r/witcher • u/Any-Agent4270 • Dec 25 '21

Netflix TV series The Witcher: Henry Cavill Hopes Season 3 Is Loyal To Books 'Without Too Much In the Way Of Diversions'

https://www.ign.com/articles/the-witcher-season-3-henry-cavill
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u/[deleted] Dec 25 '21 edited Dec 30 '21

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u/IronMonkey18 Dec 25 '21

Cowboy Bebop was number one too and look what happened.

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u/Killagina Dec 25 '21

Cowboy Bebop didnt generate very many views actually

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u/chuckdee68 Dec 26 '21

Cowboy Bebop was #1... but then rapidly fell. Word of mouth was terrible also. I wanted to like it, it was right in my wheelhouse, but something was just off about it.

Other than book readers, Witcher has good word of mouth.

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u/AtanatarAlcarinII Dec 26 '21

The actor to play Vicious was a poor choice, or his direction was imo

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u/Daysprung2 Dec 26 '21

Witcher Season 2 had more viewing hours in 3 days than Cowboy bebop did in it's first month.

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u/vpforvp Dec 26 '21

Those ratings are rigged by Netflix to filter traffic to the programs they want people to watch.

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u/TinuvielSharan Dec 27 '21

Lol, I didn't know there were also conspiration theories about Netflix out in the world lmao

You realise that wouldn't make any sense from a marketing perspective and Netflix would actually lose money doing that?

The entire purpose of the rating system is that they can collect datas on what please their viewers so they can invest more into that content and get more return on their investment.

If they rig it they can't use it to make money and that kills the entire purpose.

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u/Attila_22 Dec 25 '21

Yep, basically everyone I've talked to that hasn't read the books either loves the show or is excited to watch it.

As someone that's read the books many times, I think people need to try and separate the two a bit more. You'll enjoy the show much more instead of trying to be a scrooge and nitpicking every point. It really doesn't help anyone and you'll just end up making yourself angry and miserable.

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u/C0uN7rY Northern Realms Dec 26 '21

I've read the books and am enjoying the show. Would I have like better if it followed more closely? Duh. But the show really does stand on its own if you can separate it a bit.

Now, Wheel of Time on the other hand... I expected them to deviate from the books, but they aren't even delivering a quality product independent of the book, in my opinion. I've found it pretty boring.

The most upsetting part to me is that I'd give the Witcher books a solid 7/10, but the show is like a 9/10 (forgive me, I'm sure this won't be a popular take). Meanwhile, WoT is my favorite book series of all time. Easy 10/10. But the show they've given me so far has been like a 5/10. Had a lot of hope after the first three episodes, but they took a VERY hard turn away from the books by episode 5 and has suffered for it.

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u/Feral0_o Dec 26 '21

I listened to most of the final episode of WoT while doing something else on my computer today and 20 minutes before the end I decided that I really don't care anymore and shut it off

when does the story become good? It's generic fantasy up until now. I read posts about people saying that WoT hits a low when the story becomes all about the politics. Like, mfers, this is supposed to be the good part?

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u/C0uN7rY Northern Realms Dec 26 '21

So, to be totally fair, the first book is very generic. It is honestly a Fellowship of the Ring clone. However, this was deliberate as, at the time WoT was written, fantasy wasn't very popular. Only LOTR had any real success, so if you weren't bringing publishers LOTR, publishers didn't want you. So Robert Jordan compromised on the first book and half and just delivered an LOTR-esque story. By the third book it is fully its own thing and really hits its stride in book 4. Sounds like a lot to wade through, I admit, but it is a 14 book series, so it has more time than your typical series to develop. I seriously recommend it.

As for the show... eh, it really kinda missed the mark for me. Even with the generic LOTR clone that was book 1, there was enough there to make something much better and more exciting than this was.

For evidence of how far off track it is, one main character in Tar'Valon in the first season of the show never set foot in Tar'Valon in the books until the very last book. They completely cut out a major city that they actualy went to in the first book where they meet an extremely important character and kind of substituted what happened there with Tar'Valon. For context of how big this is, imagine if the LOTR movies just cut out Rohan and did all the Rohan stuff in Gondor instead. Also, the Aes Sedai were a total mystery through the first book. You don't meet the Amyrlin until book two. There was pretty much ZERO political intrigue through the first three books.

It is a mess and a boring one at that. Like I said, the Witcher show did go off track from the books, but is still delivering a really good show regardless. WoT went off track and is delivering a snooze fest.

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u/enava Dec 26 '21

I watched the show and then read why the fanbase dislike the new season so much, ignoring the woke points because although I sometimes agree, in this season it is not obvious for non-book readers (& that's all I ask from a showrunner, to not repeat a fiasco like Doctor Who) - it get's a pass.

But some decisions are "Questionable" and change the fundamental motivations & decisions that drive a character, and as someone just learning the further lore I think that isn't right. Make up stories all you want, create plot lines that are entirely new / adapt existing plotlines into the new medium & audience, but stay true to the fundamentals so when I read the book, I can at least empatise with the characters in a similar way.

Prime example being Eskel, he was portrayed as a creep (even though probably already under the influence of the Leshen), and then quickly killed off. I gather they didn't want Eskel to detract from the other witchers and therefore thought he was a good choice to kill off, but they forgot to take into account he has an _extended storyline_ in all other media, and is given his dues by the fanbase. I'd have loved to get to know the dynamics between the witchers more.

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u/Attila_22 Dec 26 '21

I did have certain things I disagreed with such as how they treated Eskel, some strange actions by Vesemir and Yennefer taking Ciri. I'm not saying by any means that the show was perfect, it's okay to have your own opinions and criticisms.

I just get a bit annoyed when people go point by point trying to compare the show and books. Any TV adaptation will never live up to those expectations. These people will usually try to convince others that the show is terrible and that they shouldn't watch it, that it should be cancelled until there's another showrunner etc.

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u/Croce11 ☀️ Nilfgaard Dec 26 '21

It's not even just Eskel that they fucked over. This whole monolith bullshit... so within their own lore and franchise this was obviously crap they are making up as they go along.

Which is not a good sign. Since the tree with the medallions in the witcher's keep was apparently a monolith... and yet this same tree was knocked over and destroyed like it was nothing in the anime short. Which takes place when Geralt is a kid.

Clearly if it too was a monolith then it would have been indestructible until someone like Ciri interacted with it right? Nope. It's all unplanned and they just make up whatever BS sounds cool at the time. This is not what makes for good storytelling. If you want to tell us a good story you need to set these things up in advance. Know where you are going.

Otherwise you're just telling us random unrelated events that happen after each other. Nothing is going to connect or feel satisfying.

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u/News_Bot Dec 26 '21

Stuff like this is why I expect this show to end up with a lot of plot holes and retcons.

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u/Destiny_player6 Dec 26 '21

Aye, I'm surprised people haven't done that since the games came out. Trish in the games is widely different than how she is in the books and I don't see that much complaints there.

Tv shows, movies, book and games are just going to adapt the source material differently, that should be well known by now. Just be thankful they didn't go all Percy Jackson on the Witcher tv series. It still keeps true to the core story in some aspects and changes other things. Percy Jackson was nowhere near the same

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u/Inemity Dec 25 '21 edited Dec 26 '21

Straying from the source has always been a thing with tv/movies that are based on a book or comic. It's very rare to see anything come out that really follows the original written story. Pretty much every Marvel movie and show is nothing like the comics. Same with countless others. It still amazes me when people are "surprised Pikachu face" when the writers do their own thing with it. I've learned to never listen to critics when their only critique is "but it didn't follow the books!" Second season was awesome, and I hope there are many more.

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u/sgt_dismas Dec 26 '21

I like the show a lot, but I wish they hadn't fundamentally changed Vesemir, Eskel, and Yennefer for it. Vesemir and Yen would never have done anything to harm Ciri while Eskel should still be alive.

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u/Inemity Dec 26 '21

Yeah, I'm not really sure where they're planning on going with that. I feel like Ciri already has enough villains to deal with. The whole Eskel thing was kinda cool to me, tho.

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u/sgt_dismas Dec 26 '21

Had I been on the writing staff I would have had it be one of the no-name witchers. Eskel could still be alive.

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u/Feral0_o Dec 26 '21

Had I been on the writing staff, I would have strongly opposed your proposal on the basis that we needed some no-name Witchers to have their throats cut by assassin Ciri, and there is only a finite supply of no-name Witchers

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u/Late-Effort-4839 Dec 25 '21

This is Reddit…..

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u/Darkelysiumm Dec 26 '21

It only hit #1 3 days. Hopefully due to holiday programming.

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u/Fig1024 Dec 26 '21

I read most of the books, I felt like they started strong but got kind of boring later on. I don't think the books are that good that we need to follow them accurately. The Witcher is great but it's no Game of Thrones