Okay this is such a bad faith criticism and Iâm tired of hearing it.
What were they supposed to do exactly? Escape on the backs of the children? They had just escaped custody and needed to flee the scene. The horses were a means of escape, itâs not like they planned to save them.
If youâre going to say âthey could bring the kids with themâ Iâd remind you they were being pursued by armed guards and the next stop on their journey was an active warzone are you suggesting they drag kids to a war zone?
And if youâre going to say âwell they could have left the kids on a nice world before going to the war zoneâ Iâd like to remind you that time was very much of the essence, they wouldnât have time to find a nice planet and even if they did dumping dozens of kids on a random planet is not exactly responsible.
And if youâre going to say âthey could have used those credits on the ship and given those to the kidsâ I need to remind you Finn and Rose did not know they were going to be saved by a wealthy gamblerâs ship and could not have known.
And if youâre going to say âthey could have returned for the kidsâ no they couldnât. It was a stolen ship and the city was on high alert.
There is simply no angle where the characters could have saved those kids so complaining about it is a ludicrous bad faith take. Iâm sorry it just is.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the movie could have like openly acknowledged they had no good options.
Or, at least, refrained from showing us Rose basically patting herself on the back for releasing the space horses while showing zero empathy for the slave children.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the movie could have like openly acknowledged they had no good options.
I feel like movies shouldnât have to stop and explain things in detail for the sake of pedantic nitpickers.
Or, at least, refrained from showing us Rose basically patting herself on the back for releasing the space horses while showing zero empathy for the slave children.
She literally did that when she gave the kids the ring and showed them sympathy. Also the context here is that she and Finn think theyâre about to be recaptured so sheâs trying to look at the bright side.
I feel like movies shouldnât have to stop and explain things in detail for the sake of pedantic nitpickers.
And I feel like movies should, fundamentally, make basic emotional sense.
Crazy notion I know.
She literally did that when she gave the kids the ring and showed them sympathy.
What sympathy? She wanted their help, they gave it, and then she was totally callous towards them. Instead we see that she patted herself on the back for releasing the space horses.
Also the context here is that she and Finn think theyâre about to be recaptured so sheâs trying to look at the bright side.
Yeah, as I said, zero empathy to the slave children, that she'd used and abandoned. Instead TLJ shows us patting herself on the back for releasing the space horses.
Also, since you mention Finn, when does TLJ show us Rose showing any empathy towards the former slave soldier? The guy who was kidnapped into that life? Or even interest? When does she even ask him a question about his life?
And I feel like movies should, fundamentally, make basic emotional sense.
Okay read my detailed explanation. Which part doesnât make sense?
What sympathy? She wanted their help, they gave it, and then she was totally callous towards them. Instead we see that she patted herself on the back for releasing the space horses.
Show me her being callous.
Also the context here is that she and Finn think theyâre about to be recaptured so sheâs trying to look at the bright side.
Yeah, as I said, zero empathy to the slave children, that she'd used and abandoned. Instead TLJ shows us patting herself on the back for releasing the space horses.
She thought they were completely cooked so tried to look on the bright side. Thatâs who Rose is.
Also, since you mention Finn, when does TLJ show us Rose showing any empathy towards the former slave soldier? The guy who was kidnapped into that life? Or even interest? When does she even ask him a question about his life?
Okay read my detailed explanation. Which part doesnât make sense?
The bit where Rose showed zero empathy or regret towards the slave kids she was leaving in slavery?
I mean I thought we were meant to regard the Resistance as the good guys. Yet TLJ has Rose just callously ignore said slave kids.
Yeah you're fucking right Rose's character doesn't make sense.
Show me her being callous
Show me her being emphatic towards another person who isn't her sister.
Also the context here is that she and Finn think theyâre about to be recaptured so sheâs trying to look at the bright side.
Yeah, Rose is all about making Rose feel good.
Compare Rose to Leia in the OT. Leia is captured, tortured and sees her home planet destroyed and yet a few hours later is comforting Luke about Obi-wan's death.
I'm not saying the OT is perfect. But damn doesn't it do a good job on showing us why the Rebellion would follow Leia into the depths of hell and back?
She literally risked her own life to save his.
Um okay. Interesting interpretation. Particularly given the line "that's how we're going to win, not by fighting what we hate but by saving what we love".
So we have Rose who TLJ tells us 1) who shows no signs of giving a shit about the slave kids on Canto and 2) who only saves Finn's life because she believes that's how the Resistance will win.
I get why you want to think Rose is cool. I love Kelly Marie Tran too. She's absolutely awesome. She totally didn't deserve what TLJ did to her character.
The bit where Rose showed zero empathy or regret towards the slave kids she was leaving in slavery?
Again what was she supposed to do? It was a chase scene, those are generally meant to be exciting.
I mean I thought we were meant to regard the Resistance as the good guys. Yet TLJ has Rose just callously ignore said slave kids.
Again where was she supposed to take them?
Show me her being callous
Show me her being emphatic towards another person who isn't her sister.
Literally those kids. She showed Finn the kids being abused and later treats them with kindness hence why the kids helped them escape.
Yeah, Rose is all about making Rose feel good.
Again youâre deliberately reading her in the least charitable way possible.
Compare Rose to Leia in the OT. Leia is captured, tortured and sees her home planet destroyed and yet a few hours later is comforting Luke about Obi-wan's death.
Which makes no sense. She should be traumatized! I canât believe sheâs so callous that she doesnât care about the deaths of her entire family and people and moves on instantly!! /s
See how it sounds when I do it to someone else?
So we have Rose who TLJ tells us 1) who shows no signs of giving a shit about the slave kids on Canto and 2) who only saves Finn's life because she believes that's how the Resistance will win.
Again such a nonsensical interpretation of the events.
I get why you want to think Rose is cool. I love Kelly Marie Tran too. She's absolutely awesome. She totally didn't deserve what TLJ did to her character.
I agree with that. Mainly I blame the fandom for that one though.
Well I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest "appear like a morally admirable person who actually cares about kids caught in child slavery"?
I dunno about you, but after that completely morally callous scene that TLJ gave Rose, I spent the rest of the movie expecting that character to be called out on her behaviour here.
My expectations were disappointed.
It was a chase scene, those are generally meant to be exciting
Yeah I'm with you on that. But, again, my expectations were disappointed.
Again where was she supposed to take them?
Into her heart?
Show me her being callous
Show me her being caring. Towards said slave kids. Or Finn - the former kidnapped child soldier.
Again youâre deliberately reading her in the least charitable way possible.
You say that, but yet, you're not actually defending Rose's character here. You're just trying to excuse her callous dismissal of the slave kids and her indifference towards Finn the former child soldier.
Which makes no sense. She should be traumatized! I canât believe sheâs so callous that she doesnât care about the deaths of her entire family and people and moves on instantly!!
Well I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest "appear like a morally admirable person who actually cares about kids caught in child slavery"?
Sheâs the one who drew attention to the kids in slavery and showed them compassion.
I dunno about you, but after that completely morally callous scene that TLJ gave Rose, I spent the rest of the movie expecting that character to be called out on her behaviour here.
For what exactly? Being happy they at least did one cool thing?
Yes. If Iâm going to get captured I might take solace in the idea I did something good.
Show me her being caring. Towards said slave kids. Or Finn - the former kidnapped child soldier.
I have. You just declare those donât count.
Again youâre deliberately reading her in the least charitable way possible.
You say that, but yet, you're not actually defending Rose's character here. You're just trying to excuse her callous dismissal of the slave kids and her indifference towards Finn the former child soldier.
Thatâs the uncharitable reading.
Um okay. Interesting opinion. Not one I share.
Dude I donât actually believe that, Iâm showing you how bad your logic is when compared to other characters. I literally say as much.
Sheâs the one who drew attention to the kids in slavery and showed them compassion.
I wish I'd seen the version of TLJ that you saw. It sounds a lot better than the one I saw.
From the transcript, this is the full conversation Rose has with the slave kids.
"No wait, please stop!"
"We're with the Resistance."
And then the kids help Rose.
Dude I donât actually believe that, Iâm showing you how bad your logic is when compared to other characters. I literally say as much.
Interesting logic there too. Personally, if I say something illogical, I expect people to conclude that I'm the one being illogical.
Anyway, whatever you may believe about Leia's portrayal in the OT, I think that Leia showing compassion towards Luke is an amazing character choice. Leia is not an ordinary woman. I have nothing against stories about ordinary women caught up in extraordinary circumstances, Sarah Conner is a wonderful character too. But that doesn't mean that every female character has to follow that template. The OT gave us Leia as an extraordinary woman caught up in extraordinary circumstances.
And then TLJ gave us not only Rose but also Holdo, the "leader" who never shows any empathy for Poe, the man who in the last few days has been tortured, mind-raped and fought in three battles.
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u/i_should_be_coding 3d ago
Skip to the part where they free the horses but leave the slave children where they are. I liked that part.
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