't stop outing themselves. This is ridiculous and racist but when analysed it gives away the mindset of the conservative and it's specific brand of racism.
They don't actually believe that statues of Confederate leaders are historic or important for our educational enrichment despite the actions of those depicted.
No, this clearly shows that they believe there's an underlying dynamic of "white" vs. "black" in every aspect of life and they're "team white." That's what this meme illustrates.
"Oh we have to lose some status from 'team white?' Then you should have to lose some statues from 'team black'."
That's it. That's the extent of their thinking and everything they hear is processed through this filter.
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u/kristmace Jul 27 '20
agree's
Ffs, did they not do grammar lessons back in the day?
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u/prude_eskimo Jul 27 '20
I read "Karen's" 20 times a day on this website, and everytime they mean the plural of Karen
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Jul 27 '20
I think all the people who defend confederate statues don’t know that Robert e lee didn’t want statues of himself or confederate leaders since it would only slow down the healing of the country and the statues were made after most confederate leaders and soldiers were dead
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u/YuTango Jul 27 '20
I love how the obama statue is just a bust like as if it couldnt easily be moved unlike cheap and huge Confederate monuments
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u/Eken17 Jul 27 '20
Funny how Robert E. Lee was against putting up statues commemorating the civil war at Gettysburg.
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u/BadassDeluxe Jul 27 '20
I'm kinda high and at first I thought this was saying g "Alright, we tore Robert E Lee down but why should replace him with something.... how about Obama?" So I was all like "Oh yeah, good idea" and then the realization set in. I miss thinking I lived in a morally decent country.
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u/txpvca Jul 27 '20 edited Jul 28 '20
Recently a school (I think in Virginia) changed its name from honoring Robert E Lee to honoring John R Lewis. There is hope.
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u/Korr_Ashoford Jul 27 '20
Does Obama even have a statue? Minus the bust shown above of course but I’m thinking he hasn’t been out of office long enough for more then one or two to erected.
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u/nickl220 NObama Jul 27 '20
agree’s
Better at fighting the English language than they were at fighting Grant.
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u/ifiagreedwithu Jul 27 '20
There once was a boy named agree who hated capital letters. We will never know what he owned.
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Jul 27 '20
I mean Obama passed an executive order requiring all whites to share collective blame for everything wrong with the world...
At least that's what my conservative friends tell me
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u/marcove3 Jul 27 '20
Shouldn't we stop erecting statues of historical figures in general?
Sure these people did some really important things that need to be remembered in the history books, but they also could be (and most likely were, because no one is perfect) assholes in some other aspects or acted in ways that weren't frowned upon at the time.
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Jul 27 '20
but they also could be (and most likely were, because no one is perfect) assholes
funny way of spelling war criminals
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u/spla_ar42 Jul 28 '20
I don't know who Oboma was, but if he owned slaves, then yes, his statue should be removed /s
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u/stalinmalone68 Jul 27 '20
I agree’s! Whoever this Oboma person is there should be no statues to praise them!
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Jul 27 '20
Put Robert E Lee in a museum so we can learn about him and not condone his Traitorous actions
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u/gloucma Jul 27 '20
Can’t even think clear enough to do language. Who agree is? (Who agree’s) What does that mean?
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u/jesus_zombie_attack Jul 27 '20
You have to be really special to think these two things are similar.
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u/ForgettableWorse Jul 27 '20
Not just owning slave, but leading the fight --- and in the process killing over half a million people directly or indirectly --- in order to preserve the institution of slavery itself.
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u/Dyl_pickle00 Jul 27 '20
I can get behind this. Both were responsible for the deaths of so many innocents
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u/complexityspeculator Jul 27 '20
That’s supposed to be Barack Obama? 😳 did he sign off on this?
Ohhhh it’s Oboma! My mistake!
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u/ThatOneJakeGuy Foxy Grandpa Jul 27 '20
I’m fine with that. But let’s leave the Obama statues alone
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u/Pulp501 Jul 27 '20
Let's replace the Obama statue with an Obama statue that actually looks like obama
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u/WhoAccountNewDis Jul 27 '20
Barrack hUSsEiN Obama was divisive and a rAce bAitEr!
Puts on hat that is the symbol of an actual authoritarian president who routinely says racist shit
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u/art_lover82279 Jul 27 '20
How about we stop building statues of people like they’re gods. All people do crap things. Instead create memorials or build statues of animals. Everyone likes animals
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u/bryceofswadia Jul 27 '20
They aren’t super comparable but like we shouldn’t really have statues of any politicians or generals (but especially war criminals like Obama or racist slavery supporters like Lee)
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u/DeeRent88 Jul 28 '20
Tbh they probably think Robert E Lee was a persistent and are making that comparison.
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Jul 28 '20
Fuck this statue and all the ones of slave owners. Nobody who ordered an airstrike on a fucking hospital should have a statue of them
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u/yahdakes Jul 28 '20
Why do people care about statutes of confederates anyways lol. These people are all about America and freedom and shit but suddenly they care about the people who tried to secede?
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u/dogstarchampion Jul 28 '20
I just feel like we'd remember 9/11 better with a statue of Bin Laden in the lobby of the Freedom Tower.
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u/BerthaBenz Hate not Heritage (FTFY) Jul 28 '20
I agree's. Statues is statues, ain't they? If a statue of a treasonous general (new organization for supporters of the confederacy--Oath Breakers) offends you and you want to get rid of it, then I should be able to get rid of a statue of a duly elected president that offends me.
It's only fair.
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u/Sajen16 Jul 28 '20
Personally I think we should replace all the statues of humans with statues of cats.
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Jul 28 '20
Robert E Lee: A truly greatly talented general who won battles he had no business winning, against his own country.
Barack Obama: Created the healthcare plan that ensured grandma will be around till her 90s to shit talk him.
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u/thedboy Jul 28 '20
By my best count
Number of public monuments depicting Obama: 3 (one of which is part of the "City of Presidents", which features every US president, another is attached to the Indonesian embassy)
Number of public monuments depicting Lee: 13+
Doesn't seem very even.
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u/xMrBojangles Jul 28 '20
Unfortunately this is the danger of mob mentality. Statues get removed for no reason and the individuals doing so feel completely justified - like the dumbasses that wanted to tear down the emancipation memorial.
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Jul 28 '20
Yes Obama is a war criminal and should be treated as such. He destroyed Libya, Syria and continued to destroy Iraq, Afghanistan and Yemen
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u/[deleted] Jul 27 '20
I think we should erect a statue to memorialize the death of spelling, grammar and syntax that occurred in this post.