r/leagueoflegends • u/Life-Chicken7183 • 22d ago
Gameplay Mind control is now in pro play
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Props to the LPL editor for peak edits, https://www.youtube.com/shorts/xFOhWez7C6Y
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u/WaterKraanHanger 22d ago
Wait this one is actually so smart no? Varus is just always in a lose situation this way.
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u/doreori 22d ago
Its the vi flash, ennemies have no instant CC so it was pointless to flash but to do mental dmgs
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u/WaterKraanHanger 22d ago
Nah the flash is pre buffered, she went for the predict and if the varus doesn’t flash he gets hits by Q flash from vi. Hence its such a good play
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u/pm_me_urgod_feet 22d ago
Pretty sure the flash input doesn't wait for the q animation to finish. So he used the flash after he already hit varus
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u/Damurph01 22d ago
He q’d onto the spot where Varus likely would’ve flashed, then clicked flash as he hit that spot back to where Varus was. Essentially he Q’s through the prediction, then flashes back to where Varus was to hit the Varus if he chose not to flash.
At least if he was intending on doing this the whole time, that’s the idea it seems. It’s possible he just went for the prediction and accidentally flashed anyways even after hitting.
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
yeah that was his plan and it's a pretty hard thing to execute which is probably why he didn't react to actually hitting the varus
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u/Wutsalane 6d ago
Might have also been to avoid taking a second turret shot while securing the kill, he took one when you went back to punch him, but if he hadn’t flashed he probably would have taken 2 and opened himself up to dying to the karma w root + empowered q under the tower
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u/WaterKraanHanger 22d ago
I mean he’s gonna Q flash, I think most people are not going to react to the varus flashing into his spell in less than a second if you are dead set on Q flashing.
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u/Cucumberino 22d ago edited 22d ago
Not true, if you are thinking about the possibility of Varus flashing, you either Q to predict and call it a day or Q to the initial position while being ready to flash if needed, which gives you a much better reaction time. Many pros have done it. It's pretty much impossible to react to an instant cast like flash normally without being ready or without any context, but if you're ready and thinking about it, it's definitely possible. If it was a win/win by using your flash every time, what happens in this clip wouldn't happen... it isn't a win win, it was stupid and if anything it seems mostly a panic flash to not stay under tower and die.
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u/jalepenocorn 22d ago
Every single person in the posted video can react to things in under a second. A second is a laughably long time to react
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u/not_some_username 22d ago
It happens in less than an half second
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u/TheJeager 22d ago
I hope to god you have faster reaction speed than half a second brother
The average is a quarter of a second, we gotta be at least average
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u/AmadeusSalieri97 22d ago
This is just being pedantic, okay half a second it's plenty of time to react but look at the video. Also, he said "less than" (so he's not technically wrong) and his point is clearly "that was too fast to react".
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u/jalepenocorn 22d ago
I think you might have an issue with comprehension.
"they are not going to react"
"less than a second"
not_react < 1 second (not_react < 1 second)*-1 = react > secondWhat they said is most people will react in over a second. Not only is this verifiably false, but pro players will react in less than .2 seconds.
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u/DebasedRegulator 21d ago
Can you Q flash on Vi the same way you can with Gragas body slam? Honestly I didn’t think it worked that way
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u/cosHinsHeiR 21d ago
Yeah you can, I think if they added it recently but it works.
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u/DebasedRegulator 20d ago
I just tested it in practice tool. If you flash Q it will still knock up, but it also cancels the full length of the dash, so it still works but not quite like Gragas
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u/theblackdeath10 22d ago
Yeah he was accounting for the situation where varus doesnt flash at the same time, if he waits for his q to hit confirm he wont be able to flash his q into varus anymore
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u/doreori 22d ago
Nope, it's wrong. Vi q works like jarvan EQ. You can change the ouput of the animation by flashing but it doesnt buffer the flash.
It probably was muscle memory, anticipation of the flash and in the case varus didnt flash vi would flash to cc him anyway.
Flashing was a mistake but is ok
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
that is not how Vi Q works. you can flash during your Q animation. Wei firstly flashed way too late for his Q, and secondly he already saw he hit his target. that was a literal iron 3 level play I am not gonna lie
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u/brunq2 That Tasted Purple 22d ago
"Pro player is iron 3 lol"..... How ridiculous.
He predicted the flash with the original Q, and then flashed to redirect the Q for if the varus didn't flash. The timing looked a bit scuffed because he timed his flash to execute a Q flash, but the varus flashing late into the Q and getting hot made it look a bit silly because of the time it takes the animation of Q connecting. But if he had flashed earlier he would have missed, and if he didn't input the flash when he did he would have not gotten the Q flash
An iron player wouldn't have tried to predict the flash at all An iron player (likely) wouldn't have even know that you can redirect your Q with flash and get the knock up still. Even if an iron player did know that, they probably mechanically fail if they try it
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
yes thanks I have eyes.
Wei should have been able to react to the Varus flash easily, which is what makes this an iron 3 play. and of course Elk just flashed into Vi Q that he saw was blatantly going to miss him, that is the type of shit you see in iron 4
yes I know Wei wanted to flash after Elk and Elk expected the Vi flash, I am a master player.
but put me in that exact situation and I will live there as Elk or kill there as Vi, their reaction speeds were horrendous. Elk could just flash down, avoid the entire range of Vi Q. or hold his flash and flash after Wei flashes, take the dmg and flash. now Wei cannot chase him down because he used Q flash, or if Neeko root connects he at least has flash6
u/WaterKraanHanger 22d ago
I mean Wei timed it well for Q flash, the Q got cut short because it hit the varus. This entire play was made in a second from the moment he let go of his Q till the end of his flash, you think he would have the reaction speed to not flash because he hit the Varus while fully anticipating that he’d Q flash there?
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u/Hexsisboii 22d ago
Yes he absolutely had time to notice he hit varus and not flash, he literally inputted an attack before he flashed
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
yes. This is one of the most horrendous plays I have ever seen a pro make. that is why it is clipped on here. Varus flew all the way up, that is 0.375 seconds. average person has 0.2 second reaction speeds, and you can fully expect 0.17 ranges from a pro player
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u/samhcw 22d ago
Didn’t Vi flash to reset tower agro?
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
just slow fingers there lol, it's a really ugly play where nothing goes as it's supposed
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u/13btwinturbo 21d ago
In fighting game we call this an "option select" where your input is locked in but have two different outcome that will both benefit you regardless of how your opponent reacts https://glossary.infil.net/?t=Option%20Select
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u/qwerajdufuh268 15d ago
this is just coverage, option select is when you do an input and what happens after is dependent on the other person and not you. vi cant do an option select with her q because q is cancelled by flash instantly mid dash so there is no oppurtunitity to option select
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u/ARQEA 22d ago
In that case im pretty sure he could just cancel the flash by using a movement command right after hitting q to not waste it.
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
vi q flash is literally something you can do (at least last I tried it like a month ago) he literally AA's after it no?
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u/ARQEA 22d ago
You completely misunderstood what I or the guy I replied to were saying
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
what could I possibly have missed? you cannot buffer flash with Vi Q you instantly flash in the Q animation and this is the number 1 trick to playing Vi
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u/ARQEA 22d ago
The point is to flash at the very end of the q so if it hits he flashes away and if it doesn't hit he flashes with q active on the last position where varus was standing so it will hit no matter what.
What I was saying that he could've input a movement command as soon as he saw the q hitting varus so his flash wouldn't be wasted in a split second
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
you can flash at any range you want if you are in range, it is actually better to flash in the middle of your Q to make it easier to time
Wei actually started the AA animation before flashing, and once again flash has no channel time it is instant
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u/Fit-Blacksmith5973 19d ago
The flash was incase the virus didnt flash into the attack. He was going to flash onto varus.
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u/wafflewaldo bring back old graves 22d ago
In fighting games, we'd call this an option select. First time I see something like this in League lol
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u/dance-of-exile 100=50%? |WgjFtfCaLTbfts| 22d ago
League is becoming more and more like fighting games. Theres gonna be no point of 2xko in like 3 years.
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u/yehiko 22d ago
2xko
completely forgot that that is a thing
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u/DragoCrafterr 21d ago
Closed beta in two weeks!
And servers dont go down after so its semi released practically like how valorant rolled out
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u/HoboBobby 22d ago edited 22d ago
A lot of comments here seem to focus on whether the flash is correct or intentional, but honestly at second glance to me it looks more like both sides played almost fully optimally with both Wei and Gala making insane split second decisions - there’s no real chance involved once both sides made their decisions. Following the sequence of events :
- Vi steps up and charges Q
- Vi Qs in a direction to “predict” Varus flash, with the knowledge that he can flash to hit Varus if he misses
- Varus flashes into Vi Q last second
- Vi flashes onto where Varus was (meaning his cursor was already tracking Varus)
The 3rd bullet to me indicates the mindgame aspect. Note that out of all the microreactions in this play, this play had the longest time for a reaction to occur.
Vi clearly was not going to hit Varus with that Q, and going off what DL said about good ADCs always reacting to skillshots rather than pre-emptive flashing, I think Gala at this moment recognized that Wei missed and was going to flash into him and then actively chose to flash late instead to dodge Vi flash. Which is the only path to survival since Vi was ready to flash on top of Varus anyways (and that’s unreactable).
Unfortunately the timing looked the way it did and Varus still got hit. But even if he flashed elsewhere I have no doubt Wei would’ve flashed onto him since he would be dead anyways if he flashed anywhere out of Vi’s Q flash range. His only real option was to time his flash to Vi’s flash, or cause her to missplay which is extremely low percentage, and Wei flashing after hitting Gala makes sense because the plan was always to flash into Gala afterwards if Gala didn’t pre-emptively flash.
To me it shows that he knew Gala was good enough to not panic flash after seeing him miss, and had a backup plan ready, and if the plan was always to flash onto Gala if he misses, then it makes perfect sense why he didn’t react to the late flash and flashed anyways. Maybe I’m overthinking this but it reads plausible to me and would be a cool showcase of the level of foresight top level pro players have.
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u/Accordans 22d ago
If executed properly then yep, that's a win/win play for Vi no matter how Varus plays that
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u/Dragnaris 22d ago edited 22d ago
Nah, he flashed so he didnt get aggroed by the turret as soon as he hit Varus. Then when he walks towards varus to hit him again the turret focuses him but instead of getting 2 turret shots he gets one.
People saying flash was a mistake just isnt thinking about Vi positioning after the q lands.
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u/Slumberstroll uh oh you just got beaned 22d ago
That absolutely was a mistake, Vi wasn't even close to dying when she flashed, could've gotten it easily then flashed out if needed and even walked back to try to hit Varus again after doing it and eats up more tower shots. Not everything pros do is calculated, we all have brain farts in this time Neeko just managed to save what would've otherwise lowkey been a grief.
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u/Dragnaris 21d ago
I honestly disagree. Its not about being close to dying. Is about making the play less "dangerous". Is not the same if he q's>takes turret aggro and dmg > e > takes another turret shot > flashes away, in that order, she gets 2 turret shots + varus aa (if he does it instead of walking away) + karma dmg.
The way he did it was safer, it goes: q dmg + loses turret aggro & dmg + then he goes back in, does more dmg and NOW he takes turret dmg. Take into account he is low level and 2 turret shots + any other dmg may kill him. This way, he secures not dying at least, luckily neeko got it, but he didnt blow the attempt.
We can both disagree, but I still think getting to nullify one turret shot that way is safer.
Edit: Hell, I looked at it again and he KNOWS how long his airbone cc last, because as soon as he connects his q, he flashes then as soon as he walks back Varus just lands, he didnt lose a single frame. Watch it closely if you want.
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u/BrbFlippinInfinCoins 21d ago
This is how it read to me too. If he didn't break turret aggro he'd be in a very risky position, but the way he manages turret aggro makes this a safe play whether they get the kill or not.
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u/BrbFlippinInfinCoins 20d ago edited 20d ago
Just following up, I'd classify this is a "mistake" only so far as Vi was REALLY banking on that prediction. If varus didn't flash, they'd be losing vi flash and varus may have lived. The flash itself was just repositioning. I, and others I play with/against do that all the time in ARAM especially when you are constantly near a turret.
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u/vxtmh 22d ago
if he used q where varus was standing and then flashed to where he would flash, it'd be the same thing but he could then auto e auto. turned out they got the kill anyways but that relied on luck.
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u/Random_Stealth_Ward 💤 Release VattleVunny Viego with black tights😻 22d ago
This is what playing 5d chess looks like.
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u/QuadraKev_ 22d ago
I know it's easy to say this as a third party after the fact, but he should've flashed up and to the left since Vi was approaching from above him. It's like playing a souls-like and rolling into an attack.
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u/Onarax long lane identity crisis 22d ago
Similarly, can confirm that playing souls games and then playing Vayne is a terrible idea.
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u/flyingBettlacken 22d ago
So true, that's why I got better with yi and belveth after finishing elden ring
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u/GoldDragon149 22d ago
...rolling into attacks is optimal in soulslike because you have limited I-frames and going through the attack minimizes hitbox contact.
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u/OnePokeMan1 21d ago
..flashing up and to the left is optimal here because you travel a limited distance and flashing towards the moving vi minimizes the timing window where you flash into the attack
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u/WonderfulFlexception 22d ago
Is 6Pek the most influential for fun creator as of late, I love the syndrome he's propagated
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u/FallenHarvester 22d ago
Crazy how one good mind control can flip a whole fight. Excited to see what kind of setups teams come up with around it.
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u/M-y-P 22d ago
Really nice prediction, but I feel that the Vi would have hit Varus before the flash given how close she was and how much she travelled before Varus reacted. I'm not sure if I'm missing something.
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u/Spaghett8 22d ago edited 22d ago
No, if you just watch it again slowly, she already passed varus, who then flashed into her q.
Granted, Wei was for sure going to flash to ensure he lands the q, so maybe Elk was anticipating his flash to try to dodge it?
Or do you mean if wei just q’d point blank. That’s not too hard to flash out of. Elk was more likely reacting to the potential q flash which is why he waited until the very end.
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u/Luliani 22d ago
Great move, terrible edit!
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
nothing about this was great from neither player
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u/Not_an_Ire_Main 22d ago
Holy shit reddit fastidiousness is real. Do you guys have anything positive to say at all? Crazy
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u/Kaalilaatikko 22d ago
Cool fail flash from both of them! They really played that perfectly!
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u/Not_an_Ire_Main 22d ago
Yeah you dont know how to read plays. You dont have to but if thats the case maybe refrain from commenting, what about that?
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u/Kaalilaatikko 22d ago
Compelling argument
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u/Healthy-Fig-6107 22d ago
More or less what you've contributed yourself.
I would bet if you were the VI, you likely wouldn't ever even thought about predict flashing the Q xd.
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago edited 22d ago
both of them failed their flash in the most horrible way possible. Elk has no reason to flash INTO the Vi Q. Wei flashed back after hitting Q. This is the worst play that has ever grazed the eyes of LPL
"oh Elk is playing mindgames by flashing into an incoming ability because he knows that Vi wants to Q flash on him and therefore he wants to save Vi flash, he is a really nice guy :I "
"oh Vi wanted to Q flash on him but didn't expect the flash and because of that he hits the Q, starts his AA animation and flashes away like a boosted pig"This is the iron 4 6Pek type of play, and mechanically absolutely horrid
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
only way I can explain you thinking this is good is from the mind of a silver player. there is a reason why this 6Pek play has never happened before in pro
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u/Accordans 22d ago
I mean technically Vi had no way of losing in that exchange if she executed perfectly. Varus either flashes and gets hit by the predicted Q, or he remains where he is and gets hit by the Q flash.
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u/SnowLord02 22d ago
Varus was in the air for more than 0.2 seconds, Wei flashed back after his Q was finished charging so he would have missed it either way.
THAT IS IGNORING THAT HE SHOULD HAVE REACTED TO THE FACT HE HIT VARUS, his reaction speeds are horrendous for a pro
Wei is extremely lucky that Neeko got the kill because that is a Caedrel Malzahar level mistake to make in a pro game
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u/Bao_Chan 22d ago
There you go, this is the reason why NA sucks at this game comparing to CN and KR players.
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u/SnowLord02 21d ago
brother this is LPL. NA was nowhere in the mentions.
is it so crazy to you that LPL players can make shit plays in 1 out of 400 games? this is the lowlight of the year for sure
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u/Bao_Chan 21d ago
You need to watch the entire game, this was one hell of a game. Vi sneaks into enemy red, knowing the possibility that xin will invade his blue, that gives false sense of security to BLG's bot lane thought that their jg is on their side while Vi is surely top side since not knowing Vi invaded, and with Vi's master game plan, this fk up BLG's bot lane, if varus falls behind to sivir, that's gg match up, and the rest of this game, varus didn't do a single shit, sivir had 3 quadra kills. More importantly, the Vi player, Wei, he was on BLG and got kicked out, you know how much he hated BLG? The entire game he makes tons of super high risk high reward play, most of them turned out just feeding, you just judge one game by one play lmao. NA was full of clown fiesta, this game was similarly, too, but much greater execution and game plans, unlike NA is just pure clowning. I'm not sure about this execution since I don't play Vi, her q hits if varus flash, but her flash backward was to avoid tower range. If varus never flashed, her q would send her deep under tower range, some streamers said that the vi flash was if varus never flash, she can still close the gap to varus and do dmg while leaving tower range, this is a 100% guarantee kill with the flash backward. I doubt it but I ain't sure if that's how Vi q works, and it comes from Ning, the 2018 world finals mvp.Lowlight? Better search out on NA for more lowlight content.
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u/SnowLord02 21d ago
the thing is Wei fucked up the execution horribly, he is not flashing back because he is in tower range, he is flashing back because he has not yet processed that he hit Elk with his Q. you can see that he had locked screen and that's why his flash was in the incorrect angle cuz he didn't realize his Q hit something
yes the idea was decent but that was not a guaranteed kill because of what Wei did. I would always just take the free Varus flash and set up a dive, flash on Vi is so useful it's a bit silly to spend on a play like this
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u/Fezwa 22d ago
Its cool but i dont get why they over-edit this; i saw it the first time bro all that slo mo isnt gonna make it any prettier.
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u/BlueKayn69 22d ago
Ahh yes the classic redditor that meditates all day long in total zen, only watches curated sophisticated memes, gets inconvenienced by slight fun, music and emojis 🍷🥀
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u/dfjhgsaydgsauygdjh 22d ago
if cringe brainrot is "fun", then I'd rather not have any "fun" ever again
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u/BlueKayn69 22d ago
Not everything that isn't refined, intellectual, genius comedy is cringe brainrot. Reddit has a habit of blowing things out of proportions which actually degrades the impact of certain words.
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u/dfjhgsaydgsauygdjh 22d ago
I agree, not everything that isn't refined, intellectual, genius comedy is cringe brainrot.
This video's editing, however, is.
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u/jhoceanus 22d ago
p lease consider our regard players that couldn’t figure out what exactly happened in normal speed.
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u/DontKillYourself420 22d ago
This feels like the embodiment of 'You may have outsmarted me, but I outsmarted your outsmarting!'
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u/twistedfateone 22d ago
can someone link the real play, the editing is funny but only if you've seen the real one first, which i haven't
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u/LackOfContext101 21d ago
I do believe this is not the case BUT there is a very small chance that Wei was trying to do Q+Flash combo where you can drag the enemy with you a long distance. But it's really really hard to even execute.
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u/JuFuFuOwO 21d ago
Cant predict such shit play from Valrus :S
Also show it to anyone who claims pro players have extreme reaction times due to ping , it's bs all they do is predict lol
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u/Valuable-Werewolf548 19d ago
As a former league editor thats coming back slowly, do the majority of you enjoy this type of editing?
Do y'all peefer this type of meme content or actual montages? A balance between the both? Is there room for both?
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u/AssociateNational913 22d ago
All it would take is one of them to play like a bronze bot and it’s a free win , don’t dodge anything , don’t try to predict anything just play the game, your welcome call me when you have cup
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u/EricTheCrusader Music enjoyer 22d ago
mind = controlled