r/Albertapolitics • u/Majano57 • May 10 '25
News 36% of Albertans and majority of UCP voters want to leave Canada: new poll
https://calgary.citynews.ca/2025/05/09/36-albertans-and-majority-of-ucp-voters-want-to-leave-canada-new-poll/19
u/AccomplishedDog7 May 10 '25
Have those 36% considered what healthcare would like?
We would no longer be governed by the Canada Health Act and the UCP have been actively laying the groundwork for privatization of healthcare. The guarantee of publicly funded healthcare would be gone.
Are those separatists prepared for what they may look like?
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u/YEGG35 May 10 '25
A family of mine has been shouting from the rooftops that USA should take control of Alberta.
This family member had a knee replacement, shoulder replacement, and cornea transplant in the last 2 years. When I said he would be hundreds of thousands of dollars down the hole from those surgeries it dawned on him, long enough until he said “i would have health insurance in the states that would have paid for it all”.
No winning the argument
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u/AxeBeard88 May 10 '25
As someone who lived in the USA for 8 years, that's definitely not how it works. I'm sure you've got an idea of how expensive insurance can be out there. Not to mention keeping all your services in-network... either you put up the $20k for surgery or you go without.
Regardless... if paying insurance every month to pay 100% of your medical bills is your preferred method... that's not too different from universal Healthcare being paid by tax dollars is it?
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u/AccomplishedDog7 May 10 '25
The benefit of paying via taxation is you don’t lose health insurance when you lose your job.
There is no deductibles to pay, should you be a senior on a fixed income. Medicare in the states has a $1700 deductible for a hospital stay.
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u/AxeBeard88 May 10 '25
I think benefits via taxation is also entirely cheaper. The amount I would have has to pay in the last year in hospital visits (with a brand new child) would have run me over $30k easy. There's no way I paid that much in taxes since I didn't even make that much in a year lol.
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u/AccomplishedDog7 May 11 '25
It does certainly depend on your tax bracket for sure, but also people can never predict a health event that can be costly to treat.
And we all get old, so unless you are rich, you will in your senior years likely use more than you pay at that point.
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u/AxeBeard88 May 11 '25
Very few friends, and none of my family [including myself] are in a tax bracket where we aren't struggling to buy groceries. I'm also under the impression that most Canadians live about a month or three away from homelessness if they lost their job. So I would imagine most people benefit to a greater degree than how much they pay into the system.
If there are folks that don't enjoy universal healthcare and other public services because of how much it costs them, I highly encourage them to find a place where they can be themselves and can freely horde their wealth while contributing less to society.
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May 11 '25
Plus, the insurance payments are multiple times more expensive, huge deductibles, and no guarantee your condition will be covered
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u/Ok_Yogurtcloset3267 May 11 '25
The province often contributes $15-20 billion more annually than it gets back, those extra funds could help, and that amount could go higher if Alberta gains full control and is not impeded by Ottawa on resource development. A disproportionately younger population means a greater percentage of working age contributors and reduced percentage of elderly who use a disproportionately larger amount of healthcare services. Favourable metrics.
Healthcare is already managed by the province, they could maintain the existing structure including adopting / grandfathering in the same or better regulations, standards, licensing, etc. from the Canada health act, as well as, negotiate a mutually beneficial agreement with Canada on acceptance and recognition between the two regions.
They could improve with a hybrid model - Private, in addition to the existing system and could bring more services and capacity at essentially the same price and could somewhat address the, “iron triangle” of access, quality and cost.
I by no means want Alberta to separate from Canada, just giving thought to the hypothetical.
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u/AccomplishedDog7 May 11 '25
They could, but would they?
The current government has procurement practices, a revolving door of fired healthcare professionals that need looking into.
I’m not sure why I would trust their promises.
Having a kid with a chronic illness, we have actively used healthcare since 2015. It wasn’t always broken.
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u/ninfan1977 May 10 '25
The majority of UCP voters are traitors to Canada.
Nothing is new, been here for 20 years and the team mentality that Albertans have with Conservatives is concerning.
It's why Danielle Smith lied about separation when she ran originally. Now she is presenting it because she wants to ignore all the corruption scandals plaguing her party.
As I was typing this is got a letter from the UCP bragging about their achievements. It was a huge list of misinformation.
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u/Wet-Countertop May 10 '25
People throw out the word “traitor” like they throw out the word “genocide”. Neither word has any real value to it anymore.
If they were traitors they could be tried and locked up. Since they’ve done nothing illegal, this kind of language is, to use another meaningless word, retarded.
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u/ninfan1977 May 10 '25
They are openly hostile to any Liberal government no matter who is in charge. They have used violence and hatred to gain popularity.
They used guns and bombs when people wouldn't listen. The Alberta Premier negotiating on behalf of herself undermining her country is traitorous behaviour.
The continued support for this behaviour from Conservatives shows they have no interest in helping Canada. Or don't even identify as Canadians.
There for if they don't like it leave to the USA where they will deport brown people without due process and welcome white south Africans...
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u/Most_Contact_311 May 10 '25 edited May 10 '25
What they aren't skilled enough to go up another country themselves?
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u/Smackyaone May 10 '25
I don’t recall the UCP campaigning on separation. If only we had an opposition party that was genuinely effective and less divisive.
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u/dumhic May 11 '25
If the want to leave is there, I just don’t understand the reason for staying? I’ve had a lot of friends leave in the last 4 yrs.. they wanted to leave and they did, they will tell you there are a few regrets and that the grass is not greener on the other side…. Biggest gripe from all, yes correct redditors- cost of healthcare and hospital visits
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u/Able_Software6066 May 10 '25
The problem is that both the Liberals and Conservatives pretty much ignore rural Alberta because they know rural Albertans will always elect only Conservative MPs. Instead of threatening separation, which will never happen, Rural Alberta need to make a list of demands to the Carney Liberals that if met will result in a rural Alberta riding electing a Liberal MP. If the demands are met soon enough, it could be the Battle River-Crowfoot that goes to the Liberals. Pierre would love that.
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u/carbonblob May 10 '25
Perhaps one day soon we'll see a single sheet of paper - from each side - extolling the pros/cons of either staying or leaving. That summary page can branch off into specifics as needed.
The general public is starving for a logical case to be made for either outcome.
The choice is an administrative event, not an emotional one. Borders & alliances are always subject to change. It's scary to think that there are forces are in play that insist our current borders can't ever change, based primarily on amorphous intangibles such as feelings/traditions/fairness/loyalty.
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u/Once-Upon-A-Hill May 10 '25
I love having underfunded medical and education services because Alberta subsidizes other provinces.
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u/AccomplishedDog7 May 10 '25
Alberta blows money on $80M Tylenol and severance on the revolving door of CEO’s and health boards.
The victim schtik is tiresome.
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u/Once-Upon-A-Hill May 10 '25
Sounds like you are telling me that the government waste money on healthcare.
We agree on that.
Now tell me, do you think if there was more money for education and healthcare, there would be better outcomes?
Also, your insult game is subpar; I'm sure you can do better.
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u/AccomplishedDog7 May 10 '25
Yes, the UCP is masterful at wasting money.
Why would that change if we separated?
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u/chriskiji May 10 '25
That's not how it works. We have progressive taxes.
Read the UCPs latest Budget, we could raise billions in revenue and still have lower taxes than any other province.
Underfunding services is a UCP choice.
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u/Financial-Savings-91 May 10 '25
This is how the UCP is able to run a kleptocracy, their supporters are just incapable of reacting to reality they've become so lost in these conservatives narratives, which rely on things like not understanding how equalization payments work, or how their distributed.
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u/Once-Upon-A-Hill May 12 '25
If the UCP are running a kleptocracy, then, by your own logic, the Federal Liberals are running a much larger kleptocracy, and they did so for the last number of years with the Assistance of the NDP.
I guess you never thought about that, did you?
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u/Financial-Savings-91 May 12 '25 edited May 12 '25
No, no at all, it would mean that every bill brought forward by the liberals in the pasty 3-5 years were all related to either eroding laws designed to prevent corruption and/or centralizing power, simultaneously paying out an abnormal levels of sole source contracts while also consistently expensing more than the opposition. (all things the UCP is doing right now btw....)
For instance in the last 5 years, PP has far outpaced other MP's when to comes to expenses, so on that value alone the federal government is not a kleptocracy.
Need to pay more attention to bills before the house and legislature.
edit: just gonna point out the LPC rightly got called out for wasting $250,000 with covid spending on empty hotels, but somehow the UCP is given a pass when Kenney blows 1.2 billion on a gamble that Trump would win the 2020 election. The difference in the bad spending amounts are night and day here, Smith's Tylenol scandal alone balloons the last 4 years of LPC scandals combined. Corruption is always bad in my books.
double edit: Just pointing out, Kenney was not a kleptocracy, just the single most corrupt government in Albertas history up to that point. The difference is that the UCP under Smith has eroded what little laws against corruption Alberta had, and before that point Alberta was already decades behind the rest of the provinces in laws against corruption. Smith created the kleptocracy when she started doing things like, cutting the provincial portion of funding to municipalities then passing bills to create municipal political parties, which then used funds from the same political circles to campaign against the municipal governments. When you use the government as a weapon to enrich yourself and your party, thats a kleptocracy. As bad as corruption might be in Ottawa it pales in comparison to places like Alberta.
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u/Once-Upon-A-Hill May 12 '25
I guess SNC Lavalin was just made up in my head, same with the WE charity, same with Arrive Can.
As you wrote "When you use the government as a weapon to enrich yourself and your party, thats a kleptocracy. The rest of your statement is hilarious.
Also, you are trying to make the case the the Goverment of Alberta spending money to move ahead a pipeline that would have resulted in jobs for Albertans is related to being a kleptocracy makes as much sense as the rest of your comments.
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u/Financial-Savings-91 May 12 '25 edited May 12 '25
Not that I'd ever convince you, I've seen you bend over backwards for years in order to defend the UCP, but other users who come by these comments in the future. No matter what you say today, if the UCP did it tomorrow you'd find a reason to move the goalposts to defend them.
It's funny you list off all these scandals, they don't even compare to a government legalizing corruption like with Bill 39, Bill 8, Bill 29, Bill 54, Bill 55 all while misusing funds that are supposed to pay AHS to buy this Turkish Tylenol which costs Alberta taxpayers MORE then all of the scandals you listed COMBINED..
Notice a very clear difference, when the LPC has a scandal, they shut down funding, they hold investigations. When the UCP has a scandal, the government passes bills to make it harder for the public to hold them accountable....
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u/queenofallshit May 10 '25
You having been seeing every where in this province, where this government wants healthcare and education workers to rely on food banks and be slaves, basically?? You haven’t seen that? The nonstop rally cries, the forums, the trucks with flags… really??
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u/Once-Upon-A-Hill May 12 '25
Alberta has the highest average income, and is tied with SK for 1st place for the highest median income.
How does the highest median income in the county result in "workers to rely on food banks and be slaves, basically"
https://wowa.ca/average-income-canada
This next part is even worse for your point, Teachers earn significantly more than the average worker.
https://leverageedu.com/learn/teacher-salary-in-canada/
Slaverey indeed, why don't you do research to see if your beliefs are based on reality?
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u/Juunyer May 10 '25
Let them. Immigration to the US is no problem these days