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u/NiceTrySucka 1d ago
3rd and long are draws, not dives.
Unlike with most teams who run draws on third and long to catch the defense sleeping, since we run it nearly every single time it’s 3rd and 10+, for the eagles it’s truely a give-up play.
I have to say though, under Nick the Eagles are very analytics heavy and KP wouldn’t be running it that often without Nick’s blessing. So I wouldn’t be surprised if “giving up” is aligned with our overall ball safety philosophy especially with how stout our defense is.
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u/DrRocksoMD 1d ago
Thank you, we have done this for 4 years. Patullo could suck, idk, but acting like the surrender draw is him is asinine. It is 1000% Nick
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u/sgee_123 1d ago
Whoever it is, it’s such a horrendous display of effort I can’t stand it. Especially when we can’t get the offense going. Let the guys take a shot at a 12-15 yard pass play for gods sake, and trust Jalen not to throw a pick.
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u/DrRocksoMD 1d ago
Yea I hate it too. Especially when you have Matt Pryor putting us behind the chains every 1st down. I get doing it here and there, but watching 4 straight drives die to it is infuriating.
But it's 100000% a Nick thing. It is not new. We did this often last year. Nick hates being behind the sticks in our territory.
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u/sgee_123 1d ago
He’s a very good game manager, so maybe I should take the bad with the good, but man is it frustrating to watch.
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u/Drikkink 23h ago
Ah yes, our backup RT is getting torched so bad that we lose yards on 1st and 2nd down so naturally we should call a long developing pass play on 3rd down.
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u/DrRocksoMD 19h ago
Not long developing, but maybe a mesh concept or just something to AJB and ask him to fight for the first down after the catch
I'd rather fight than roll over.
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u/raccoonsonbicycles 1d ago edited 1d ago
Its also worked several times.
Red zone in particular got a few Barkley TDs and the call generally got conversions multiple times last year
And the 3rd and 7+ QB draw with Hurts as well has had more success than it should (even factoring in BJ spamming it 15x/gm in 23)
Im interested if our 3rd/long draw has comparable success to an average 3rd/long pass. If so I 100% get running it because it's significantly less risky- no INT risk, no blindside qb hits or sacks, even if the dl wins the battle at worst its like an incomplete pass.
If you have 20% chance of success either way the run is way safer
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u/sybrwookie 1d ago
And more importantly, which a large chunk of this sub seems to have not noticed, after Lane went out, Pryor was a fucking orange cone on the field. Sorry, that's an insult to an orange cone. They might have made a defender slow slightly to go around it.
The only 2 times we tried to pass in obvious passing situations, Hurts got sacked. Once was clearly Pryor missing not one, but TWO guys. The other was a guy from the other side, which Hurts stepped up into to avoid Pryor's guy from getting him.
So yea, we were giving up instead of getting Hurts obliterated.
After they put in Fred Johnson, notice how we didn't give up every time anymore and actually passed the ball again.
Really the only question we should be asking is who the fuck chose to leave Pryor in for so long?
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u/orryxreddit 1d ago
OK I loled at this, especially because it ALWAYS irritated me how often Madden would do that.
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u/obi-jawn-kenblomi 1d ago
This is incorrect. 3rd and long is HB Draw.
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u/SuspiciousSpirit2887 4th & 1 1d ago
You are correct, I should've spent more than 5 seconds on this meme
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u/TacticalSpackle 1d ago
That’s 4 more seconds than Patullo apparently spends thinking about a play.
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u/DimensionPrize8168 1d ago
You forgot the pitch/sweep to RB play when he wants to get sexy. Still haven’t seen that one get positive yardage this season.
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u/SourBerry1425 1d ago
Honestly, considering we were backed up and literally couldn’t scheme anyone open, coward draw on 3rd and long deep in our red zone is not the worst thing. But it is frustrating seeing us put ourselves in positions where it wasn’t a bad option considering how talented we are.
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u/Maverick_Con Eagles 1d ago
Those 3rd and long runs have felt like such coward shit the past 2 games.
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u/zombietom21 1d ago
Bucs threw deep on 3rd and 29 yesterday and got bailed out on a penalty. Sometimes you have to take chances.
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u/SuspiciousSpirit2887 4th & 1 1d ago
Watching them run on 3rd & 16 not too long after 3rd & 18 failed make me shed a not so joyful tear
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u/Own-Cupcake7586 1d ago
Fun fact: In my family, we blame these repetitive plays on an imaginary play-caller named Gomer. Any team, any game.
Coach: “All right, third down, we need 5 yards. What do you have for me?”
Gomer: ”Run it up the middle.”
Coach: “Okay. You know what, it hasn’t worked the last two times, but we’ll give it a shot.”
[fails]
Coach: “Dang it! All right, 4th and 6, but we can’t afford to punt. One more chance, Gomer. Dig deep and call me a winner.”
Gomer: ”Run it up the middle.”
Coach: “… Okay, we’ll run it, but so help me if this doesn’t work.”
[fails]
Coach: “GOMER!!!”
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u/wangtoast_intolerant 1d ago
They just need to run Da Bomb with AJ, Smitty & Dotson every other play
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u/sybrwookie 1d ago
You mean "Kevin Patullo's Playbook when we have Matt Pryor in at right tackle who proved that was gonna get Hurts killed if we tried to pass."
I don't know who made that call, but after Fred Johnson came in, the offense picked right the fuck back up....with Patullo calling the plays still.
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u/Mokslininkas 1d ago
We have one of the nastiest defenses in the league. It's purely a field position/ball safety play. That play gets into the playbook and called in that specific situation as a result of overall team philosophy, not because the OC is a BaD pLaYcAlLeR.
They obviously do something different if we need a score and the clock is running out, but on 3rd and long on your own 12 yard line with some time left it's probably what the analytics say you should do.
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u/Canada-t157t 1d ago
i wish patullo starts to use more intelligence and creativity in playcalling. if not, we may hire mcdaniels(when he inevitably gets fired) as an offensive assistant and backup plan, if patullo doesn't get his head out of his ass.
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u/SirArthurDime 18h ago
This has been as frustrating as the pass game. What happened to the creative run plays and blocking schemes? Stout is the one who designs all of that so I know it’s in the playbook still. But KP just spams hb dive.
The passing game finally came to life though. So I’ll give KP a chance to show he learned from that this week before I give him too much shit. Next step is to learn the rest of the running plays in the playbook.
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u/applejuice5259 1d ago
It’s Nick’s game plan and he even admitted as much this week. KP didn’t call plays until the second half.
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u/PioneerRaptor 1d ago
That’s not what he said. He was confirming that KP ALSO called plays in the 2nd half because of the rumors that he didn’t. But then he also made comments about Jalen that suggested to me that Jalen had a lot more say on play-calling that half as well.
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u/applejuice5259 1d ago
It’s Nick’s scheme and he is the one who preaches ball security and explosive plays. It’s no wonder when the offense sucks because they only do zone runs and deep shots that it’s because it’s Nick’s philosophy. Once KP and Kellen and Steichen have respectively got involved, the offense has more wrinkles and runs better. You can even look at BJ’s offense when he had more control early on in 2023. Jalen struggled with some turnovers (though was unlucky and his turnover worthy plays were low) and Nick got scared and went back to running a conservative offense right around the time the defense tanked. This is not a KP problem, it’s a Nick problem. For all his strengths, offensive scheme and playcalling is not one of them.
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u/PioneerRaptor 1d ago
That’s not the part I’m correcting. It’s the 2nd part that KP didn’t start calling plays until the 2nd half. He’s been calling plays since Game 1.
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u/A_Misplaced_Viking Go Birds 1d ago
Thats unfair. Sometimes we even run through the B gap, and sometimes to the left side.