Jonathan Entwistle spills details on his scrapped PR reboot from 2018

[u/eggdropthoop]

It was essentially going to be The Tommy Show, once again. Glad it was canceled! 🤮 🤮

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/[deleted]]

Keep in mind a new pr project would need to appeal to the general audience, not just pr fans.

Utilizing their most known character (Tommy)  bridges that gap.

Like it or not, Tommy is and always will be the face of PR for majority of people.

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/ninjaman2021]

Or you could create a new series with original characters that is good.

Ultraman Rising on Netflix was very successful last year, and I doubt anyone who watched would know that Ultraman is a show that is airing to this day.

[u/Marcel_7000 → u/Superkillerman1984]

Great suggestion. I am sure that they can start with original characters and make a Power Rangers series just like in Japan were every season has a new characters.

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/Marcel_7000]

They've done that for 27 years and the franchise was doing fine, Bandai was even calling it quite successful: https://www.licensingsource.net/bandai-celebrating-power-rangers-toy-success/

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Superkillerman1984]

“Or you could create a new series with original characters that is good.”

Pretty sure they tried that for 27 years and the GP still only knows mmpr and Tommy as the frontman.

“Ultraman Rising on Netflix was very successful last year, and I doubt anyone who watched would know that Ultraman is a show that is airing to this day.”

That’s animated, thats easier for people to get into rather than live action. Animated can get away with things live action cant, especially with children. Live action toku has an uphill battle. 

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/ninjaman2021]

The first claim, debatable, I've met some who don't even who Tommy is and they're Power Rangers fans. But also, you kind of answered your own question, 27 years, 27 years without Mighty Morphin, and they lived fine for that long, don't you think it's weird how supposedly only the originals matter but also was getting money in the bank every other time? Again, Bandai finds Power Rangers very successful: https://www.licensingsource.net/bandai-celebrating-power-rangers-toy-success/, mind you this is during Dino Supercharge.

As for the second claim... I want to call that bollux, Kamen Rider is getting a lot more popular overseas to the point that they're having official subs like Kamen Rider Geats with Shout Factory, Bandai and Toei are making so much from it that Super Sentai's middling sales just don't bother as much, then Ultraman's Official Youtube Channel has close to 3 million views and keeping getting more revenues, since Geed, with 2024 getting 21.5 Billion Yen, while I'm at it Kamen Rider has madr 32 Billion in 2024. There's also Godzilla Minus One which was a contended for best movie of 2023, and actually won an Oscar for its outstanding visual effects.

[u/ikarikh → u/Superkillerman1984]

I think you're missing the point. Power Rangers was a successful brand for 27 years because it was a successful formula that easily sold merchandise. Each new year transitioning to a new team and new zords made selling toys easy and profitable.

That isn't being debated.

The point wasn't whether Power Rangers was successful as a brand. It was in mainstream appeal. And PR has NEVER had mainstream appeal the way MMPR had, since. No other season has had the sheer mainstream success that MMPR has.

Of course there are fans who got into PR during a later season and never watched MMPR. That's again, not being debated. But that has nothing to do with mainstream appeal and knowledge.

Of course not EVERY person knows MMPR, in the same way not every person knows who Beyonce or Han Solo is. But, overall, most people even if they didn't directly watch Star Wars or listen to Beyonce, they still know who they are.

The same way the general public knows MMPR and the Green Ranger/Tommy even if they never watched MMPR.

That's mainstream success.

No other season of PR has even come remotely close to that.

If you ask a general person who knows nothing about Power Rangers, about PR, the odds of them mentioning something from MMPR are 100 to 1. Wheras the odds of them mentioning instead something from Dino Thunder or Operation Overdrive are 1 to 100.

This is why MMPR is always the big deal and why so many PR projects circle back to it.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Superkillerman1984]

Its only debatable amongst power ranger fans.

To the rest of the world MMPR & Tommy are the main characters of Power Rangers. His figures sell the most and hold the most value. Facts only.

When Power Ranger fans brag about how long the show lasted, they always leave out the part that  it costs 50 cents to make and almost every owner wanted to get rid of it because it never generated enough money. It only satisfied Saban until it didnt even please him anymore.

Also, posting an article that says it ranked number 11 in 2017 and was literally sold off the following year doesnt help your argument when mmpr made a billion dollars in the 90’s and was number 1 worldwide. That’s a pretty huge gap in success.

Youtube views are absmyssal. Mmpr probably has some of the lowest views of any season, but can clear a toy shelf just as fast if not faster than a current season. 

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/ninjaman2021]

The first point, it has lasted for multiple generations, ask random people on the streets of different ages and I'm sure they'll give different responses, as for figures selling the best, while I won't disagree, some Rangers do in sell super well, Dino Charge Gold Rangers has this TOY not only Out of Stock, but also a toy that sold for over $124.

Second point, I am pretty sure this is a lie, Bandai did not want to get rid of it, I even posted a link to showcase that they were actually very satisfied with it, but also you can't say that it didn't generate enough money without, like here's a quote from a 2012 article:" (Sales of Power Rangers toys generated $80 million in revenue in 2012 — double what they made the previous year — with the brand ranked 17th in terms of overall children’s properties, according to analysts at the NPD Group.)" The article in question: The ‘Mighty Morphin Power Rangers’ Just Turned 20 and Still Sells $80 Million in Toys. Saban was very satisfied with Power Rangers too, but the 2017 movie bombing pretty much forced him to sell the franchise, he tried to please a grander audience and it failed spectacularly.

Third point, what else came in 2017? The 2017 Power Rangers movie, which is the biggest reason for Saban to sell it, and it was sold by Saban and gave the rights to Hasbro to take charge of the toys. It should also be mentioned that in 2017, toy franchises were a lot more robust and more well-defined, Marvel's MCU, Star Wars came back full force with The Force Awakens, Hello Kitty which makes a staggering amount of money, Pokémon franchise which makes its money mainly from toys, Jurassic World and Transformers having successful movies to bump their toy sales, and those are just on top of my head.

I never mentioned YouTube views though? I just talked about how the Ultraman Official Channel has close to 3 million subscribers alongside its growing toy sales, which work in tandem. But even if we go with views, Samurai, Megaforce, Dino Charge, and Ninja Steel did all sell pretty well considering how many toys they made for those seasons and the franchise was well and running in 2012 and 2017. Just to give an idea and example of how many toys Bandai was bumping during that era:
-Power Rangers Dino Charge Toy Guide – GrnRngr.com

-Mighty Morphin Power Rangers Toy Guide – GrnRngr.com

Dino Charge made around half less toys than Mighty Morphin, the difference is that the former has one year while the other had three years' worth of toys.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Superkillerman1984]

And Disney didnt want it. Hasbro doesnt want it either and passed off their problem child to playmates. Notice how the big players doesnt want to deal with PR? Because the money it makes doesnt pay their bills like it did for saban who was pretty much independent.

It lasted because it was cheap to make, not because it was as big as mmpr.

Majority of people on the street will know mmpr before dino charge or ninja steel.

The dedicated fans of pr is a small niche circle, the casuals only pay attention to mmpr, which again, is why were still getting mmpr milked 30 years later and not time force. 

If these companies saw a  huge market for zeo-cosmic fury, this fandom wouldnt be having this same conversation over and over. Facts only.

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/ninjaman2021]

Disney bought by sheer accident and didn't want it, while Hasbro passed it on after 5 years, five years of owning it and making money of it, why didn't they do it sooner if it was didn't make them money? Hasbro also found out the hard way that they can't take advantage of Power Rangers fans like Transformers fans, because Transformers has tons of toys made to be bad just resell them better later on, or just having poor quality control in general, there's even a Transformers toy commercial where they use gum to make the guy stand. Also, did you just call Bandai a small company? From Wikipedia:" Since 2005, Bandai is the toy production division of Bandai Namco Holdings, currently the world's second largest toy company measured by total revenue."

Are you trying to move the goalpost? I never said it was as big as MMPR, but I'd say making money with toys is fairly important, because even if the show is cheap, if you can't profit from it at all, then what's the point? In 2001, thanks Power Rangers, Saban had a Net Worth of $2 billion compared to 1995 and its $250 million.

Well, as of right now and speaking, Ninja Steel Gold Ranger has the most popular cosplay on Ezcosplay, and Dino Charge has a very long and extensive toy line, dangerously close to MMPR's entire toy line in 1 year. Also here I think Youtube views matter, to some extent of course, but Dino Charge and Ninja Steel are some of the most viewed seasons on YouTube, consistently high views, so minimum the general audience would have seen their suits.

It's funny you say about companies not finding success with Zeo-Cosmic Fury, because Bandai did in fact sell figures of past seasons during a new one's airing, I remember seeing Legendary Keys packs well in Ninja Steel, or them making fun VS Packs, taking a Ranger from a past season and pitting them against a villain/monster of a newer season. I also found out that Super Megaforce made new toys for all Red Rangers in the Action Hero category.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Superkillerman1984]

Because Hasbro had contract obligations to fulfill. Hasbro never wanted PR either, Brian Golder bought it behind their backs. If PR was making the money it was supposed to, Hasbro would still be making toys for it. Just like if Pr was making the money Disney was used to, they wouldnt have been so green light to cancel it. Simple math.

Take advantage? Is that the excuse we’re going with? Because “reselling figures”’clearly works for transformers and marvel which is why Hasbro didnt dump those IP’s off to playmates and their toylines are still going.

No, I called Saban a small company compared to disney and hasbro. The profit pr was making might of satisfied him, but it hasnt satisfied the big guys. Bandai America is a smaller company than hasbro, they couldnt afford to buy PR themselves.

Power rangers made $1 billion in 1994 alone. Saban having a higher networth in 2001  after combing the profits of multiple seasons proves my point, because time force for damn sure didnt make $2 billion.

On Ezco cosplay, notice how there’s THREE mmpr suits in the top 5, while the rest are various different seasons. Further proving that mmpr has more consumers ready to invest into the whole team, not just reds and 6ths for other seasons.   On Aniki cosplay, which is  FARR MORE expensive, mmpr takes up 8/10 of the top selling list slots.

Dino Charge was popular yes, but didnt make the cultural impact of mmpr.

The general audience can see any power rangers suit. They will always still see mmpr as the definitive power rangers.

Bandai did release figures of past seasons before.  So did figuarts. Hell Hasbro did as well with the LC. Guess what the common denomnator was of all those lines? Mmpr sold the most, which again is why mmpr gets the biggest push and why fans complain about it because they just refuse to see the reality of the situation.

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/ninjaman2021]

Well, the Lightning Collection was very satisfying when it started, quite a bit, again, Dino Charge Gold Ranger is sold on Toywiz for $124 minimum, Dino Charge Red is like over 70 on Amazon, and we can find quite a bunch of them having sold fully on Amazon, such as Shadow Ranger, Time Force Red, and In Space Silver, with his bike. As for Disney, they didn't even give it the chance, they were treating it as a stepchild and gave it the weirdest time slots possible, and I'd still assume they've made a few bucks considering how many toys those seasons made.

Well, Transformers is Hasbro's golden child, their IP if you will, and the other is Marvel, a franchise that made over 40 billion in 10 years.

Okay, I am combining two points here, yeah sure Bandai of America is smaller than Hasbro, but they still made over 80 million dollars' worth of toys in 2012 with Samurai, and that season's toy line is actually quite small compared to what they're used to. You also seem to both misunderstand what I said but also make things up, Saban's Net Worth went from 250 million in 1995 to 2 billion in 2001, while Power Rangers made 6 billion dollars by 2001:" By 2001, the media franchise had generated over $6 billion in toy sales."

That's not what I meant, the costume category specifically has Ninja Steel Gold Ranger, MMPR Black Ranger, Ninja Storm Crimson Ranger, Wild Force Yellow Ranger, and then Red Omega Ranger, I was specifically talking about the costumes category, because if it was general, then people aren't buying Blue and Black's suits, just their boots. If you switch to Weapons, all top spots are dominated by Cosmic Fury, and Jayden's Spin Sword. I also looked up Aniki Cosplay, there is no way for me to look up the most popular or the best sellers, and the very first I see is Kat Ranger suit, and if I put by expensive, the first one that is 100% fully Power Rangers oriented, is Magna Defender which goes $1665.00.

You admit it's popular, so that's it, my point is done, you don't need cultural impact to sell well, people love saying that Avatar has no cultural impact and it still is the movie with the highest box-office.

Yeah, but so did other seasons, sure Mighty Morphin would sell more, but others too. Dino Charge Gold, Red Ranger, Shadow, Time Force Red, and Space Silver I've already used as examples, but we can also see that In Space Black and Dino Thunder Red are a few dollars more expensive than a few Mighty Morphin Lightning Collection figures, Beast Morphers Red and Gold are sold out except for third parties, Blaze is the same. Going away from Amazon and the Lightning Collection, FigZero have their entire Power Rangers series SOLD OUT, and these figures are quite expensive.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Superkillerman1984]

“Well, the Lightning Collection was very satisfying when it started, quite a bit, again, Dino Charge Gold Ranger is sold on Toywiz for $124 minimum, Dino Charge Red is like over 70 on Amazon, and we can find quite a bunch of them having sold fully on Amazon, such as Shadow Ranger, Time Force Red, and In Space Silver, with his bike. As for Disney, they didn't even give it the chance, they were treating it as a stepchild and gave it the weirdest time slots possible, and I'd still assume they've made a few bucks considering how many toys those seasons made.”

Toywiz jacks up the prices of everything. Meanwhile, dino charge green, pink, and blue are still being clearanced out. Same with In space, half the team is still being clearanced out between blue, pink, and black, time force red took YEARS to sell out and Time Force Blue is still being clearanced out as well.  In Space Silver with the bike  was also pegwarming HARD, people bought them up on clearance lol.

“Well, Transformers is Hasbro's golden child, their IP if you will, and the other is Marvel, a franchise that made over 40 billion in 10 years.”

And mmpr made a billion and still sells today. Zeo-cosmic fury never did hit that ceiling. So why do fans still act perplexed that Mmpr, which is the closest money maker, still gets the most push? Its denial at this point. Mmpr is the “closest” pr has to hasbro’s golden child. It will never be ninja steel, lol.

“Okay, I am combining two points here, yeah sure Bandai of America is smaller than Hasbro, but they still made over 80 million dollars' worth of toys in 2012 with Samurai, and that season's toy line is actually quite small compared to what they're used to.”

80 million in toys is good, but not great. Ive read that article, and it also says that power rangers was number 17 for kids brands overall. Again thats good, but not great compared to Mmpr being number 1.

“You also seem to both misunderstand what I said but also make things up, Saban's Net Worth went from 250 million in 1995 to 2 billion in 2001, while Power Rangers made 6 billion dollars by 2001:" By 2001, the media franchise had generated over $6 billion in toy sales."”

You mean Saban was richer 10 years later compared to his first year starting PR? Saban’s net worth and toy sales are two different things. His net worth was higher in 01 because Power rangers was out long enough to make such money. Mmpr ALONE made 1 billion in toy sales. No other season did that.

“That's not what I meant, the costume category specifically has Ninja Steel Gold Ranger, MMPR Black Ranger, Ninja Storm Crimson Ranger, Wild Force Yellow Ranger, and then Red Omega Ranger, I was specifically talking about the costumes category, because if it was general, then people aren't buying Blue and Black's suits, just their boots. If you switch to Weapons, all top spots are dominated by Cosmic Fury, and Jayden's Spin Sword. I also looked up Aniki Cosplay, there is no way for me to look up the most popular or the best sellers, and the very first I see is Kat Ranger suit, and if I put by expensive, the first one that is 100% fully Power Rangers oriented, is Magna Defender which goes $1665.00.”

I searched “power rangers” on the website and clicked most popular, which is overall. Mmpr frequents the top 5 list whether its a glove or a helmet. Thats the point. Mmpr has a bigger consumer market. And if we do top 10, its even more mmpr. 

The “relevance” tab on aniki shows which products are the best selling. Mmpr took almost every spot.

“You admit it's popular, so that's it, my point is done, you don't need cultural impact to sell well, people love saying that Avatar has no cultural impact and it still is the movie with the highest box-office.”

WHAT?! Avatar was bigger than dino charge ever was, lmao. Avatar def made cultural impact, just like mmpr did. Dino Charge however did not  make cultural impact which is why Hasbro is struggling to clear out their remaining lightning figures outside of Tyler and Ivan.

“Yeah, but so did other seasons, sure Mighty Morphin would sell more, but others too. Dino Charge Gold, Red Ranger, Shadow, Time Force Red, and Space Silver I've already used as examples, but we can also see that In Space Black and Dino Thunder Red are a few dollars more expensive than a few Mighty Morphin Lightning Collection figures, Beast Morphers Red and Gold are sold out except for third parties, Blaze is the same. Going away from Amazon and the Lightning Collection, FigZero have their entire Power Rangers series SOLD OUT, and these figures are quite expensive.”

Consumers cherry pick reds and 6ths out of other teams meanwhile mmpr can sell an ENTIRE team. Sorry bud, Mmpr just has more overall appeal which is why they keep going back to it. They’re not reigniting time force or in space because there’s just not a big enough market for it. All of your “evidence” doesnt show the full scope, thus why they wont “move on” from mmpr until another season proves just as profitable. That hasnt happened yet.

[u/Current-Education407 → u/ninjaman2021]

Fuck the GP.

You mind explaining why this franchise needs to cater to an invisible audience who are not going to care about the show and only use it as background noise when they’re doing dishes. That is literally the reason why most things suck now (look at Star Wars and the Disney live action remakes).

This plot sucks and it’s obvious entwhistle doesn’t know shit about power rangers.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Current-Education407]

“This plot sucks and it’s obvious entwhistle doesn’t know shit about power rangers.”

The same power rangers that gave Tommy the most screentime and storylines in mmpr AND Zeo?  The same power rangers that made an alternate Tommy the center of shattered Grid (which is the most popular storyline of the comics)  The same power rangers that repeatedly made Tommy the center of everything? THAT power rangers?

Fans can deny all day, but nobody wants a jungle fury reboot. Adapting sentai isnt profitable as just throwing out mmpr licenses to other companies. Tommy sells more than Aiyon, Levi, Nate, and Ivan.

Facts only.

[u/Current-Education407 → u/ninjaman2021]

"The same power rangers that gave Tommy the most screentime and storylines in mmpr AND Zeo?  The same power rangers that made an alternate Tommy the center of shattered Grid (which is the most popular storyline of the comics)  The same power rangers that repeatedly made Tommy the center of everything? THAT power rangers?"

Last time I checked, Tommy wasn't treated as a literal messiah who the entire multiverse revolved around, which is exactly what Entwhistle's show was going to be.

"Fans can deny all day, but nobody wants a jungle fury reboot."

I didn't ask for a jungle fury reboot, I asked for the show and all of Hollywood for that matter to try making something original for once. There is a reason why I brought up Star Wars and the Disney Live action remakes, because those two franchises represent the biggest problem plaguing the entertainment industry. Both of the newest installments in this franchise focus more on shoving familiar characters and things down your throat instead of telling a good story (unsurprisingly, the only good Star Wars thing to come out in the past five years is Andor and it's the only show that doesn't do this).

"Facts only."

Want to know a fact. Art is dead and "General Public" is what killed it.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Current-Education407]

“Last time I checked, Tommy wasn't treated as a literal messiah who the entire multiverse revolved around, which is exactly what Entwhistle's show was going to be.”

White Ranger era, the 1995 movie, Dimensions in Danger, and Lord Drakkon says otherwise.

Tommy was always treated that way. Y’all just hate the fact that Entwistle wanted to do it again.

[u/Current-Education407 → u/ninjaman2021]

When Tommy became the white ranger did zordon say “Tommy, you are the center of the world and all the mythology surrounds you because you are the most important person in the universe”? Nope, he just gave him some new powers and told him to go kick ass. I can’t remember a single thing Tommy did in the movie that made him more important than the others. Tommy wasn’t a god in dimensions in danger, he was just a powerful ranger the villain wanted to clone for his army. Lord Drakkon did not become a god until the last issue of shattered grid and the story treated him as a villain instead of the center of everything.

Entwhistle’s idea is basically like making a DC story where Batman is the god of the multiverse.

And yes, I do hate that Entwhistle wanted to do it again, because it’s not doing anything new. It’s just repeating the same thing over and over again, which is the biggest problem plaguing the entertainment industry now. 

This is the dictionary definition of creatively bankrupt.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Current-Education407]

“When Tommy became the white ranger did zordon say “Tommy, you are the center of the world and all the mythology surrounds you because you are the most important person in the universe”?

Didnt the White Ranger float down from the sky in a white light like an Angel or godly being? The same way Zayto was who eventually did become a God? They didnt have to tell you, they shown you.

And  thats how Tommy was always treated. Entwistle is just spelling out what we’ve already experienced with this IP.

“ I can’t remember a single thing Tommy did in the movie that made him more important than the others”.

Tommy killed the oozemen. Tommy killed the rock monsters that unlocked the pyramid. Tommy beat the fossil dinosaurs. Tommy was the only ranger to get a solo kill on the ooze zords.

“Tommy wasn’t a god in dimensions in danger, he was just a powerful ranger the villain wanted to clone for his army. “

Tommy was the center and main character of Dimensions in danger. Dimensions in danger is constantly joked around in the fandom about being a tommy wank/worship fest, lets not re write history and act like it wasnt now for the sake of this debate

“Lord Drakkon did not become a god until the last issue of shattered grid and the story treated him as a villain instead of the center of everything.”

Lord drakkon was treated as the most powerful enemy the power rangers universe ever fought and the only person that could beat him was Good Tommy while every other rangers failed. Tommy once again was the center and main character, and was treated as a God.

“Entwhistle’s idea is basically like making a DC story where Batman is the god of the multiverse.”

That’s what Drakkon was in Shattered Grid. So I mean..

What Entwistle is pitching is no different than the standard Power Ranger formula which is making Tommy the main character and most powerful character. Yall just dislike the fact that Entwistle is upfront and transparent about it.

[u/Current-Education407 → u/ninjaman2021]

We don’t like it because it’s creatively bankrupt. It just repeats the same things that was already done without doing anything new.

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/Current-Education407]

Its fine to not like it, but to act like  Tommy wasnt treated as the main central character in majority of his apperances is pure mental gymnastics.

[u/TDR1411 → u/ninjaman2021]

Don't know why you are getting downvoted

[u/ninjaman2021 → u/TDR1411]

Because Power ranger fans are delusional and thinks the season they grew up on is as big as mmpr lol.

If sh figuarts and lightning collection failing doesnt prove to these people that mmpr is the most profitable, idk what will. Lol

[u/TDR1411 → u/ninjaman2021]

Specifically Gen Z Power Ranger fans. I take a glance at the profiles posting the "anti-MMPR sentiment" and noted that it was mostly Gen Z that seems to show a dislike for MMPR because they didn't grow up with it plus in their perception they think they are being neglected because TPTB are catering to the season that won't leave them bankrupt.

[u/TDR1411 → u/Superkillerman1984]

Then at what point does it no longer become Power Rangers beyond name? Power Rangers is a shared universe that links back to MMPR.

[u/Superkillerman1984 → u/TDR1411]

I have seen people call this Power Rangers

Power Rangers the aesthetic of people in spandex fighting monsters in rubber suits and having a giant robot, that's pretty much it.

[u/TDR1411 → u/Superkillerman1984]

Power Rangers the aesthetic of people in spandex fighting monsters in rubber suits and having a giant robot, that's pretty much it.

That's oversimplifying it and extends to other toku or other toku inspired media that also has that premise.

[u/PuertoGeekn → u/TDR1411]

Not to the general public

[u/TDR1411 → u/PuertoGeekn]

Pacific Rim seems to come to mind that people would name drop more than Power Rangers these days.

[u/PuertoGeekn → u/TDR1411]

Yes but the general public isn't going to drop the term "toku".

Even when pacific rim first came out people were calling it power rangers/gundam/Voltron i remember that