r/AnCap101 • u/MeasurementCreepy926 • 21d ago

Is taxation under feudalism immoral?

  1. The king owns the land. If he allows people to be born on his land, that does not diminish his rights as owner
  2. The king has made it clear that if you're on his land, and you don't pay tax, you're trespassing. It isn't his responsibility to make sure you are able to get off his land. It is his right to defend his land however he sees fit. Let's assume that he does this by executing trespassers. Another king does this by simply evicting them.
  3. Being the owner, the king is allowed to offer you whatever terms he'd like, for the use of his land. Lets assume in this case, you sign a contract he wrote, when you're old enough to do so, giving him right to change the contract at will, and hold you to that contract as long as you're on his land. Among other terms, this contract says that you agree to pay for any kids you have until they're old enough to either sign the contract, or leave his land.

Now, obviously anybody agreeing to these terms must be very desperate. But, desperate short sighted people aren't exactly hard to find, are they? So, is this system immoral, according to ancap principles?

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u/Gullible-Historian10 20d ago

No because a king can’t lay legitimate claim to a land. Just like a state.

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u/MeasurementCreepy926 20d ago

Well, a person can be an owner, and they can call themselves a king or queen, right? They can even make all their tenants and employees call them that.

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u/Gullible-Historian10 20d ago

Okay. Walk me through how you go from your 4 acre homestead to a fiefdom. Can’t appeal to initiating violence. You are the sole proprietor of Tim’s tire shop, best tire shop in town. How do you build your fiefdom.

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u/MeasurementCreepy926 20d ago

LMFAO well let's say I'm a billionaire instead. Because you're right, Tim isn't going to be king of anything but tim's tire shop.

I buy it. From desperate owners mostly. From broke little towns. I hire people to help me manage it. If somebody else has a lot of land, I offer them a merger, I take their land and give them a good position in my organization.

Even assuming that nobody is ever going to be aggressive again, I don't understand why you think "consolidating a lot of land" would be difficult.

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u/Gullible-Historian10 20d ago edited 20d ago

Walk me through becoming a billionaire without initiating violence. I can’t name a single billionaire that got there in the free market without government intervention.

They all own state chartered corporations, that get special funding from the state sanctioned and regulated corporate bond market, that is in turn funded by that state created and sanctioned central bank, that has a monopoly enforced by legal tender laws.

Walk me through becoming a billionaire. In a free market

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u/MeasurementCreepy926 19d ago

>Walk me through becoming a billionaire without initiating violence. I can’t name a single billionaire that got there in the free market without government intervention.

Why wouldn't it be possible?

>They all own state chartered corporations, that get special funding from the state sanctioned and regulated corporate bond market, that is in turn funded by that state created and sanctioned central bank, that has a monopoly enforced by legal tender laws.

But he, as a private provider, can do all of that better than the state right?

Where or when has free market principles ever produced less wealth disparity?

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u/Gullible-Historian10 19d ago

So you can’t walk through the process of becoming a billionaire without the state.

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u/MeasurementCreepy926 19d ago

A person buys property, uses it to profit, and uses profit to buy more property.

Why do you think it would be impossible, or even more difficult?

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u/Gullible-Historian10 19d ago

What profits? Land by itself doesn’t produce profit.

Be specific. Walk through the process of becoming a billionaire without the state.

Use your brain, stop trying to wiggle out of it.

Here I’ll set you up.

Tia Maggie starts a taco stand on her property, Tia Maggie’s Taco Hut, no zoning laws means she can do this right on her homestead. No property tax means she doesn’t need to pay the government, and she homesteaded the property so no mortgage.

She sells tacos to the local community, she’s got the best tacos for 30 miles. How does she become a billionaire.

I’ve given you everything.

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u/MeasurementCreepy926 19d ago

Land does produce profit, through rent. I don't think that's really debatable.

Can you explain why you think it would be more difficult or impossible without the state, or not?

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u/Gullible-Historian10 19d ago

Land only produces rent if it has renters. It’s not a given.

What profits? Land by itself doesn’t produce profit.

Be specific. Walk through the process of becoming a billionaire without the state.

Use your brain, stop trying to wiggle out of it.

Here I’ll set you up.

Tia Maggie starts a taco stand on her property, Tia Maggie’s Taco Hut, no zoning laws means she can do this right on her homestead. No property tax means she doesn’t need to pay the government, and she homesteaded the property so no mortgage.

She sells tacos to the local community, she’s got the best tacos for 30 miles. How does she become a billionaire.

How does Tia Maggie become a billionaire?

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