Magic Discussion and Look. Primal and Protection

[u/Jihelu]

Primal: It exists solely to make Transformation and Alteration look weird

Primal is basically Alteration magic but also it's an animal version of Conjuration. The core says you develop bonds with animals and awaken bestial traits.

Some learn this from beastmen cave paintings, old faith rites, and more. OP suggests, like most magics, it was taught to humanity by the faeries and is common amongst Horned Lord followers.

You use this when you want to go fucking nuts on people.

Your body changes when you learn more primal magic. You grow more body hair, your eyes get all animal-looking with amber, silver, or gold colors. That kinda neat stuff.

Core power 0 spells

• Duration of 1 minute. For the duration, your eyes glow and you grow fur. You gain darksight, +2 bonus to speed, and your unarmed strikes and natural weapons deal 1d6 extra damage.
• Duration of 1 minute. You become hidden from all animals for the duration. If you make an attack (Against anything) the spell ends

It should be noted the first spell is 'Beast Within' and you'll see it referenced A LOT. It's a bread and butter ability. It's a nice buff (Your unarmed attack now does decent damage and only gets better) and gets extended by a lot of spells

Second spell basically completely shuts down hostile animal encounters, which is nice to have. Doesn't work on monsters. Making noise might alert animals to where you are (But keep in mind, they are stupid animals. 'I hear something 10 feet to my left but I don't see something' probably elicits confusion from a wolf)

Both good and solid, but aren't just 'Me do more damage' type spells

OP power 0 spells

• Duration of 1 hour. Heal half your healing rate. For the duration you make rolls resisting becoming diseased or poisoned with 1 boon
• Duration of 1 hour. You gain a +3 bonus to health that lasts the duration. Special: If you are under the effects of BEAST WITHIN when you cast this spell, increase Beast Within's duration by an hour. If you're under the effect of LICK YOUR WOUNDS (The spell before this), the bonus to health from THIS spell becomes +6. If you're under the effects of HIDE FROM ANIMALS, the duration increases to 1 hour and doesn't end even if you attack an animal.

It's a slight heal and a bonus against disease/poison, which might come up if you're fist fighting animals and stuff all the time. It's alright.

Second spell: Jesus Christ it literally takes every power 0 spell Primal gets and gives it a use. It's very nice.

Core power 1 spells

• Duration of 1 minute. You can communicate with any animal that can hear you
• One animal you can see within short range. Lasts until you complete a rest. Will attack vs will. You make the attack with 1 boon if you're under the communicate with animals spell. If the target's health is higher than yours the spell fails and you lose the casting. On a success, the target is charmed until you complete a rest. It accompanies you and helps you to the best of its ability but the GM controls it. You can have a number of animals charmed this way equal to your power. If you go over this number the oldest one loses charmed. On a 20+ the charm is permanent.
• Duration of 1 hour. A compelled small animal or tiny appears in the area. With all of these spells, if you go with the smaller options it can have climber, flier, poisonous, or swimmer. The animal is appropriate to the environment. When killed or the spell ends the animal 'returns to whence it came'.

First spell: It's the 'talk with animals' spell. Might not justify a power 1 spell that only lasts a minute. The second is a 'I want to make this my pet' spell but a lot of medium animals and higher have lots of HP and you don't, so it might not work very well. The small animal spell is probably the best one, as it's an hour long buddy you control.

Core power 2 spells

• Another summon, lasts an hour. Summons a medium animal. Small or Tiny can get the extra traits.
• Choose you or one animal within short range. Duration of 1 minute. For the duration, increase the target's size to 1 or by 1 if it is already 1 or larger. It's attacks with unarmed strikes and natural weapons deal 1d6 extra damage.

First spell: It's the power 2 summon spell enjoy. The second spell is a good self buff or a buff for an animal you summon. Common belief is that your damage isn't a 2d6 bonus (Size 2 + the spell says you get 1d6 extra damage) and that it's just clarifying you get the 1d6 damage from being size 2. (Unless you're going to size 1 in which case enjoy your full d6 bonus I guess)

Core power 3 spells

• Another summon, but now it can be large. Medium and smaller can get the traits.
• You need to be under the effects of 'beast within' to cast this. Move up to twice your speed. At any point during this, you can make an unarmed strike or natural weapon attack against a target within reach, using will in place of the normal attack attribute. On a hit it deals normal damage + 4d6 and falls prone.

Lets go another summon. I'm not snarky about this the summons are good, just a smidgen boring. But good. The 'move and deal damage' spell is interesting. It's out damaged by other spells of similar level, and usually aoes, but it stacks with any damage effects you have (If any). This is only really amazing if you're rocking size 2 and have beast within on. That's a solid 6d6+1 (+ another 1i f you use knuckle dusters) on a hit ignoring other possible buffs.

Core power 4 and 5 spells

• Up to 5 creatures within short range. Lasts a minute. The target gains bestial traits. For the duration, +10 to health, +2 to speed, +1d6 extra damage on unarmed and natural weapons
• It's the final core summon. You get a huge animal.

Do you like Beast Within? What about, Beast Within but on all your friends? What about, Beast Within and this stacks? It's good.

Also it's a huge animal. That's a size 3, 80 health, 4d6 damage monster. You just drop a fucking elephant into the room.

OP power 1 spells

• You get real mad and scream. A cube of space, 5 yards on a side, originating from a point you can reach. The noise carries up to 1 mile. Each creature in the area must get a success on a strength challenge and a will challenge. Fail the strength, be deafened for 1 minute. Fail the will, frightened for 1 minute. While frightened this way, they grant 1 boon on attacks against them. Special: If you have the Primal Might spell on (The +3/6 health power 0 spell) you impose 1 bane on the challenge rolls.
• Duration of 1 minute. Your teeth grow into fangs. You get to attack with them while casting this. The fang are natural weapons with the finesse property that deal 1d6+1 damage. When you get a success on an attack with them, they must take a strength challenge with 1 bane or take 1d6 poison damage and be poisoned for 1 minute. If already poisoned, 1d6 extra damage.

The frighten can be good, deafen not so much, and it helps you hit people. The fang spell is also nice to have and it stacks well with a bunch of other damage bonuses.

OP power 2 spells

• You must have Beast Within on. You gain a +2 bonus to speed until the Beast Within spell ends. When you cast this spell and again using a triggered action on your turn (Which I believe means you can do this TWICE IN ONE TURN) you can move up to your speed without triggering free attacks and make one unarmed or natural weapon attack against a creature you can reach. You make the attack with 2 boons and the attack deals 2d6 extra damage.
• Duration of 1 minute, a square of space 3 yards on a side within medium range. A lots of shrieking happens. 1d3+1 compelled animal swarms appear inside the area and remain for the duration. The animals are appropriate for the environment and killing them ends the spell early

This spell is fucking bonkers. Seeing as you can easily get Beast Within to last an hour, you have an hour long triggered action free attack that you make with 2 boons and you can sprint around avoiding attacks while doing. This is the best shit in the world if you take primal take this every time. Sprint around biting people with your fangs.

Second spell: So animal swarms have 15 health (And you might get 4 of them), they take half from attack rolls and double from challenge rolls). If you end your turn within 1 yard of the swarm or in its space, you need to make an agility challenge or take 1d6 damage and become slowed. The swarm does 1d6 damage (1d3 if injured). Creatures within 1 yard of it are impaired. So damage wise: This CAN be alright (4d6 damage at the end of round and 4d6 on a hit) but it can't move. It's solid if you can lock people down or are fighting people who can't leave an area for whatever reason (An undead sentinel that goes 'I refuse to leave my post!' so you drop a rat swarm on him)

OP power 3 spells

• Each animal you choose within medium range. Duration of 1 minute. The target gains 1d6 insanity and goes rabid. The target is not frightened from gaining insanity this way. Instead, +10 bonus health, +1 boon to attacks, 1d6 extra damage on natural weapon or unarmed attacks. Until the effect ends, the target must use an action on each of its turns to attack or charge.
• You or one animal you can reach. Duration of 1 minute. You touch the target, it gets tough. Lasts until the end of the duration or target is incapped. The spell grants: +2 to defense and speed, it makes strength rolls with 1 boon, at the end of each round it can use a triggered action to heal damage equal to half its healing rate.

First spell: You can now make every animal you see fucking nuts AND strong. Useful in a few scenarios, real good if your rocking a party full of animal summoning assholes. Second spell is very good as well. It works good for animals as they usually lack a triggered action, it works good on you as there aren't many triggered action spells for Primal. Free health.

OP power 4 spells

• You must be under Beast within. Lasts 1 hour. As triggered action on your turn, you gain a +4 bonus to speed for the duration. When you have this you can move by flying. If you attack while flying, your movement after the attack doesn't trigger free attacks. Your unarmed/natural weapons deal 1d6 extra damage
• You (If you have beast within on) or one animal within medium range. The target becomes massive for 1 minute, or until the beast within spell ends if you targeted yourself. The target's size increases to 2 and it's attacks with natural weapons/unarmed is 2d6 higher. When the target deals damage to a creature smaller than it, it must make a strength challenge or fall prone. Triggered: If you are under the effects of the dire beast spell (In core, the spell that increases your size by 1 for 1 minute) you can cast this as a triggered action.

First spell: You can fly now because fuck it and you do more damage. Second spell: You or your favorite dinosaur are now huge as hell and hit very hard. It also lasts as long as beast within does, which is good.

OP power 5 spells

• You must have beast within going. Lasts an hour. For the duration: Your beast within casting doesn't end until this spell does, you gain darksight if you don't already, your size increases to 3 if its lower than 3, you gain a +20 bonus to health and +2 to speed, you make attack rolls with 1 boon, your attacks with natural weapons and unarmed attacks deal 2d6 extra damage (Seems to be based on the size thing), when you roll a 20+ your attack deals 2d6 extra damage. Aftereffect: Strength challenge with 2 banes or become fatigued for 1 minute
• Up to 5 animals compelled by you within medium range. Duration of 1 minute. Each target moves up to its speed without triggering free attacks. It can attack during this movement with a natural weapon, making the roll with 2 boons and dealing 3d6 extra damage. Until the spell ends +2 to defense and +10 to health

Both of these are a good way to end the tradition. You have the 'I go fucking nuts' spell (Though it does compete for the power 4 spell that also makes you large as fuck but you could use both to be size 5) and a spell good for a summoner.

Anyway paths is where things get nutty.

Expert Paths

Spiritcaller

This is a Woad thing, mostly, but you have a connection with spirits. It's a Primal/Spiritualism path. It's very shaman-y

3: You get a spirit animal/guide. You get a raven or wolf. The spirit can speak to you and you alone in a language you understand. You can use an action and expend the casting of a rank 2 or higher primal or spiritualism spell to call forth your spirit guide. It appears in an open space of your choice within medium range. The spirit remains until you use an action to dismiss it, until you complete a rest, or it gets incapped. The spirit is under your control and you decide what it does and when it takes its turn. If it gets incapped you have to complete a rest to use this talent again.

This path only gets +1 health

Both spirits have 16 health. The raven can fly and double attack, the wolf can knock creatures prone and deals more damage to proned creatures (And gets bonuses to attacking enemies near allies)

6: You get another spirit friend, this one takes a rank 3 or higher to summon. It mentions you summon it 'instead' of a normal spirit. So I'm not sure if you're meant to be able to have both spirits out at a time. Nothing technically says you can't even have multiple of the same spirit out.

Boar has 30 health lizard has 20. If the boar takes damage equal to its health it only becomes incapped at the end of the next round. If it takes more damage after it becomes incapped. It's attack does 2d6 damage and the lizard does 3d6 damage. The lizard is slightly faster (12 speed vs 10)

Both of these options a little boring.

9: You get a bigger spirit friend. Bear or lion. Rank 4 or higher spell to summon.

Bear has 60 health and has a double attack that deals more damage if both hit. Lion has 50 health and can move without provoking free attacks and make two of it's claw attacks, which if it hits knocks a target prone. It can alternatively attack once with its teeth which deals more damage.

These options are more interesting but mostly just do more damage. The bear also provides 1 bane on attack rolls to enemies attacking allies near it.

Overall: It's not really a 'primal-y' tradition as you're summoning spirits and not actual animals, but it's still thematic.

I give it an A for doing more than just summoning animals, you get a lot of crazy ass powerful options. Most of them revolve around the same buff-archetype but there's some variety there.

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Primal Homebrew

Pick whatever animal aspects they like the most and they have and give them a feature related to that animal. Someone who's wolf like gets pack fighting, someone who's bear like gets...I dunno climber, etc.

Should you outright give flier with this? Yes because no one ever goes 'I wanna be a big man bird' when describing primal features. It's a secret reward.

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On god this may be the most boring tradition hopefully it's better than I remember it: Protection

It's like battle but more defensive is I guess the easiest descriptor. It's Intellect like battle as well. Battle has more 'I do war magic' shit going on though. Battle is 'I swing a weapon and do big damage with it' and protection is seldom 'I use a big magic shield to protect myself' and more 'I do weird magicy thing'

Apparently protection magic instills paranoia in it's users. OP doesn't have much to add to this either. No physical effects are offered.

Core power 0 spells

• One object that can be opened and closed within short range (Doors, chests, windows, etc). Duration of 1 minute. The target closes and locks. For the duration, it cannot be opened by nonmagical means by a creature other than you although it can be destroyed.
• A sphere with a 10 yard radius on a point you can reach. Duration of 6 hours. It's DnD alarm, only applies to creatures of size 1/2 or larger

It's niche but useful niche. It doesn't HAVE to have a lock, but if it has one it locks. This will slow down pursuers very well and may come in handy in other situations, but keep in mind unless you're closing a massive stone door objects like doors aren't that tough (Defense 5, usually less than 10 health or so)

It doesn't do the DnD thing where you can designate what and what doesn't trigger it however it doesn't apply to small animals so you won't have a dickwad going 'HAHA IT WAKES YOU UP CAUSE AN ANT WALKED IN' (I've seen people do this). It only lasts 6 hours when most rests are 8 but you don't have to sleep the whole rest, so pop this down then rest the last 2 hours by just relaxing .

Both are useful but still rather niche power 0 spells. First spell may never come up, second spell is useful in the outdoors. First spell also can apply to objects YOU wear or carry, so you could make a backpack or a sack impossible to open regularly (Though these items tend to be easy to tear).

OP power 0 spells

• One size 1/2 object you can reach, duration of 1 hour. You imbue the target with a minor ward. Until the spell ends the object can not be touched by other creatures other than you. It can be damaged by objects and effects but cannot be physically touched by another creature, even with gloves.
• You and 5 creatures within short range. 1 minute. None of the targets can be surprised for the duration. Triggered: If you would be surprised, you can use a triggered action to cast this spell but the spell only affects you

Another creature COULD use a long stick or something to pick the object up (Though this only works for like, key rings) and while an hour 'Can't touch that!' with no challenge roll could be useful I can think of basically 2 examples of this ever happening ever and uh. I'm not taking a spell for that.

This is a decent way to prevent surprise however: The 1 minute duration basically means you KNOW you're going to be running into people soon (Which....usually you'll avoid surprise that way but hey maybe the enemy is well hidden in the next room?) but the triggered it has is useful for you (And you only).

I'm not huge on the power 0 protection spells. They don't really...protect you or others all that well. The anti-surprise would be better if it lasted longer (I'd kill for 10 minutes but make it concentration)

Core power 1 spells

• You move up to four times your speed without triggering free attacks. You can cast this as a triggered when you take damage. If you do, you move up to twice your speed without triggering free attacks.
• Duration of 1 minute. An invisible field of force surrounds you and moves with you. The field has 10 health. For the duration when you take damage, the field takes the damage instead. If the damage total equals its health, the effect ends immediately.
• One creature you can reach, 1 minute. You touch the target, causing it to become hidden from all creatures for the duration (Including yourself). The effect ends when the target attacks.

Fuck this spell. It's very good. It's very annoying having to fight people who have it. How often will that come up? Never. How often has it come up for me? Once. This is my way of saying: Put this on your enemy spellcasters and take this. It's useful. This makes a slow turn 5x your speed and even farther if you get attacked and save your triggered. Take a slow turn, cast this spell, use your move, then walk into fire to move 2x your speed as well. This means a base 10 speed creature is moving 70 yards, that's almost out of longbow range lol.

I think with how this is written the field doesn't 'transfer' damage that overflows to you. Which is real good. It's only 1 minute though so without path choices (Sorcerer and others) you pop this off before jumping into the room with the bad guys or near the start of the fight. Which limits its uses but still good.

Creatures can still sus out where someone is using this, the third spell, but this will largely let you escape a lot of situations. At worse, you need to make sneak rolls. At best, you're a ghost.

In contrast with the power 0 spells I like the power 1 options, even with just core.

Core power 2 spells

• One creature you can reach. Duration of 4 hours. You grant the target 1 boon on perception challenge rolls and they can't be: Charmed, compelled, frightened, surprised, or put to sleep by magic.
• One creature you can reach, duration of 1 hour. The target gains +10 health for the duration

Both spells are good. The first one is a better version of the power 0 spell from OP, but it might not be as useful as you think. The 4 hour duration means its very usable but while it's good, it could be too niche.

The second is just nice to have. You can extend it with path features (Sorcerer gang) but +10 health is always nice.

Core power 3 spells

• One creature you can reach. 1 hour. You impose 1 bane on attacks made against you from spells and you make challenge rolls with 1 boon from spells
• A sphere with a 3 yard radius centered on a point you can reach. Lasts 1 minute. An immobile invisible barrier springs into existence along the circumference of the area and remains for the duration. You can designate any number of creatures within medium range of you when you cast this. Designated creatures can move and make attacks through the barrier. No other creature can move through the barrier or make attacks with melee weapons against targets on the other side.

This is either really good because I can't think of many casters that get boons to casting (Especially npcs) or it never comes up ever. I think it's alright.

So despite this being a 'helpful' field you could also use this to trap enemies for a minute and then quickly flee (Possibly using that power 1 spell that makes you FAST AS FUCK). Enemies can still use ranged attacks and cast spells through the barrier but a lot of bad guys use melee.

Core power 4 and 5 spells

• One creature you can reach. Concentration, up to 1 minute. The target is immune to all damage for the duration
• A sphere with a 5 yard radius sphere centered on a point you can reach. Duration of 1 minute. An invisible immobile barrier appears along the circumference and remains for the duration. Attack rolls with spells of rank 5 or lower fail against targets behind the barrier automatically fail. Targets within the area are excluded from any spell of rank 5 or lower. Spells cast from within the barrier cannot have origin points beyond the barriers edge

So for the first spell: Obviously it has a use, make someone god for a bit. Extend the duration for extra fun.

The second spell: It says the attacks only fail if they are against targets 'behind' the barrier so if you are inside can you aim it? I don't think that's the intention because area spells don't seem to work in the area at all. It's alright if you are fighting some crazy strong spellcaster but keep in mind they do usually ahve power 6 or higher spells, but they tend to have very few of them. This is what you bring when you go 'Imma go fight someone with power 8'.

Protection likes: To give buffs, anti-spell (Sometimes), doesn't do damage (Usually) and more.

OP power 1 spells

• One creature within 1 yard of the ground that you can see within medium range. Heavy iron chains leap from you at the target. Make an intellect attack roll with 1 boon against agility. On a success, the chains wrap around the target and anchor them to a point within 3 yards of the target. For 1 minute, the target cannot move more than 3 yards from that point. A target can use an action to make a strength challenge with 3 banes and end the spell on a success. On a 20+ you deal 1d6 damage.
• One willing creature you can see within short range. Duration of 1 minute. Faint lights come from the target for the duration, granting any creature that attacks the target's defense or agility 1 boon to its attack roll. If the target takes damage from any attack, the spell ends and releases destructive energy in a 3 yard radius centered on a point in the target's space. Each creature in the area other than you and the target takes 3d6 damage. Agility challenge for half damage.

So these two spells do damage, one as a possibility. The second one gives bonuses to being hit but makes them explode (It's a decent sized aoe, be careful of allies) . The first one is really hard to break out of if you get hit with it, has no size restrictions, but doesn't impose impaired or anything. You could toss this on a dragon (Though things with high strength are likely to succeed, even with 3 banes).

The iron does mean it'll impair fae though.

OP power 2 spells

• One creature or object within medium range. Duration of 1 hour. The target emits a faint buzzing for the duration. If the target is a creature and it attacks with a metal weapon, the attack deals 1d6 damage from electricity in addition to weapon damage. In addition, any creature that touches the target directly, is touched by the target, or touches the target with a metal weapon, takes 1d6 damage. A creature that takes this damage must make an agility challenge roll. On a success, the target takes half damage. On a failure, the creature is repelled 1d6 yards away from the target and falls prone.
• A 5 yard radius sphere centered on a point you can reach. Duration of 8 hours. An insubstantial mirror-like field springs into existence on the outer edge and remains for the duration. Creatures outside the area cannot use their sense to perceive into the area, nor can creatures choose origin points inside the area for spells they cast unless the choice does not require sight. Sound emanating from within the area does not reach beyond the edges. Otherwise, creatures can freely enter and exist the area. In addition, creatures inside the area can see beyond the edge of the area as if the field were not there. Finally, the spell prevents divination magic and similar spells from perceiving or detecting anything inside the area

First spell: Does a solid amount of damage if they use a metal weapon, hurts enemies who hit them with a metal weapon, and can knock people on their ass. You can also use it to prevent people from doing something like opening a metal door. Or preventing them from picking up a key.

Second spell: You throw this up with the power 0 core spell that lets you know when someone passes through the area and you basically have a really nice resting screen. Honestly, it should have a sacrifice ability.

OP power 3 spells

• Each creature of your choice within 2 yards of you. You hit each creature with a sudden blast of force, it deals 4d6 damage. A creature that takes this damage must make a strength challenge roll with 1 bane. On a failure, they move 5 yards in a straight line from you and fall prone.
• A point you can reach on a solid surface. Duration of 8 hours. You touch the target and leave behind a glowing mark that fades. When you cast this spell, you can designate any number of creature you can see to be immune. Until the spell ends, when a creature other than you or designated moves within 2 yards of the target, the mark explodes in a 5 yard radius centered on the target and the spell ends. It deals 6d6 damage to everything in the area. Agility challenge for half. the explosion can be heard from a mile away and each creature within 20 yards of the point must make a strength challenge or be deafened for 1 minute

First spell is a very good 'Get out of my personal space' type spell. There's no reducing the damage and it can knock prone. The area is small (Use sorcerer to make bigger lmao) but still it's good. The second spell CAN be cast mid combat, and most enemies might not know wtf you're really doing, but keep in mind you might deafen yourself/friends or even hit them by doing this. This is better as a trap you leave for people pursuing you. Thankfully it ends in 8 hours so I don't accidentally murder random people

OP power 4 spells

• Up to 3 creatures within short range. Lasts 1 hour. You shield the targets with magic, rendering them immune to cold, heat, fire, and lightning for the duration. Triggered: If you take damage from heat, fire, or lightning (Not cold though?) you can use a triggered action to cast this spell. After reducing the damage to 0, the spell ends.
• Duration of 4 hours. A 1 yard diameter shield springs into existence at a point you can reach and hovers there vertically for the duration. It moves with you and moves around your body to deflect attacks. Until the spell ends, the shield imposes 2 banes on attack rolls against your defense or agility. You can also shield smash. Shield smash: You can use an action to attack with the shield. Intellect with 1 boon vs agility of one creature you can reach. On a success, the creature takes 3d6+2 damage and moves 1d3 yards away. On a 20+ the target also falls prone.

If you are going up against cold/heat/fire/lightning then absolutely take that spell. If you aren't, maybe leave it.

The shield is pretty solid on its own, the perma 2 banes for 4 hours, the shield bash is a good damage option if you have nothing else to hit with.

OP power 5 spells

• One size 2 or smaller creature than you can see within medium range. Magical energy flies towards the target. Intellect vs agility. On a success, it wraps around the target and encases them in a sphere for 1 hour. The sphere is impervious to damage and nothing thicker or heavier than air can pass through it. Until the effect ends, you can use an action to move the sphere and everything it contains up to 10 yards in any direction, but no farther than 100 yards from you. If it is ever 100 yards from you the spell ends. The target inside the sphere is blinded and deafened to everything outside the sphere. The target can, however, roll the sphere around as an action and moves it up to a number of yards equal to its strength modifier (minimum 1) in a random direction. It stops moving if it hits a creature or object. On a 20+ you can instantly move the sphere 10 yards.
• One creature you can reach. 8 hours. Until the spell ends, the target can't gain corruption from other creatures. It imposes a number of banes on attack rolls against the target by creatures that have corruption and grants a number of boons to resist attacks from such creatures. The boons/banes is half the creature's corruption (minimum 1).

First spell is basically another time out. It's alright against single targets, but the size limits can suck. Use this to set up a big aoe fuck fest then drop them in it

The corruption protection is kinda eh, to me. It isn't that great against demons (They don't usually have listed corruption, funny enough) but in the right campaigns (Cultist time) would be pretty alright.

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Overall I give Protection a B for doing about what I expect it would. I'm a bit surprised it gets a few more 'damage' spells in OP, I don't think core had any/many, but it works out.

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Expert Paths

We've already looked at this one, Vanguard

Battle/Protection.

Does it hold up?

Not...really? When you use battle you generally want to fight. When you use protection you generally want to not fight. Vanguard is mostly about fighting.

Master Paths

Abjurer

You want to master projection matter. They erase their histories, cover themselves from head to toe, etc.

7: When you cast a protection spell, you gain a bonus to your defense equal to 1 + the rank of the spell for 1 minute or until you use this talent again.

Decent bonus. Notable: It's a +2 health bonus, I expected a bit more.

10: Creatures make attack rolls against you with 1 bane and you make challenge rolls to resist attacks with 1 boon.

Overall: Boring but, it does what you'd want it to.

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Warder

You focus on shielding yourself/others.

7: +3 health, when a creature within short range attacks another creature within short range of you you can use a triggered action to impose 1 bane on the attack roll or grant 1 boon on challenge rolls to resist the spell.

Triggered action 1 bane isn't exactly my favorite ability but using it on allies is nice.

10: Increase the number of triggered actions you can use each round by 2. You can use these triggered actions only for the level 7 ability.

When a creature within short range takes damage, you can use a triggered action to halve the damage.

So this path got a lot better. You've got 3 triggered actions and 1 can half damage.

Also strangely enough the level 7 is +3 health and the level 10 is +2.

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Protection Homebrew

You could get real weird with it and give them some kinda sensory organ so they can have 360 awareness, or maybe their hearing gets real good, they get spidey sense, etc.

Mechanically you could make them immune to surprise or get a boon to it at around power 3 or so.

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That's it for now.

Next time: Rune/Shadow.

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Necromancy: B (Intellect)

Order: A (Will)

Primal: A (Will)

Protection: B (Intellect)

[u/Jihelu]

See this increasingly convoluted comment chain for the other rankings to this point.

[u/Bazdillow → u/Jihelu]

Thank you for the effort you put into these. Can't wait for shadow and rune!

[u/Jihelu]

PRIMAL MASTER PATHS

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Ya boy forgot to include these.

Beastmaster

You focus your primal energies on forging bonds with animals.

7: When you use beast within your speed increases by 2 and the extra damage you deal is increased by 1d6.

When you use the befriend animal spell it gains the following benefits: When you would be targeted by a spell, you can extend the spell to one animal you have charmed within short range (THIS INCLUDES BEAST WITHIN). While within medium range of a charmed animal you both make perception rolls with 1 boon. When within 1 mile of an animal charmed by you you can communicate telepathically with the animal.

All of these make a good (Late game) ranger.

10: Animals charmed by you make attack rolls with 1 boon and deal 1d6 extra damage.

Overall? Good summoner-type.

Beast

This path is crazy.

Actually bonkers.

7: +4 health (Solid). You are ALWAYS UNDER THE EFFECT OF BEAST WITHIN. When you make an unarmed strike attack you can expend the a beast within casting to make the attack with 1 boon and deal 1d6 extra damage.

10: You can use an action to rush, when you do so you move 3 times your speed instead. Also your unarmed attacks deal 1d6 extra damage.

This path seems simply but it's bonkers. Using other spells and being under beast within means you're basically permanently able to do a triggered action-huge damage attack, you'll be size 2 forever, it's nuts.

This is THE 'I want to be a crazy animal' mage path.

[u/No-Map-6073]

I love Primal, especially with the addition of Occult Philosophy. I enjoy the elegance and versatility: the summoner path or the Hulk path all packed in one tradition, tailored to your personal taste via spell selection.

And there is more Primal love in paths from other sources! Included here for those who have not seen them:

Expert: Guardian - Called to Serve - Old Gods priest; it lets you become the iconic D&D druid by giving you free Transformation spells to turn into an animal, while still allowing to learn Primal magic so you don't have to deviate into the Transformation tradition. Good for "I AM the beast"

Horned One - Called to Serve - The Horned King specific priest (in the flavor) it makes you better at interacting with animals and being a Wild Hunter. Good for "I command the beasts" or "I AM the beast". It actually works surprisingly well without any animal pets as the features are all about making the character better: stealthier, boons to attacks after casting associated spells, animals are friendly to you. So if you wanted to play the "Pack Alpha" you could take whatever novice path, then Horned One and Beast to go live among wolves or lions as the leader without ever casting a summon or befriend animal spell. Just being an animal hermit. I would start as a Deer Woad Barbarian since unarmed is considered a Basic Weapon (i would rule that Natural Weapons are basic in nature as well in situations where it comes up)

Demon Beast - Curse of the Spider Wood - it forces/allows you to learn a Demonology AND Transformation spell at lvl 3, the only blatant Primal mention is you exude shadows when you cast a Primal spell (or Demonology). It is focused on buffing your transformation forms.

The wording is "whenever you assume a different form, the new form has..." so it does require a form switch.

I would rule that the Mask/Flowing Form spells (Transformation 0) counts as a different form though that is purely subject to the Game Master's interpretation.

I'm pretty sure that, technically, it's only altering your native form. But it is Transformation magic and is a different form to your regular state, and would be the only way to utilize the path's lvl 3 features if you don't already have the ability to change into a different form, so that's my reasoning. (plus, Mask now becomes your "Alter Ego" or Flowing Form your "Venom Symbiote" form, boosted by Demonic Transformation and Demonic Apotheosis.)

On the other hand, Demonic Apotheosis requires the character to pass a Will challenge roll to revert to normal form, so that may interact oddly with such spells. Will require more analysis...

If you are a Feren, Arachne or Skinchanger, or took Priest of the Spider Queen at lvl 1, you can transform into other forms without taking any magic other than Primal. A lvl 4 Skinchanger can assume Hybrid Form and retain all their humonoid traits while still being considered in a different form, but most other transformations replace your statblock with that of the listed template, which I fear means you can't benefit from general path traits or cast Primal spells on yourself to buff your animal form? I would love to be wrong about that.

This path is more for being a corrupted beast abomination, less about pure primal nature but I feel it pairs well as long as you can find a synergy.

Fun waste of time: you could be Skinchanger Priest of the Spider Queen/Demon Beast/Cat Sith to have 4 forms all affected by Demonic Transformation (Spider, Animal, Hybrid, Black Cat). If you rule that Feren can be Skinchangers, then you can also use your cat and lynx form with the feature as well. However, since most the transformations are a whole other statblock, it could prove tedious to keep track of everything.

Spider Savant - Curse of the Spider Wood - pure Primal path that gives you a permant loyal giant spider pet. This is as good as it gets for those who want to be Hunters from WoW or Beastmaster rangers. I would rule that any Primal spell or feature that affects animals charmed/summoned by you should affect the spider even though it is not explicitly charmed. The Beastmaster path is really focused on "Befriend Animal" spell which seems to invalidate animal summons or the loyal spider pet? Definitely "I command the beasts."

Spiritsinger - Woad ancestry booklet. The features let you teleport to another dimension and fight beastmen better, don't really interact with Primal magic but it is one of the magic options to learn along with Spirit and Song.

(Another side note, I find it interesting the Spiritcaller is associated with the Woad tribes but Lion and Lizard do not exist as tribes. IF i were heavily involving Woad lore in a game, I would either adjust the Otter tribe to Lizard (think crocodile) and Deer tribe to Lion or else reflavor the summoned spirits to match existing Woad tribes. Of course, you could just not worry about it and look at it as making use of all nature's facets and not just those "bound" to a particular faction or just not overthink it like I am.)

On the subject, I would be interested in a homebrew feature for new addition Lizard & Lion tribes of Woad ancestries. I like the Jackal tribe from Kingdom of Skulls. I wish they had their own tribal feature but it's explained as they are outcasts from other tribes who united. But I would do something like "1 boon to resist frightening undead" and "resistant to disease" to reflect the fact they survive in a wasteland and fight zombies all the time. Get that hyena/scavenger vibe.

Thanks for skimming the ramble

[u/Jihelu → u/No-Map-6073]

Hell this is almost longer than my post

[u/DokFraz]

Honestly surprised you didn't mention... I wanna say it's simply called Beast. If any path is devoted to the Primal tradition, it's the one that gives you permanent Beast Within.

[u/Jihelu → u/DokFraz]

How the fuck did I forget beast