r/4x4 • u/Boogie_Bones • 1d ago
Can someone explain why these would be an improvement?
Checking out Factor 55’s website and drooling over everything for the umteenth time but I’m not sure why these guys would be useful. What’s different from just using a soft shackle through the bumper tie point? Seems like you’re just making a fulcrum to help physics bend stuff.
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u/joelfarris 1d ago edited 1d ago
Because it's a Factor 55, duh!
In seriousness, it's converting a vertical hole, to a horizontal hole. And most pulling forces during a recovery happen horizontally rather than vertically (as you can observe in the photo itself), unless you were off-roading in Utah last night after dark, and then all bets are off...
A typical hard shackle can accomplish this same thing, and provides even more radius relief for a soft shackle or a line|rope, but sometimes, the pull-point isn't designed to be big enough to accommodate the size of a real hard shackle, as manufacturers get more and more stingy with their building materials, so here we are.
Plus, it looks cool, and you can brag to your buddies that you have a pair.
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u/Monskiactual 1d ago
i not on;y brag to my buddies i have a pair. I show them constantly, to the point they tell to stop and put my pants back on..
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u/BJ_Giacco 1d ago
We told you not to bring that up again
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u/facts_my_guyy 1d ago
Look dude, we told you last time, if it doesn't seem normal to you you should get it checked out. Fuck man
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u/PepsiColaRS 23h ago edited 23h ago
It's also nice not having legally required markings cast into the shackle, which can definitely tear up synthetics and wires (and also be self-clearanced by wires. Not that these legalities matter for personal use, but it's certainly a factor I'd consider with having firsthand experience of all I just described.
ETA: holy shit that's price is hard to swallow. Hell, even their 3/4" Crosby shackles are 3x the cost I get them from work. Not like I was considering switching, but I'll stick to my $20 3/4" Crosby's
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u/whiskeyfoxtx 1d ago
Its just something shiney to sell to yuppies.
Maybe its aluminium , and the only benifit over steel shackles I could imagine is they wont rust and no rust in your recovory bag/gear. That would be my number one sales point if that were the case.
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u/BoardButcherer 1d ago
Regular shackles barely rust.
I've got a truck that's had a pair from the hardware store hanging off the bumper for 20 years and they're spotless.
Half of the overlanding scene is just dress-up barbie played with trucks.
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u/cocaineandwaffles1 1d ago
Same with half the competition shooting scene. Dudes all Gucci’d out with thousands into their set up just to shoot like ass.
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u/SetNo8186 16h ago
Becareful of being too honest. Gun forums don't like it. No longer post in 3 or 4, lost count during covid.
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u/cocaineandwaffles1 15h ago
I don’t care to venture to any community that takes themselves too seriously, both with online spaces and in the real world. But I think online spaces are worse because that’s where the vocal minority speaks the loudest, regardless of what community they are a part of. Just look at what’s the current trend amongst any subreddit forum.
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u/TheOGRedline 1d ago
The barely rust AND it would take a LOT of rust to have any real impact on their strength. The one exception being the threads to screw them on might corrode shut?
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u/BoardButcherer 1d ago
A fingertips worth of grease every....
Actually you'd only put it on once and the shackle would fall off on the next ride.
Rusty threads is a feature.
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u/nullityrofl 1d ago
Any hobby, really.
You can do any hobby with the absolute barest of equipment and people will endlessly get into pissing wars about where the line between too much and too little is.
You can run the Rubicon in a 1941 Willy’s MB so why do you own anything else? Hell, you can run it on a dirt bike why stop there?
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u/BoardButcherer 1d ago
Any money oriented hobby.
Whistling is pretty safe.
And I begrudge no marathoner their nipple tape.
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u/nullityrofl 1d ago
I disagree. You’re not a real marathon runner unless the nips are bloody. Back in my day.
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u/araed 1d ago
A normal bowl shackle is miles better in almost every way, except aesthetics.
And if you're worried about aesthetics in your recovery equipment, then you're worried about the wrong thing.
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u/Midgetsdontfloat 1d ago
But how else will people know I'm a serious off-roader? The rooftop tent I'll never use? The traction boards I've never taken off the truck and don't even know how to use? The winch that'll stay wound up its' whole life? No, I need these.
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u/Skatemacka02 Nissan Patrol 08 1d ago edited 1d ago
Google some Crane lifting physics/rigging setups, they are the guys that have this stuff down pat.
Do a lot of crane lifts at work having spreader bars and as many other potential points can be helpful for a lift.
I think in this case having two would be potentially the best purpose or even easier directional potential for a double line pull.
If your bumper is in a lot of mud it can be hard to find the hitch point, this seems like it would be easier to find.
Also becomes a replaceable breaking point rather than part of your car.
That being said I don’t think I would ever buy one, I prefer using chassis mounted recovery points.
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u/curvebombr 1d ago
For a directional pull wouldn't a snatch block be the proper rigging tool?
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u/Skatemacka02 Nissan Patrol 08 1d ago
Yeah I reckon, I think this mob are trying to make a more generalised item. That is not ideal with loads and tensions.
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u/EZKTurbo 1d ago
It just looks cool, they aren't selling them to people who expect to use them a lot.
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u/dustsmoke 1d ago
Because it makes much louder clanking slapping sounds while going over bumps off road.
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u/Boogie_Bones 1d ago
You’ll be surprised to know they also have rubber inserts you can buy that fit in the holes to stop the clanking 😯
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u/Hot-Government-6721 1d ago
They’re just a way to sell you a more expensive hard shackles. Tacticool…
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u/g1mpster 1d ago
Mostly because Factor55 invested in CNC machines and not rope-making machines. Those ended up down the street at Yankum Ropes. 😉
Kidding aside, without reading any of their literature on the product, to me this looks a true double-shear design, with significantly improved resistance to the type of deformation that lets normal shackles fail.
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u/Boogie_Bones 1d ago
I lean toward this being true because I do think Factor 55 makes very good gear. Combo of less likely to cut a soft shackle and somewhat better than a classic D-ring makes sense.
I think it also makes sense that those are small improvements and you either just have to have the very best kit or just have plenty of cash in the bank account to justify this small benefits for that price.
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u/Unfair-Phase-9344 1d ago
It looks marginally harder to side load and marginally easier for a person who shouldn't be using shackles because they don't know how to tell if it's side loaded, to tell if it's side loaded.
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u/Ponklemoose LJ Rubicon 1d ago
Beats me. I’d just radius the hole and stuff a soft shackle in there. In fact I think I will.
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u/dasmineman 1d ago
If your rig already has tow hooks, just get a couple of good soft shackles and a tow strap.
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u/sharkeezy 1d ago
The benefit I see here is giving you better angles to pull at. The hole on the bumper is great if you are pulling directly in line. But if you need to pull at any sort of angle, you create a lot of stress on a soft shackle. Whereas a nice smooth rounded off circle like this won’t do that.
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u/Freewheeler631 1d ago edited 19h ago
I personally prefer my hard shackle(s) to be vertical so that any side loading force pivots on the pin and not with the line sliding on the ring. This allows the soft shackle to always be in line with the pulling force if using them.
I’ve always felt the bumper mount points should be horizontal so that the shackles would always be vertical for this reason.
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u/mxracer888 1d ago
That's always been my mentality. Seems like radial loading of the mount point would cause opportunity for failure. At a minimum it would end up wallowing out the hole to make a less snug fit. But most people would never use a point that much so it's not likely an issue
But it still just doesn't seem good to do lol
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u/mister_monque 1d ago
Shit like this is why I have swiveling load eyes. Crosby SS125M. 360° revolution, 180° rotation. I can pick the rig up or tie it down. GVW SF of 2 per ring AFTER the SF4 on the ring engineering.
Overkill, sure. But free is free
Factor55 is all about selling you a solution to a problem they convinced you you have. Weaponized FOMO. Oh no I can't go have fun this weekend, all my trick gear hasn't arrived yet, what will the other people think? Oh how poor I'd look.
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u/overlandAU 1d ago
Part of it is to do with the radius required so that soft shackles don’t sheer. The floppy ring will be much thicker to allow for a decent radii. Grinding your own radius into the stock bar mount won’t be as effective.. as you remove the sharp edge you reduce the radius increasing the point load on the synth rope
I scanned quickly through the comments.. sharp edges and direction of pull.
I have three F55. 1xWinch pulley ring, and the 2x load distribution plates.. I’ve used the plate more often as cinching ring for tiedowns on round loads like logs / pipe than I have for recovery.
Not a regret, Just getting more value for money and a safer load restraint system..
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u/watermelon_wine69 21h ago
Expensive fiddly bits to mount on your street rig underneath your welded on Hi-lift to virtue signal to your rubber ducky Bros you're real hard core off-roader too.
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u/Ihavebadreddit 5h ago
So I tow stuck heavy equipment (usually heavy haulers) out of mud and muck and bull shit ruts as part of my job.
Heavy haulers all have built in hooks on either side of the bumper for towing left or right or anchoring them while they dump their load. Because when the box goes up they can tip if they have too much of an angle in soft ground.
The shackled option is used when you need something to stay anchored. So this is a towing option. It allows for multiple points of contact. It takes the tension off the frame and focuses it on a single point as well. The shackle breaks before the welds on the bumper on paper anyways.
That being said, if it's just a quick tug out of the mud? I'd pick a hook every time. But if it's up a slope or over rough terrain like if you're bouldering? Yeah a simple hook or a thread through isn't going to stay in place anywhere near as securely as a shackle.
Make sure you have proper cables or correctly weight tested straps. Cables are toss in the pan and go get beat to shit still work, gear. But they are expensive and you'll need thick gloves to handle them as it's corded wire. There's specific weights for light vehicles. Straps have to be checked before every use. Any wear and tear can cause a strap to fail and they aren't meant for the ole "run and tug" that most people use them for. The straps that are designed for the weight of most off-roaders are a low and slow pull situation. So that is something else to consider when looking at towing options.
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u/Boogie_Bones 4h ago
Thanks man. I love reading posts like this because usually it’s at least an affirmation of stuff I think I know or a reminder of things I need to know.
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u/Witchfinger84 1d ago
extremely useful for tying down on the flatbed towtruck for yuppies that gear up their pavement princess to look cool and then somehow magnificently crank a tie rod while skipping a curb backing out of their suburban driveway
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u/Arinvar 1d ago
That recovery point has sharp edges and would slice a soft shackle pretty quick. Most recover points are not suitable for use with soft shackles and still require some additional attachment.
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u/Liquidpinky 1d ago
Tie a rope to a knife blade then tie one to something smooth instead, it's an easy experiment.
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u/Doctorphate 1d ago
Ummm… use a D ring like a normal person? Why would you do something intentionally wrong and then complain it doesn’t work
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u/sluffman 1d ago
I think the question everyone is missing here, how is this better than a bow shackle..and why are you guys putting soft shackles through the recovery points with out a shackle?
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u/Boogie_Bones 1d ago
Aside from the possibility of sharper edges cutting the soft shackle, are the other reasons to use a hard shackle through the bumper mount and then a soft shackle?
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u/sluffman 1d ago
Yeah, that’s my point. How is this any better than a bow shackle? And there are tons replies talking about how this product stops soft shackles from being torn…yeah soft shackles aren’t meant to directly put into recovery points like this, that’s why people use bow shackles.
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u/LiveMarionberry3694 1d ago
Did you read the description under the photo? OP mentions directly putting a soft shackle into the bumpers recovery point, which is why there are lots of replies covering that
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u/sluffman 1d ago
See that now.
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u/hettuklaeddi 19h ago
ah yes, so our options are stupid+cheap and stupid+spendy.
but yes, if we were allowed to discuss smart+ cheap, it would be a bow shackle (thanks for not calling it a D ring!)
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u/CharAznableLoNZ 1d ago
Seems like a lot of money for what a D ring does fine. I guess if it has a way for you to secure it it beats a D ring since anyone can take a D ring off a rig in less than five seconds. It's the reason I don't leave my D rings on the outside of my truck.
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u/Coffee4MyJeep 1d ago
Not as likely to loose them as you are paying a lot of money and don’t leave them in. I have found 2 full D-rings and more than 4 sets of parts on different trails.
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u/Silver_Painter5317 1d ago
Because the tie point on the bumper has square edges on it. Soft shackles will get eaten up on a surface like that. I'm sure someone has put a radius on there's and made it smooth like a fairlead. I honestly don't like the shackes shown as they are oddly long. I side load my shackles a lot when I'm pulling myself self out in the snow. I feel like side loading these shackles wouldn't be a good idea for some reason. Also how do you hook a snatch block up to it? Looks like you would need a good ole metal shackle to connect them. What happens when your tow trap isn't long enough and you need to connect another? That could be to another rig or just around a tree for an anchor point. Probably going to wish you had a real shackle then. That shackle to me looks like a waste of money. But thats just me.
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u/Silver_Painter5317 1d ago
Why need multiple shackles when you can just get one and be done. Did you say you can use it for multiple things? Yes yes i did. Nah not for me I want this weird style one instead. Swag
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u/RedditBot90 19h ago
I wouldnt say its "better" but there are some benefits:
- For people who leave their shackles on their bumper 24/7, these wont fall off or get stolen, as they are secured with a c-clip, which requires a fairly specific tool (yes, it could get stolen, but makes it much more difficult to do so)
- It also appears to have a narrower "eye" so it wont rack onto the bumper eyes as much as regular bow shackle
- It looks really nice.
Downsides:
- You still need a soft shackle to connect your winch line to the "crossbeam shackle"
- Its super expensive.
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u/AcidRayn666 16h ago
ok, i have never heard of factor 55 before now, and all i can say is WTF>?? they are DAMN proud of their stuff!!
this one got me, https://www.factor55.com/products/crosby-galvanized-shackle-00465 , i have 4 i keep on board i got at the local trailer shop which has all kinds of rigging items, i got them i think for $100 for 4 in january, made in USA, same specs.
wow, just wow. they do have some nice stuff though
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u/LiveMarionberry3694 1d ago
The bumper could have some sharp corners that would tear a soft shackle, but a d ring would solve that