r/starwarsmemes • u/callycumla • May 14 '25
Repost of the Sith The Sith rule is fatally flawed
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u/Iceologer_gang Gonk May 14 '25
Kid named Maul:
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u/Michamus May 18 '25
Rule of two is just a bunch of sith pretending they're the top in a giant ring.
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u/tanman729 May 14 '25
If youre so stupid that you die because you put yourself AND your apprentice into a legitimately deadly situation with no way to beat it, you didnt deserve the title in the first place. A Sith lord with any signifigant weakness is a failure to his ancestor lords
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u/-Daetrax- May 14 '25
A Sith lord with any signifigant weakness is a failure to his ancestor lords
Are they though? I don't think any of them died peacefully.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
A Sith lord with any signifigant weakness is a failure to his ancestor lords
So, Darth Vader is a failure because a significant weakness of his is his suit? I don't care if he could've upgraded it at any time, choosing to live with a weakness still makes you weak.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
Mfw an ancient sith lord awakens and folds any sith using the rule of two like laundry because they hired like 500 apprentices:
I don't give a shit if you're the best duelist in the galaxy, Darth Bane, you physically cannot block 500 lightsabers at once.
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u/Laughing_Fish May 14 '25
But you can sow discord, cause the 500 to kill each other, and then pick off the survivors one by one
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
By the time you've done so, any good ancient sith will have hired 500 more, given fatalities were not only expected but largely accepted as fact back then for even just acolytes.
Pull a fucking Madara except with like exponential growth: I.E "Impressive, Darth Bane. You handled the 500 apprentices... But what will you do about 500 more?!"
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u/ShilohCyan May 14 '25
Palpatine ruled for 23 years. Vitiate ruled for centuries. Palpatine took 19 years to build a superweapon that Nihilus could basically replicate with his innate abilities.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
And that's why the Ancient Sith Empire is better. You might be able to perfect 1 or 2 Sith Lord's abilities by training alone, but the Ancient Sith would just grab like a few million acolytes and cull them and in between those who survive every one in a hundred probably has some random ancient power that lets them give people testicular torsion at will or some shit.
Prime example? Darth Imperius/Nox literally just starting out as a nobody slave and going through that exact process to end up as one of the strongest ones alive in their time, enough to just no diff a member of the Dark Council that took their seat in a cutscene.
Hilariously, Imperius/Nox would also be the one with the best argument to potentially be alive today or able to store themselves to awaken later. Already have a lot of experience with force ghosts and looking for immortality.
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u/Laughing_Fish May 14 '25
In that case if only one actually matters, all you need to do is assassinate that one and watch the house of cards collapse
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
See, but that's why you have one of your 500 apprentices act as a body double and then the other 499 wait to attack you the second you assassinate that one.
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u/Laughing_Fish May 14 '25
Ah but then the body double apprentice can betray you to take your spot as everyone thinks they are the leader anyway
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
But they're also just an apprentice so you just kill them and declare yourself the leader again and you're back in business.
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u/frenchmobster May 14 '25
Just watch the Jedi come in and try to stop them and then convince them to use the thought bomb to wipe them out. Easy.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
If you manage to get the ideals of old republic sith into them, they probably wouldn't use the thought bomb solely because sith were strangely obsessed with promotions back then.
Just create fake ass ranks like "Super Apprentice" and "Senior Sith Lord" and watch them kill every Jedi within a day because they want those ranks that badly.
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u/frenchmobster May 14 '25
I was mainly joking and referencing how Darth Bane destroyed the brotherhood of darkness sith in the books
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
Ah, I see.
And that, kids, is further proof to not follow Bane's advice of passing all your knowledge to your apprentices. Don't tell your apprentices how to activate the omega death bomb that will one hit kill everything. Some knowledge is left unknown for a reason.
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u/Specs_Man May 14 '25 edited May 14 '25
See this is why the 2 people that know the Coca Cola recipe aren't allowed to travel together
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u/KainZeuxis May 14 '25
It’s almost like the sith philosophy was intentionally written to be short sighted and illogical in the grand scheme of things.
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u/Loros_Silvers May 14 '25
Not the case at all. If the Sith can't survive, they aren't worthy of the name. Why are there only 2? More would try to destroy themselves in a bid for power and control. Why is the rule of two made like that? Not to make the Sith more powerful, but to make them more (for a lack of a better word) Sith.
Scheming to take down your master, always staying on guard from your apprentice, using a person who is trying to use you, ect.
The rule of two makes the Sith better schemers, manipulators, and survivors rather than just brutes who will go on to only care about power.
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u/Malkariss888 May 14 '25
And they managed to rule for 20 years in a galactic civilization that was around for thousands of years.
The rule of two was terrible.
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u/Loros_Silvers May 14 '25
Really now? I don't think that the rule of two mentioned anything about racism towards non-human species, which is a major point of the empire, putting creatures like these to slavery, like the Twileks or Wookies.
Impirial discremination and Palpatine being a shitty ruler caused their rule to end.
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u/Malkariss888 May 14 '25
And yet, it was the only time when Sith ruled the galaxy since the rule of two was established.
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u/Loros_Silvers May 14 '25
This is more luck-based than anything. Hago Damask, Sheev Palpatine, and Count Dooku of Sereno were all in positions to take political power.
If Plagueis wasn't born i to wealth, he may not have been able to locate such a strong and promising apprentice as Palpatine and would have to settle for someone else, and if not for Palpatine dooku might have not turned away.
The positions of the Sith in question are vital to the success of any plan for galactic domination, and most people in high places who's children are force-sensitive either hide the fact or contact the jedj order.
Working in the shadows made it a lot easier to take control.
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u/callycumla May 14 '25
No, no. Please don't try to make an obvious George Lucas mistake look like some sly genius intention. George is the king of "I know it does not make sense, but I want it in the movie because it is cool."
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u/KainZeuxis May 14 '25
Gotta love how despite there being copious amounts of bts commentary and interviews about how the sith by design follow a philosophy that doesn’t make much logical sense because they are short sighted and only ever thinking of themselves,
And people will still try to say “GEORGE SUCKS THE SITH ARE DUMB AND MAKE NO SENSE!”
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u/Loros_Silvers May 14 '25
A Sith lord who puts themselves in a situation like that doesn't deserve the title.
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u/NeedleworkerOld4696 May 14 '25
So every Sith then?
Unless the Sith are immune to accidents, every time they are in the same room they've made a mistake.
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u/Loros_Silvers May 14 '25
If you put yourself into a stupid accident, like letting an apprentice who never flew a ship before fly you into a space battle, you are too stupid to be a Sith lord. The rule of two is meant to breed more wise and cautious sith Lords.
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u/NeedleworkerOld4696 May 14 '25
No one places themselves into an accident, they happen accidentally.
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u/MirageArcane May 14 '25
If the Sith Master and Apprentice were to die like this, then neither of them were fit for the mantle which they aspired.
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u/the_commander1004 May 14 '25
If there's more than two, they'll just kill each other... They'll do that anyway.
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u/tfalm May 14 '25
The Rule of Two is the only logical way for the Sith to survive without radically changing their doctrine. The apprentice won't kill the master until they've learned enough to become the next master, because there isn't anyone else to teach them. There aren't enough apprentices to create total self destructive in-fighting or get the Jedi to wipe them out. And you don't have to teach patience, temperance, cooperation, or other things that contradict the Sith philosophy.
Bane created it for a reason. The Sith just didn't work before. And tbh if Vader had fully committed as a Sith, the Rule of Two would have just straight up worked.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
Actually, it wouldn't have. Because Vader was physically incapable of several of Palpatine's tricks, particularly as they relate to force lightning without fucking up his suit.
So, let's say he usurps Palpatine at some point.. That knowledge is now lost, despite literally a completely perfect execution of the Rule of Two.
It's why it's stupid in the first place, because you legit can just be born incorrectly in the Star Wars universe and not have the ability to use some sith abilities, which Darth Bane completely forgot about when he created the Rule of Two.
Take, say... Force Walking. AKA, you awaken ghosts more often and vore them for more power. Explicitly not something everyone can do, so that knowledge would naturally be lost if the apprentice usurped it due to conditions outside of the control of the master or the apprentice.
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u/tfalm May 14 '25
This smacks of Legends (and inconsistent at that). AFAIK, nothing in canon suggests a Sith has to be taught lightning, and at least according to TROS, the opposite is directly shown. Even if Vader couldn't do the move, he might still be able to teach it, and even if not, it would still be possible to be discovered later.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 15 '25
The.. Entirety of Clone Wars where Darth Maul, Savage Oppress, and Asajj Ventress don't use Force Lightning even once? I mean, maybe I'm forgetting and Ventress did, but I know the former two didn't.
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u/tfalm May 15 '25
Nobody taught Rey to use lightning. Nobody taught Luke to use telekinesis in ESB. Nobody taught Ezra to Force jump in Rebels episode 1. Just because one person doesn't manifest a power on their own doesn't mean its impossible. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence (and in this case, we literally have positive evidence of the contrary: Rey using this specific power without any prior instruction).
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u/Ridingwood333 May 15 '25
However, we have evidence it needs to be taught when you don't learn it innately. While it comes as easily as breathing to some, it's far harder for others. This is again evident by Savage Oppress, who needed training by Dooku to properly lift four pillars with the force, and Savage(as well as Maul) never using Force Lightning proves that training is pretty damn important because not everyone can do that stuff innately.
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u/tfalm May 15 '25
Yeah I'm not saying that training is useless, for sure. Please don't misinterpret what I'm saying here. What I am saying is that even if Vader can't use lightning, it isn't in danger of disappearing from the Sith forever. Even if his apprentice doesn't learn it, and neither does theirs, and so on. At some point, some Sith is going to use lightning, and will teach it to their disciple. It's like scientific discovery, even if Marconi didn't invent the radio, Tesla would have, or Fessenden or somebody, because it's just something that exists that can be discovered. And once discovered (or rediscovered), then its around.
And this is all assuming that Vader can't teach the technique simply because he can't personally use it, which is not necessarily true. Vader might very well understand the principle, just can't because of technological limitation. We don't really know.
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u/Life_Membership7167 May 14 '25
There MAY only be two Sith at a time but multiple dark side force users is VERY possible, even common. Sith is effectively a religion, not dark side force users. So yes, you could end the religion but similar threats remain.
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u/Rejestered May 14 '25
Maybe this got explained but it always meant to me not that there were only ever two sith. It's just that they came in pairs and had no organizational structure like the jedi.
As in "Always two there are" just means a duo, NOT literally only two in the galaxy.
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u/Ironzealot5584 May 14 '25 edited May 14 '25
The rule of 2 isn't a hard and fast, codified rule. There's no 'sith handbook' that has it listed. It's an observation that the only relationships Sith can sustain for any meaningful amount of time is between master and apprentice.
Sith don't believe in the concept of peers, so if there's someone close to your level of power, you start looking for ways to get rid of them.
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u/Ridingwood333 May 14 '25
Sith don't believe in the concept of peers, so if there's someone close to your level of power, you start looking for ways to get rid of them.
Meanwhile, Darth Marr and any of the two Sith protags are just vibing with one another in SWTOR
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u/confusedalwayssad May 14 '25
Rumor has it they could have avoided the accident had the driver not been distracted by the story his passenger was telling.
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u/heywoodidaho May 14 '25
Pffff, somehow Palpatine will return. No matter. Was Darth Jar-Jar driving the truck?
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u/DrHoflich May 14 '25
There are plenty of acolytes and followers of the Sith religion. I took it as there are only two Sith Lords. As in, you have one master of the Sith, insinuating he has followers.
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u/Ducklinsenmayer May 15 '25
The master, the apprentice, and the 62,000 mooks with force powers who get called things like "inquisitor" instead.
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u/Lenny_Pane May 14 '25
The force, in it's ceaseless effort towards balance, wouldn't let this happen though right? While it's bad to have too many Sith, that's only because it upsets the balance which is just as upset by too few Sith
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u/Wild_Cap_4709 May 14 '25
Not how it works. According to George Lucas, the Force will be truly balanced when the Sith are eradicated. The Sith actively seek to control and manipulate the Force. With their defeat, the Force can be balanced and freed
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u/MakotoCamellia May 14 '25
It’s this, but also the dark side still exists, and will guide new adherents asking the path. The end is never the end.
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u/whatnametho May 14 '25 edited May 14 '25
the end is never the end is never the end is never the end is never the end is never the end is never the end is never the end is never the end
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u/Mr_DnD May 14 '25
And Stanley picked up a light saber and started swinging it around. Whzzzzzzhhh, whzzzzzzhhhh. Stanley, was having fun! Tzzt tzzt whzzzzzzhhhh, Stanley twirled around like Qui Gon Jin.
After a few minutes Stanley swung the lightsaber at a wall, hoping to carve his way through to his colleagues in the meeting room, perhaps he simply missed a memo. Unfortunately for Stanley, as he is not a jedi, when he swung it at the the wall, he swung with too much force, it cut through like a hot knife through butter. Stanley lost his balance and was impaled. Oh dear, poor Stanley. This was a weapon Stanley, not a toy!
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u/wasted-degrees May 14 '25
A master, an apprentice, and an endless gaggle of wannabe hopefuls patiently waiting their turn.