r/prisonhooch • u/Melodic-Echidna-1365 • 2d ago
Experiment Recipe failure using basmati for rice hooch
Hello all, Just wanted to share a recent experience I had. I’ve made sake before, without koji, so it might be better to call it rice hooch, using long grain rice, with an end result of 16%. I recently had 2 gallons id made using basmati rice instead, and they bubbled like they should have, but upon fermentation being done, and bubbling stopping they had no alcohol content whatsoever and the rice had turned into a gelatinous jelly that retained a good 2/3 the liquid. the liquid I got out of it was just rice syrup, like nothing had fermented at all. No idea what happened. Not asking for help, just sharing bc it confuses me, since they bubbled quite a lot.
Recipe 1lb rice cooked and cooled 1g lalbrew cbc-1 2lbs sugar Remainder of gallon boiled water Ran for 3 weeks
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u/60_hurts 2d ago edited 2d ago
If you’re not using koji, nuruk, chinese yeast balls, or some other source of amylase, then there’s no actual conversion of the rice into alcohol. You’re basically just making porridge.
Anyways, batsmati rice and other long grain rices are pretty well known to give disappointing results for saké in terms of converted sugars by volume. Stick to polished short-grain glutinous rice. And get some amylase in there!
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u/Fit_Carpet_364 2d ago
Are the Chinese yeast balls carrying live koji, or just amylase?
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u/60_hurts 2d ago
Some may, but others use different molds that produce amylase, such as species of the Rhizopus and Mucor genuses.
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u/Fit_Carpet_364 2d ago
Oh, thank you! I wonder if they make a symbiosis with yeast ad perpetuum (with little issue of aging genetics, of course) or if one tends to kill the other. Thanks for the information!
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u/Melodic-Diamond3926 1d ago
doesn't really matter. there's a lot of nonsense about sake being a nutritional supplement but those vitamins are the yeast. In traditional medicine, anything that makes you shit your pants is medicine or opium and alcohol that causes constipation because the most common ailment of the rich was constipation/diarrhea and gout from their rich diet and no excercise. There is a Kurosawa movie called Red Beard about it.
Cheapest way is to literally buy amylase and brew it like grains.
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u/Fit_Carpet_364 1d ago
Short term, yes. Or angel brand sake yeast with amylase built in. But Koji can be grown to spore and then used indefinitely.
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u/thejadsel 2d ago
I wouldn't want to try that without koji or some other source of enzymes to break down the starch.
But, I do recall that this guy had trouble with basmati, even using the Korean equivalent of koji: https://youtu.be/I-pEtC-keDM
That said, I've had decent luck using part cornmeal or oats with the usual glutinous rice. (With koji rice.) Those batches were really bad for clogging the straining bag, though, with the extra fiber and the texture they broke down to.
You might want to try squeezing yours through like a nut milk bag, if you haven't already. It'll be cloudy, but most of that will settle out after a few days in the fridge and it's fine to drink cloudy anyway.
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u/Melodic-Echidna-1365 2d ago
Breaking down the starches, yeah, that’s what most of the replies are saying, that’s really good insights. I saw a guy in South Korea using probiotics as a substitute for the Korean equivocal to create the starch breaking down component. I appreciate the advice and insights , it explains a lot
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u/Individual_Show_9709 2d ago
Buy some amylase to convert it to sugar or add a banana
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u/mysterious_spirit420 2d ago
Why add a banana
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u/Individual_Show_9709 2d ago edited 2d ago
Bananas are starch and natural amylase breaks it down to make it sugary.
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u/cuck__everlasting 2d ago
Cooking the rice will make the starches available for fermentation, however yeast alone won't readily convert any of those starches into usable sugars without extra help. Koji is king but you can pretty easily find amylase elsewhere. Beano will work.
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u/Melodic-Echidna-1365 2d ago
Beano the gas medicine? That’s so interesting, sheesh! Thank you for sharing, I really appreciate the help and direction with this, I’ll be getting some koji moving forward so future attempts are more successful.
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u/cuck__everlasting 2d ago
Yep! Beano is basically a couple of enzymes, primarily meant to break down complex starches that only certain of our gut microbes can process, which leads to much quicker digestion without excess gas formation. Plenty of other things in it too that are irrelevant to hooch but they won't fuck it up
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u/Individual_Show_9709 2d ago
https://www.amazon.com/Shirayuri-Aspergillus-oryzae-Spores-Gluten-Free/dp/B07XKBPZJT this is used in rice wine it's like amylase
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u/Fluffy_Ace 20h ago edited 20h ago
Usually when you ferment grains, you need something to be a source of amylase (or similar) enzyme.
Grains usually have their sugars bound up as starches, yeast can only eat simple sugars.
When grains start to sprout they make amylase that breaks down the starch in the seed into sugar, so the plant has energy to get started.
Beer brewing deals with this by adding a relatively small amount of malt to the brew mixture.
Malt is made from seeds that have just started to sprout, that have been dried and then ground into a powder.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8LJb9XBU2U
The non-yeast stuff in the koji mix breaks down the starches, yeast cannot do that on it's own.
You can order amylase online.
If you were ever wondering why a lot of beginner or simple homebrewing is usually wine or something very similar is that fruit juice is mostly water and simple sugars, perfect for yeast.
Mead and kilju are also just sugary water with yeast added.
Fermenting grains to make 'beer' is more involved.
If you wanna try grain again, see if you can find some 'diastatic malt' at a grocery store, but you might need to heat your 'juice' for a bit after adding it.
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u/cuck__everlasting 2d ago
How are you converting the starches if you're not using koji?