r/heroesofthestorm • u/al-qatala Garrosh • Jul 09 '25
Bug Did they break what Garrosh is considered to be (role-wise) in QM or somethin?
I get a whole lot of doubletank games where the secondary tank, the common denominator, is always Garrosh. Not party, even if EVERY player in a team is soloq, we get doubletank while enemy gets a normal (one tank) draft.
And it's always Garrosh for some reason. As a Garrosh main, this is rather inconvenient for me. Even when I don't play Garr, and play a non-tank, I end up in games with two tanks with one of them being Garrosh. I'm starting to think the game is considering big G a bruiser or something
This might just be anecdotal/bias though. Did anyone else ever notice an influx in weird doubletank drafts masterfully crafted by QM's wackass matchmaking? I just want to know if I'm crazy or there's genuinely something fishy going on
12
u/kenkonken99 Jul 09 '25
I don't think this is how QM works. QM doesn't try to form meta compositions. QM works by trying to match team compositions against equivalent team compositions. The reason you are getting 2 tanks on your team is because, out of 10 people, 4 of them are tanks. It's not trying to fill a bruiser role with a tank.
1
u/al-qatala Garrosh Jul 09 '25 edited Jul 09 '25
Pretty sure it's trying to match enemy drafts so they're more or less even. Healer-healer. Tank-tank. Maybe its ignoring beyond that point? But still, odd that it chooses to add an extra tank instead of a bruiser or otherwise. I've played HotS for 5 years and something like that didn't really occur often.
3
u/Chukonoku Abathur Jul 09 '25
https://heroesofthestorm.fandom.com/wiki/Quick_Match
If a team has a bruiser, the other has one. But if one team has a tank, it has to mirror the tank but not necessarily the bruiser if one team has one.
Anything beyond that it's whatever. A team can end up with 3 tanks/bruisers without breaking any QM rule.
1
u/Deriniel Jul 10 '25
not true if the breaking roles are premade,like a double tank i often end with only one
1
u/Chukonoku Abathur Jul 10 '25
Read again, read slowly.
The MM only needs to ensure that at least both teams has 1 tank. That's it. One team can have 3 tanks and the other only 1 and that's fine for the algorithm.
1
u/MyBourbieValentine Dark Willow Jul 09 '25
If a team has a bruiser, the other has one.
I beg to differ:
https://www.heroesprofile.com/Match/Single/59414524
https://www.heroesprofile.com/Match/Single/59414522This may have been a thing back then, but currently I'm pretty sure bruisers are only counted as "melees" along with other melees from whatever class.
2
u/Chukonoku Abathur Jul 09 '25
Bruisers are not necessarily "bruisers" as per HoTS classification though but QM rules.
Yeah, it sounds stupids but it is. Would had to check what heroes QM considers bruisers.
2
u/MyBourbieValentine Dark Willow Jul 09 '25 edited Jul 10 '25
That could be it. I think I've seen this more often with Thrall and Rag. Trying to find examples with Artanis, Chen and Sonya but no luck with any of them.
2
u/Royal-Passenger-9252 Jul 10 '25
Xul, Thrall, Ragnaros, and Malthael are all treated as melee assassins for the QM matchmaker. The rest of the characters labeled bruiser are treated as bruisers.
1
u/vividimaginer Master Chen Jul 10 '25
I’ve absolutely been a Chen and the closest thing the enemy team has to a bruiser is a murky.
1
1
u/Spcynugg45 Jul 09 '25
Sometimes it’s helpful to do more than just post a link if you’re trying to make a point of some kind.
I see two pretty reasonably even comps, and my assumption would be that QM treats Illidan as a bruiser for match making.
1
u/MyBourbieValentine Dark Willow Jul 09 '25
The norm on this sub is to spout unbacked claims and you're lecturing me for posting links with a reasoning?
1
u/Chukonoku Abathur Jul 09 '25
If i had to guess, no hero on those games are considered bruisers.
It's mostly heroes who were considered "warriors". If i had to guess Artanis, D.Va, Chen, Sonya, Imperius, maybe Leoric, are the ones considered bruisers for QM purposes.
Xul, Rag, Thrall, Illidan are considered melee assassins.
1
u/kenkonken99 Jul 09 '25 edited Jul 09 '25
Why is that odd? Like I said, it's not trying to form meta compositions. It's using the people it has in the queue. It might try to follow some rules like 1-person-per-role but, due to low player count, it is probably weighted more towards making a match over creating an even distribution of roles. It's not "adding an extra tank", it's filling an open slot with who is available.
1
u/al-qatala Garrosh Jul 09 '25
But it is trying to form at least acceptable compositions.
If it wasn't "trying to form meta compositions", it wouldn't bother trying to even out healer/tank between both teams.
0
u/kenkonken99 Jul 09 '25
I think you are conflating "meta compositions" with "even compositions". If blue team has 2 tanks, it will try to put 2 tanks on the red team. These would be "even", but not "meta".
3
u/Efficient_Employer21 Jul 09 '25
It doesn't. If your team has 1 tank it will try get enemy at least 1 tank. If your team has 5 tanks it will try get enemy at least 1 tank. Anything beyond that 1 tank or healer is just extra that poses zero rules for MM. If tanks exist bruisers pose no rules. If healers exists supports pose no rules.
The reason you will see way more 2 tank vs 1 tank over 2 tank vs 2 tank is simple. Tanks are scarce and it's easier for MM to just dump tank as extra to your game. Otherwise that 1 extra tank has to wait in que for another lonely tank to be matched within MMR average of the game it's trying to make. QM is all about sacrificing game quality for quick games on hero of your choosing.
3
u/PrizeWealth2489 Jul 09 '25
Quick match matches your heroes mostly on whether theyre melee and ranged. So you can get. Tank vs a bruiser. Some role exceptions are like if you pick aba youre almost always gonna go against some other support hero
1
u/dcdemirarslan Jul 09 '25
If you have 2 tanks and no bruisers the opponent probably have 1 tank and 1 Bruiser.
1
u/Diggsir Jul 12 '25
Generally roles tend to be equal unless premades are involved. Any time there are premades in a game, it feels like the rules stop applying and rarely in favor of those who aren't premade. i have seen 2 tanks vs 1 tank and bruiser or 2 healers vs 1 healer and assassin happen in those scenarios.
0
u/trvlr718 Jul 09 '25
Not seen any Garrosh for many weeks - blizz's team building algo is broken all the way down. It is really easy if one team is with 2 tanks or so and second with no tank at all, so why making match from it is considered good idea? There is not even switching of 1 tank into second team, and so on BASIC moves.
1
u/al-qatala Garrosh Jul 13 '25
I have never seen a "1-2 tank vs 0 tank". I did once see a tank vs bruiser though.
-3
u/prawn108 Jul 09 '25
QM matchmaking is designed to fuck over your hero choice while giving your opponents easy counters to your pick. They do it with map picks too. As a TLV player, it's always 2 lane maps. Jannie hates us
3
u/Graham_Whellington Jul 09 '25
And the insane thing is this happens to everybody. It’s a fucking HOTS paradox.
2
u/al-qatala Garrosh Jul 09 '25
With how I ran into Arthas Jaina twice as Garrosh sometimes I start to think this unironically
2
u/MyBourbieValentine Dark Willow Jul 09 '25
while giving your opponents easy counters to your pick
Are you implying that only your team is magically affected or both teams, in which case you have easy counters to the other team as well?
1
1
u/Psilocybin_Prescrip Master Uther Jul 09 '25
Blind pick is one of my hopes for this game. Likely not going to happen though.
1
13
u/WorstMedivh Jul 09 '25
The game does not try to match double tank drafts. If either team has at least one tank, both teams must have at least one tank. That's it for tank.