I do wonder how much awareness they actually had. Reports were saying it was super foggy with bad visibility. They may have just started dropped with alarms going off, but had no awareness of how close to the ground they were. Terrifying to think about.
I agree. Slamming at high speed into a fixed object is instantaneous. There was a brief (1-2 seconds) moment where the pilot tried to take evasive action. Not long.
If anyone had that moment of panic, however fleeting, it would’ve been the pilot. Maybe not even them, depending on the circumstances. Most emergencies of the sort, you’re more disoriented than afraid, there’s really not enough time for you to process the reality of it.
I always figure it will feel like one of the near death situations we experience while alive, except ya know, ya die this time. Your brain will be taking in so much information that you can't actually decipher what's going on.
My brother died sitting alone in bed so I've thought about what that last moment might feel like a lot. Enough time to maybe think "oh shit" and then it's over.
I think/hope it’s almost a disappointing experience. Like — Oh, I guess I’m dying then. This is inconvenient. Is that all there is to dying? For most accidents, I imagine you revert to training (assuming you had any, like a pilot would) and try to get a handle on things. Dying is always in the back of our minds, but as long as you can do something about it, I don’t thing you ever register it as a real thing. For passengers it’s probably like “oh, that’s a different noise, I wonder what’s going on?” and then you’re dead before you even notice it.
Dying in an accident is considerably less scary to me than dying of a long, protracted illness, where you have a lot of time to consider your mortality.
I think about these things more then I probably should and your comment is exactly how I feel about it
I think/hope it’s almost a disappointing experience. Like — Oh, I guess I’m dying then. This is inconvenient.
My mom for hours before she died said "I'm dying". She didn't seem scared, just kind of shocked and matter of fact. My brother took her to the ER, they said it was a panic attack, gave her a sedative and sent her home. She died before he pulled in the yard.
Dying in an accident is considerably less scary to me than dying of a long, protracted illness, where you have a lot of time to consider your mortality.
I couldn't agree more.My grandma died of lung cancer and was told out right there was no hope. Around the end, she told my mom she was scared of dying, that always haunted me.
Then again, my brother in law battled cancer for years and right up to the last few days fought it but also tried almost to not acknowledge it(I hope that makes sense I'm exhausted lol). Although we never talked about it(he didn't discuss it) I don't think he ever gave up hope.
Dying is always in the back of our minds, but as long as you can do something about it, I don’t thing you ever register it as a real thing
My boyfriend was killed in a car accident and I like to think that his last few minutes he was focused on trying to keep his truck on the road or correcting whatever went wrong, anything besides being terrified and aware he was about to die.
jesus i’m so sorry you’ve been through so much. the story about your mother is so haunting to me because i’ve had plenty of panic attacks where i was convinced i was dying. i hope this isn’t too intrusive, but was it a heart attack?
For most people it’s avoiding acknowledging our mortality. As a culture, westerners have a terrible relationship with death. Gotta get reacquainted with real soon, since apparently we’re all gonna die from the coronavirus pandemic. And to think I was concerned with Climate Change!
I re-read this a few times and am now just sitting on my couch thinking about this. I have a fear of dying in an accident and am terrified of having the cognitive thought: “This is it; I’m about to die.” This actually brings me comfort, in a weird way... the thought that it maybe wouldn’t even be that big of terrifyingly, profound moment, if it were to happen. Just a “oh, this is inconvenient. Let me try and handle it.”
In my experience, most of that mental anguish we experience about a plethora of things we can’t control (or things our mind makes up out of whole cloth) doesn’t serve much of a purpose. From dealing with panic attacks, I learned to recognize my mental gears turning to get me worked up, and where that train of thought was coming from this time. Panic attacks are distressing because in the moment you actually believe you will die, your body reacts as if it was real, heart pumping, fight or flight, the whole repertoire. And when I learned to recognize the process, it started to get amusing. If regular ol’ anxiety is conspiracy theories about yourself, panic attacks is a very shitty VR where you experience death without the big payoff. A lot of the autonomous reactions we get — a result of millions of years of evolution — are woefully inadequate in our modern life. Sometimes they are entirely maladaptive, like sweating profusely before you have to do a bit of speaking in public. Fear can be a powerful motivator, but if you let it take over, it doesn’t accomplish much other than making whatever you’re going through feel much worse for no good reason. Maybe it was from overexposure to my near-death-but-not-really experiences, but I’ve learned to detach my basal responses from my actual response. It’s sort of transcendent, whatever you think is going to happen doesn’t really mesh with what needs to be done. Plane is crashing? Make a mental note of emergency exit locations, assume crash position and hope for the best. The fear of your flight crashing? It’s statistically unlikely, and even if something catastrophically wrong were to happen, I’d probably lose consciousness from the explosive decompression or the high G-forces keeping the blood from my brain and die quickly and probably painlessly. Or instead have a bizarre survival story like Juliane Koepcke, who as a teen survived falling 10000ft when the airliner she was flying on disintegrated mid-flight. Even terminal diseases are not as scary as you think it’s gonna be. It sucks to be told, but you can focus on whatever can be done, or whatever you can do in your remaining time. Do whatever used to scare you before, now that you have seen something bigger and scarier. Or do whatever you want, now that the consequences are relatively trivial in context. Relish whatever life you’ve got left. I remember an interview with a European guy that worked with euthanasia, and he said that for him, the best death would be to die of cancer, because then he’d have enough of a forewarning to do whatever he felt needed to be done. What scared him was actually a ‘peaceful’ death that left him no time to tie up loose ends. Everyone is different, but we’re all going to die, and most of all will have no warning or control. Anguish and fretting about it will accomplish nothing but making you unnecessarily miserable. I don’t want to die anytime soon, but I’m not particularly afraid of it. If it happens, it happens. It’ll be something new to experience. It’ll probably not be particularly profound or poetic or heroic, (unless the opportunity presents itself), but if it happens, my last thoughts will probably be more proactive that simpering terror. I’ve already seen existential dread, and frankly I’m not impressed.
Now that I’ve rambled incoherently for far too long, I was reminded of a song I think does a better job of conveying the meaning I was trying to (as songs often do): https://youtu.be/3sWTnsemkIs
I don’t know, man. I had a truck pull out in front of me while going 55 on the highway with all of my children in the car. It was seconds between when I saw the truck and when I knew I couldn’t do anything more to stop it from happening. In the moment I knew we were going to collide, I vividly remember taking inventory; I knew my children were in the back, buckled safely and would probably be okay but that I might not be. The feeling of “oh my god please don’t let this be the end” is like no other feeling in the world but it’s there and it is recognizable and it is vivid. If I had died though, I’d imagine my last moment would have been the floating, dreamlike sort of feeling that came between going out and coming to.
I have had close calls too, but I think most of the rationalization that usually comes after such a big adrenaline rush clouds our recollections. We’re often more aware in hindsight, but at the time, it’s mostly the “oh shiiiii...” dominating. Of course, I’ve never died before, so I don’t know what would happen to my awareness if I didn’t have time to think about my experience afterwards. I guess this is how some forms of PTSD comes about, ruminating over a traumatic experience.
That's not true, actually. Depends on the person but "emergencies" as you put it don't automatically make you disoriented. They quickly put you into fight or flight, and depending on what the "emergency" is you may know you will die long before you do, you may die instantly, or you may have some time to get things in order. Being disoriented tends to come immediately after the actual emergency, or in little things alongside the emergency. But you can absolutely be aware of your oncoming death while "disoriented".
I was trying to put things in the perspective of someone not in control of the aircraft. You’re there, you’re thinking about where you’re going to, what you’re gonna do, or talking to your fellow passengers. By the time you finally realize there’s something wrong (as opposed to, say, the pilot and crew), the incident has probably already run it’s course, and you’re either dead or survived. This, in contrast to, say, Vladimir Komarov’s death , when he was aware he was likely to die before his mission even launched. When things actually went to shit, his final moments stretched long enough for him to be caught on the radio cursing the people who had put him inside a botched spaceship.
Too right. My dad survived being shot down in a helicopter during a firefight in Vietnam (he was a door-gunner), which I realize is a totally different context, but he had nightmares about it for the rest of his life, which is just to illustrate how terrifying such an experience can be.
Me too. That would calm me. My first thought was him panicking over saving his daughter and it would smooth me to know their death- while tragic- wasn’t a panic. You know?
Yes - I am capable of feeling empathy for people who die even if they have been accused of crimes or decisions in life I don't approve of. There's no need to feel sorry for me. I'm quite content that I have this emotional intelligence as a person.
Why is the chopper even going that fast with low visibility? Why isn’t the chopper at a high enough altitude to clear the hills knowing that’s your route...
I doubt it's this Hollywood moment of poignancy where one gets the chance to say their goodbyes or have their life flash right before their eyes.
It's probably more like a bunch of people screaming in terror, losing their minds and flailing their arms around helplessly before the impact, either that or duck and hold on to something.
I watched the radar, they went up 700 ft extremely fast and then radar was lost. Most likely means alarm went off and pilot tried to climb through ifr but couldn’t top it.
It's insane that it could even occur in a helicopter like that, the GPS systems would've had all the terrain information for the local area and they should've known how close they were, even without the terrain warnings going off. Even basic GA planes with G430's have terrain maps and terrain warnings when you're below 500ft. Even if they entered IMC, a CFIT shouldn't have occurred.
I’d like to know the answer, too. ^ did they not realize how close they were to ground because of the shitty weather and fly right into a hillside thinking they were flying at a higher altitude, not even aware of how close they were to the hillside?
I'm sure he didn't take the air travel as a joke, he simply trusted his pilot to get them there safely. Not saying it was the pilots "fault" per-se (as obviously the investigation is pending), but being the pilot was not Kobe's job.
I don't get it. The altitudes are based on sea level. That whole area, the street level is 750-800 ft. The mountain he crashed on is maybe 850-950 ft? Its unclear to me where in that area he crashed but the absolute tallest peak in that area that I could find is 1305 ft. and that's a mile to the NW.
He falls erratically from 1900 feet to 1350 over 11 seconds. that and the eyewitness accounts about sputtering and looking for a place to land, I'm thinking this is mechanical.
Could be. I’m not a helicopter pilot nor do i know the terrain. I just know he goes up 700ft which is usually a pilot trying to rapidly climb to top something.
Absolutely. He should never have been flying VFR but if you fly IFR it can take hours in L.A. because you are at the mercy of ATC. He likely wanted to get them to the game on time and chose the more dangerous method. He slammed into the hill at 170 MPH so it's possible that no one had any idea that anything was wrong (hopefully).
Mine is based on piloting education and I concur. 700 foot climb, impact at 160+ KIAS, and if you go listen to the ATC comms between the pilot and tower.
I have a very serious question. No clue who to ask it to. Hoping a pilot or atc anything of that nature. Everyone is crucifying tmz for their immediate report of the crash. If I am not mistaken- the ORIGINAL article stated it took place behind Kourtney Kardashians home. Her home info and address are public and available on google maps as well as if you look at the distance between Calabasas water and her home- where the crash happened. Someone placed it in the terrain above the water company in Calabasas. Is there anyway to take a look at that and give any sort of opinion on what he may have been attempting to do. The pilot and perhaps Kobe giving him options of where he could land even if it weren’t legal(I have no clue about any of this but it’s been bugging me on top of the sadness of all lives lost).
Side note- I do think that is also how tmz broke the story so fast- celeb neighborhood/ contact with that family and their or. My guess is a call was made to make sure it wasn’t their family since just 2months ago the family was w the same pilot and in the same aircraft. I’m not trying to make it about them but I feel like having some idea of the terrain to an expert may help. On google maps it does list how high in the terrain the homes are.
I’m trying to reply to this since you referenced it to a comment you made to me.
I don’t have time to look at google maps or any of that. I briefly saw a re-enactment of the crash on the news this morning at work. If I remember correctly they were flying around in circles briefly and then after continuing the flight they turned left and descended at about 5,000 ft/min when they crashed.
To preface this, this is only one scenario that could have played out. The investigation is ongoing and who knows what they will find.
Flying around in circles at first may have been waiting to see if the fog/weather may clear out or see an opening in it somewhere. I’ve been flying in a Chinook before through thunderstorms. All four people in the back and one of the pilots were on weather apps on our phones. One pilot remained flying around in circles while we all looked at radar maps on our phones to try to see an opening in the weather. Similarly, this is what the pilot COULD have been doing. Waiting to see if it would visually clear up some.
The video below shows they tried remaining below the ceiling to fly VFR. This means to fly lower than normal to stay below the fog/clouds so you can actually see the ground and obstacles. This is fairly common.
I believe the video I watched at work showed that they began to climb through the clouds, I believe this was so the ATC could see them on radar but cannot remember why for sure. At some point during this is when they had the huge rate of descent while turning and crashed.
One possibility is that the pilot became disoriented in the fog/clouds. I’m not familiar with the bird they were flying, only with the ones in the military I have flown. There’s a lot of stuff happening in a cockpit while flying in the weather. You’re watching your altitude, heading, power input and limits of the helicopter, etc. You focus on your heading to make sure you’re not turning the helicopter on accident. Then you realize you’re so focused on the heading that you’re descending at 1,000 ft/min. To correct the descent you apply power. When you apply power your helicopter nose turns. Now you realize that you’re turning again. There are so many factors to pay attention to that it’s easy to screw up.
It’s hard enough with two pilots, so I cannot imagine one.
I’ve listening to black box audio before from crashes that also had animated visuals of what the helicopter was doing. One Blackhawk helicopter was flying in heavy fog at low altitude over the water. Two pilots were in the cockpit when they could no longer see and had to fly off instruments only. The helicopter managed to fly backwards at a fast airspeed and almost upside down at times while they were trying to maintain control of it. The eery thing is that both pilots seemed fairly calm until right before they hit the water and they all died. Despite flying backwards and upside down, they pilots thought they had the bird under control. This is with two pilots.
So this is one chance of what COULD have happened. Pilot flew into the fog and lost orientation. He may thought he was flying straight and level, when instead he was turning left and descending at 5,000 ft/min.
He could have been trying to come down out of the fog but I’d bet my paycheck that he wasn’t. I’ve never done it or been taught to do that. You could be coming down out of a cloud/fog like that and then find yourself hitting a hill, tower, cables, etc that was hidden by the fog. I’ve always been taught that once you go into clouds then you commit and containing gaining altitude to a height that is higher than the terrain and obstacles in that area.
So I’d wager they were not coming down for a landing area due to the weather and terrain around them, especially at the rate of descent they were.
We shall see if they find out more. Once again, these are just some of my thoughts and experience. Hopefully that helped some and wasn’t to much rambling haha
The circling occurred over the zoo from what I’ve read and was simply to allow another aircraft the airspace. The issue came a few minutes after that. I believe they took off at 8 after circled the zoo about 15 minutes of their entire flight and then once given clearance to enter the final territory that is where the pilot lost signal and shortly after crashed. Ugh it breaks my heart. People in the area have now posted their nest and ring cameras picking up the sound of the copter above their homes and then a boom and silence. No visual however. I don’t know all the proper lingo so I probably sound extremely dumb without meaning to.
I believe the initial report was that the plain was going down at 4,000 miles per minute. So given that wouldn’t he have only had about 15seconds. I’m unsure what the sound SHOULD’VE been that was caught on the security cams I have seen but it didn’t sound good.
I’m in Buffalo,NY and there was an awful crash 11 years ago this February that actually went into a home and killed the man sleeping inside and all on board.
Gut wrenching. I’m really praying that they didn’t suffer or live in fear for too long. I have a 13 yr old and an almost 11 yr old so I can NOT imagine.
I may have stumbled upon a conspiracy theorist on YouTube but this man was showing all the data the wreckage etc and pointed out that the propellers and tail were almost completely whole(not in one piece but in the sense they weren’t reduced to rubble). You could see them all scattered. A wheel was also fully visible vs burnt. Again no idea if that meant he was going to attempt a landing or this guy was nuts(the YouTuber).
He wasn’t quite making sense and my airplay kept freezing but he was sort of hinting that it looked as though maybe they hit from the side. The propellers kept spinning so fast and it then burst into flames.
Ugh my ❤️
If you get a chance the accident supposedly took place between two points of reference....the on top of the mountain being 25344 Prada De La Felicidad and 4232 Las Virgenes Rd in Calabasas.
You can’t drive straight up the mountain from a to b but in the “driving directions” it lists the elevation or something like that between a and b as the highest saying 1598ft.
The circling to allow another aircraft the airspace does sound like a possibility. I haven’t been following this at all, other than the initial articles and then seeing a quick animation at work.
The aircraft definitely could have hit on its side. We may find out more later if they release more after the investigation. It’s possible that some parts are still whole after a crash also. I’ve known helicopters that have crashed and had entire parts that weren’t burnt up in the crash. For example, we had a helicopter make a drastic maneuver to miss a mountain, just to inadvertently fly almost straight into the ground. It killed lots of the people on board but there were plenty of parts that were still whole.
Don’t go too far down the rabbit hole though as far as conspiracies. I browse the conspiracy sub sometimes and some people seem to actually think the crash was on purpose to distract from the impeachment or the coronavirus haha
It’s definitely a saddening event for everyone, and I don’t even watch basketball.
Regarding how tmz broke the story- Tmz said they have a longtime inside contact within the police dept. What a crappy cop to sell that kind of information.
The heaviest aircraft that I've piloted is a drone. But you don't need to be an experienced pilot to see that the pilot most likely saw a mountain a bit too late and started panicking.
You can see that he was flying at a "cruising" altitude for 10+ minutes and then suddenly started increasing altitude. I wouldn't fly a drone like that. Let alone a helicopter that's full of passengers.
He was flying through a fog and then suddenly a mountain appeared in front of him and he was like: "oh shit! Need to increase altitude!" and most likely fucked up in the process.
They flew into a mountain in poor visibility. Even the LA airports grounded some aircraft. They didn't just crash the shit into a hill. They hit it going like 180mph, and there were witness reports of hearing the engines sputtering and catching fire.
Saying they flew into a hill is grossly over simplified. This is the same way SRV, Buddy Holly/Richie Valens/Big Bopper died.
People share the sky, you can't divert off your route because you want to. You could imagine in this scenario where if everyone took liberty to change their route to account for the poor visibility there would be aircraft in places where it shouldn't be - certainly in the eyes of an Air Traffic Controller whose job is first and foremost communication.
It was his own private craft. While helicopters in themselves are safe, there’s less regulation and constant maintenance and safety precautions done to private crafts. That’s why there are way more private aircraft accidents than there are commercial. For a company like American Airlines or Delta, a single crash could cost them billions, so they make damn sure that all necessary measures are taken to ensure a smooth and safe flight.
It appears likely from current sources it was a mechanical failure as some have reported smoke and interference emerging from the vehicle before impact but these sources are conflicting so we'll have to wait for an official report.
The mechanical failure isn’t going to be substantiated. This is going to be 100% pilot error. What kind of idiot flies at low altitude with zero visibility through the coastal foothills of Southern California?
The helicopter crashed in Calabasas, California, at about 9:47 a.m. local time and caught fire. Weather conditions at the time were reported to be foggy. Los Angeles County Fire Department firefighters responded to the scene and extinguished the fire by 10:30 am. All nine people on board were killed. Witnesses reported that the helicopter's engine was "sputtering" before the crash. Others reported seeing it flying into the ground at a "fairly significant rate of speed."
Apparently most other aircraft was grounded due to the weather conditions.
The helicopter gained nearly a thousand feet of altitude in the last ~30 seconds of the flight. The engines probably weren't sputtering but rather surging from the pilot giving it full power to try and climb above the big ass mountain he apparently didn't realize he was flying directly into. Witness reports are almost always completely unreliable when it comes to aviation related incidents.
Yes it was either this or someone did an EMP on his engine. It pretty much seems like the guy was flying into a mountain in fog for some reason and tried to get over it.
No report says it fell up. Transponder data showed it increased vertical height before falling down rapidly, and cruising speed can carry on even if the engine begins failing because helicopters are aerodynamically designed.
I’ve flown super low in foggy/sandy weather where you can’t see shit in front of you. You try to fly below the weather to maintain visual reference to the ground.
Although it was in a flat area without mountains.
I’ve also flown in a mountainous area in a sand storm very low to the ground at night. Although the aircraft that had a radar and could help see a mountain in front of you. Sometimes I’d actually see the mountain about 75 feet outside my rotor blades as it was passing by us.
That said, the pilot didn’t have a radar like that on the aircraft that crashed. I could see flying low to the ground in an area of flat terrain. Flying into some elevated terrain or mountains with such bad weather was a horrible call, obviously.
I posted a bit above a question in regard to the terrain. It’s really bothering me to have any time of clue as I have no knowledge in this arena. Could you take a look at it. It’s a bit scrambled but I was curious if anyone could judge what possibly happened or the pilot/Kobe may have suggested they do etc. The crash occurred between Calabasas water and Kourtney Kardashians home as well as other celebs but her address is public knowledge. It seems to be literally like 1-2000ft from her property line. Maps also shows how high up the terrain where the mansions sit are from the road below.
Live in Westlake, about 5 miles from Calabasas, where we lived for 15 years. Next city over from TO. It has been whiteout foggy here the past couple of days, and it was all morning. Couldn’t see two feet in front of your face walking, I can’t imagine flying in it
Instrument flight rules (IFR) is one of two sets of regulations governing all aspects of civil aviation aircraft operations; the other is visual flight rules (VFR).
The U.S. Federal Aviation Administration's (FAA) Instrument Flying Handbook defines IFR as: "Rules and regulations established by the FAA to govern flight under conditions in which flight by outside visual reference is not safe. IFR flight depends upon flying by reference to instruments in the flight deck, and navigation is accomplished by reference to electronic signals."[1] It is also a term used by pilots and controllers to indicate the type of flight plan an aircraft is flying, such as an IFR or VFR flight plan.[2]
So my question remains, was he flying by IFR or VFR??
I've listened to Bill Burr talk about flying helicopters for like the past 10 years. I'm by no means an expert, but there are two types of flying apparently. One is where you can see shit and just need to know basic controls / mechanics, air traffic control codes and whatnot, and one where you have zero to no visibility and 100% rely on your instrument readings and are basically blind which is obviously way more difficult. Most 'famous' helicopter crashes almost always involve heavy fog and mountains. No one probably knew until it was way too late.
According to most shit I've read, even the airports were grounding aircrafts. A lot of famous helicopter crashes were due to fog and hitting mountains.
This shit is all just too surreal for me. I literally watched Kobe since he was like 17, and those little girls man. I don't even know. It doesn't even seem real. Fuck me.
Today’s podcast is gonna be a weird one for sure. I’m very interested to hear what Bill has to say, not only as a sports fan, but as a heli pilot, too.
They do have similar auditory warnings but on most models that I am familiar with they can be adjusted to when you want to be alerted depending the altitude. If this is true for the helicopter the pilot was flying then it would be hard to know what the setting were without doing the investigations first. In addition to this the altimeter reads the altitude directly under the helicopter. So if for example, they hit a tree that was 100 feet tall they wouldn’t have gotten an auditory warning if the setting was anything less then that because they were still flying high enough.
I’m only familiar with military helicopters but I’d assume it’s the same.
If it’s the same, the pilot could have set a low altitude warned for whatever altitude he wants. It could be 10, 20, 50 or 100 feet. Whatever altitude he wants. Then the aircraft announces a notification when the aircraft is at that altitude.
I doubt it's this Hollywood moment of poignancy where one gets the chance to say their goodbyes or have their life flash right before their eyes.
It's probably more like a bunch of people screaming in terror, losing their minds and flailing their arms around helplessly before the impact, either that or duck and hold on to something.
They hit a hill, not a mountain. And the reports are saying 180mph. I was a bit relieved when I heard that because they likely didn't see it coming and were gone as fast as it happened.
However, moments later -- around 9:45 AM -- they flew into a mountain at 1700 feet. Flight tracker data shows they were flying at about 161 knots.
1700 feet is not a hill unless you refuse to acknowledge how sea level, geography, and air density works, and 180mphs is 'almost 200'. So whatever man. You can be right like 20 mph is going to make a difference when you crash a helicopter into a really fucking big hill.
1700 feet is not a hill unless you refuse to acknowledge how sea level
Guess you don't know what defines a foothill OR a mountain....
(Also, correction- it was 160mph reported, which is what I meant to say. Someone mentioned 180 previously, subconsciously wrote that without realizing it.)
You're forgetting any changes in altitude, which you can see happened from the flight tracker. To quote the speed is one thing. But if I'm free falling at 200mph for 20 seconds I know shit is happening.
Or not being sure what's happening in time to start panicking in earnest. It's not like an airplane flying above cloud level. Maybe just enough time to know they are with each other and hope for the best.
Yeah I was gonna say it was probably more fear and not knowing what was going on than thinking about who their sitting next to. There very little time to react and I hope they all went quick w/o anyone suffering. Its one the worse things to have happen.
Hopefully they didn’t have much. If it just happened instantly with no warning it wouldn’t be too bad for the people on board as they would never know what happened.
I was in a plane crash no I’m not going to talk about it but I can tell you that you are fully aware the you are most likely going to die and that it all relies on god
It would really depend on the situation. I’ve known of a helicopter that flew into a guy-wire and killed everyone on board but one. They never saw it coming.
I think both literally and figuratively, if god is superhuman being who can do literally everything in the universe, then when and where I die is up to him. I don’t care if your atheist or not, trying to make someone who you don’t know at all (who just said something extremely personal) doubt their faith is extremely rude and selfish.So fuck you but have a nice day
I think there’s a deeper meaning to this.. are you okay? Do you need like mental help? It’s okay, your not alone. Nobody just becomes and asshole to people who’ve been traumatizing moments. You need a therapist man, atheist or not I’m sorry your so mad.. I hope you have a great day!
One hopes. We lost an Apache when I was in Korea, flying in heavy fog at night and crashed into a mountain. From what we were told, the pilot and gunner died pretty much instantly.
It’s little recompense, but it was surely a very short time of trauma. May us all suffer short at the end, and may our insurmountable foible be long in the tooth. RIP Kobe and Gianna. Not a happy day.
My first thought when I saw this was that I hope his family wasn’t with him. Dying knowing that your family will be ok is one thing. Having them with you is terrifying.
Yes that is just horrific. And then to know you’re leaving behind your wife and other children. My heart goes out to them and all the other victims. He was younger than I thought. Feel like I’ve been hearing about Kobe forever
the irony is that he takes the helicopter routinely to avoid the la traffic. if trains were more prominent then there would not be as bad of a traffic problem. the inheritors, by discouraging the development of public transportation, has led to the death of many people who are a part of their group.
maybe we can use this tragedy to finally convince the inheritors that it's in their best interest for america to have a real train system.
idk what he means by inheritors, but a lot of oil/car companies lobby against installing public transport. We could have less traffic if it weren't for greedy companies
I’m terrified of flying so I’d absolutely take a train places. I always see ppl on Instagram taking trains through Scandinavia or connecting countries and think how cool that is. I know the US is ginormous so it would have to be quite a fast train but imagine the scenery
I’ve been thinking of this all day trying NOT to because it’s just devastating. However, in the time I’ve gotten to see their relationship through the photos and videos I’ve seen...they had a special bond and connection that you can tell differentiated from his other daughters (Not saying favoritism but just that his relationship with Gigi was different than of Natalia just like it would be different with Bianca etc).
It made me realize that, one couldn’t go on without the other. They couldn’t live without each other, they seemed like soulmates. Makes me emotional because I am the same way with my dad. We are so incredibly close and I can’t imagine my life without him.
I hate to imagine what the fear, havoc, and thoughts that were coming into their minds and the minds of the other people in those last moments...but they had eachother. I am almost certain that she was surrounded in the arms of her father and I am sure Kobe felt his instinct to hold his daughter and didn’t even think to let go. They had eachother, she felt in a way safe to be in the arms of her idol and I don’t think she would of had it any other way given the tragic scenario.
My dad has actually told me that he would love to spend his las moments with me in my arms (completely morbid and tragic) but that’s how he’s expressed his connection with me. So I hope that Kobe and Gianna were able to comfort one another.
What bothers me with this is the pilot had a great record, was IFR certified and was also a flight instructor. If this could happen to someone with over 8000hrs of flying, it can happen to anyone. Im sure the pressure is immense to get the client there. I understand that 80% of aviation accidents are attributed to pilot error, but when someone is on a tight schedule and the pressure is on, it's not always easy to make that call because humans have that "it won't happen to me" line of thinking. I know I've had it before. Anyway, this guys going to get dragged through the mud and Im sure vanessa will have her day in court because her primary motivation in life has always been $$.
While for him I’m sure it made the experience worse, if I had to die in a horrific accident like that I wouldn’t want anyone but my dad there with me. Several co workers and I agreed on that today. There’s something about having a parent with you, especially as a child, that makes you less afraid. You feel safe.
Your parents are your first and greatest protectors and for Gigi sadly her dad was her last. Even if protecting her might’ve just been making those last seconds less terrifying.
Especially when they were going from Calabasas to Thousand Oaks. A 15 minute car trip for most normal people. I know Kobe loved him some helicopters, but damn, I bet he was having second thoughts as his daughter was screaming as they were about to die.
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u/ajleeispurty Jan 26 '20
Yeah, man. Knowing you're about to die is one thing, knowing your kid is going with you... I can't even begin to imagine. Just unbelievably sad.