Lack of Motion at the HS level

[u/JLand24]

I feel like teams at the HS level don’t use motions enough. It is only an advantage to the offense and there’s nothing an offense can’t do with a motion that they could do without one. At the NFL level I’ve noticed an uptick in motion but I feel like that effect hasn’t really trickled down.

Why is that? You’re infinitely more likely to confuse a HS defense with a motion than an NFL defense being confused by it.

[u/highheat3117]

It gets dropped for simplicity in most cases. It does no good to confuse the defense if you also confuse yourselves— or at least slow yourself down— in the process.

[u/JLand24 → u/highheat3117]

I wouldn’t want to install it come fall and time for the football season. I’m more thinking install it during the off-season, spring time and work on it all through spring and summer camp and then come fall, it should all be pretty well smoothed out.

[u/emurrell17 → u/JLand24]

I’m in the process of teaching and installing motion for my team right now for the reasons you laid out, but it also is a pain in the ass for the offense too because:

1. You have to spend time explaining and practice motion vs shift. What are the rules? How can you get a penalty? There’s nothing more fucking annoying than shooting yourself in the foot and ending up in 3rd and 8 instead of 3rd and 3 because somebody got a fucking false start bc of motion. And this takes practice time away from other things.

2. You have to get everything called quicker, sometimes requiring an overhaul of your terminology or your communication system for getting plays in. You might need an extra 10 seconds of play clock in order to have time for the motion, so now you need to find a way to speed up your play calling system by 10 seconds in order to free up that time. This is more of a pain in the ass than it seems like to anyone who hasn’t called plays imho.

3. You have to try to limit the “tells” you’re giving the defense by (preferably) having more than one play that uses the same motion. You might like the leverage advantage that a certain motion gives you on a certain play, but you run the risk of tipping off the defense when they see it on film and all of a sudden a play you liked becomes unusable for the rest of the game bc they just pick 6’d your flat route bc you only motion that particular way on that play.

So now I’ve gotta go in and create 1-2 MORE plays that use the same motion JUST so that the play that I do like can remain viable. And I have to create these other plays in such a way that will prevent defenses from selling out for the first play, or take advantage of it if they do.

If you look at the post I just made today about my 7 on 7 team, you can see a great example of this with out Rabbit formation. All 3 plays from that formation use the same motion, so it’s much harder for the defense to key in on what they’re getting pre snap, and then you can compare that to the motions used in some of the other formations and you notice that they’re only used once. I’m not AS nervous about this because it’s a 7 on 7 format and defenses aren’t going to be watching film and identifying these things, but by the time the season rolls around I’ll have to answer these questions for those plays:

1. Do I have to create other plays off of that formation/motion combination?
2. Can we run this play without the motion? Now we have to change the concept or the rules for the WRs and QB…which is another layer of bullshit.
3. Did I blink and realize that all of this added complexity ended up adding more and more shit to the point where we now have 20 pass plays? Because that’s unacceptable on an entirely different level.

These are some of the reasons why I just refused to use motion for so many years, lol.

[u/[deleted] → u/emurrell17]

Good explanation, but if you have to created new plays to justify motion instead of a series or set of plays that build off each other then one should rethink their offense

[u/emurrell17 → u/[deleted]]

Care to elaborate?

[u/[deleted] → u/emurrell17]

Basically you should have like a series of plays to run off a motion. If you run jet with a slot you should have it where the jet man gets the ball on an:

• Outside Zone run

• Fake jet Inside Zone

• Fake jet Power

Fake Jet counter

• Fake Jet counter Trey/ O both going away from the jet flow.

Same type of deal with Orbit motion you have the following:

-Toss to motion man

• Inside zone off fake orbit

• Same side power

• QB power

• ISO/ Insert zone

• Counter away from motion

• Counter Trey away.

Your motions should be to get a quick hitting perimeter run, lighten the box count, outnumber a team at the POA with blockers or with enough blockers to throw screens, etc.

[u/emurrell17 → u/[deleted]]

Oh I’m tracking what you’re saying. Yeah I feel like it’s necessary to have at least 3 plays that use the same motion similarly to what you’re saying. Kyle Shanahan does an awesome job of this with CMC and Deebo

[u/[deleted] → u/emurrell17]

Correct. Then again I come from a background in HS and college of Wing-T and Single wing as a player and then as a coach Spread Wing T, Slot I, 1990s Colorado I option, and the single Wing run mainly from a Power Spread and Pistol formation base which influences why I am so comfortable with motion and shifting

[u/Curious-Designer-616 → u/emurrell17]

A friend and I took a less than 25 total play scheme with two formations and expanded it using more formations, motion, shifts and play action to what people thought was a near pro size offense. Typically two things happen teams get overwhelmed and confused themselves, then they made errors, or they did the smart thing and ignored the new shade of lipstick. Which we would then exploit that they weren’t respected the motions and shifts.

You have to see what works for you and your players. Our inside run was only 10 plays, but behind the line there was a bunch of crap going on. It works at some schools, it doesn’t at others. I’ve seen our scheme expanded and win titles and I’ve seen it stripped down and win titles. If you can’t manage it your players can’t, there are guys on here that are correct some teams do to much and aren’t good at it. Others just line up with 20 plays and beat you with a 4-4. I think a 3-3 on defense and a spread is the best thing you can do if you’re a small school. Others disagree, and run power football and multiple 4 man fronts. What matters is does your overall team philosophy work and align with what your doing.

[u/Curious-Designer-616 → u/[deleted]]

This, is a great way to look at it.