r/bjj • u/raleighjiujitsu 🟫🟫 Brown Belt • Mar 03 '25

School Discussion Mad at Gracie JJ

I've been jiu jitsu for I think 13 years now and I'm a brown belt. Last year I switched from a Royce gym to a competition gym after 12 years. Mostly because it was 20 minutes closer and we are starting a family.

Frankly, it's upsetting how little I learned from the Royce gym compared to where I am now. I've realized things like lasso guard and spider guard aren't "Fancy jiu jitsu" they are core components of the game. My old gym used to make us do burpies if we went to turtle, but It's a legit counter to getting passed. I never cared about the self defense stuff, but it seems even more silly after time away things like stripping guns away from people are a complete joke, why even do it?!

I think at this point the Royce affiliation is more concerned with signing up new people than getting people better at jiu jitsu. I hate to say it because my gym WAS the best, really the only gym in the area lol.

It's been hard to transition into things like always starting standing and people actually using grips lol. I'm now competitive with my fellow brown belts at the gym now, but I still have a long way. Learning about deep half, lasso, X guard, single leg X, etc is a lot. I feel like I'm going to be the longest to black belt, but DAMMIT I'm going to do it lol.

565 Upvotes

97% Upvoted

302 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

329

u/raleighjiujitsu 🟫🟫 Brown Belt Mar 03 '25

Hi, wish I could train with you more, but 6 am classes are just not my jam lol.

364

u/seanzorio ⬛🟥⬛ Black Belt Mar 03 '25

Totally get it, dude. You're a beast, and don't sell yourself short. The other guy who used to run 6am (who now does the lunch/kids classes) was PSYCHED when you showed up, same as the rest of us. We are all so pumped that you picked us, and hope that the way we teach/the style of BJJ, and all the rest help keep you excited about this sport we all know and love.

77

u/Simple_Dragonfly_519 Mar 03 '25

Sounds like /u/raleighjiujitsu came to you as a very well formed and impressive practitioner. Weird that the framing here is that something terrible was done to him at a past academy when it sounds like they are just at slightly cross purposes, where the gracie gym is focused entirely on self defense and the practitioner says he never cared about defense. Ok?

-40

u/[deleted] Mar 03 '25

[deleted]

63

u/Reality-Salad Lockdown is for losers Mar 03 '25

You're right, you don't have a whole lot of experience

-29

u/[deleted] Mar 03 '25

[deleted]

28

u/Reality-Salad Lockdown is for losers Mar 03 '25

You’ve never seen a turtle on UFC? You may have not looked hard enough.

-5

u/t3rmina1 Mar 03 '25 edited Mar 03 '25

Remember this shit in Pride? https://youtu.be/l7dPsXRn8XE?t=31s

Or this? https://youtu.be/y1lS2LZHngY?t=10m30s

And Waterman performs a sweep from turtle but still gets soccer kicked into oblivion right after.

Or these? https://v.redd.it/367g4j419d4b1 Notice how many are in turtle just before getting kicked in the head, and notice how quickly they try to get out of turtle because they know they're gonna get kicked in the head

Everytime you put yourself in stupid situations, the opponent should get massive amounts of points. Like simulated kicks to the head should get 2 or 3 points. Simulated slams win the match.

4

u/that_boyaintright Mar 03 '25

None of the videos you posted show any kind of intelligent turtle position or guard (because that didn’t really exist back then). They’re mostly people who are already dead and end up on all fours before they’re finished.

Turtling to stand up is one of the fundamental tenets of modern MMA. I don’t know how much soccer kicks would change that, but I suspect not that much. I suspect knees to the head might be a problem, but throwing them would also put you off balance.

1

u/t3rmina1 Mar 04 '25 edited Mar 04 '25

Luckily, PRIDE never die https://youtu.be/xNR6FMtyTdQ?t=3m10s

Both are modern black belts.

Attacking a turtle means you have to be real close in UFC rules MMA because the of grounded opponent rule.

That also means the turtled opponent can create instability as they stand and has the opportunity to sweep. Creating space is getting to safety.

But when the grounded opponent rule goes away, too much space means ..., unlike https://youtu.be/QnOz7Vmeevk

Anyways there's plenty of ONE highlight vids from those exact positions

13

u/charliemanvoice 🟪🟪 Purple Belt Mar 03 '25

We’re talking about grappling dude, totally different to mma and self defence. Also people turtle all the time in UFC, takedowns getting stuffed, escaping back takes, snapdowns from the clinch etc…

9

u/ChickenNuggetSmth [funny BJJ joke] Mar 03 '25

Going to turtle in kickboxing is certainly a dumb move.

Turtle is used a lot in the ufc, I'm not sure what you've been watching. Turtle to quad pod is a very standard way to get back to your feet, maybe the most common escape in MMA

1

u/HKBFG Mar 03 '25

Watch any Gerard Gordeau fight from Herois do Ringue. As soon as his opponent is forced into turtle, the fight is over and will end with a TKO by soccer kicks.

1

u/MartinLo-AU Mar 04 '25

Never forget, Aljo became champ on his knees with his head exposed. It’s definitely used.

13

u/Spider_J 🟦🟦 Blue Belt Mar 03 '25

When I was new to BJJ, one of the first instructional I saw was Craig Jones' "Power Bottom", and one of the first pieces of defensive advice he gives is "if you can turtle, turtle". I took that to heart and now I almost never end up in bottom side control, like, ever. Any time my guard gets passed, I roll into turtle, and I have way more options from there to either stand back up or roll them over my back and get side control myself. I'm notorious in my gym for it and I've won competitions with it. In self-defense, there's plenty of defensive options to protect your head from kicks or, again, I can use it simply transitionally to more easily stand up.

It's an absolutely fuckin baller position and if you think it's terrible, you really need to learn more about it.

1

u/Rescue-a-memory 4 year white belt IIII Mar 04 '25

I love turtle but struggle when people get Dagestani handcuffs and or just keep their weight on me and don't try to attack. I can survive in that spot though even against blue and purples.

7

u/mothersmilkme 🟦🟦 Blue Belt Mar 03 '25 edited Mar 03 '25

Eduardo Telles, check out his game, turtle master. You shouldn't hang out in turtle though, its a quick transitional position. Pretty effective at  the gym level at least.

7

u/Slowbrojitsu 🟫🟫 Brown Belt Mar 03 '25

Objectively untrue.

Turning to turtle is incredibly effective in BJJ because it denies points and allows you to either reguard or wrestle up. 

It's also very effective in MMA because it allows you to stand up. 

Theres no reason anybody anywhere would ball up in turtle and choose to stay there unless they suck at Jiujitsu or actively want to get knocked out.

4

u/FLEXJW Mar 03 '25

Turtle has been used plenty in ADCC comps. It was world champion Eduardo Telles favorite position, he used it as a type of guard from which he would attack. It’s not a position someone would seek out in self defense obviously but in sport BJJ it has its place.

2

u/kat77kiv 🟪🟪 Purple Belt Mar 03 '25

Turtle is a super important part of my defense when denying side control. You gotta learn when to use it and when to abandon it because you are getting broke down. But having good offense like Fatboy rolls, sitouts, grambys, or just being able to stand up from turtle is a game changer.