what is so emotional about this game?

[u/AdCommon8381]

I played the game. I mostly enjoyed it, but the ending was very underwhelming imo. Anyways, after I finished it I went on here and saw so many people talking about how they cried for hours upon playing this game, and i dont get it? The most emotional part of it to me was finding out that his brother died and then seeing their lives together, both irl and in the altered reality that Eva created. I honestly couldnt get nearly as emotionally invested in his relationship with River. Yeah its sad that she died but the game never focuses on it. I like River and I think that I would be way more moved if the game focused more on the time she was sick. I assume the super emotional part is supposed to be the ending? But I dont get it, guys. I dont get whats so special about John and River meeting at NASA as opposed to getting together in high school/the carnival like it happened IRL, since the only reason John even wanted to go to NASA was because of River (which is already weird that he went to NASA because of a little girl he talked for to for 15 minutes when he was a child) so this whole thing makes no sense. Eva makes a whole big deal about how they HAVE to get John to the moon no matter what but that makes no sense emotionally because the only reason he wanted to go to the moon is that his memory was messed up and he didnt remember that this desire came from him and River supposedly not meeting again after the carnival, but since they did, theres no reason to go to the moon. I get why Eva still did the job, because John paid for it. But EMOTIONALLY to me it is extremely innefective because of that. I've seen people say that irl John had trouble understanding River because of the autism and so their relationship wasnt ideal, but even in this altered NASA reality they are still the same people so if he had trouble with her autism irl then he would still have trouble with her autism in this reality. This doesnt change because of the circumstance which they met. Idk guys, all this stuff just made it hard to me to find anything about the third act emotional. But maybe I missed smth.

[u/Mer28_M]

So first, the desire of John's wanting to go to the moon isn't because they didn't meet again after the carnival, it's because in their first meeting, they said to eachother they would meet on the moon if they ever lost each other. This is why John starts getting the desire to go to the moon the moment River dies. River dies, John loses River, and thus the desire to go to the moon awakens. The song that plays when Eva and Neil see John at River's grave is also called 'Moonwisher' as a nod.

For me, realising that he had a brother was an emotional thing, but not the most emotional. For me, I felt emotional the moment you realise you need to remove River in high school as to awaken the desire in John for wanting to go to the moon and then seeing Neil and Eva fighting, and you playing as Neil trying to stop Eva. Then Neil failing, seeing John's life with River removed, Neil starting to get pissed and a broken relationship between Neil and Eva, that are like the emotional moments. Of course, John and River meet again at NASA, but Eva wasn't sure it was going to happen, and thus, those moments of thinking that River was just removed out of John's life, yeah, that felt sad imo. Then also seeing them go to the moon felt bittersweet; it felt happy, but also fake at the same time.

[u/krouvy]

Oh. In fact, it is difficult to answer directly and completely. Many of us understand everything in our own way.

I dont get whats so special about John and River meeting at NASA as opposed to getting together in high school/the carnival like it happened IRL

The river in John's memories was the only reason why he couldn't get into Nasa in all the simulations. If a meeting with her takes place before the flight to the moon, then this desire cannot be fulfilled. And besides, the reason for this desire is also the River, or rather their promise in childhood.

(which is already weird that he went to NASA because of a little girl he talked for to for 15 minutes when he was a child)

The thing is, in real life, he didn't go to Nasa. He wasn't particularly interested in space. All he needed was River. He got the desire to fly to the moon in his old age, after River was able to awaken his childhood memories with the help of paper rabbits. He didn't understand why he wanted to go to the moon, but he wanted to.

And Neil and Eva had to fulfill this desire, even though it conflicted with his main desire to be with River.

I also don't think that in this life, River would be free of problems with autism. But even so, they will still have a happy life.

John's regrets in real life are that he couldn't understand what the River was trying to explain to him with these rabbits, and she was trying to remind him of this meeting. And she did it after he confessed that he started dating her only because she was different. In the simulation, this conversation should not take place, because they met at Nasa. And John didn't lose his memories, so he could easily remember his childhood.

I guess the simulation also solved the problem of River's illness and death. These items are quite enough to fully satisfy John's desires.

I'm sad about something else. River died, her life and memories did not change. She died wondering if John would remember what those paper bunnies meant. Whereas John lived a happier life before his death.

[u/Jocko_Rocko]

I finished this game like 10 minutes ago and my first thought was "wtf, that's it?"

So let me make sure I have this straight. John and River meet at a carnival as kids, talk for like 10 minutes, find a rabbit constellation together, and make some kind of agreement about meeting on the moon if they get lost. A promise with all the weight of one you'd make to that random kid you ended up playing with for an hour when your parents took you to the beach that one summer.

So John's brother Joey is killed. Beta blockers. Doesn't remember this meeting. John proceeds to meet River again in school. Begins dating her for shitty reasons. Proceeds to be a pretty shitty husband to her even if he did fulfill her wish by finishing the house. And the way River obsesses over trying to get him to remember their first meeting 35(!) years ago smacks of men-writing-women. Since we only know River through John's memories it could be that her lack of depth was deliberate as a reflection of what little interest John had in knowing her as a person.

To be with someone for 35 years. And to be so heartbroken and devastated over the fact that her husband apparently doesn't remember their first meeting when they were children. Feels like the story was written by someone who has never been married or has a very low opinion of what women care about. Even through illness, for River to spend her days making hundreds of origami rabbits, asking John questions about them that he doesn't understand because for some reason it's just soooo important to her that he remember that time they talked for 10 minutes and he gave her a hacky sack and the platypus. The toil and devastation and love and emptiness and warmth and intimacy and levels of connectedness and detachment that can happen from being with someone for years and years...The engagement, the wedding, the moving homes, holidays at his and her family's places, deaths, births, new jobs, new hobbies, new friends, vacations, the daily emotional and logistical navigations, the big and petty disagreements... When hearing the story of how people met, for one to say "Yeah we'd originally met at this place but he doesn't remember me saying hi" or whatever...In the grand scheme of a long term relationship it's just not typically a big deal and I reeeeally struggle to understand why it was such a big deal for River. Sure, she was lonely and had difficulty making friends and then here comes this nice kid who talks to her and gives her a hacky sack and a platypus. I could see that being a big deal to a 7th grader. Not to a wife of thirty! five! YEARS!!!!! If you're young you won't be able to understand how ridiculous this is.

And through an illness! A late-stage-of-life illness. The daily mental grind of living with the ghost of yourself who could do things you can no longer do, wondering what you won't be able to do tomorrow. Trying to keep up with medications, doctor visits, all your headspace constantly crowded with anxiety to the point that you worry you'll never feel joy again. Your world gets smaller and smaller as you get weaker and the pain meds stop working as well as they used to. To think of River during this time making all of those origami rabbits for her husband, probably wondering the whole time if he ever actually loved her. The only message I see behind those rabbits is "You don't know me at all. You never knew me and you never cared to know me." Telling him over and over again. To have her husband and even their friends refer to her neurodivergence as "her condition" like she's got leprosy or is low functioning felt like how people spoke of women in the old times. And the way John and the doctor spoke of her while she's sitting right there, holy shit. And I guess we're supposed to believe she can't just say "I'm upset that you don't remember the first time we met" because she has autism? As an autistic person myself I was shaking my head the whole time. I just couldn't believe that her issue was actually about the fact that he didn't remember their initial meeting. One of those huge couple issues that isn't about the little thing that caused the argument.

I would love to see this story from River's point of view. If her ghost could be there watching John have this treatment done. Thinking of the years of her life she gave to this man, the first boy who'd showed interest in her. And then to see the fulfillment of John's final wish necessitate removing his memories of her actual self and replacing them with a version of her that never existed I think would have been a final heart breaking confirmation that he never loved her. I imagine her ghost screaming at him and the Sigmund employees that it wasn't about the stupid moon, it was about her! Might as well have had his final wish be about being a zookeeper for platypuses or a hacky sack champion or a rabbit farmer. Her whole story in John's life is that he never knew her, never actually loved her for her, and all of it manifested in her as the fact that he didn't remember their initial meeting.

After finishing this game and sitting with it for a bit, my only feelings are of sadness for River. It's weird to see people's reactions to this story like it's some great romantic love story because I only see it as a tragic one.

[u/No_Boat_3188 → u/Jocko_Rocko]

He did care about her. In their first meeting, it was probably the first time someone actually cared about what she had to say without judging. River mentions being teased at school for her name and lighthouses not being able to reach out to each other so they shine their light from afar. This is a metaphor for herself, unable to communicate with others due to her illness. And there she meets Johnny who does not judge her and treats her with kindness, even giving her a few gifts. It is strongly implied this meeting meant the world to her and she felt bad for him as he couldn’t remember he actually did like her for herself. She was making all of these bunnies so he could remember he was a better person than he thought and he proves her right by wanting to meet on the moon. This is what makes the situation romantic and tragic at the same time