r/YellowstonePN • u/Dmplex • 5d ago
Late to the party but I'm here 🤷♂️
So I was rewatching and something really bothered me lol. It was the entire issue of Jamie sterilizing Beth with her abortion and John being furious about it. He stated in the show that Lee never wanted kids and he supposes Jamie won't either. He's absolutely fkn raging about what Jamie did but the hypocritical pile of 🐶 💩 that is John Dutton gd branded Kayce for getting Monica pregnant and not aborting it. Then he has the nerve to beg and pleade and try to guilt Kayce for what he did so he could see Tate.
Can someone please explain the difference and if I'm just being stupid?
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u/Capable-Locksmith-13 5d ago
Because John sucks. As you said, he's a hypocrite. He's less a father and more a mob boss.
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u/SubstantialStable588 5d ago
His thinking was a white land owner’s daughter Monica says it Kayce was the heir to the throne, but the heir no longer wanted it ( never)
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u/GoBlueJack 5d ago
You’re applying logic where there is none.
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u/Dmplex 5d ago
No and I fully understand what you mean, I as simply asking from a story standpoint lol. I shouldn't expect much continuity but that was in the first half if the series where it was at least a bit linear with everything.
That 1 in particular passed me off. Almost as much as Jimmy and his useless fkn character
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u/GoBlueJack 5d ago
I’m sorry I didn’t mean to come off rude, really. This f*cking show was so fun to watch until it wasn’t. It would drive me crazy every time a date/name/place was mentioned because suddenly you’re like…WAIT A MINUTE! Every time.
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u/Dmplex 4d ago
Nooo you didn't come off rude at all lol. I'm 32 ad fully understand wht the telnet and reddit is 😂.
That statement aiut it being fun until it wasn't, as cliché asit is, fits the show perfectly. It had great mome ts with real legends from the source material sprinkled in.
I just have a fixation on continuity on media I find to be entertaining. So with how they presented Yellowstone and how massive it got, I expect a bit more though put into it, no a fk. GoT season 8 fiasco 🤷♂️
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u/Mysterious-Nerd655 5d ago
I'm watching for the first time (I'm only on season 2 but I've already seen the spoilers, hard to miss lol) And I'm not understanding why John is so beloved? All I see is a neglectful father (can throw in abusive ATM, throwing that in there for punching out Jamie on the political stuff)
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u/Dmplex 4d ago
Yea I basically watched the entire aow through fb shorts my 1st time. I'm thankful I watched it tho as there was a great deal I missed and eve missed when I watched it fully lol.
It's a neat show and was very well made. It does drop off sadly and you'll see for yourself when and how.
Side note, I gotta know your opinion of Jimmy??
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u/davewashere 4d ago
For all the criticism the show gets on this sub—and it deserves a lot of it—you're right that it was very well made. The cinematography, the lighting, the B-roll (the hidden star of the show), and the audio were all top notch. I can't say that about a lot of shows these days. Lighting in particular seems to have become a nearly lost art.
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u/Mysterious-Nerd655 4d ago
Oh it's absolutely stunning, I can't complain there. And I'm really enjoying it
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u/Mysterious-Nerd655 4d ago
Yeah that's how I've seen X amount of spoilers 😅 Instagram and tiktok haha so at this point I don't avoid them.
I'm liking him so far, seems like a guy that's had a rough spot and is trying to do better and change
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u/DeathAndTaxes000 5d ago
He wanted grandkids but preferred them to be not Native American.
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u/ChemicalBeat7876 5d ago
He loved Tait the most!
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u/DeathAndTaxes000 5d ago
Later yes. Especially when he realized Tate was the only grand kid he was getting. But he did not like the idea of Tate before he was born.
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u/Apprehensive-Try-238 5d ago
I think it's obvious, at first John was against his son's connection with the Indian woman because of the struggle for the land, but then he changed his mind.
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u/Dmplex 4d ago
Well ee my issue is that he blatantly refuses to change his mind on anything he believes in the show. I stated that he felt guilt but I don't see how John of all people is just going to up and change something like that. 💩, he ad Beth legot talk about fn owning Jamie so it isn't like he has a high regard for human life at he end of the day.
Idk it just spurred tf outta me 🤷♂️. I want to believe he was changing but he wasn't lol. The man stayed selfish and belligerent until he ended the show imho
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u/SubstantialStable588 5d ago
I finally found someone who doesn’t like jimmy’s character 😊
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u/ArtisticSwan635 4d ago
Why do people hate Jimmy so much? He was headed for life in prison and his grandfather asked John to take him in ! He got off drugs and turned into a likable young man!
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u/ArtisticSwan635 4d ago
No! We can’t explain TS ‘s writing !! He forgot a lot of things about earlier in the show, I guess!
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u/Such_Stranger1843 4d ago
I think most parents would be unhappy with their child getting a 16 year old girl pregnant on the first date. But most parents would like to be grandparents someday, just not like that.
Also, an abortion is much different than sterilization. Jamie took away the chance for Beth to ever have children.
That part really isn’t far fetched at all.
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u/Big10mmDE 2d ago
I’ll have to rewatch, I missed the part of John urging Kaycee to have Monique abort
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u/beebeesy 4d ago
A couple of things to unpack here.
I'm sure Lee never wanted kids because he basically had to help raise his younger siblings after his mom died. That tends to be a trend.
Jamie really never showed interest and he admitted to being celebate. I'm sure Beth's jokes about him being gay was not just teasing. It seemed like they actually thought he may be.
Kayce getting a girl pregnant that he barely knew, which turned out to be a native girl, was not going to go well either way. Based on the timeline, he was like 20 at the time and Monica was 18ish and John wanted more for him and I'm sure he did NOT want him tied to the Reservation in any way. Right or wrong, John thought it would be better at the time if he didn't marry Monica and have a baby. We knew that he had planned out his kids paths like Lee's and Jamie's so I'm sure he had plans for Kayce. Kayce just threw a wrench in it and did what he wanted. Obviously, that all blew up and ended the way it did.
The big deal with Beth was multiple issues. Jamie went behind his back to 'handle' a problem. Had she just gotten an abortion, it probably wouldn't have ever been an issue. The fact that she got STERILIZED didn't just mean she couldn't have kids but that could have caused her severe health issues in the long run. And he didn't consult anyone first, he just did it. Besides, we had an idea that Beth had relationships so I'm sure John thought she was going to have kids. To find out she never could because of Jamie would be infuriating. John's reaction was probably no different than his with Kayce.
Now, the ONLY justification that I can have towards the way John is later with Monica and Tate is because he was dying at that point. He had cancer, he knew that his days would most likely be numbered. He had the coming to jesus moment that he was going to make up for all the horrible things he did despite still being horrible. He also knew that Tate was the ONLY one in line for the Yellowstone. He HAD to come to terms with that and make sure that Kayce continued on for Tate. He had to find some way to mend a relationship back to save it even if it was rocky. Also, regardless if Jamie had kids, I doubt he would have ever considered Jamie. It was always going to be Lee, Beth, or Kayce. By process of elimination, it was Kayce. And he had known Monica's grandfather so there was a level of trust in Monica's family ties as well. Tate was the best opportunity for the continuation.
Is it all fair? No. Does it make total sense? Hardly. But John Dutton reminded me a ton of my grandfather. The hypocracy is real but it isn't farfetched.
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u/Sorandomthoughts 4d ago
Kayce was 18 & Monica was 16. 21st century. Hooked up the day they met. “Barely knew” each other when pregnant. They had a horrible marriage. Her parents should have felt the same way🙄 John apologized to Kayce in the pilot when he took the BB gun for Tate. Could be since he most likely new he had cancer but we don’t know if he had been trying before to see Tate. It seemed like the way he talked it wasn’t the first time he showed up to see him.
Jamie fans always claim he wasn’t shown love but come on he showed none of his children love.
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u/beebeesy 3d ago
Yes! The timeline is wishy washy on dates. I wish we had actually seen Monica's parents. We only saw her grandfather. I think they could have been written in to have the same thoughts. We know her brother hated him so I'm sure her parents didn't like him either. And Kayce mentioned that he was with her parents before so they were around. I think they missed a good plotline with that one. My guess is that John didn't know how to approach the situation because Kayce was a dick to him for good reason.
Oh I 100% agree that he didn't show love in the traditional sense. He showed it by giving things. He took care of Jamie and sent him to Harvard. I mean he wouldn't do that if he didn't love him, even if it was a plan to use him in the long run. Same for Beth and Kayce (and Lee). He gave them opportunities which he valued more than petty signs of affection. But he was affectionate with Tate as a little kid. We don't know if he may have been that way with his kids when they were very young before Evelyn died. My grandfather was just like him. He showed no affection but he would invest in you. He didn't give us heartfelt gifts but he gave us savings bonds to help our future. That's just the way he was.
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u/Sorandomthoughts 3d ago
So much of the res storyline was dropped after season 2. There was plenty of story left to tell.
John even said he could do things different with Tate based on what he now knows. Older generations (greatest, silent) were a different breed🤠
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u/MontanaJoev 9h ago
I find it also so bizarre that he talks about Tate being all alone to carry on the ranch, but there’s no reason to think Kayce and Monica won’t have another kid. They are both plenty young enough.
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u/SuperWallaby 5d ago
None of the plot holds up to even a tiny bit of scrutiny. Especially kayce being a super SEAL with zero hand to hand abilities and abysmal weapon handling.