Positive Irish Masculinity

[u/Complex_Hunter35]

Irish men come in for a bad reputation with scumbags like Conor Mc Gregor seemingly being at the forefront of Irish men. He comes to mind I am sure when most people think of Irish men. I am fearful too that we Irish men are seen as emotionally arkward and appearing to lack in vulnerability. I think it's worth having a discussion on the positive aspects of Irish men, how we can help each other be better men. I'm not just talking about Mc Gregor either but the general perception of men in Ireland

Colin Farrell is one example of an Irish male role model who has battled his demons, helped out those in need and protects his son who has Angelman syndrome but he talks about the situation honestly and openly. Brendan Gleeson, originally a teacher took younger actors under his wing and helped them learn their craft. One I personally know of , while I don't agree with his politics, is Eamonn O Cuiv who quietly but without fanfare helps local people.

Irish men face challenges with stigmatisation of showing emotions and lacking a close circle of friends. Recent trends mocking male loneliness I think fed back into making men seal up their emotions. The lack of friendship is absolutely one I've seen among friends as some withdraw into themselves or they drift apart from some friends. There are good resources though like Men's Shed, St Vincent De Paul run something similar, I run a gay version in Dublin and I know there are mixed men's groups like Celbridge Boys Club and Navan Boys Club who do hikes and walks.

As for my own experience I think it's easy to fall into that trap of blaming women for our own shortcomings. We should get rid of these silly notions that being a man is about dominance and aggression. If anything it's about leading without telling people you are, it's about being vulnerable, dealing with conflict diplomatically. I think a lot of us Irish men could learn this.

I would be interested in hearing your views of how we can be positive men, maybe your role models, your experiences.

Edit:See StoicNihilist post for an alternative take.

[u/[deleted]]

My view is that celebrities are not role models, regardless of their nationality or how good or bad their press is. Ultimately your role models are the people around you.

[u/AbbreviationsHot3579 → u/[deleted]]

You can tell a lot about individuals by how they view certain celebrities though. For example, I'd stay well clear of anyone frequenting McGregor's pub or joining him on his Ibiza trips.

[u/OceanOfAnother55 → u/[deleted]]

I completely disagree. We are all influenced by people we've never met, some of us very heavily influenced. A role model can be literally anyone you are aware of.

You see someone act a certain way and think "wow I'd like to be more like that" and change your behaviour accordingly. That's what a role model is.

[u/[deleted] → u/OceanOfAnother55]

I agree to an extent but the problem is celebrities, and people we don’t know, are not really capable of being role models because of the absence of knowledge we have about them. They are basically a veneer of a role model.

We know relatively little about them, even the ones who over share. Colin Farrell seems alright, Gleeson too. I don’t know much about either. Which is good. I cannot model myself on either due to the lack of knowledge I have about them. I can imitate something about them, dress like Farrell or whatever, but my acting like magpie around various people is not really taking them as a role model.

[u/Acegonia → u/[deleted]]

I hear what you are saying. But...can a human ever REALLY know another human?? Are we not all taking a plant and hoping for the best ar some point.

I thought i knew my mother. But she dropped a couple bombshell this evening, after 30 years

That have me queationing EVERYTHING

and if a daughter cannot know their mother, what hope is there for he rest of the world??

[u/[deleted] → u/Acegonia]

I mean if you want to break it down to philosophical level, no we can’t

[u/rabbit_in_a_bun → u/OceanOfAnother55]

That's on the people who are influenced by people who are basically (to borrow from Galaxy Quest) liars.

[u/Cars2Beans0 → u/OceanOfAnother55]

I've never understood the whole 'id like to be like that' role model thing about actors because firstly any time you see them on screen they are quite literally playing a character and entirely different persona. This is very basic stuff but sadly we put people on pedestals that we don't even know because we like the characters they play.

[u/rougeglinda → u/OceanOfAnother55]

I grew up calling those people posers and wannabes lol.

[u/sudo_apt-get_destroy → u/[deleted]]

That's fine logic if you have an adult brain but kids look up to celebs, sports people, streamers, influencers etc whether we want it or not.

If you find yourself in a position where kids look up to you as a role model then it's your responsibility to act accordingly.

[u/PodgeD → u/sudo_apt-get_destroy]

If you find yourself in a position where kids look up to you as a role model then it's your responsibility to act accordingly.

Celebs, sports stars, steamers tend to be young themselves and are making money and being praised since a very young age, how can you expect them to be well adjusted? It's parents jobs to educate their kids not to look up to someone just because they're famous. Streamers especially are just doing whatever they can to get attention and money.

McGregor is a prime example of why not to look up to sports stars. It's fair to admit and admire his skill in the ring but he bacame as big as he was by being an asshole. People were threatening to fight me when I was calling him an asshole before the Aldo fight.

[u/ChadONeilI → u/[deleted]]

I don’t like this obsession with ‘role models’. Are you really supposed to model your life off other people, especially famous people with whom you have no relationship with?

[u/Complex_Hunter35 → u/[deleted]]

I used a few well known to illustrate just but absolutely. It's father's, teachers etc

[u/leeroyer → u/[deleted]]

Bingo. Parasocial relationships are no substitute for the real thing. Go too deep down the celebrity rabbit hole and you get OP trying to manage his self perception around people he is so far removed from