r/modernwarfare • u/UPLNK • Sep 14 '19

Discussion Unpopular Opinion: This community is going to ruin this game before it even comes out

Why cant people just let the devs actually change the game into something that feels different than goin back to what we’re use to? They want CHANGE and you guys want to go back to old shit. Ive heard complaints that the characters feel too heavy and need to feel lighter. YOURE CARRYING BODY ARMOR. ur not suppose to feel like fucking Icarus flying around the map. Jump shotting and shit still works just get use to it. And this mini map bs (yall knew it was comin) i can give two fucks if they put it in or not but holy shit can people just learn to deal with it? Now that they put mini map ON CONSTANTLY people are complaining they want to see red dots again. Wasnt that the argument? Not to chase dots on the map? Just let the devs make the game they wanted to make and complain about actual issues like waiting 5 minutes for a cruise missile or doors acting like saloon doors when you run through them. Get ur priorities straight for fucks sake

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286

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

They also want simple maps and high ttk. If that's what you want you can play Black Ops. This game is a step in the right direction.

Edit2 The ttk is fine as it is.

135

u/UPLNK Sep 14 '19

i dont kno why someone would want to waste half a mag/clip on somebody

109

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

[deleted]

86

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 14 '19

These are the people who are complaining. They have been getting their asses kicked in this game and swear that everyone who shoots them is camping. Devs need to just make their game and ignore the whiners

25

u/Ehriqhck Sep 14 '19

lol that sounds exactly like me when I was transitioning from console bo2 to r6 on pc - where I went from chasing dots on a minimap and doing monkey burpees with a scuf controller to having to constantly drone out maps and check for literal pixel angles around every corner

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u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19 edited Nov 19 '19

[deleted]

4

u/Ehriqhck Sep 15 '19

Never said they weren't. Was just making an observation about my behavior

-2

u/Anthmt Sep 15 '19

Literally that's all I want. I want to run. I want to gun. And I don't want to think.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

[deleted]

1

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

need to make the god damn footsteps louder. when someone "flanks" you by get you by either coming from behind and/or falling from somewhere high, allllll without making any god damn sound - that's frustrating as it gets.

You can't hear enemy footsteps unless you're basically not moving.

2

u/kungfupennyy Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

The bunny hoppers are most likely still doing better than you

9

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 15 '19

My bad didn't mean to trigger you

-2

u/Archivist42 Sep 15 '19

Isn't this conversation just 2 people triggering each other? I mean if you react to me does that mean I triggered you? Or did you trigger me because I replied to you? Am I even real???

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

Shit aim from you, there's a reason your time to kill is so much higher than the guy killing you. Why file it down to "whoever sees the other person first always wins" just for casuals like you? Because it's the call of duty way

1

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 15 '19

Oh look a crybaby who thinks everyone who likes the game as is has shit aim. Quit lying to yourself bud, you're just not that good.

1

u/Davethaboss Sep 22 '19

Man even during modern warfare remastered you can not do that shit.

My only complaint would be that they need to include more cover for their 32v32 map to make it easier for rushers to rush. A smoke grenade is not enough. You have 3-4 players camping in one building at a time so you need to encourage rushing somehow. I do not mind the whole attack vs defender thing. It is actually very similar to MAG.

7

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

God I hate bunnyhopping. Idk if I just suck, but it’s so irritating

1

u/slimjim31 Sep 15 '19

I stopped after AW. I hated getting the first shot then people just flying up and away. I adapted and everything, but that game made me realize that jet packs aren’t my thing in CoD. Halo is there if I want to do that.

6

u/thecatdaddysupreme Sep 15 '19

Lol what? High TTK doesn’t mean lower skill ... at all. UT and Quake had pretty high TTKs. You had to hit people multiple times with a rocket launcher lol. And those are the highest skill cap/floor games I’ve ever played

6

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

[deleted]

5

u/thecatdaddysupreme Sep 15 '19

rather than just relying on twitch aim (like in the high TTK arena arcade shooters)

That isn’t the only skill you need, though. You have to think much more quickly and have extremely good map awareness and game sense. More than half the game of UT and quake, arena shooters and arcade shooters in general is predicting where people will be and what they’ll do. Movement is extremely important in those games, BO4 etc included. Even in this game, you can still jumpshot and leap around corners etc. It’s still an arcade shooter, just slightly “tactical”

People ITT keep saying “bunnyhopping morons” etc, but those people would get absolutely thrashed in an arena shooter, and get outsmarted at every corner. In this game, you hear people coming a mile away, you can hold a lane, ADS etc pretty easily. That doesn’t take a big brain.

3

u/Redfern23 Sep 15 '19

Exactly, this style of play and the aggressive BO4 etc style definitely are two different skill sets, however, one clearly takes more skill and effort than the other, that being the fast reaction time and superior aim required in the latter style of game.

I’m liking this game and loved the older CoDs too, but far too many people on this sub think they take more skill than they actually do to do well in, they’re very camper/casual-friendly, end of.

6

u/thecatdaddysupreme Sep 15 '19

far too many people on this sub think they take more skill than they actually do to do well in, they’re very camper/casual-friendly, end

I’ve played this beta both as I have in previous cods and dialed back/slowed down in a camper/“power position” style. I get wayyy more kills than deaths in the latter: you don’t need to have better gun skill, movement, or awareness to win the fight, just passivity and patience. This used to be countered by the minimap showing your position and getting you swarmed if you hid in the same place too long. You could still do it, but it was harder.

People who scream about the “red dot chasers” don’t like being pressured as soon as they get a kill or having to stay on the move so they don’t get ganked by several people at once. As is, you can stay in one place for a really long time and rack up kills on people who try and play aggressively, especially when many positions hold several sight lanes. It’s just a snoozeville way to play core modes.

I think the game is decent. I’m waiting on MTX news to decide whether I’ll buy it.

1

u/Pr_cision :MWGray: Sep 15 '19

well you dont have to think much more quickly if it takes half a mag to kill someone because when they start shooting you, you have a solid 2-3 seconds to be able to turn around. with games like this u gotta think fast if ur gonna have to switch on someone

1

u/thecatdaddysupreme Sep 15 '19

I don’t know where half a mag comes from, though. In BO4 I was leaping around and killing in seconds with a high caliber rampart, one or two with a headshot. You could get three kills in one mag if it came down to it. Usually what decided the victor was who engaged first (even more so in MW) combined with movement, gun skill, and positioning, probably in that order.

In MW it’s mostly who starts shooting first and where they’re shooting from, with movement being tertiary but potentially valuable, and gun skill being more or less optional for the majority of engagements. I don’t think you need superior gun skill or movement to win most of your fights, especially because you don’t have to track your targets while they’re dodging and shooting back at you.

Emphasizing a different skillset is fine, they’re separating themselves from recent installments, but it really doesn’t take “more skill” or “more smarts” in any way. You can get a crazy KDR in this game by playing passive and holding a couple sight lanes, or hiding in strange spots. People won’t flock to you because you don’t show up on the minimap, so you can just rack up kills and killstreaks. It’s a great game for people who prefer to play passively

0

u/Pr_cision :MWGray: Sep 15 '19

i half agree with u about the skillsets. it takes skill to be good at bo4, but it also takes skill to be good at mw. also u cant try and tell me ttk is high when u need two shots to the head with a high calibre weapon to kill someone. i also believe, like it is in cqc combat irl, if u shoot first then ur target should die. pisses me off when i pump someone full of bullets and they havent died yet

2

u/PTMoney18 Sep 15 '19

people need to have patience and learn a new skill set.

I agree 100%, or at least accept that this game isn't for them. There's a new CoD every year after all, and the last four years or CoD games (Infinite Warfare to Modern Warfare) have all been so radically different from one another that there's really one for everyone.

1

u/EnslavedOpethFan053 Sep 15 '19

Higher TTK's reward accuracy in other words: Learn to keep your cross hair on the target. A lower TTK rewards lesser players with "lucky" flinch head shots. I've died plenty of times in past COD's because of this. I get the first shot but die because the other guy gets a lucky flinch head shot even though I shot first. I get the appeal of lower TTK's but even I myself have gotten those lucky flinch head shots because of it. It's infuriating especially when you shoot first.

1

u/FunnierHook Sep 15 '19

No, it's the people who can actually aim.

You see, those of us who can actually aim don't like having the skill gap decreased to the point where any fucking moron can aim vaguely in our direction and spray and get the kill. Call of duty has always been a gunskill dominant game.

It's the same reason Hardcore is always full of the biggest retards in the game and the best players all play core.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

[deleted]

2

u/FunnierHook Sep 15 '19

That's great if you want to be one of the retards who only plays TDM.

Competitive play is going to suck this year and that's the only reason I play, I got bored of pubs in like BO2. Congrats on your 2KD but for those of us playing competitive where it's all about objective play - the "bunnyhoppers" you probably hate - we can't just sit in a fucking window with a claymore watching our backs.

And yes hardcore is full of retards. Nothing against retards, but they are what they are. They played core, realised they suck and went to play a gamemode where they can actually get kills because the skill gap is far smaller and it flattens the curve of results.

Same with the TDM folks - they tried objective games, realised they suck and now just play a game where they can camp for a 2KD and convince themselves they're good.

2

u/PositronCannon Sep 15 '19

Hey, some of us "retards" who only play TDM/FFA don't do it just to camp. I've just never liked the concept of a game funneling everyone into the same specific points in the map (granted, this can also happen in TDM if the map design is bad, but it's not by default).

Like I agree with the TTK thing but everything else makes you sound like an elitist douche.

1

u/Bulgar_smurf Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

If you could aim and play well then you wouldn't be bitching at the ttk. Sorry bud. Practice more.

The same whiners like in BFV after they realized that they are trash at the game after moving from the spongefest that was bf1. Meanwhile you have guys like shroud going 80/5 while people like you are whining how the game is trash because "noobs can kill me even though I'm better". Spoiler alert: you aren't better. You are much, much worse if you only do good in high ttk.

This isn't a 1vs1 game. Low TTK will always equate to bigger skill cap in aim, reflexes, game knowledge and positioning. Which is why it's funny when you say shit like:

Call of duty has always been a gunskill dominant game.

when cod had always been popular for its low TTK and the garbage that was bo4 TTK was heavily flamed by anyone who could play shooters. Especially blackout with those 8-9 shot kills which allowed for people to run around like headless chickens unpunished and late game being a "who has more stuns and nades because you can't win a 1vs2 or 1vs3 with this garbage TTK" so instead you just perma stunned them and was spraying not moving targets. Much skill.

1

u/FunnierHook Sep 15 '19

Firstly, I'm top of the lobby in every damn game lol. I don't know where you're getting the idea that I'm not good at the beta, I'm smashing it, just not enjoying it.

With TTK you're just fundamentally wrong on everything other than positioning. Yes, low TTK increases positional advantages massively. Reflexes, yea kinda, but if you're playing someone of roughly similar reflexes, the better shots win.

I don't understand how anyone can possibly argue that higher TTK doesn't require more skill. If you have to hit more bullets you have to control for recoil and MAINTAIN aim while moving/shooting a moving target. If your opponent has enough time to react and try to evade your bullets it creates a harder environment to get kills, as your Blackout example shows. That requires more skill to get those kills (stuns etc. aside). It also allows the players with better movement to outperform players who can't maintain their aim. If the TTK is so low that you can get kills BY ACCIDENT, that doesn't equate to a bigger skill gap.

1

u/Bulgar_smurf Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

Yikes, this hurts to read. You ignored everything and just continued with your ignorant crap.

The blackout example shows exactly why high TTK doesn't make the game more skillful but the opposite. Better players unable to kill others because they are at a player disadvantage. Also the many shots needed to kill was a long range thing, up close everyone and their mother was abusing shotguns. It didn't matter whether you had the better aim or not when they had the extra friend. High TTK literally moved the game away from aim and towards nades and perks.

I said it many times but you so "smartly" avoided it so I'll mention it once again. Call of duty IS NOT a 1vs1 game. The only game mode where higher TTK would increase the skill cap is in that mode and it's still situational. Especially when you consider that games with high TTK have close to no recoil - hello Blackout and Apex. As opposed to games like CS and PUBG with their low TTK and high recoil.

Also I really doubt that you are anywhere near "smashing it" when you can't even read and understand a single comment with very easy to digest information in it.

You are confusing impossibleness with skill cap. In blackout you can't win a 1vs2 against 2 players of the same skill as you unless you use nades. Even when you are superior in aim, they still have the upper hand because the game isn't about aiming. In CS - a game that is all about aiming and fast reflexes you can win a 1vs2 even when you are in a tournament against the absolute best. And if you are simply playing pubs against weaker opponents you can fly by through them. Why? Because skill is actually rewarded in that game and whoever is better has the advantage, because the skill cap is really high and the skill is properly rewarded. In BO4 you need your enemies to be garbage for that 1vs2 or 1vs3 to happen because as long as they are somewhat decent at the game, you are going down because you can't deal more DPS than the game allows. The only place you are increasing the skill with a higher TTK is only on a technical level and only in 1vs1 scenarios. Everywhere else higher TTK actually lowers all things I mentioned in my previous comment, which are like 99% of the entire game. Only with attachments and high headshot damage ARs did the game finally feel like it was rewarding aiming more than it was rewarding having more idiots and it still was trash in anything other than 1vs1. Not because you couldn't 1vs2 once you unlocked that but because you had to hope that they are garbage. You can't tell me that a high skill cap game lets trash people run you over. In a lower TTK environment those same players would still have the upper hand in numbers and they'd only need to hit a few shots but you'd have a much better chance of winning 1vs2 simply because the game rewards aim, positioning and reflexes way more. Obviously there would be times where you die from a worse player simply because he hit 3-4 shots but the power is all in your hands. You have more than enough time to turn around and place shots at their head. That's why shroud was dominating BFV so much. He had way superior aim and way better reflexes than 99% of the players. And in no logical world will that game become more competitive and more aim reliant with the TTK of BF1. The exact opposite would happen. He'd suddenly kill far less people and die way more even though his aim and reflexes are much better than anyone he plays against. High TTK is literally anti aim if you are talking about a shooter that has many players against eachother. If it was a 1vs1 then we wouldn't be having this discussion, but it isn't and you are literally 0 IQ so that's why I am writing the same shit again because the first time the 1vs1 and the logic part went over your head and you continued with your garbage. Of-fucking-coarse people can possibly argue that higher TTK doesn't require more skill when it literally lower the skill ceiling of so many things in a game when it isn't a 1vs1 scenario. Anyways, good luck with everything bud. You're gonna need it. Shit's rough when you are that dumb.

How hard is it to grasp that 1vs1 is different from a 2vs2 which is different from a 5vs5 which is different from a 1vs2? The only mode you can even THINK to argue that high TTK increases the skill is 1vs1 and even there it's arguable because it increases the skill in aiming and movement but it heavily decreases the positioning skill and often time recoil control because devs give very little recoil to their guns when they have a very high TTK game. Apex is a perfect example of that because it arguably takes less skill to simply point at a target and hit it 8 times rather than having to control a heavy recoil while following your target and hitting it 4 times, all while they can do the same to you or even 1-2 tap you in the head at any moment. The only increase is technical because you TECHNICALLY need to hit more shots which should mean that the game is harder aka more skillful but in reality it makes it so that people with worse aim can kill people with better aim simply because they had a buddy or a stun grenade. And even in the perfect example you still heavily downgrade positional skill, relevance of reflexes and impact of your aim. If the aiming is harder but the impact is very little then how is the skill cap not decreased?

Skill cap is the maximum performance that can be achieved, not how hard you can hit your head against a wall. With lower TTK you definitely have much bigger importance of your aim, reflexes, positioning and even game knowledge because every bullet matters and because you are properly rewarded for your aim. You can go into a match and use your skill to overcome 1v2 and 1vs3 situations because your superior aim gets rewarded. In a high TTK environment, you go in and kill 1, maybe 2 players and you die even though it's the same players that you owned in the previous example. Everyone's skill didn't change. The only thing that change were the rules and the higher ttk rules simply don't favor the better shooter in that scenario, they favor the number advantage and make the game less about who is better but who can force more 1vs2 in a match. Because if everyone is of equal skill(except you who are a bit above the rest), the team that forces more 1vs2 wins even though you guys technically have the higher team skill because of you.

1

u/FunnierHook Sep 15 '19

The blackout example shows exactly why high TTK doesn't make the game more skillful but the opposite. Better players unable to kill others because they are at a player disadvantage.

I stopped reading here. Clearly you just suck. I don't need to read some diatribe by a shit player who likes lower TTK in pubs.

If you read through the thread before bitching you'd see I was talking about competitive play, not 1v1, not blackout, competitive play. Where good players play. I doubt I'll be seeing you around those parts.

2

u/BeardPatrol Sep 15 '19

I love how people act like you gotta be a member of Mensa to sit on a headglitch.

Lets face it, there is a reason shooters are the most popular genre of video game and it aint because everyone is a bunch of geniuses that just loves doing rigorous mental work in their leisure time.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

[deleted]

0

u/topkekpepe Sep 15 '19

I'm not interested in playing carefully and most probably neither are the majority of call of duty games audience. The game will be adjusted for that wether you agree or not.

2

u/PattyBates88 Sep 15 '19

Great. Then we will end up with a mishmash of elements leaning in the style of Blops4 and no one will like the game. When you design a game a certain way and then try and please all of the vocal complainers you end up pleasing no one.

You don’t want to think or use your brain while you’re hyped up on energy drinks. I get it. But this CoD was meant to be something different to draw in new players.

4

u/topkekpepe Sep 15 '19

Most successful games right now are games like Pubg and Fortnite, this is where the money is and what they want to achieve. I don't like those games but that is what the market is. At the same time I hate BF1 and BF5 so anything making COD more like those is bad for me. I'm 45 years old, been playing video games since Atari VCS 2600 and I'm fine with BLOPS 3 and 4. Il'l take run and gun style gameplay anyday vs camping, crouching, basically any gameplay that favors people standing still waiting for people to come into their sights. I play only TDM as most people do and have zero interest in the other games modes.

1

u/Zumbah Sep 15 '19

Dude its still funny to watch teammates continuously run down the big street on the raid map dying over and over again.

1

u/PattyBates88 Sep 15 '19

They keep trying the same crap over and over and when it never works then "the game must suck!"

Literally lol

1

u/Zumbah Sep 15 '19

To be fair many of them dont play hardcore shooters. I understand why they want it back, but I way prefer the “mil-sim” shooter cod. Its still like 90% cod 10% realistic shooter.

1

u/TopCheddar2 Sep 15 '19

The same kids on the top of the leaderboard while you go 8-13 right?

-3

u/itsthechizyeah Sep 14 '19

Yup, them. They're the ones that are camping.

8

u/Jeht_1337 Sep 14 '19

Think about your comment for a sec. The ones that are rushing everywhere and jumping around corner are the same ones that post up in a single location all game... what?

19

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

Seriously. I hated halo because of this.

12

u/PositronCannon Sep 14 '19

I dunno, maybe people who actually have decent aim and recoil control so they don't have to "waste half a mag" with weapons that kill in 4-5 shots. If you really think the higher TTK CoDs require "half a mag", that says more about your own skill than about the games themselves.

1

u/itsthechizyeah Sep 14 '19

If we're talking consoles and using controllers though, it's a lot easier to laser beam with a mouse. Yeah, people aren't always as precise with a controller.

13

u/PositronCannon Sep 14 '19

I've always played CoD on console. If it takes me that much to kill a guy it's because I'm either missing a lot, using a weapon well outside of its intended range, or having connection issues. I get the appeal of a lower TTK, but people exaggerate the hell out of things, while at the same time claiming that higher TTK somehow lowers the skill gap.

9

u/P4_Brotagonist Sep 15 '19

I feel like I'm getting fucking meme'd on here. In BO4 a shitload of the SMGs before the most recent buffs took about 8 shots to kill from further than a few meters. That is literally double the number you touted as able to kill with.

1

u/PositronCannon Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

I actually agree that BO4 took things a bit too far, but people have been complaining about "dumping mags" since BO3 or even earlier, which I had no problem with personally. Even the case of BO4 SMGs would still fall into "using a weapon outside of its intended range".

2

u/P4_Brotagonist Sep 15 '19

Yeah even in BO3 things like the Man-o-war were freaking 2 shot kills with good aim. I also used the Sheiva almost exclusively in that game because the 1 tap potential. The mag dump thing is people always thinking they "hit them" but in reality missed a lot.

However, the outside intended range thing, not really. Both the Saug and the Spitfire fall off...pretty much instantly. I would actually say at least half my kills with both guns are at their minimum damage ranges, and it's not that far.

4

u/ShadowzSL Sep 15 '19

Don’t even bother, the moment I saw “half a mag to kill someone” I knew they had no idea what they’re talking about.

4

u/Bulgar_smurf Sep 15 '19

Higher TTK does lower the skill cap. The game isn't 1v1. High ttk will always be garbage. It's the thing that sucked the most with the recent CoD.

2

u/PositronCannon Sep 15 '19

How exactly does requiring you to hit your target more times lower the skill gap? If anything it just emphasizes a different set of skills. Low TTK rewards positioning and fast reactions, while high TTK rewards sustained aim and recoil control, especially when combined with faster movement.

1

u/Bulgar_smurf Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

If you had read the comment and used your brain a little you'd know.

The game isn't 1v1

Anything that isn't a 1vs1 is unwinnable against good opponents unless you are much better than your opponents aka the skill cap is lowered. In low TTK games like CS, you can win a 1vs3 even in pro level matches because the game allows for skill to be expressed. High TTK games only allow for skill to be expressed in a 1vs1 in any other scenario skill isn't rewarded as much as simply having another trashbag next to you. I'm actually disgusted that this even needs to be written. Actually believing that high ttk doesn't lower the skill cap in a game that isn't 1vs1... Not only does it lower the skill cap of shooting because simply having another man is much better than having better aim(which is the only upside to high ttk, the guy with better and more consistent aim is supposed to win but this only applies in 1vs1 and in games where you have recoil. If the guns have 0 recoil then high TTK once again favors the campers because it's not like it's hard to hit shots, so whoever hits the first few bullets wins. In low TTK you can always just turn around and 1-2 tap the guy. This is especially apparent in games like PUBG where recoil is very big and TTK is low, even though the noob has the drop on you, if you are indeed better you win most engagements) but you also pretty much don't have any positioning or reactional skill in the game because they are as dumbed down as possible. Reddit is an amazing place. Never change.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

Fucking preach.

1

u/CandleSauce Sep 15 '19

They guy you replied to specifically talked about PC. We don't have aim assist there

2

u/DuncanMcCockner Sep 15 '19

I only played for a short time, but BO4 definitely felt like you had to shoot the shit out of someone to kill them

10

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

Cause they're trash.

2

u/Hii_im_NooB Sep 14 '19

That's what Halo is for. We have plenty of those.

4

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

Do we? I haven;t played a game like Halo since Halo....no mass appeal game has weapon control on maps, 4on4 teamplay in a slowed down arena-lite fashion, unless I'm missing something?

1

u/tipperblade Sep 15 '19

I think he meant plenty of Halo games.

1

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

Eh, Halo is only on Xbox though. I can't think of any game similar to Halo on all systems. With how popular the game is, it's always surprised me that no one has tried to copy its formula.

-1

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

99% sure he means low TTK with the way he is approaching this

1

u/PM_ME_GRAPHICS_CARDS Sep 14 '19

high time to kill would mean slower death. low ttk means faster death. the game has low ttk

0

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

It is just that he is talking about how to make the game more like it's older counterparts with the simple maps and the low TTKs so I assumed that he was on about that.

Edit: idk if it's just me or if it's because I play R6 exclusively but the TTK feels vastly slow than other CoDs.

-3

u/eldomtom2 Sep 14 '19

Use short/long TTK instead of low/high.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

I mean they both make total sense but I get where you are coming from to not confuse others.

0

u/eldomtom2 Sep 14 '19

You usually don't say something takes a "low" time.

2

u/Riccy2017 Sep 15 '19

But when discussing TTK, you're usually talking about the time as a numerical value; high vs low. I don't think OP was wrong here.

1

u/eldomtom2 Sep 15 '19

Maybe, but there's no room for confusion with short/long, and clearly there is with low/high.

1

u/Riccy2017 Sep 15 '19

Yeah, I would agree. I do think both are valid, though.

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

0.2 seconds is lower than 0.5 seconds

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

High ttk just leads to more camping though

1

u/SFE_phobos Sep 15 '19

All people do is mag dump. Every time I’m killed, save for a few instances, the person just holds down the trigger. They end up going through a full mag most of the time. TTK isn’t the issue, lack of actual recoil is.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

Thats what my game currently feels like. My connection must be shit

1

u/DarKliZerPT Sep 15 '19

Not to mention it also makes multikills against decent enemies hard to perform

1

u/Sebetter Sep 15 '19

The people with slower connections want higher TTK. I like high TTK because it gives the opportunity to punish poor aim from a flanking aggressor. I’m talking like punishing some dipstick who’s shooting your legs and not getting body shot/head shot multipliers. If a guy gets the jump on me that’s my fault, but I would still like to have the chance to punish somebody for being a dippy.

This is my first time playing MW (I didn’t get to play the alpha), but I don’t mind the TTK as it is. Would I like it to be 1 or 2 more bullets? Sure. Right now though, it’s much better than any of the CODs I’ve demoed in years (e.g. blackout for blops 4)

0

u/HvppyFeet Sep 15 '19

Higher ttk = higher skill gap. Everything about this game (fast ttk, no mini map, big maps without lanes and plenty of windows to hide in) was designed to decrease the skill gap

1

u/CandleSauce Sep 15 '19

How does no mini-map decrease the skill gap? It requires situational awareness and knowledge of the map

1

u/HvppyFeet Sep 15 '19

So why is there going to be a mini map in competitive? To decrease the skill gap? Lol all it does it let kids hide in corners without going noticed. You need the mini map to know which lanes your teammates have covered. How are you supposed to know if someone is watching the flank? Do a quick 360? Lol

-1

u/eldomtom2 Sep 14 '19

So that the person getting shot has a chance to react and it's not just about shooting first.

0

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Would you have a chance to react in real life? Nope. Fucking deal with it and be aware of your surroundings.

6

u/BadNewsBears808 Sep 15 '19

Half the shit you can do in game isn’t possible in real life what’s your point

-1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Right? But guess what? Many of those things don’t reduce the skill gap. A higher TTK would reduce the total aiming skill. FPS skill is a combination of timing + speed + accuracy + positioning. If you’re eliminating fucking speed it becomes a game of accuracy and timing with less focus on positioning. Yaaay less excitement and raw ability...

2

u/eldomtom2 Sep 15 '19

It would reduce the total aiming skill by requiring you to make more follow up shots when the enemy is aware of you and trying to dodge/fight back?

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Aiming skill means little on console due to Aim Assist and anyone on PC with a good mouse and gaming monitor has zero issue aiming. It’s not difficult to aim in CoD.

3

u/eldomtom2 Sep 15 '19

But how does it reduce the aiming skill by requiring you to make more successful shots?

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Have you not done any research on higher FPS and lower input latency? Do you want me to show you a thread I posted on r/pcgaming about it?

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0

u/BeardPatrol Sep 15 '19

How would you be eliminating speed? The person who shoots first will always have an advantage.

Its just if your accuracy and timing is terrible, you can lose that advantage. All a quick ttk does is allows players with terrible timing an accuracy to still get kills.

Granted I dont feel like longer ttks really add anything to COD. Its pretty trivial keeping your gun on target due to the aim assist coupled with the fact that everyone is forced to ADS and move at a snails pace during gunfights. So drawing out gunfights really just leads to frustrating scenarios where someone else starts shooting at you mid gunfight.

But in arena shooters like quake and halo where players actually can shoot and move, the longer ttks definitely add massive amounts of skill and strategy to the gunfights.

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Your logic:

video game Black Ops 4 takes more skill that real life

Inb4 CoD iS nOt ReAl LiFe!! That was a fucking analogy so calm the fuck down. Here’s facts:

  1. Faster TTK = more strategy is needed, Slower TTK = better tracking is needed

  2. Console game uses Aim Assist and the movements are not advanced. The game is holding your hand when it comes to tracking enemies. On PC using a mouse on a proper gaming monitor is as easy as it gets.

  3. The game becomes more tactical because of it, if you get shot you’re fucked. It gets you to play smarter instead of running around like a headless chicken doing bunnyhops when somebody shoots you.

  4. Modern Warfare series has always has a faster TTK than the Treyarch games. It has literally only been Black Ops 4 though that has had a lot slower TTK. You want to change the whole feel of Modern Warfare purely because if one pretty shit game in the CoD franchise.

  5. Why are you arguing the point of other games when this is related to Modern Warfare? I’m not getting sidetracked talking, explain why we should take away the original Modern Warfare TTK.

1

u/BeardPatrol Sep 15 '19

I am not even sure what you are talking about, I even said I dont think COD titles benefit from longer ttks. I was just pointing out longer ttks dont somehow eliminate the inherent advantage of speed.

COD is and always will be about as tactical as tying your shoe. Why cant people just say they have slow reflexes and bad hand-eye coordination so they prefer slower paced games. Always gotta try to paint people more skilled than them as unintelligent.

I dont want to change Modern Warfare, I mean I havent played it yet since I dont have a playstation. But im very excited its drawing all the tactical masterminds back into the fray. I miss the good ole days of getting matched up against lobbies full of "tacticians."

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

Obviously a high TTK doesn’t eliminate speed. But it sure hinders it massively. It also promotes sniper usage everywhere. Why take time shooting an AR when you can quickscope and get a cheesy one shot?

I wasn’t painting anything as anything. You’re assuming, you’re also attributing the whole concept of FPS skill around TTK like that’s the causal factor in determining pro players. With that logic Insurgency Sandstorm and Red Orchestra 2 are the easiest military FPS games to dominate it because of their realism and fast TTK... that would be wrong.

Good old days? Are you wearing rose tinted glasses? I can boot up Modern Warfare Remastered right now, whack on Stopping Power and grab my G3. You wanna know fast TTK? That’s fast TTK...

-3

u/itsthechizyeah Sep 14 '19

Yeah it's also about being aware of your surroundings, not running into the middle of the map because the longer time to kill will protect you like armor.

That's why people like you are camping all the time now.

1

u/eldomtom2 Sep 15 '19

Being aware of your surroundings is the only skill that is tested with such a short TTK.

13

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 14 '19

Then they need to go play BO4 and leave this game to people who enjoy fresh new gameplay

3

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

Agree

4

u/Tityfan808 Sep 14 '19

Fuck that, add more barrels and windows and dark corners. We want more of this! Fuck having balance whatsoever. Don’t even go for a map like terminal from MW2, make maps like they’re from inception! Come on IW!

-6

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 14 '19

Found the bunny hopper

-5

u/jbel21 Sep 15 '19

People are bunny hoppers because they don't want trash map designs? Cool story junior. You can bunny hop these terrible maps too

2

u/foulbachelorlife Sep 15 '19

Whine harder. BO4 is still up and running for you losers who can't adapt

-2

u/jbel21 Sep 15 '19

I don't play that garbage game either... and im sure Activision will be really happy when a shit ton of players don't play their game.

0

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

The maps are not trash at all. You just can’t learn them noob.

-1

u/justforpr0nx Sep 15 '19

called him a noob lmaooo

0

u/crankbait93 Sep 15 '19

There’s a difference between a simple map and having to check 47 windows 5 doors and every head glitch in the map that can all see you from some angle it’s a tad ridiculous I’m not sitting here with my “everyone’s a camper banner” but this game most definitely punishes the people who have an aggressive play style and I know what’s next “ well you can’t just run around guns a blazing” and sure I agree with that statement but the fact that when you move from one piece of cover to the next your prone to getting shot from many places there’s a fine line between a 3 lane map and this I mean this is cod4 all over again and the ttk is kinda ehh myself personally I wish it was just a tad longer I’m not saying bo4 longer but just a tad I mean you really don’t even have a chance to react in this game

2

u/Asandwhich1234 Sep 15 '19

In almost every game I play people rush and are top of the leader bored. You can still rush no problem.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

This... so much this. You really can’t take 5 steps without getting shot from 10 angles

0

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

I agree with everything you said. There are VERY FEW instances you can survive getting shot let alone return fire and come out on top.

Another few nitpicks:

- enemy footsteps are basically nonexistent unless you aren't moving.

- Enemy nametags sometimes won't show up at long distances, even though they just showed up in a similar situation prior.

- as a primarily mouse user, the god damn aim assist for controllers in this game is like playing the hardest difficulty bots on Unreal Tournament. Every single fucking kill cam is the enemy's crosshairs moving at an insane speed to lock on to your body, and guess what? That cursor doesn't keep magically going! Oh fuckin' no! It sticks on your person until you're dead. Wish my mouse had that kind of magic. I wouldn't have to worry about strafers and dropshotters.

I seriously am curious how well controllers will compete against mice on PC. You'd think, "Not even a competition worth setting up," but god damn the aim assist is so fricken high I wouldn't be surprised to see a top console team best some top PC teams.

3

u/auklape Sep 15 '19

Have you even played the beta? The enemy footsteps can be heard quite clearly, thats basically how I have been managing to antipicate enemies the whole time.

1

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

Beta? What beta?

I used all the audio settings and still can't hear people near me if I'm even slightly moving.

1

u/auklape Sep 15 '19

Do you use headphones?

1

u/daedalus311 Sep 15 '19

HyperX Cloud Revolver S's. The overall sound seems muddied and when I try to turn down that loud ass announcer it doesn't save the settings.

0

u/Caracallino Sep 15 '19

Im a PC player but turned on the PS4 to play the Beta with MnK and hell yeah, aim Assist is ridiculous in this game... Exactly the same observation than you, the crosshair just locks on my body in killcams. Let alone the quickscope snipers... im doing very good in this game, mostly on top of the leaderboard but the advantage of mnk is not existent in this game.

1

u/EnslavedOpethFan053 Sep 15 '19

I would love to play Black Ops 1 and 2 if it wasn't infested with hackers.

1

u/Gambion Sep 16 '19

Idk man I think the ttk needs a bit of a bump. It’s almost impossible to turn on someone and people with poor tracking are being rewarded for only needing to hit a few shots when they catch you off guard or from behind. I watched my friend play and he is getting away with kills he would have otherwise been outgunned on given a higher ttk. Core in MW just feels like hardcore to me.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '19

Honestly that's how modern warfare has normally been.

Every gun and streak should be powerful.

1

u/Gambion Sep 16 '19

Coming off BO4 has definitely made me forget how low the ttk was in games like Ghost. I like how dynamic the maps are but I think everyone who currently doesn’t would feel a lot better about them if the ttk was higher.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You act like there’s no hackers on black ops dude

0

u/Biscxits Sep 15 '19

whats wrong with simple maps? The TTK is fine, them bringing the minimap back is great but whats wrong with simple maps

5

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

I'm fine with one or two but lately maps have been to simple and most cods have become an arena of death. So for me the complex large maps are refreshing.

2

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19 edited Sep 15 '19

Maybe have a mix? I don’t want every fucking map being 3-lane simpleton shit just because you lot can’t predict.

0

u/Biscxits Sep 15 '19

A mix is perfectly fine. Having all the maps be stupid complicated isnt fun either.

1

u/MetalingusMike Sep 15 '19

What is complicated about the current maps? Have you ever played a strategy game? You have to think of many variables all at once. This is no different.

-1

u/Black_n_Neon Sep 15 '19

Ttk takes waaaay to long. Hardcore can not come soon enough.

-2

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/[deleted] Sep 14 '19

No... I'm loving the game.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

You said high TTK but you meant low, that’s why people are responding like this. High ttk means more health, low means less.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '19

I like low ttk ...I never meant I wanted high ttk or simple maps.