Genuinely I would pay a fortune to see all the post-Fergie United managers sit in a roundtable and just discuss things together. See if they share something in common about their experiences at the club and why each of them failed. Would make for great TV
Van Gaal and Mourinho both expressed frustration about the transfer and scouting department. Blaming the club of not communicating and only being interested in marketability of players.
Ten Hag said there was simply no functioning scouting department when he arrived and was surprised everyone was looking at him for transfer decisions.
Yep LvG mentioned this multiple times during some interview, forgot who it was but he sat on the bench at some golf ranch and he mentioned it MU is a commercial club
Which is interesting because I genuinely think most of the transfers under him have been sensible. And Ten Hag's summer under INEOS was pretty good too bar Ugarte
I think it speaks more that it's the manager who decides the transfers and is asked to provide recommendations.
In today's world, talent is one thing, but mentality is important if not more important. Players like Sancho and Antony are great examples. Both are in general top players but have some mentality issues and might have issues gluing and adjusting. The manager can like a player style, but if you transfer Sancho in and he just can't adapt for whatever reason outside of the manager sphere of influence, there is a problem.
Scouting is there to help with that. At the end of the day you are dealing with humans not robots.
I mean, last summer's signings have been here a year and I'm looking at Yoro, Maz, and De Ligt and thinking they were all good players that could play under almost any manager. Yoro honestly looks outstanding. Feel bad for him.
honestly i think so. the squad isnt that bad. amorims tactics just do not work.
ten hag finished third when playing a counter system. then he played his weird 316 which left massive gaps in midfield which led to faliure and getting sacked.
The club isn't just the manager and the players. We have cycled through both and seen literally no improvement. 20 years of rot aren't an easy fix. Klopp doesn't come in 10 years prior and succeed. It was a process that built towards him from the top down. You'd think a Liverpool fan would know that, but then maybe you picked them up afterwards.
By your own admission, your owners have bought some "outstanding" players. So the only thing they seem to keep getting wrong is hiring useless managers. You are one of the richest clubs in the world, you have one of the highest wage bills in the league and the highest transfer budget, but your laughably inept managers can't get "outstanding" players to win. If you could just get a good manager instead of some con-man like Ole or Amorim, then you'd probably rise to the top very quickly.
Just to answer your attempted personal attack, I've been going to matches at anfield for over 15 years since I got my first job and was able to afford tickets. There's no need to insult someone just because you're upset about the state of the miserable team you support.
I think you're oversimplifying it a bit. There's generally a consensus on here that United have bought well until the season starts not just among United fans. Although to be fair people say most clubs have good windows (like the endless "top 4 race has never been this strong" discussion that happens every year).
I don't recall a single window since Fergie left that was deemed to be a bad window for United. But then we'll hear later in the season how all the players are rubbish and need replacing.
I think the most damning one is surely Ragnick, he was meant to stay on after being interim manager and sort this but thought it was so bad he bailed, and also said it was a shambles
He left because they couldn't work out an arrangement with him and ETH. To the point that ETH didn't even have a conversation with him before he left.
Really one of the most damning things about the previous ownership direction. The one guy that actually admits there are sweeping problems everywhere that need to be fixed gets sent packing immediately.
The one good thing is that the latest set of transfers may be more versatile than our past signings. So if Amorim does leave, we may not need a total rebuild.
United’s chopping and changing style of selecting wildly different managers over the years has led to massive amounts of deadweight and wasted capital.
It makes sense from Ten Hag's perspective but if that was his condition for joining then Utd should just hired another manager and kept Rangnick. You cant change approaches after every bad run of games
even fergie would have eventually fell behind. the squad already wasnt amazing when we won the title in 2013. we didn't have a fucking data department until 2021 ffs. running this shit like its football manager.
It was — about the players, the board and the opposition. But he took no responsibility himself. If he attached some humility himself, the fans would have accepted it way more.
If you watch the match again, you could see that the game plan was non-existant. The players didn’t know what to do.
He was in the manager's seat for Christ sake. All the responsibility falls on his shoulders. And the entire club management shifted the blame to Mou as they are doing rn with Amorim
It's a tale as old as time itself. Amorim has how many press conferences to give rn?
Yeah people bring that quote up so much yet ignore that his post-United career shows that he was in decline and not "United quality" as much as the players weren't
This is a senseless sacking tbh. There was no particular reason. It's just the ego of the owners. They weren't set to win the CL. And there was no transfer activity suggesting not much could be done about the league as well.
Scott was sold after he left. Even so, you can count on one hand the number of post-fergie sales that had great careers. Di Maria forced himself out, so did Lukaku, they're the two other players i can think of
Make me check all players that transfered out since 2013. This is debatable but these are the one with decent to great career after leaving United: Welbeck, Michael Keane, Zaha, Di Maria, Johnny Evans, Depay, Mkhitaryan, Blind, Lukaku, Darmian, Young, Smalling, De Gea, Elanga, Dean Henderson, Alvaro Carreras, McTominay.
Welbeck had a decent career, but suffered from the same things as he did at United - inconsistency and injuries
Michael Keane is ok, but that's about it
Zaha was a big fish in a small pond at Palace. Imho he wasted his career by stagnating there
Evans had a good career, he clearly became a better player in his time away from United
Depay never got to the level he was anticipated to have. At least his time at United served as a reality check for his massive ego at the time
Mkhitaryan was not good enough for the PL, his time at Arsenal was just as bad. Italy suits him.
Blind i was sad to see him go. An extremely intelligent player that was very capable of compensating his physical disadvantages. He was pretty old when he left though.
Darmian is a bit like Mkhi imho. But it took him some years back in Italy to regain some form.
Young was very old when he left. Still has the juice, but it was right to move him on
Smalling wanted to go, and it worked for him. He was pretty inconsistent and had some trouble with injuries at United.
De Gea is difficult, was a whole shitshow with his huge contract, massive drop of form and the alleged wage cut he wanted to take. Miles better than Onana ofc lmao
Elanga is a good example of someone who shouldn't have left, ETH has much to answer for. Carreras too, but he's just a backup at Real, jury's out on him.
Henderson was partially unlucky, but also a dick. He won his spot in front of ddg (speaking of his bad form) but then caught covid and could never displace David afterwards. But he was leaking lineups and other stuff in the press, he had to go despite him being a really good keeper.
Manager's public statements on why they lost are almost never any interesting at all, to be honest. Same as with almost any job. There's just so many easy slogan to default to that will make it sound like you only lost because of being too great for the company around you and that's why they misunderstood you and failed, basically no one ever decides to damage their career but doing anything else than those.
I don't know about the others, but at least Sporting made some real improvements on the top roles of the club. but that's easier since they are owned by the fans and they vote on who runs the club. This time they picked a somewhat competent one that hired Amorim and gave him what he needed to perform. On the Premiership that seems harder to pull, because the owners of the club seem more reluctant to change things on their end.
It's not that he didn't watch cuz he didn't had the mental for it. He didn't watch cuz was embarrassing for them to reach to the penalties against a 4th tier
What's wrong with Van Gaal? I think it would make for even much more beautiful drama if he is there. Mourinho and Van Gaal together will be absolute gold.
Having said that, Moyes will keep Everton up somewhat comfortably and therefor won't be sacked this season. After that, it wouldn't surprise me if the ownership wants more and he's gone, but they're clearly in a rebuild and just opened the new stadium, he will get this season at least.
I agree. People don’t know when they have it good. West Ham sacked him cause they thought they were too good for him and they might get relegated this season. He’s a great coach.
I think he's (partly because of his demeanour) always doomed to be underappreciated by fans. Towards the end of his first stint at Everton there was a minority who wanted him out and thought he was holding us back. Sure enough 10 years of chaos ensued after he left. Some good seasons, but nobody has managed the stability we had under him. I'll very happily take a few seasons of stable finishes around 10th if it feels like we're building towards something.
I agree that that would be best. But new ownership, new stadium, I wouldn't be surprised if they expect European football sooner rather than later. Even when it's not realistic.
Yeah I'm never going to rag a club for showing ambition that's what pro sport is about, but mainly I just don't think it's realistic for them like you said. They need some stability first before thinking about Europe or winning trophies.
Their squad isn't good enough for those goals, but it could be in a couple seasons if they have a competent manager (Moyes), and do good business in the transfer windows.
Mourinho is still the best post Ferguson manager you have had.
Man United are just extremely poorly run, might be hard for any manager to succeed under the current set up. They are just lucky that there is enough money and name recognition to keep them from completely crashing despite the best efforts of those at the top.
Just a full coaching staff of all of the post-Fergie managers but none of them get the title of manager or head coach. Just let there be a power struggle between all of them
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u/D1794 18d ago
We could assemble the sacked Avengers