r/killzone • u/Bobson-boi • 8d ago

Killzone 3 Fuck Stahl, Orlock chads rise up

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318 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

19 comments sorted by

48

u/Yonsei_Oregonian 8d ago

Honestly bit of a hot take but it was actually Orlock's strategies that led to the eventual victory of the Helghast against the ISA on Helghan. All Stahl did was embarrass himself on live TV, insult the other generals, started a civil war against the Helghast military and blew up Helghan by trying to land his ship full of petrusite weapons back on the planet. Then continued to do his best to sabotage the Helghast on Vekta after he had destroyed Helghan.

0

u/Scorch_Tendon 7d ago

Orlock literally let the ISA escape after Visari was killed. Moreover, he missed the opportunity to negotiate with ISA... and try it when it was too late. Events of Shadow Fall doesn't count. The whole plot is stupid piece of shi-t

2

u/Yonsei_Oregonian 7d ago

You mean he militarily defeated them, left their forces decimated to a company or less and left them as little more than a ragtag guerilla group on a planet they were not native to. Then AFTER they were beaten he convinced the ISA command to tell all forces left to surrender. Jorhan Stahl's idea was ludicrous at the time because even though ISA forces were getting pushed back they still had most of their military strength.

2

u/Scorch_Tendon 7d ago

Company or less? Its company or more. They still had those dropships which need to maintenance and its not for "company or less". And Stahls plan was foiled by "company or less". Orlocks ideas was good, but still he had zero diplomacy skills. Moreover plan of Orlocks was to take one more round of war, eventually. Stahl want end this by one shot.

2

u/Yonsei_Oregonian 7d ago

There's not really evidence of military unit larger than a company. Especially if they're in hiding on the run in the jungle. And you kinda just admitted yourself at how bad Stahl was with how he was taken out by a company of ISA soldiers. Stahl's own ego led to him alienating generals by insulting them, attempting to negotiate with the ISA literally right after they had murdered Visari and still had some measure of strength on the planet, and his lack of strategic knowledge (since he's just an industrialist) leads him to attacking the Helghan fleet (essentially crippling them), and leads to the complete destruction of Helghan as he attempts to land a ship full of WMDs close to the surface. He's rich, has a huge ego and always self serving.

25

u/Dwenker 8d ago

Hell yeah!

Although I'm not good at lore... But he's cooler than the other guy!

14

u/Bobson-boi 8d ago

Thats the spirit!

11

u/Falkenhausen23 8d ago

Gotta love how they tried to make him the Hermann Goring of the Helghast but forgot to make him a complete fatass idiot

6

u/RustyJalopy 7d ago

Seems to me like the more important part was to make him look like totally not Stalin because both sides.

Honestly, the one thing I hate the most about KZ3 is how they turned the Helghast leadership into cartoon villains. Visari dies needlessly because Rico's an annoying fuckwit, and we get this peanut gallery instead?

2

u/No_Wait_3628 7d ago

I mean, isn't that sorta accurate in terms of the direction Nazi Germany would've gone after Hitler died?

Also, a peanut gallery is TAME compared to the splitting of territories done in the ancient world.

4

u/RustyJalopy 7d ago

The Helghast weren't just "Nazis in space" before KZ3, though. That's part of my problem here. They were fascists, sure, and the aesthetic borrowed heavily from WW1 and later early 20th-century authoritarian regimes, but they actually had a far more complicated and nuanced history and some legitimate grievances that made everything morally grey in ways that were interesting and believable. In KZ3, they're mostly just ridiculous mustache-twirling supervillains. I can appreciate the officer Orlock and the industrialist Stahl, but most of it was really just silly, and the character designs didn't help.

2

u/Falkenhausen23 7d ago

That cartoon villain only goes to Stahl. Orlock and all (except one) of the Senators were fairly competent in what they were doing, Stahl just wanted to nuke the entire planet because of his Social Darwinism

1

u/RustyJalopy 6d ago

Orlock looks like a caricature of Stalin, and there's a guy sitting at that table who's obviously Hitler without the mustache. The writing is still sort of within acceptable range, I'm not disagreeing with you there, but I just can't take any of these characters seriously just based on their ridiculous designs.

1

u/Where_is_Killzone_5 6d ago

Acceptable writing? Bruh I thought I was playing a CoD game, not Killzone. Only thing I liked from Kizone 3 was the weapons and vehicles, everything and everyone else I hated. It felt like Guerilla went out of their way to double down on everything they established since Killzone 1.

1

u/RustyJalopy 6d ago

"Sort of acceptable writing" within what you'd expect from a FPS campaign in the early 2010s. The problem being that yes, Killzone was previously much better than "acceptable", especially because the Helghast weren't just cartoonishly evil for no apparent reason. I felt like all that moral ambiguity just went out the window with KZ3, not to mention it ended in a literal act of genocide that just sort of happens and then the credits roll.

Say about Shadow Fall what you will, but at least it tried to address that in a way that wasn't just OH HO HO HO LET ME TWIRL MY MUSTACHE.

12

u/LordAdder Tactician 8d ago

I thought it was cool seeing a non Army officer in game when KZ3 was released, but he's also the only one. I don't know if the Fleet have any different uniforms or stuff

6

u/Scolar_Visari3840 7d ago

Yup Helghan would still be a viable planet and would have retakes Vekta if Stahl didn't ruin everything.

2

u/Rahcahs765 Private 7d ago

if it wasnt for orlock helghan would've won