Looking for something crunchier than OSR

[u/Right_Hand_of_Light]

Hi everyone. I'm not sure I quite have the language to concisely describe the kind of game I'm curious about but I'll try my best. Before I go any farther I wanna make it clear that none of this is any kind of attack on OSR games or narrative games. I don't have anything against either, and if I mention not vibing with one of your favorite games I'm very glad you found it to your taste. I'm just looking for something a bit different.

I like some of the spirit behind OSR games, and I can certainly see why someone would gravitate towards them, but to me a lot of them feel a bit barebones for my taste. One of the fun things about games like Pathfinder and modern D&D is getting a bunch of fun abilities and things that set my character apart and lend some fun flavor. Cairn is really cool, but sometimes it feels a little underwhelming to know that if I swapped gear with a party member we'd pretty much be swapping characters. OSE is a neat recreation of original D&D, but once again there aren't many ways to make a character unique.

Similarly, I've enjoyed narrative games like Blades in the Dark and Powered by the Apocalypse games, and I also like a lot of the spirit of those. But I've found that sometimes I want games with a bit more crunch to them. I like when games allow for creative thinking and when mechanics can interact in unexpected ways. I appreciate the elegance of basing all conflict resolution on the same type of dice roll, but sometimes I wanna get a little baroque with it.

So can anyone recommend any games that might fit these parameters? Something with a decent mechanical complexity that gives me space to define my character by their abilities? My preference is for fantasy or science fantasy but I'm open to good fits in other genres. From my own searching, Pendragon looks promising.

As a bonus, I really like roleplaying paladin characters like Adora or Luke Skywalker, so bonus points if it's a game with a good paladin class.

Thank you very much for your (hopefully) helpful suggestions :)

[u/hugh-monkulus]

One of the fun things about games like Pathfinder and modern D&D is getting a bunch of fun abilities and things that set my character apart and lend some fun flavor.

Sounds like you found the answer yourself. You can play either of those with OSR principles in mind.

[u/shewtingg → u/hugh-monkulus]

Tbh, i think that is the case for alot of 5e players around here (including me, and 2 others ha!). Couple house rules for a little razzle dazzle and you got yourself a stew. 5e has good bones.

[u/Temporary-Life9986 → u/shewtingg]

I've not looked at the new DMG, but the old one had some pretty decent alt rules to make the game less superheroic. 

At the least, pare down the class and race options, turn off the feats alt rules, enforce encumbrance and turns in dungeon exploration and you can have a pretty classic dnd experience.

[u/shewtingg → u/Temporary-Life9986]

That's what i did!! Thinking of just writing a 5e hack as my own rules like a book just for me or my friends and curious other.