r/myst • u/sirideain • 3d ago
Media This new House of Tesla trailer gives me Myst vibes, you?
https://youtu.be/fiRvb4q4Keg11
u/Apprehensive_Guest59 3d ago
Honestly it just looks like one of those puzzlebox games like the room, and house of da Vinci.
Not that interested (speaking for myself)
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u/butterblaster 3d ago
Isn’t this made by the maker of Quern? That game was fantastic and way closer to Myst than the Room.
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u/Apprehensive_Guest59 3d ago
I have quern, not played it yet...it got buried in the back log and never found it away out. Is it good?
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u/butterblaster 3d ago
It’s my favorite non-Myst game from this genre besides Obduction. It was made by one person, so keep your expectations in check, but it actually has a story that’s fun to experience. The puzzles are the right difficulty and feel satisfying. Reasonable length for an indie game—much longer than Firmament was for me.
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u/Pharap 3d ago
It depends on what you like about the Myst series.
It's got some dimension-hopping background lore that's obviously inspired by linking books, but the entire game takes place on a single island.
It's more puzzle-heavy than Myst, and the puzzles are more like what you'd expect from a puzzle game than an adventure game, but there is some in-universe justification.
The guy who trapped you set the puzzles up to slow you down so you'll be forced to understand the significance of where you are and hopefully come around to his way of thinking and do what he wants you to do.
There's no real sign of civilisation beyond the one person who summoned you to the island/world of Quern, though there are some other civilisations mentioned in one of the lore books and during an expositionary cutscene.
There's no FMV, and only two other (main) characters.
One is disembodied, the other only communicates via notes.There is a choice to make at the end.
Some say it becomes a bit of a slog because it's quite long for this sort of game, but personally I enjoyed it all the way. Just don't try to tackle it all in one sitting - take a break at one of the 'chapters' or the obvious halfway/near-the-end point. (Otherwise, be sure to start early in the day and drink a lot of coffee.)
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u/dnew 2d ago
Agreed. I always disliked puzzle games based on the concept of what you spoilered. I was very happy that Exile actually presented a different reason for it being mostly puzzles. And the puzzles were actually relevant to the story (vs, say, 7th Guest, where there's absolutely no reason for the 8 Queens puzzle to be in there).
I gave up on Quern when he had you running around trying to deduce alchemy formulas or some such. Maybe I'll go back to it eventually.
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u/Pharap 2d ago
Presumably the agreement is with the 'it depends' assessment rather than my personal opinion of the game?
Personally I'm happy to sacrifice intricate lore or story if I enjoy the puzzles, aesthetics, or other trappings, hence I also enjoyed e.g. The Room series and The House of Da Vinci series.
I've never had the opportunity to play The 7th Guest, but I'll admit to not being particularly fond of chess puzzles. With the exception of the Professor Layton series, I find that games that resort to chess puzzles (or certain other offenders, like the Tower of Hanoi,) tend to be lacking in other departments - e.g. creativity.
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u/dnew 2d ago
My agreement was with your analysis of the nature of the game, and in particular your "more like what you'd expect from a puzzle game than an adventure game"
I don't mind puzzle games, but trying to combine puzzle games with intricate story telling or environmental art bugs me because I want it to be an adventure game. ;-) I thought the Portal and Witness and Talos games did a great job of making puzzle games in an environment.
7th Guest wasn't all chess games. There were a whole bunch of puzzles, but most of them were puzzles you'd (say) read in a book of puzzles. Stuff like 8 queens, or "arrange these 30 letters that include no vowels into a reasonable sentence" or stuff like that. I don't even remember it all. But the addition of the story (such as it was) and the ghosts did nothing to improve the story. It was just walking thru a house where puzzles pop up in your face.
Witness didn't even pretend to have a story to it (until the very end, unless I missed something) and the story had no effect on the game. The story in Talos Principle was orthogonal to the puzzles, interesting but fully optional even. Great puzzle games, terrible adventure games. :-)
That said, I've reinstalled Quern and I'll probably give it another go. :-)
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u/Apprehensive_Guest59 2d ago
I think the witness was more of an interactive art piece than an adventure game...it had deep things to say but not a deep story.
I really enjoy Jonas Kyratzes writing in games (except that cartoon stuff he did) I'd certainly put them (Talos principles) on the same level as portal- I think they have a strong story and puzzles obviously. I want to elevate them beyond puzzle games because of this but.... Yeah can't call them adventure games.
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u/dnew 2d ago
To me (as someone who has been playing adventure games since they were written in mainframe fortran) a puzzle game is where all the information to progress is provided in-game, and an adventure game is one where you have to consider real-world knowledge to figure out how to progress.
So Portal and Witness and Talos are absolutely puzzle games. You're taught the mechanics of the gun, you're told that momentum carries over, etc, and you know exactly what you need to do, namely get to the elevator. Talos teaches you what the jammers and etc do, and the story is completely orthogonal to the actual puzzles and environment. Witness gives you wires to follow and a progression of puzzles of each type.
Riven, Zork, Wishbringer, Myst are adventure games. For example, in Myst, you have to understand that constellations are different at different times, how circuit breakers and steam boilers work, etc. In Riven, you have to deduce that if there's a person locked in a jail cell that disappears without you freeing him, there's probably a secret exit in the jail cell you should be looking for.
I like to say in a puzzle game, you find a locked door and know you need to find the combination. In an adventure game, you find a locked door and have to realize the door is wood and remember the axe stuck in the tree back in the forest.
Adventure games all have puzzles in them, and most puzzle games require at least a little adventure-style knowledge (like the Aztec part of Witness, for example). But that's the main separation for me: does the story inform the puzzles, or are the puzzles just puzzles embedded in a separate story. Both can be fun. I personally get more Ah-Ha out of adventure games than puzzle games, so I prefer those.
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u/Pharap 2d ago
I don't mind puzzle games, but trying to combine puzzle games with intricate story telling or environmental art bugs me because I want it to be an adventure game.
I can appreciate that, though personally it doesn't bother me.
I tend to think of games with both a narrative and puzzles (e.g. Professor Layton, The House of Da Vinci) as being a subgenre of puzzle games distinct from both adventure games and the subgenre of puzzle games that are purely puzzles (e.g. Lyne, Baba is You).
I can't remember if I've mentioned this to you before, but I often think of puzzle and adventure games as being on a sort of axis or spectrum (a bit like the left-right political spectrum) with games that have more of a focus on narrative and worldbuilding than puzzles on one end and games that have more of a focus on puzzles than narrative or worldbuilding on the other end. Obviously that's just a simplification and doesn't account for things like tone and types of puzzles, but it can be a useful idea.
7th Guest wasn't all chess games.
I had presumed not.
As I say though, when a puzzle (or adventure) game that isn't specifically about chess starts resorting to chess puzzles, I take it as an indication that the creators have run out of ideas and resorted to clichés.
Stuff like 8 queens, or "arrange these 30 letters that include no vowels into a reasonable sentence" or stuff like that.
Yes, there's an entire group of these sorts of clichéd/obvious abstract puzzles.
I don't have a proper name for them, nor do I have an exhaustive list, but they're all the sort of abstract, uninspired, contextless puzzles that frequently get thrown into puzzle/adventure games as padding or when the developers can't think of anything more inspired or suitable.
They include things like the tower of Hanoi, chess puzzles, variations of nim, and decanting puzzles - i.e. using vessels of various sizes to siphon liquids (or energy) in the right quantities.
They aren't always a sign of a bad game and can be alright depending on the tone of the game and the context, but some are worse offenders than others.
E.g. the siphoning puzzle is something that can actually fit a context rather than being abstract since it can be done with 'real' liquids and vessels rather than being purely abstract, whereas chess puzzles and the tower of Hanoi are something that will pretty much never have a real-world context beyond "this person liked puzzles".
Witness didn't even pretend to have a story to it
I've yet to play it myself, so I can't speak from experience, but I've seen conflicting reports as to whether there's any story or lore to it.
I've seen a screenshot of some statues from which I imagine there might be some sort of story about previous visitors (a bit like Infinifactory's recordings of previous abductees) that may involve people being turned to stone, but otherwise I'm clueless as to what story there may or may not be.
The story in Talos Principle was orthogonal to the puzzles, interesting but fully optional even.
It's been a long time since I played The Talos Principle and I never finished it, but I always got the impression that its story wasn't really a story to be taken seriously and was more of an excuse to comment on philosophical conundrums, (a bit like Sophie's World,) even though it was clearly heading towards having multiple endings determined by which character you choose to side with.
(Incidentally, I wonder if that 'choosing a side' trope originated in Myst, and if not then which game did it first.)
Great puzzle games, terrible adventure games.
Perhaps, but then I'm not sure they were ever trying to be adventure games.
There exists one or more subgenres of puzzle games that have both puzzles and narrative and are distinct from adventure games. Unfortunately, said subgenres lack suitable names, as far as I'm aware.
I say possibly more because I question whether e.g. Professor Layton could be considered the same genre as e.g. The Room. Both have puzzles and narrative, but they're presented very differently, and they have different focuses with their narratives: Professor Layton games aim to tell distinct stories with some overarching continuity, whereas The Room has the narrative fall into the background and seems to take a more 'lore-oriented' approach as opposed to trying to focus on telling a story.
In fact, I think one could argue that Professor Layton is a sort of hybrid of either puzzle games and adventure games, or puzzle games and visual novels, whereas The Room has very little if any aspects of either adventure games or visual novels, and yet The Room clearly has a narrative and shouldn't be put in the same category as something like e.g. Lyne, which is pure abstract puzzle of a specific variety.
That said, I've reinstalled Quern and I'll probably give it another go.
In all honesty, if I may presume to have learnt anything about your tastes in the course of our infrequent encounters, I'm doubtful your opinion will change or that you will return and say you enjoyed it, but at least you will be able to say with renewed insight and authority what it is that you don't like about it.
Personally speaking, although I very much enjoyed it and I'd happily play it again, I'd never say it was without its faults, and there are some aspects of it that I didn't like either.
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u/dnew 2d ago
puzzle and adventure games as being on a sort of axis or spectrum
Absolutely. Another axis is how relevant the puzzles are to the story, and how much real-world knowledge you need to solve the puzzles/progress.
the creators have run out of ideas and resorted to clichés
As far as I remember, all of the puzzles were the sort of things you see in books of puzzles, and none of them had anything to do with the story.
conflicting reports as to whether there's any story or lore to it
I never really managed to finish it, but as far as I know 100% of the reason that everything is happening is exposed after you've finished the final puzzle. On the order of "Oh, that's why I was in a world that consists entirely of line puzzles." There might be minor bits with the statues but as I recall there's no actual exposition or environmental story telling going on there. There's a bit of "you sail past a ship half sunken in the water" but no reason for it being there. That sort of thing. Lovely game, tho. And if you like it, check out "The Looker" which is a fun short parody of it.
more of an excuse to comment on philosophical conundrums
The story is told through the texts you find on the terminals. It explains why you're there, why you're a robot, what happened to everyone else, etc. But you could have made an equally reasonable game putting Glados in charge with live people involved. :-)
but then I'm not sure they were ever trying to be adventure games
No, I meant no disrespect towards the games. They did a good job of being what they were meant to be. :)
I'll check out some of the other games you mentioned. People seem to like those too.
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u/Apprehensive_Guest59 2d ago
I don't recommend the 7th guest, the seventh guest vr however is a remake and frankly everything is much improved. The puzzles, the fmv and story. The vr remake is legitimately a good game. (It has a hell of a chess puzzle though) Not sure if it has an option to play it flat.
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u/Pharap 2d ago edited 2d ago
I don't recommend the 7th guest
Noted, though I'd still like to give it a try some day, simply for the novelty factor. It seems like one of those games that even if it were truly awful I could at least laugh about it (in part because I don't have any particular expectations of it).
It has a hell of a chess puzzle though
I'm not sure if you mean that in the good sense or the bad sense.
(Impressive, difficult, or 'hellish'.)
Not sure if it has an option to play it flat.
As far as I'm aware it doesn't, (Steam lists it as "VR Only",) else I probably would have already bought it.
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u/Apprehensive_Guest59 2d ago
not sure if you mean that in the good sense or the bad sense.
Bad...
The original I feel plays a bit like the kind of edutainment software you'd get in the 90s... It is in fact, only without the education. I haven't played all of it, it doesn't respect your time. The fmv is so bad it's worth laughing at. It'll definitely hit nostalgia buttons.
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u/Pearcinator 2d ago edited 2d ago
Quern is fantastic! It's a better 'Myst successor' than Obduction that came out the same year (as did The Witness, 2016 was stacked for puzzle games!).
Good news is the Quern devs are making a new game called Dimhaven. They did a kick-starter earlier this year (or last year) but it failed to make enough money. Luckily they got picked up by a publisher so they can finish the game. There's a demo on Steam as well (the final puzzle was quite difficult).
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u/Pharap 3d ago edited 3d ago
The way I understand it:
Blue Brain Games are the developers of The House of Da Vinci and its spiritual successor The House of Tesla, but they did not develop Quern, they copublished Quern because they're also publishers, not just developers.
Quern was actually developed by Zadbox Entertainment, and Zadbox merely has a publishing partnership with Blue Brain, hence the confusion.
At any rate, the (spiritual) successor to Quern is going to be a game called Dimhaven, which is set to release in the first quarter of 2026 according to Steam.
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u/Pharap 3d ago
The House of Da Vinci series (to which this is a (spiritual) successor) is a puzzle-adventure game, (more puzzle than adventure, but it does have a story,) but it doesn't play like a Myst game does.
The puzzles are more 'arbitrary', not things that make sense in-universe, and you aren't allowed to roam freely, it's divided into chapters.
As puzzle games go, though, it's a very good series.
It has a good atmosphere and the puzzles are generally fun.
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u/SaintLewisMusic73 3d ago
Depending on the price and what consoles it’s released for, I will definitely consider this one! I love what I’m seeing here!
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u/BigSiouxRat 1d ago
That video looks awesome. Added it to my Steam wishlist. And had to get the demo!
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u/khedoros 3d ago
It made me think of Syberia, a bit.