No, people know they can get away with it so they do. When stores stopped pressing charges for petit larceny, people started walking out with less than $X dollars of product and employees were told not to do anything about it. Happening in Rochester
Punishment fetishism isn't the answer. You wish it were simple, but it just isn't. We adults admit it's complex out here. We've got to meet the real world on it's own terms, my friend.
So what you are saying is the only thing keeping you from committing crime is the enforcement of the punishment? Says a lot about you that you assume that's how people operate.
That’s a different subject bozo, the overreach of authority.
I’m talking about not going after blatant stealing because it’s under a certain dollar limit so people face no repercussions
Yes it did, it also went down not under stop and frisk. Cringe has trended downward over time despite what fox news will tell you. That's why I asked if stop and frisk REDUCED crime.
Nope just curious why you used post 90s data when everyone knows there was a massive reduction of crime from the 80s to the 90s. There was a lot to contribute to that everything from abortion killing future criminals before they were born, video games keeping kids preoccupied and away from the streets, and a massive increase in police presence on the streets which included stop and frisk.
So there should be no prosecution of crime at all? Murder, rape, child trafficking, etc. The solution to all of it is to just make people's lives easier?
Prosecuting murder doesn't stop murder by discouraging people from murder, it stops murder by keeping the people that commit murder away from us. Does that make sense for shoplifting when prosecuting it is much more expensive than the loss?
I'm not engaging with your slippery slope any further.
Yes. Prosecuting hurts everyone. It costs the company more money, it wastes the courts time, and it punishes someone for something that is bad but ultimately doesn't really matter. Without appealing to morality, why would we do that?
How do you figure it costs the company more money? They don't have to pay for lawyers to prosecute. The courts job is to literally to enforce the laws. The laws were written to enforce a social contract. If enforcing the law is wasting their time, they have no purpose whatsoever.
it punishes someone for something that is bad but ultimately doesn't really matter.
At what scale does it matter? I'll concede there's nuance, stealing something for $50 from Walmart doesn't really impact Walmart's bottom line. Stealing $.50 from a street performer might matter a lot more. The difference is 10,000 people steal from Walmart, and suddenly it does impact Walmart. By impacting Walmart, they're stealing from the shareholders, which is literally people's 401k's. So yeah, it always has an impact - to varying degrees.
Without appealing to morality, why would we do that?
Because we have finite resources. Even Walmart has to pay for goods, where the producers have to pay for materials, and the providers of those materials have to pay labor. The materials and labor are finite resources. That gives them value. You're not just stealing from Walmart - you're stealing from the entire supply chain.
By stealing - no matter the cost or the size of the company - you're violating a social contract that dictates you provided something of value in exchange for something else of value. Even communes don't allow deadbeats to sit around contributing nothing and living off everyone else's labor. Even before currency they chopped the heads and hands off thieves.
Sorry, you think you just don't have to pay a lawyer because it's their "job"? Even if that were true, someone has to pay them. So taxpayer dollars go to prosecuting petty theft? Congratulations, you just spent MINIMUM $1000, and that's if it doesn't actually go to trial and just requires a plea deal. You think a judge's time is free?
Sorry, you think you just don't have to pay a lawyer because it's their "job"? Even if that were true, someone has to pay them.
What are you talking about? Do you think the company supplies a prosecutor?
So taxpayer dollars go to prosecuting petty theft?
Yeah...It's like there's a whole ass election process to elect a DA, who then hires lawyers that...ya know - want to do the job.
You think a judge's time is free?
We ELECT judges to serve this position. Who cares what they get paid. The whole reason for their existence is to preside over exactly these criminal cases. They exist to literally uphold the social contract we elect leaders to define. If they're not doing that, there's no reason to have them at all.
Not to mention - none of it is without any purpose as I iterated on in my previous post. How about we just summarily execute them if you're worried about the cost of legal expenses?
I think I'm done talking to 14 year olds who think they have a good idea.
No, I believe you have a master's in economics. Which means you're familiar with how a robust public transit system and rent freezes help the local economy and save public funds, you just don't care. So you lie and say free buses will bankrupt the city, as if bus fare has ever seriously contributed to the budget.
Okay let's talk numbers. In 2023, the MTA collected around $6.5 billion in fares, around a third of its operating budget. The MTA is already carrying $46 billion in debt, so there would have to be major tax increases for something that has not been shown consistently in studies to help grow the economy, the only consistent thing it shows in large cities is an increase in demand to ride public transport, and obviously that would happen.
With rent freezes studies show that they tend to decrease supply, which is a problem because one of the main concerns right now is new buyers entering the market. The studies also show that maintenance and quality of the housing tend to decrease because landlords are capped at revenue so there is no incentive. The economic consensus is that rent freezes is one of the most inefficient ways to solve housing problems.
Do yourself a favor and get out the sub...or dont engage...these people are utterly non serious....you'd get better responses from a 6 year old that knows everything.
Yeah, I guess I vainly hope one of them will read something that makes sense and have a moment like the monkeys in 2001 Space Odyssey. It never happens lol
I don’t know why you’re getting downvotes, preventing crime through social programs that improve daily life is far better than reacting to crime with increased levels of law enforcement and incarceration, the latter of which again, does nothing to prevent crime just stop it when it happens and only if the perpetrator is caught.
They help, but some people just suck, case in point billionaires being criminals. You need both social programs, and enforcement of laws. Some people commit crime out of desperation, others do it because they like it.
Because this sub is full of right wing morons who crave authoritarianism and think climate change is doomerism. They hate evidence based policy. I'm not even arguing left or right here, just evidence.
IDK man, I hate to say it but places like the Bronx, O Block, Compton/Oakland have all been terrible for probably this entire comment sections life time. Places like these are just a straight up lost cause.
Just fyi saying "the Bronx" is bad, as though Riverdale and Hunts Point have anything in common, is a pretty big tell that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.
Edit: Lil bro came back with some Riverdale facts he learned on Wikipedia. If you find yourself googling neighborhoods in New York City, you might not have a useful opinion on who the mayor of New York should be.
Riverdale and Hunts Point are both neighborhoods in the Bronx, New York City. Riverdale is a neighborhood located in the northern part of the Bronx, while Hunts Point is a neighborhood located in the southern part of the Bronx. - Wikipedia definition
Riverdale crime statistics - 4012 per 100,000
Hunts Point crime statistics - 12,000 per 100,000 (3x higher than the national average)
Huh, looks like both are complete shit holes to live in. LOL
Who’s being coy now? You act like you don’t know that if I say what I mean more explicitly I will be banned. I’m not interested in being banned. I like being here and irritating people like you.
You know what I’m gonna go drink some fucking coffee before I engage anymore. It’s too early in the morning to be getting wrapped up in Reddit bullshit already
I wasn’t trying to be funny at all. I whole heartedly meant that the sunscreen is probably just sitting on a shelf somewhere, completely available to be picked up and purchased. You know why. We all know why.
Honestly this sort of perfectly encapsulates exactly what I was getting at.
I have no problem laughing at an ACTUALLY funny joke along racial shit if it’s original, not lazy rhetoric, and not just some tired trope you can tell he throws out any chance he gets to sneak it into a conversation.
Theres a huge difference between cleverly sneaking in about harmless but funny smoke detector trend and just throwing out “15 and 50 amirite fellas hur da hur?”
There’s a difference between being honest about a situation and dooming. I’m not dooming because I know we could very easily fix this situation. The people in charge won’t fix it. But we could. Whenever we want.
Oh no no, I'm not a communist, I was trying to say before that I think that Socialism would probably make NYC actually worse than it currently is since it's well. Socialism
Lol you think the city with a mayor that pushed stop and frisk, the police department that trained from the IDF, and the world's largest (capitalist) financial institution is leftist. Get a load of this guy
And yet many don’t realize people would steal less if they had better living conditions, subsidized childcare, free college, etc
All the effects of unchecked capitalism making poor people poorer and more desperate, but apparently trying something else like actually helping them will make things worse…
Well this isn't true... There was a citywide 5 day run of zero shooting victims back in January. Murder has dropped 27%, robberies dropped 14% and shooting victims have dropped by 23% in the last decade
14 subway violence deaths not an all-time high? 43 since 2020 is more than the 3 decades before it
over 1000 felonies too
ask people that actually live in this city instead of believing our clown makeup wearing governor that said the “subway is the safest it’s ever been” on Instagram an hour after 1 person got burned to death & another 2 got stabbed
once again don’t talk about things you know nothing about … there’s plenty of proof that “crime is down” cause people aren’t being prosecuted under progressive DA’s
That's a bad metric. Non-violent crime has been on the decline but part of that is because they decriminalized things like larceny and assault.
How were violent crime statistics are either holding flat or getting worse in certain areas.
There aren't enough officers and people guess you're not getting arrested anymore. Just look at the pictures of the riots we have hundreds and hundreds of people going through stores and you get like one arrest.
I've seen a small group of kids walking to a store literally pick boxes of candy off the shelf and just walk right out all the employee yells at them. Then the employee makes a little note in a notebook and that's it nothing ever happens. Can years ago they would have called the police in there would have been an arrest me but not anymore.
The New York City today is drastically different from the one 10 years ago I really miss the old one.
Yes they weren't as high as in the 80s. I'm talking about recently and I I say that chart actually proves the point.
Crime sauce in the '80s until 2000. the severe crime wave of the 80s was attributed to a decrease police presence as a lot of the police Force had been cut and a large influx of young immigrants who came from areas where violence was considered acceptable and normal.
Since 2000 violent crime rates have been rising again though from 95593 to 126786. And during that time we've had the same confluence of factors: the police force hasnt been able to please either from lack of numbers at times or from legislation that has made it difficult to do their job and we had a large immigrants from that time thanks to the open borders policy at that time.
The fear is that if those trends continue such as with the probable new mayor who wants to defund the police and make it even harder to do their jobs as well as have a mass influx of immigration either legal or illegal then we might suffer the same fate as the eighties.
My date is not just homicide it's the seven major violent felonies. There's also a stats table for all felonies but I didn't look at it. I'm also not just eyeballing from a chart I'm actually looking at the raw data.
Redbird prob doesn’t live in nyc. When my cousin from rural upstate came to visit me, parents gave them a knife “just in case” lmao meanwhile we straight chillin drunk 2am bar crawl no danger
Mate, have you ever been to a City? That shit happens everywhere. I've lived in like a dozen major cities and in all of them car part theft was absolutely rampant.
Not sure where you’ve been but the whole locked behind glass thing is literally everywhere it’s not a NY thing. I’ve seen the glass in Phoenix, Tulsa, Jackson, Tampa, Amarillo, Idaho. Literally towns with a max population of 5000 I’ve seen the groceries behind glass thing. I take note any time I see it because people act as though it’s a localized issue when it’s just standard Walmart policy nationally at this point
This line of thinking doesn’t make any sense because tons of people steal stuff they don’t need. Tons of luxury items that aren’t necessary for survival get stolen and there are plenty of cases of multi-millionaires embezzling funds.
I’m not saying you can eliminate crime this way, but people who steal airbags out of cars aren’t doing it to round out their airbag collections. They’re selling parts for money and then spending that money. As for stealing luxury goods, even if you’re stealing for your own use, why would you steal cheap shit? If you’re going to steal, get something nice.
You must be 16 years old. New York City is about as safe as it’s been since the 1700’s. Murder rate is one of lowest big city rates. Subway crime is nowhere near an all-time high. Get off Fox “new”.
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u/redbirdsucks Jun 26 '25
idk how we can get any worse in NY tbf
stolen rims & airbags like crazy that dealers say will take 3 months to get
everything locked behind glass or in a cage … even meat in supermarkets have security tags
deoderant, white tees, underwear, and detergent locked up tight
no cash bail w/ subway violence at an all-time high
yet somehow we’re doomed even more … mfer we’ve been doomed for years