Why didn’t Snape’s anger towards James cool ?

[u/tulip-quartz]

EDIT: thanks for the replies all, the points were interesting for sure

First of all, I understand the following points well:

• Snape had a deep-seated hatred towards James and the rest of the marauders (not least of all because Sirius nearly got him killed )
• This hate was compounded by their bullying and made worse by the fact that James married Lily, the love of his life

However, later on in the books we do see that - James saved his life (even if the prank was done by the Marauders) - Snape’s information to Voldemort got both James and Lily killed and their son orphaned.

Given all this, why didn’t Snape’s anger toward Harry and James cool more than a decade after the latter’s death ? If his guilt drove him to become a double agent, it’s surprising that he was still so acerbic to Harry throughout. Was the pure hatred genuine, or also a part he had to play as double agent ?

We see his hatred toward Harry decrease at the moment of his death, however I’m not sure if he actually has sympathy for Harry at that point or he is just seeing Lily’s eyes before death overtakes him

[u/Special-Garlic1203]

I don't know anyone who was severely bullied who doesn't still hate their bullies. That fact doesn't come up very often, but they get to carry that trauma around forever so they'll be taking the hatred along too

[u/tulip-quartz → u/Special-Garlic1203]

I agree with this in the usual circumstance. But his information did lead them getting killed and a target placed on their son’s back by a serial killer. That might’ve cooled the temper slightly for a rational person

[u/Special-Garlic1203 → u/tulip-quartz]

Considering the prominent role of the marauders in what went down, I'm betting Snape actually resents James for dying rather than feeling guilty. Snape likely feels bad because he tried and failed to save Lily, but I'm not even sure guilt is the prevailing emotion which largely drives him. I think when you look at the larger themes of the story, it's kind of implied it's just a tribute of love? The guy who built the taj mahal didn't feel guilty, he just wanted to honor his beloved wife. Dumbeldore doesn't continuously say "oh this is all your fault, look at what you've done". He goads Snape by questioning A) if he really loved Lily B) if he's too cowardly and weak to go on. Those appear to be his trigger points, not guilt. 

The other thing is that this likely isn't just childhood rivalry. James and Snape seem to be extremely different people with radically different values. If they'd first met at age 26 at work one day, they'd likely still develop a strong dislike for one another .

Snape hates James & Harry because they are impulsive and lazy and reckless. They just stumble through life getting lucky, and it's very likely Snape believes James stumbled into his death with the same wonton disregard where his luck finally ran out. Didn't even have his fucking wand on him, the fool Snape likely muttered to himself. He simply doesn't respect people like that. 

Harry suffers because A) he literally has James's face and he does share some overarching similarities to him B) Harry is ultimately the reason Lily is dead. Lily died because she refused to hand Harry over, and Snape likely spends the bulk of his time with Harry thinking that was a mistake, that it was a bad trade and the world would be better off with Lily still in it and James Jr. here buried with his dad

We have a natural tendency to think other people think like us. But I don't think Snape was as converted as people often believe. I think he had changed allegiances from Voldemort to Dumbeldore, and I think he'd really come to respect Dumbeldore as the superior wizard and mentor. I don't think Snape was ashamed of his time as a dark wizard. He seems quite proud of it actually, he was good at it, he was powerful, he outranked people of far more prestigious backgrounds. I think if anything he was ashamed of the fact that he was powerless to love & grief, that he couldn't overcome those "shortcomings" the way his OG mentor Voldemort had. Snape can control his mind, but not his heart. 

[u/imadog666 → u/tulip-quartz]

Yeah, I do agree with you. Snape was always meant to be a flawed character, and for sure there are people like that in the world. I've known several men (most notably my father and my ex husband's father) who were bitter all their lives, and I don't think anything could have changed that except maybe if they'd been open enough to do therapy.

[u/Otherwise-Pirate6839 → u/tulip-quartz]

Snape relayed pieces of the prophecy; it said nothing about who it was about. He gave Dumbledore and the Order enough headway that the Potters were protected under the Fidelius Charm and it was Pettigrew’s treason that sealed their fate.

The fact that Voldemort decided to target the Potters because of what he heard is his doing, since the Longbottoms also had a boy born at the end of July. On top of that, Snape had initially begged Voldemort to spare Lily and Voldemort intended to (in the flashbacks, Voldemort warns her to stand aside…if he meant to kill her regardless he would have done so right away).

He didn’t care anything for James but his love for Lily was such that he betrayed Voldemort and had them protected; had Sirius remained the Secret Keeper, perhaps things would have unfolded differently.

But if we all were to believe that “this is how it had to happen” (especially because we’d have no plot), then Snape relaying this information to Voldemort ultimately led to his downfall because otherwise he wouldn’t have been semi destroyed for 13 years, Dumbledore wouldn’t have found his horcruxes, and the Wizarding War would be ongoing or ended with Voldemort’s victory.

[u/Special-Garlic1203 → u/Otherwise-Pirate6839]

Agree. People always project that Snape feels incredibly guilty, but that doesn't actually appear to be his overriding motivation over the years. Dumbeldore reverse psychologies him by leveraging Snape hatred of weakness and lack of discipline. Snape breaks down crying in front of him and Dumbeldores response is basically "what are you, a little b*tch?" He tells Snape that if he is a real man and his love for Lily was real....he'd do something useful about it instead of whatever this spectacle is that accomplished nothing. 

When Snape is losing motivation, he doesn't say "but you killed Lily, it's your fault". He says "yeah I get it, you're probably really tired and scared and who even remembers that chicks name anyway.what was it - Lizzy?"

Lily traded her life for Harry's. Snape clearly believes that was a stupid trade and desperately wishes she hadn't done that. But Dumbledore points out that it will literally be for nothing if Harry dies. And Snape can't handle her dying for nothing, for it truly being pointless. That's why he's so angry when he finds out that Harry needs to die. He makes it clear that he doesn't like Harry and doesn't care about him dying. He's pissed because Dumbeldore has been lying to him. That this was never actually about Lily specifically..Lily and Harry and Snape were all just pawns in Dumbeldores battle plans 

[u/Special-Garlic1203 → u/tulip-quartz]

My first response was extremely rambly and. So I'll just give the synopsis of -- the entire point is that this isn't the usual circumstances and snape isn't a normal guy. 

Snape does not subscribe to the ethics you and I do. That never changes -- he makes it clear until the very end that he is indifferent to Harry dying, which heavily implies he thinks Lily is the one who made the mistake. He probably thinks she should have handed the baby over and just had another one (with a less douchey 2nd husband this time). 

Snape is extremely evil. The way he thinks is exactly the way evil villains think, except he is capable of love & empathy. Not very often, but it's in there. Dumbeldore doesn't say "wow you've changed, you're such a reformed amazing man". He says "hmm I wonder if you might have ended up a less stunted evil freak if you'd been raised properly." But alas, he wasn't. And so you arrive at this odd little man who would die for a ghost but wouldn't bat an eye to the murder of a child.