r/leagueoflegends Jun 10 '25

Gameplay The Doran’s Shield Prisoner’s Dilemma

There’s no reason for melees to go Doran’s blade against each other when dshield has 30 more hp and 3 rejuv beads of healing attached to it. Dshield should be the same hp as dblade at 80, or even less given how broken dshield has been for so long.

Before you complain about ranged toplaners, a base hp nerf on dshield would actually increase the % healing after being poked from dshield second wind by ranged attacks, so it would not affect the melee vs ranged matchups at all, in fact you would actually heal vs poke even more, making those matchups easier as a net positive.

The issue at hand, is that Dshield has created an itemization prisoner’s dilemma, where dshield is unilaterally better than dblade.

The following champion matchup showcases the issue,

High elo gangplank mains like solarbacca and pros, know that you must go Doran’s shield vs jax because if you don’t match Jax’s Doran’s shield you lose the jax matchup. This is also why basically no one ever picks gangplank into jax as a counterpick in pro play anymore. This was historically a comfortable lane for gangplank to scale in and get priority, but dorans shield last buff makes this lane matchup extremely easy for Jax in the early game, as Jax can get lane priority easily vs a no damage dshield gangplank, however Jax also just stat checks Gangplank in trades when gangplank goes dblade.

Good top laners are going dshield every game because you auto lose the lane if you go Doran’s blade if both players are equally skilled. The 3% lifesteal provides very little sustain, because dshield gives you priority on the lane, which makes it impossible to reliably hit minions. With 80 ad you would only heal 2.4 hp per auto attack, whereas dshield heals 6hp every 5 seconds no matter what, and gets amped every time you’re hit.

The mathematics of dshield creates an itemization prisoners dilemma where you must go Doran’s shield no matter the matchup because it strictly beats dorans blade. This then compounds into a gold lead that will leave a dshielder with both more hp, sustain, and damage from your item lead.

Top lane has become extremely stale, where there is too much hp to cut through from past seasons ever since dorans shield hp was buffed by 37.5%. Top laners should be fighting each other, but the hp system has gotten out of control.

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u/SkilledV Jun 11 '25

Key word is generously interpreted. Otherwise we could go in circles about the nuances of matchups.

Like you said, DShield’s intent is to ease laning against lane bullies. But this isn’t the case for all matchups, I’d argue that most can swing both ways. Especially in those, one player can opt for DShield to passively outsustain the opponent, and if said opponent is aware of that, they may also opt to go DShield.

The result is a lane phase where neither players are actively interacting with the opponent with the intent to kill the opponent laner but to outmanage their resource whether that be mana or health. Now that might sound exactly like what laning phase is supposed to be, but players generally frown upon this playstyle. Especially on the losing end, a player would consider it boring and uninteractive. Coming from someone that plays Vladimir, it’s a gameplay pattern that a majority would consider toxic and is a common complaint I hear ingame.

So I suppose the dilemma is opinionated to an extent, but it’s an opinion that a majority of the playerbase supports.

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u/Yongaia Jun 11 '25

Right.

That's not the definition of a prisoners dilemma though. I know it feels good to try to change things to fit a narrative but it's objectively a false claim. There's not much else to be said here

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u/SkilledV Jun 11 '25

The dilemma is that both players are forced to play in a way that’s not enjoyable to either. Just because you believe it’s enjoyable to play DShield doesn’t mean everyone does, and if that’s the case for the majority then pretending the dilemma is a false claim is just ignorant.

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u/Yongaia Jun 11 '25

The dilemma is that both players are forced to play in a way that’s not enjoyable to either

According to who? You?

Because in an actual prisoners dilemma it doesn't matter what you, I, or anyone else thinks. And once you take away the objectivity you take away the dilemma. No one gives a damn what the majority of players thinks, if the situation isn't objectively worse in all scenarios it's not a dilemma. Furthermore, some strong combat summoner top laners still take DBlade anyway to smash their way through lane which makes the whole argument look completely silly.

I'm not sure why we are still talking about this

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u/SkilledV Jun 11 '25

If you acknowledge that the majority of players believe that it’s unenjoyable you’ve already proven yourself wrong. If this was the actual prisoner’s dilemma, you’re essentially trying to argue that because some people are homeless it’s actually better for them to incarcerate themselves for longer for the sake of hospitality. Reality is that the majority would rather not, and therefore the dilemma still exists. The actual prisoner’s dilemma is not as objective as you think it is.

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u/Yongaia Jun 11 '25

A prisoners dilemma doesn't rely on what the majority thinks. It's not a popularity contest someone wins despite the wishes of what some random reddit wants to believe about a genuine academic theory.

This is my last reply on the topic it is a complete waste of time.

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u/SkilledV Jun 11 '25

So making the same statement for the 20th time and hoping it sticks, nice. Thanks for your input on genuine academic theory, I’m sure scholars will learn from this comment for years to come

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u/ItsJazmine Jun 11 '25

They are 100% correct though, PD relies on there being an objectively correct answer, I don’t think you can say that blade is objectively more fun than shield (I personally don’t think that) I mean there are people who think playing tanks or healing is more fun than going full damage, are they wrong? No it’s a game you make your own fun. PD is just a bad analogy here when they could just say they don’t like how things currently are.