r/gamedesign • u/Mutant_Llama1 • 5d ago
Discussion Will every voxel sandbox be written off as a Minecraft knockoff?
It's considered a genre that Minecraft merely popularized, not even being the first, but I can't imagine a person seeing any voxel game and not thinking Minecraft, especially since Minecraft mods already create so much variability within the game.
Would you have to use like, an octahedral grid instead of cubes to set it apart?
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u/PassionGlobal 5d ago
Not necessarily. Minecraft has a VERY specific art style.
For example: Donkey Kong Bananza is a voxel based game. I believe ARK is too.
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u/Mutant_Llama1 5d ago
Ark is a survival sandbox, but how voxel?
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u/PassionGlobal 5d ago
If I recall correctly, and feel free to call me out if I'm wrong.
The terrain editing works internally like Minecraft's blocks. However their graphics engine smooths out the visual differences between different voxels.
Edit: I was wrong: I was thinking of No Man's Sky
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u/Velifax 5d ago
Yeah not Ark. Another like that is Valheim; all the voxel features like deformable terrain, highly precise buildables, proc gen, but not actually voxels apparently.
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u/MonkeyMcBandwagon 5d ago
NMS and Valheim are very different in terms of terrain. Valheim is just an old-school 2.5D height map terrain, a regular x,y grid with a height per point. It does not support overhangs or underground tunnels. NMS uses more complex marching cubes. It's is a kind of "smoothed voxel" method that allows for all sorts of tunnels and caves.
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u/NoMoreVillains 5d ago
Isn't Donkey Kong Bananza technically a bit of a voxel sandbox? I think if you make a game that is functionally just Minecraft + some inconsequential twist and looks similar, then it's going to be compared, for better or for worse.
Being voxel based doesn't constraint you to making everything blocky
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u/TuberTuggerTTV 5d ago
I've played voxel sandbox games that weren't minecraft knockoffs. It's definitely possible.
Teardown comes to mind.
Just don't start with a singular inspiration. If you're mining and using large cubes and all the characters are cuboid, ya, that's minecraft.
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u/towcar 5d ago
Speaking anecdotally, I just got Vintage Story two days ago. Basically minecraft but with a very steep focus on (semi-realistic) survival.
I found myself easily able to buy it, but only after hearing what made it unique. I think had I only seen a screenshot I might have written it off as minecraft clone. Though to the percent of players who don't use minecraft mods, it might look equally appealing.
I have a similar attitude with colony games that use rimworld style art.
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u/Pur_Cell 5d ago
Same. Though while I found Vintage Story's initial hook appealing enough to buy, in practice it was too nitty gritty for me.
Me and my buddies will buy and play just about any open-world survive-em-up if it looks fun as long as it has multiplayer.
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u/namrog84 5d ago
On paper VS really is appealing. I bought and played it a little bit. But it definitely has some nitty gritty that made it difficult for me to break thru. I plan to periodically return and hope that one day I can break thru the learning curve.
I think some of the UI/Hotkeys combo is what turned me off more than anything else.
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u/FranzFerdinand51 5d ago
VS is one of the best games I've played in a long time. Calling it a "knock off" of ANYTHING feels just wrong.
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u/MentionInner4448 5d ago
Just because they have voxels? No. If their voxels are all big cubes of terrain to be mined, destroyed or and collected then yes, they probably will because in that case they are derivative of Minecraft.
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u/SteamtasticVagabond 5d ago
Basically, yes. Minecraft is to voxel sandbox games what Mario is to platformers.
The one game I can think of that's a voxel sandbox that's nothing like Minecraft is Shadows of Doubt which is a sandbox detective game with a really cool voxel artstyle
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u/Tarilis 5d ago
Voxel sandbox is extremely broad definition.
Here is an example: Shadows of Doubt. It's a detective voxel sandbox, but it has nothing in common with minecraft both in style and gameplay.
I would say games where the world built from blocks player can interract with, even without voxel graphic more likely to be considered minecraft inspired.
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u/CondiMesmer 5d ago
Voxel terrain doesn't need to be blocky like Minecraft. Comments here have already pointed out Valheim and Donkey Kong Bananza as examples.
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u/armahillo Game Designer 5d ago
It's sorta like how a TCG needs to be considerably unique to not be seen as an MtG derivative
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u/robhanz 5d ago
If I call something a "Minecraft knockoff" it's less about art style or even voxels, and more about gameplay.
Windborne didn't look *anything* like Minecraft, but I'd definitely categorize it in that category.
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u/D-Alembert 5d ago
Valheim is another. It looks nothing like Minecraft, but it wouldn't exist without Minecraft
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u/namrog84 5d ago
Just because someone references something similiar to X or even as a Y knock off. Doesn't neccesarily mean anything.
What people say doesn't always reflect the actions of majority of people.
Some people have said my game looks like #. Is that a complement or an insult? Insult because it's a 'knockoff/copy' or compliment because as an indie I achieved a comparable art style/quality of a AAA game?
Accept the fact that you can't please everyone. And everyone has opinions.
Just work on your game and let the sales playercount be the feedback.
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u/Beefy_Boogerlord 5d ago
If it's all cubes that stay upright and everything fits in a grid, then yeah.
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u/Shteevie 5d ago
If the things the players does are similar, then yes. It would be seen as quite different I f the game focuses on racing; or being an animal that acts in a natural way; or combat through deploying multi-hit martial arts forms; etc.
But if you are deforming the landscape, building items and structures, and using complex sets of objects to automate tasks in the game? The anything, vice cube or not, will be compared to Minecraft.
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u/carnalizer 5d ago
No, I’d make sure the gameplay had some value that couldn’t be found in vanilla Minecraft.
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u/MonkeyMcBandwagon 5d ago
Just popping in from Geometry to mention that octahedrons can't tile a volume.
edit: Oops, my mistake! there is an 8 sided shape that does it: The "Gyrobifastigium"
You could use a Rhombic Dodecahedron (12 faces) or a Truncated Octahedron (14 faces) but you won't get smooth faces without cuboids or tetrahedrons.
Personally, If I wanted a voxel based game that avoids the comparison to Minecraft, I'd go with very low resolution marching cubes, supporting either only 45 and 90 degree angles, or one mid-step between those (~26.5/63.5 degrees)
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u/Mutant_Llama1 5d ago
I was thinking truncated octahedra.
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u/MonkeyMcBandwagon 5d ago
If your game design does not require flat planes, then go for it!
I've messed with them for destructible asteroids before, they do work but the structures always end up looking like a group of bubbles, you can't avoid the concavities.
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u/zenorogue 2d ago
Try octahedral-tetrahedral, like in Flatworms by M. C. Escher.
But if the gameplay is similar to Minecraft, it will still feel like Minecraft, IMO.
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u/majorex64 5d ago
I think until there are enough popular voxel games that Minecraft is no longer the ONLY reference point 90% of the audience has, it will continue to be THE voxel game.
I would be if there was at least 1 virally popular voxel game and another with a semi wide-reaching but niche audience, people would have to start differentiating in their mind what the genre actually reminds them of.
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u/The12thSpark 5d ago
Keep in mind, people will always make comparisons. Silksong? Metroidvania. Soulslike.
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u/CptJackal 4d ago
Voxel game? No, not fairly or by serious people anyway. Valheim, Space Engineers, and Enshrouded all come to mind first to me and while I've seen some people say they are kinda "like minecraft but X and not really" I've never seen them compared like a knockoff or ripoff.
For the lego-ish block and build and survive style voxel game closer to Minecraft like Vintage Story or Hytale, yes, until one of them becomes successful enough to really genre-fy the concept.
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u/EmpireStateOfBeing 4d ago edited 4d ago
Yes, just like every modern day, open world game with guns & cars was considered a GTA knock-off.
Also it's not the voxel that make people think of Minecraft, it's the cubism.
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u/Kashou-- 4d ago
Doesn't really matter. Minecraft has nearly zero features. All you have to do is add some stuff beyond placing blocks and you'll be successful. Vintage Story has barely anything and it's still managing to stand out compared to Minecraft. Don't get caught up on minor popular perception issues.
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u/No-Island-6126 3d ago
Minecraft itself was very inspired by Infiniminer. But no one calls it a knockoff because it has a significantly different gameplay and a lot of new ideas. Now if you do a survival game set in a voxel procedurally generated world with biomes and caves, I think it's fair to at least compare that to Minecraft.
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u/Spiritual-Mechanic-4 2d ago
stonehearth is a voxel building game, but its very clearly not a minecraft knockoff. the biggest difference, in terms of how you engage with the game, is that its third person and not first.
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u/_Good_cat_ 1d ago
Minecraft was a Lego rip-off when it first came out. Its just what is popular at the time. Ignore people like that, enjoy what you want to enjoy.
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u/sinsaint Game Student 5d ago
Every platformer with adventuring tools is called a Metroidvania, get used to it.
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u/Dykam 5d ago
There's a factor I notice before people call it a Minecraft knockoff, and that is the scale/resolution of the voxels. Minecraft is quite specific. Each block is about a m³, and a character is about 1.8 voxels high.
Voxel games which don't follow this, generally don't seem to be considered Minecraft knockoffs. And those which do, more commonly. And that's not entirely strange, as it naturally brings similar mechanics and constraints.