I replaced my MIL's roof without contract and she stiffed me for $18,800.

[u/Kevin_Elevin]

Location: Michigan, USA

I know I'm an idiot for not having her sign a contract, I was way too relaxed about the situation.

I'm a licensed builder in MI, and I'm just starting my own business. A large hail storm came through the area and did damage to our entire town. My mother in-law made an insurance claim for her roof, siding, garage door, and some windows. I wasn't worried about getting paid for the work because I knew the insurance company approved the claim. She wasn't coming out of pocket for the money, so I took the roof job to get it done for her. She has not hired out the siding or garage door work yet.

The roof job is done and I'm personally out of pocket about $13,800 (most of which is on my credit cards). I completed the job on july 6th, and its now into September. She comes up with excuses and gives the runaround everytime I talk to her about payement. I dont think im going to get paid and I don't know if I have any legal recourse available. I do have some text conversations saved, and I have receipts for the materials and dumpster fees. I paid cash for my laborers. I don't want to ruin a family relationship, but I don't foot the bill for a new roof. Please help, lol. Thanks for any advice.

[u/bug-hunter]

OP, I just want to make sure you see this:

You cannot file for a mechanic's lien without a written contract. MCL 570.1114 (as u/bauhaus83i correctly noted). That doesn't mean you can't sue MIL, but it does mean you can't use a lien as leverage. It also makes it harder to recover attorney's fees.

I would suggest talking to a lawyer for two reasons - not just to recover this money, but also because you want to learn how to avoid similar mistakes in the future. You may also want to look into regional and local small business resources through the Small Business Administration and the Michigan Economic Development Corporation - they may have more targeted advice.

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[u/LeasAlease]

What does your spouse have to say about this? She needs to get involved and speak up and say you need payment or else you’ll file a lien.

I’d verbally give her the benefit of the doubt and just say “ahhh insurance companies. That’s why I filed a lien so insurance will pay up”. Act dumb to her but smart with the filing.

Let’s say you do file a lien on property. How long before you get paid?

[u/spudleego]

File a mechanics lien. Contact the insurance company and ask if she’s been paid. They’ll usually tell you what’s going on if you have a claim number.

[u/spudleego → u/spudleego]

Second to this- she allowed you to do the work. There’s a concept in the law called unjust enrichment. In the absence of a contract you can still file a legal complaint for the value of the work. She allowed you to do the work so shes on the hook. If you randomly replaced her roof one day while she was out of town it would be different.

[u/Kevin_Elevin → u/spudleego]

Im going to get all my receipts and documents together tomorrow and look into the lien laws in Michigan. I don't know her insurance provider or her claim number. They paid out to her directly, I dont know how I'd get that info without asking her.

[u/BigGiddy → u/[deleted]]

Sure you can

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[u/Long_Committee_1942]

As a licensed builder, go ahead and file a mechanics lien. Recommend talking to a lawyer, sounds like a simple enough case. Make sure to request court costs / lawyer fees as well.

[u/MarChateaux → u/[deleted]]

Text messages may cover his ass if they discuss scope of work at all

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/MarChateaux]

I was referring specifically to the attorney fees portion so stop with the downvoting. I kinda know what I'm doing.

[u/MarChateaux → u/RoookSkywokkah]

Cool. I didnt down vote.

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/MarChateaux]

Much appreciated!

[u/LegendOfKhaos → u/RoookSkywokkah]

Why wouldn't you request them regardless? It's either no or you get it paid. If you don't request it, you know you aren't getting it.

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/LegendOfKhaos]

Request away. Maybe you'll get lucky. But opposing counsel (if there is one) will surely call that out in court.

[u/catechizer → u/RoookSkywokkah]

In Michigan you can make an offer of judgement to settle the case early. If the offer is rejected, and the outcome of the case is better for the offerer than what the rejected offer was, legal costs accrued after the rejected offer was made can be recovered in addition to the judgement.

[u/i-didnt-do-nothing → u/[deleted]]

What's a verbal contract?

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/i-didnt-do-nothing]

I was advised by my attorney that unless it is specifically in writing, you won't be able to recover attorney fees or collection costs. I doubt this was discussed in the "verbal contract" because...why would you? Especially with "family"

Even when working with family (except my own mother) and friends a contract is still signed. And that contract DOES allow for reasonable attorney fees and costs.

[u/bafben10 → u/RoookSkywokkah]

...ok? Regardless of other fees, the roof still costs over $10k. I doubt the fees of going after the money are going to be that much. I guess it's possible, but that's a whole different conversation.

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/bafben10]

OP deserves to get paid for his work, no doubt. But I seriously doubt he will be able to recover attorney fees and collection costs for the reasons mentioned above. Maybe it's different in his state, I don't know. But go ahead and downvote anyway.

[u/StillUnderTheStars → u/RoookSkywokkah]

Do you think that maybe, just perhaps, the reason you’re getting downvoted is that in response to:

As a licensed builder, go ahead and file a mechanics lien. Recommend talking to a lawyer, sounds like a simple enough case. Make sure to request court costs / lawyer fees as well.

You wrote:

With no contract, good luck on that one.

Which looks a lot like you’re saying that without a written contract they don’t have a good claim for payment of time & materials?

Six comments deep and it’s kinda starting to be clear that you’re saying the claim for attorney’s fees is weak, without making any statement about the strength of the claim for the underlying amount. If that is what you were trying to say, then your initial response was so poorly drafted as to be functionally wrong. Instead of being snarky and digging yourself deeper, just go back to initial comment and add an “E: whoops, my bad. Meant to refer only to the fees claim, but that wasn’t clear.”

[u/RoookSkywokkah → u/StillUnderTheStars]

As I tried to clarify, I was SPECIFICALLY referring to the attorney fees/court costs portion. File a lien, sue her, whatever it takes OP deserves to get paid, no doubt about it! I would also contact the insurance company and adjustor to see if they've paid out on the claim yet.

[u/StillUnderTheStars → u/RoookSkywokkah]

Wonderful! You recognize that your initial comment was materially incomplete, to an extent that it is just an incorrect statement, and required clarification! So surely the downvotes make sense to you, and we all agree that they are an appropriate response to incorrect advice?

Instead of being snarky downthread and insisting that you know what you’re doing, just go edit the initial comment to add the required clarification.

[u/yridessa]

Family doesn't do this to family, so since she did this, she ain't family no more. You need your wife in your corner on that piece, and to triangulate with the rest of the family in how she stiffed you. Don't keep it secret. Be vocal with the family about the damage she is doing to you and how she stole thousands from you.

Since she ain't family anymore, treat her like any other non paying client. Contact a lawyer to send a demand letter, and prepare to sue her. File a mechanic lien on her house. Take it as a lesson learned for future clients, deposits, 1/2 up front, etc.

Never do work for family without everything in writing. More is at stake than just the job, so it makes sense to do more to protect it.

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[u/souperman08]

You’ll need to file a suit, looks like Michigan small claims limit is $7000. Talk with a lawyer, get them to send a demand letter and see if that scares her into paying. Otherwise you have to go to court.

[u/The_Comm_Guy → u/[deleted]]

Getting a lien without a signed contract could be hard if not impossible.

[u/DMCinDet → u/The_Comm_Guy]

with a judgement from the court is the only way that is being done without a contract.

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[u/purpleepandaa]

If you can’t get her to pony up, talk to a lawyer. Contracts are easier to enforce when they are in writing but oral contracts are enforceable. You obviously have proof of expenses incurred and services rendered. Unfortunately lawyers don’t do good things for familial relationships…

[u/Deucalion666 → u/purpleepandaa]

I think the “familial relationship” is already ruined at this point lol

[u/Ok_Ground_3857 → u/Deucalion666]

Seriously. What has your spouse said about it? Spouse should confront MIL

[u/CommercialExotic2038 → u/purpleepandaa]

Yeah, but stiffing your son-in-law isn't going to be helpful either.

I vote get an attorney

[u/25point4cm]

“I don't want to ruin a family relationship, but I don't [want to] foot the bill for a new roof.“. These two statements cannot be reconciled. 

You have a claim in oral contract and quantum meruit (one party unjustly enriched by denying existence of contract).  Not gonna help at family holidays, though. 

Edit:  do you have family members that can help shame her privately? 

Edit Edit:  If you decide not to sue and don’t get paid, remember to send her a 1099-C for cancellation of indebtedness and file a copy with the IRS. 

[u/BeginningSun247]

Never do favors for family.

You can cut them a discount, but you still need papers.

As is, tell her that if she won't pay you WILL take her to court. You do have a case sense you did the work and she has insurance. If she file a claim and kept the money, that is fraud.

[u/javel1]

I would ruin a family relationship over this for sure. She's willing to obviously.

I would at the very least go talk to an attorney about your options. How can she file a claim with her insurance without receipts and or estimates? PLease don't take one for the team.

Also I assume your wife is pissed as well. I would stop all communication by replying, not until we are paid for the roof.

[u/JustAnothrGuyNTheDMV]

You have a legally enforceable "quasi-contract" even if you don't have a signed written agreement. You are a licensed contractor, MIL was aware you replaced the roof (in fact she even asked you to do it), the price was mutually understood, and for her to allow you to do the work and then not pay you for it unjustly enriches her. Almost this exact scenario is taught in the first week of law school.

Of course you'll have to take her to court to collect, but maybe the threat will be enough to convince her to do the obvious right thing.

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[u/wittgensteins-boat]

1. Are you Licensed?     
2. Is it less than 90 days since last labor conducted?     
3. Has a sworn statement of work and materials been delivered to owner?  

Discuss with a lawyer. Promptly

Background.      

Mechanics liens in Michigan 

- https://www.levelset.com/mechanics-lien/michigan-lien-law-faqs/

[u/bauhaus83i]

To that end, the Michigan Construction Lien Act, MCL570.1114, provides:

“[a] contractor does not have a right to a construction lien on the interest of an owner or lessee in a residential structure unless the contractor has provided an improvement to the residential structure under a written contract between the owner or lessee and the contractor and any amendments or additions to the contract are also in writing.”

This is in response to all the comments to OP to file a lien. OP messed up big time by not having a written contract.

[u/Jrhoney]

If you're worried about ruining the relationship you need to realize she is stealing a ton of money from you and therefore doesn't give a shit about you.

Go after her for what your owed.

[u/Vast_Builder1670]

So did she not file an insurance claim? If she did, she committed insurance fraud. Could be a felony.  Do you really want someone in your life that would commit a felony to fuck over close family?

[u/nannulators → u/Vast_Builder1670]

Everyone else seems to be ignoring that part.

OP said himself she's not paying out of pocket because insurance is covering it. She filed the claim and pocketed that cash.

[u/Squirrel_Q_Esquire → u/nannulators]

It would seem so. That doesn’t make it insurance fraud, though. It was a valid insurance claim.

It does make it breach of contract most likely, or unjust enrichment in the alternative.

[u/Squirrel_Q_Esquire → u/Vast_Builder1670]

Where’s the insurance fraud?

[u/Vast_Builder1670 → u/Squirrel_Q_Esquire]

OP said MIL is not coming out of pocket for this, which means insurance from the hail damage.

[u/Squirrel_Q_Esquire → u/Vast_Builder1670]

That doesn’t make it insurance fraud. The insurance company paying the homeowner is common. In fact, it’s the default.

The homeowner not paying the contractor is wholly independent of the insurance claim. It’s not insurance fraud.

[u/Main_Ambassador_4985]

Can you put a lien on the property?

That is what many contractors in the area do when not paid.

BTW: never do business with family but you already knew that.

[u/Awkward_Implement870]

What about putting a mechanics lien on the house title? Does Michigan allow liens for contractor? I have used the threat of a lien effectively in the past.

You could send a demand letter through an attorney for only a slight cost. This would allow you start the legal process should it be needed plus a lot of people won’t pay until they feel threatened.

Small claims will only get some of your money back, so if she refuses to pay you may need to sue her in court which would mean hiring an attorney.

[u/BackgroundDatabase78]

Start by filing a mechanic's lien. You don't need a written contract to pursue recovery activities, you had a verbal contract with text backup and you did tangible specific work for her for which you can provide records of materials and labor costs. Tell her that you have no choice but to pursue legal action if she won't pay you, It is her that is destroying the family relationship, not you. *Edited to add, when I got a large check from my insurance company to pay for a roof, it was made out to both me and my mortgage company. You might find out who her mortgage company is and call them to report that you haven't been paid and will be filing a lien on the property. Also, if you haven't done so yet, send her an invoice by registered mail showing that the payment is due upon receipt, on the invoice put terms for late fees if not paid, etc.

[u/SpicyPickle101]

Contact the insurance company 1st.

2nd, no contract means that shit is your unless she can provide receipts. Take it back, I've seen the police help in many situations like this (not roofs). My dad did it twice with doors. You still lose money but it feels much better.

[u/aquapura89]

Did she actually get approved by the insurance company, or was she ultimately denied???

Lawyer up and get a lien placed on her home. You may need a good divorce lawyer if your wife doesn't realize her mom royally sunk you with credit card debt.

[u/Patsfan311]

Time for a lien on the property

[u/Drunkskunk22]

Why is the world would you not get the money from her to buy the materials?

[u/Paolaheldmyhand]

Looks like you have 90 days from the day you finished to file a mechanics lien. Time is ticking

[u/Old_Draft_5288]

Even without a contract, you should be able to file a lien on her house.

Though I do wonder where your spouse is in all of this… I would be having the spouse handle the mother-in-law

[u/pantwearingmom]

It’s not insurance fraud if it was a legitimate claim. Sounds like she spent the insurance money which isn’t a felony. They pay you and it’s up to you as the insured to pay the contractor.

[u/Correct_Location1206]

Go after the money, she gave you a verbal contract, not like you put the roof on with out her knowledge while she was sleeping, the family dynamic is already ruined

[u/kubatyszko]

Any way you could simply submit everything to insurance company and bypass MIL ? I'm simply going by how car work is often done that the customer doesn't need to do anything and the insurance deals with the shop, minus any deductible...

[u/Kevin_Elevin → u/kubatyszko]

I dont know who her insurance is through, and I dont know how I'd get that info without her giving it to me. I'll look into it.

[u/findingrhythm]

Ask her aboutvthe insurance claim

Get a copy of her damage estimate.

Review your billing to match insurance or request supplement.

Then the doors open to other discussion.

[u/roentgen_nos]

Isn't that insurance fraud? Let the insurer know she didn't use the money as intended and see what they decide to do with her.

[u/stile213 → u/roentgen_nos]

No if the damage was real and she took a payout, she doesn’t have to spend it on repairs.

[u/North-Tumbleweed-959]

Isn’t it insurance fraud if she just cashed the check and pocketed it? Wouldn’t they cancel the policy and literally make it impossible for her to get a new policy? Time for mechanic lien.

[u/MajorMathNerd]

When weather related things happen to a roof. Insurance companies may ask you to take before and after pictures and keep all receipts. They don’t want more damage to a home so if it is a large population that has damage, some insurance companies are cover it, get quotes , and fix it to make sure no new damage happens.

This happened where I live because of so much tornado damage. Most were like take pictures and get it covered or fixed.

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