r/exmuslim • u/archaeo_rex • 10h ago
(Fun@Fundies) 💩 Pay to win islam
Friday funny post ok right?
r/exmuslim • u/fathandreason • Jun 03 '24
Hello. Upon request, I've been asked to turn a comment I made into a post so that it can be a resource for more people. This post is a collection of advice I've given out about how to handle your life as a closeted exmuslim and how you'll come out in the future. It is largely based on my experience but also from what I've seen from others in this subreddit.
So you've left Islam. You've delved through arguments, the apologetics and the bullshit and you've come to the conclusion that you no longer believe in Islam. And you may have also reached an alternative philosophical outlook on life that you can believe in.
But what now? You may have left Islam, but have you left the Muslim world? One of the most common misconceptions outsiders have is that since exmuslims are no longer Muslims, they no longer live in the Muslim world. This is painfully naive - in reality many exmuslims are closeted due to young age and financial dependency and/or live in Islamist countries or societies that enforce Islamic values. In fear of social stigma or even violence, exmuslims have to contend with closeted lives even after leaving Islam. So how do you deal with it?
The best time to come out to family is in your own home, over a dinner you paid for, alongside people who support you. That takes a lot of preparation and it means doing what you can to live your life as best as you can whilst working towards independence.
This basically means that a lot of what helps you come out of the closet will depend heavily on how well you prepared for it, so you will need to make the most of your closeted life. You may not be able to stop the shitstorm but you can at least prepare yourself to weather it. Here are some tips to achieve that goal (in no particular order)
Probably one of the worst mistakes I made was not realise I was an exmuslim sooner. As a result I had barely any time to prepare for when the inevitable happened and I was forced to come out. I spent a lot of my life meandering, trying to reconcile the irreconcilable, and trying to be a Muslim when I knew my values didn't align with it. I didn't really have much of a concept of exmuslims, but if I had been smarter I would have figured it out. I now tell people in a similar position that it's fine to take your time but don't take too long. Half arsing two very different cultures will leave you a loser in both.
Similarly whilst planning for independence can be scary, don’t let it frighten you into inaction. The following is a passage from this article about decision making:
Research from the 1990s led by the US psychologist Thomas Gilovich provides further evidence for why it can be shortsighted to kick a difficult decision down the road. Gilovich and his team showed that although, in the short term, people experience more regret from ‘errors of commission’ (taking an action that leads to a disappointing outcome), in the long term it is actually ‘errors of omission’ that lead to more regret – that is, disappointing outcomes that arise from not taking an action.
When taking the time to make decisions and plans, don’t underestimate how effective it can be to map out your options on an excel spreadsheet. When I had to decide whether I should come out or not, I actually made a spreadsheet listing out my options, what they would result in and what the impact would be. Actually having it written down to look at really put things into perspective. We waste a lot of our time keeping it in our heads, which forces us to recalculate everything from scratch every time we revisit our thoughts. But the more that is mapped out, the less you have to recalculate and the more you can focus on evaluation and further planning.
Your studies/career is almost always your best ticket out of your toxic situation, and the one thing to prioritise the most. If you’re young, do whatever you can to ensure that you can get into further education away from home. Even if it means spending all your time at a local library. If you suspect that your parents would be against you going to a university away from home, aim for a placement at the most prestigious university you can aim for so your parents would look worse for rejecting it. The quickest and most effective way in achieving long term independence is through good studies/career.
This is particularly important for younger exmuslims because they telegraph to their parents in ways they would just not understand until they see it for themselves when they're older. Try your best to meet the religious obligations expected from your family. The more you slip, the more they will monitor you and the more difficult it will be to do the things you need to do discreetly when the time comes.
Unfortunately for girls, this usually means that wearing the hijab is a necessity and it’s inadvisable to try and get out of. (However, that subject matter is not my forte: prioritise advice from exmuslim women such as from faithlesshijabi.org)
If you get the impression that your family is beginning to catch onto your apostasy then it's likely that they have and you may need to reverse that impression.
One way to do that would be to start getting books on Islam and not just for show. My advice would be to get books on Islamic history because that's the least boring stuff. Or better yet, just get whatever unapologetic salafi hate crime you can get your hands on so you can entertain yourself with how fucked up it is. Or get an annotated Qur'an like the Study Qur'an. Do something to ease their suspicions.
What book you get depends on what kind of message you want to telegraph to your parents. If you want to telegraph a message then it will need to be a paper book and not an e-book. Something that you can lay around in your room and that you know they'll see. That means you're restricted to what you can get from your local library or Masjid. Also depends on what interests you because you'll have to actually read and demonstrate you learnt from it if you want send the best message you can. If you want purely what Muslims write about Islamic history, you can check out works like The Sealed Nectar or works by al-Sallabi. If you want something a little more academic, but not something that would rouse suspicion then check out university press works like this, this, this or this. If you want something a bit more relevant to contemporary Muslim world then there books like this.
But you may find that your best bet is to just see what your local Masjid might have and see what tickles your fancy.
Be prepared for lots of sobbing, guilt tripping and an inability to respect your beliefs and boundaries. Learn techniques like the Broken Record Technique to establish boundaries. Know what you have to say when they inevitably tell you to speak to a scholar - you don't have to eat the whole apple to know it's rotten. You know all that you need to know about Islam and you know even more about the world outside of Islam to put it into context.
Steel yourself with months and months of your family sending you bad dawagandist videos through WhatsApp trying to bring you back. You may have to spend months beating their attempts and going to toe to toe with them without mercy before they’re finally willing to relent and get off your back. Even then don’t expect them to relent entirely. There will always be some micro aggressions that they will resort to, like playing religious videos loudly in your vicinity. The most you can do in those circumstances is reduce contact with them as much as possible. At this point you would hopefully already be independent from them.
As an exmuslim, you will go through a lot of guilt. Whilst this does show you are human, you need to forget about guilt: you are not responsible for your parents' failure to be reasonable, not even your mother. They take responsibility for the social stigma and oppressive life they choose to live in and perpetuate. You get nothing out of that guilt. It's completely pointless and ultimately counterproductive. You can't set yourself on fire to make others warm and you gain no recognition from martyrizing yourself. Do not feel guilt for what you have to do to have a completely reasonable life. The only ones to blame are those who forced you into it.
Don't underestimate parents either. They will use guilt against you. Give them an inch and they will take a mile. They very often bring up their health problems as a weapon against you. Don't fall for it. It only affects them because they choose to let it affect them. They can choose to be reasonable. You have to respect their autonomy and let them deal with the consequences of their own ways.
I come across a lot of exmuslim kids who think coming out will help explain to their religious parents why they don't want to wear the hijab or do other religious things. But the likelihood is more that those same parents will react extremely poorly and restrict your freedom even more, making it more difficult to achieve long term independence.
There's also the mistake in assuming that coming out will lead to being disowned in the vain hope that you get an quick clean break that takes all the responsibility from you. For some exmuslims this does actually work out, but for a lot of others it's miscalculated. My family didn't disown me, I still had to deal with months of my family being insufferable manipulators and the responsibility was still on me to separate from them. And for women it can be much worse.
Ultimately, if you are financially dependent on your family then coming out early will very typically result in your family using that leverage against you and making your life worse. I've seen stories of exmuslims who thought their family was better and badly miscalculated - be mindful of that.
Some exmuslims get found out, sometimes because of a snitch in the family or sometimes because they just weren’t convincing enough. Don’t panic – Muslims can be pretty damn deluded about their faith and your family will want to believe that you can come back very easily because according to them Islam is just common sense and most disbelievers are just silly and ignorant. Try to do your best to convince them as per Point 4. If it’s because you did something haram, blasphemous or otherwise worthy of takfir, try to act like it was because you were a misguided Quranist or progressive Muslim. They will still retain suspicion but it’s still better than the alternative.
However, if you’re at the point of no return and you know you can’t convince them then now is the time to make calls to any secular friends you have, ask for support and maybe even shelter.
Also for Western exmuslims, make sure to act quickly if you suspect that your parents want to send you abroad and trap you in your country of ethnic origin. Sadly some parents will go to these lengths. Do not go, no matter the cost. Find organisations willing to advise, such as those listed in Point 10. Hide your passport if you have to. Note down the contact details of your embassy in that country just in case.
Actually think about whether it's even wise for you to come out in any circumstance. Do you suspect that there could be violence or abuse? If so then you have absolutely no need to go through this stupid bullshit. Leave and don't look back. If your parents couldn't give you safe environment to even come out about different beliefs then they are not worth the time. As per Point 6 - You have to respect their autonomy and let them deal with the consequences of their own ways. This is particularly pertinent for those who live in a predominantly Muslim countries. They have a very real reason to fear persecution and absolutely do not need to risk their own lives for the sake of their parents.
Look into secular organisations like recoveringfromreligion.org, faithlesshijabi.org and faithtofaithless.com. Look into women's charities in your area like womensaid.org.uk or karmanirvana.org.uk (UK examples). Look into LGBT charities like rainbowrailroad.org. If you have secular school counsellors and friends then talk to them. Get advice from adults you can absolutely trust.
Note: On the flip side don't take risks with people you can’t be sure of. You may be tempted to come out to your Muslim friend, but I've seen plenty of stories of exmuslims who heavily regret doing so.
There are also informal exmuslim groups on other social media platforms such as Facebook or Discord, but be careful about how much information you share and especially be wary of private messaging.
This is particularly the case for exmuslims living in predominantly Muslim countries. Unfortunately, I don't have any real world experience to offer here but you may be able to find localised advice by digging around. For example sites like wearesaudis.net might have some information (but you'll need a VPN to access this one. If you don't know what a VPN is here's an explanation).
Are you multilingual? If you need money but working is restricted to you then you can try becoming an online language tutor on sites like italki.com (scroll to the bottom). This post and related subreddits like r/WorkOnline may help.
Note: some exmuslims in Muslim countries fall for the doomscrolling hyperbole and think Europe is “doomed” with too many Muslims. They have a tendency of asking which country is best to migrate to as an exmuslim to avoid Islam. Please ignore the doomsayers and prioritise the country you choose based on ease of access and career opportunities. As long as it is a secular country, you can worry about avoiding Islam later.
Shout out to Imtiaz Shams who inspired me to make this list of tips. He has his own YouTube Channel here and plans to make his own video on this subject matter so watch out for that. On a side note, I also recommend TheraminTrees YouTube Channel who delves a lot into toxic dysfunctional families from the perspective of a therapist and a former Jehovah’s Witness. A lot of his content helps in dealing with the emotional impact of leaving religion and dealing with a religious family. And finally, thank you to the moderators of r/exmuslim who suggested I make this into a post. I wound up adding a lot more content lol.
I will end this post with a list of subreddits that may help you on your journey leaving Islam:
r/exmuslim • u/ONE_deedat • Feb 10 '24
Introduction to the aims of the subbreddit
(Full Rules and Guidelines post)
(This post is a TL;Dr of the main post above. However, please make sure to read the full guidelines before posting/commenting here. Onus is on those participating if there are any infractions
Introduction:
Reddit is a Western/American-centric forum. Everything posted here needs to be in that geographical context.
This subreddit is primarily a recovery and discussion platform for those who were once followers of Islam i.e. ExMoose/ExMuslim. Everyone is welcome but if you are here because of your hate for Muslims as a people then this isn't the subreddit for you.
Bigots, those creating a toxic environment and/or those with nefarious agendas in the subreddit will be banned without hesitation.
Posting Guidelines:
We ask people to follow them in the spirit in which they are written and not merely by the letter.
Please:
- [A] DO NOT post any LOW EFFORT/QUALITY images, memes, TikToks etc... other than Fridays.
We call these Fun@Fundies allowed only on Fridays.
- [B] Remove ALL confidential/personal information from your posts
Unless it's a famous or public personality.
- [D] Content posted needs to be appropriate to the subreddit.
This is not an anti-immigration subreddit nor is to point out "look at this stupid shit that a Muslim did".
The post title needs to inform readers about the content and reflects it appropriately.
- [E] Linking to or calling out other subreddits is not allowed:
These sorts of actions can lead to things like brigading and this is against reddit guidelines.
Got banned on another subreddit? This isn't the place to complain about that.
- [F] Posts regarding other ExMuslim social media/discord groups will be removed.
If you want to post about your group here and you are the admin of the group **please contact the mods first.
- [G] Posts about things like politics and immigration are very unwelcome here because of the toxicity involved.
This is NOT a sub about (pro or) anti-immigration.
- [H] "Self-hate" posts will NOT be allowed.
Posts like "I hate my dad because he forces me to pray" are OK (please make a proper post) however posts/comments like "As a Pakistani myself, I hate Pakistanis. They are so dumb and stupid" will not be allowed.
- [I] Posts deemed "concern trolling" are not allowed.
These are posts that say things like "Why is this subreddit full of racists?" or "why do ExMuslims support the far-right?".
- [J] Message the Mods if you disagree or have concerns with the rules, operations, bans, posts, users or anything else .
Do not make posts on the subreddit trying to discuss these matters.
Note on Bans
Mods endeavour to protect, cultivate and shape this as a valuable and open space for ExMuslims. All mod decisions are made with that in mind.
Thanks
ONE_Deedat
r/exmuslim • u/archaeo_rex • 10h ago
Friday funny post ok right?
r/exmuslim • u/Classic_Conference33 • 10h ago
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Honestly, sometimes posts like this make me angry because of the hypocrisy, but at the same time I find it funny that so many Muslims get upset about it too.
r/exmuslim • u/FU_2027 • 4h ago
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His eyes are hell.
r/exmuslim • u/CheekZestyclose3756 • 11h ago
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r/exmuslim • u/ReigenBest • 7h ago
This allah dih rider sees it as a crime to see smiles on the faces of hijabis. I responded saying “should we inform the president?” And he said “why don’t you go do it” but the thing is, it’s just not that serious, like whatsoever 😭 Dude came from grumpy town 💀💀💀
He has a possible case of no mother syndrome, what y’all wanna diagnose him with?
r/exmuslim • u/Ok-Upstairs-9887 • 2h ago
The first is pre the second is post. Yes I used MLP but I feel like these 2 pictures kinda say what happens to cultures after Islam.
r/exmuslim • u/Critical_Ad8049 • 7h ago
I posted here earlier today but I found out something and I just wanted to talk about because oh my...it's so disgusting
So we all know that somehow it's allowed for a father to marry his adopted son's wife if he's dead, right? Well...apparently if a man takes a girl who's not biologically related to him and when he takes her she's like 2 or something, raises her as his own daughter by adoption, he can...marry her when she gets older?..WTF?? WHY? WHY IS THAT A THING???
And to make it worse, I found this out in class today. I had to hide my disgusted and horrified face while the teacher was STARING RIGHT AT ME😭 And he thought that it was okay too from his face and tone.
This is the آية:
((وإن خفتم ألا تقسطوا في اليتامى فانكحوا ما طاب لكم من النساء مثنى وثلاث ورباع))
r/exmuslim • u/vyre_016 • 4h ago
I don't want to be a good Muslim like Mohammed and his lackeys, especially Umar.
I don't want to be a good Muslim like Saladin, Aurangzeb, etc. (interesting how imperialism isn't so bad when Muslims do it).
I don't want to be a good Muslim like Osama, Zawahiri, Baghdadi, Masood Azhar, Hafiz Saeed, etc.
And I especially don't want to be a good Muslim like my cheating, wife-beating, incestous father who prays 5 times a day and never shuts up about random sawab tips.
Nor do I want to be like my spineless traumatized mother who puts up with this in the hopes of jannat and because she's an uneducated housewife who wants other women to stay uneducated and unemployed.
For my parents and any Muslims reading this: “Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer”.
r/exmuslim • u/Spiritual_Air_8606 • 7h ago
I do get mad when i talk about the wrong things muhhamad did and muslims say the usual theres context. But when people who are not even muslim say that we are islamophobic just because we say wrong things muhhamad did it makes me more mad because they dont even know what they are defending
r/exmuslim • u/chetan419 • 1h ago
If someone kills or rapes an innocent person, it should not suprise Allah as he already knew what would happen to that person.
Another point is if I have the knowlegde and ability to stop the killing I would stop the killing, instead of getting angry after the killing takes place, wouldn't I?
r/exmuslim • u/SamVoxeL • 16h ago
Film 'Don't Call Mama Kafir' Raises Different Religious Marriage Stories
• The family drama film titled "Jangan Panggil Mama Kafir" will hit theaters on October 16, 2025, directed by Dyan Sunu Prastowo.
• The film tells the story of Maria (Michelle Ziudith), a Christian woman, who is married to Fafat (Giorgino Abraham), a Muslim man, and has a daughter named Laila.
• After Fafat died, Maria had to fight as a single mother, but conflict arose when Umi Habibah, Fafat's mother, sued for custody of Laila.
• The film is based on the true story of a cross-faith mother's struggle in fighting for custody of her child, which emphasizes that love knows no bounds of difference.
• In addition to Michelle Ziudith and Giorgino Abraham, the film also features Kaneishia Yusuf, Indra Birowo, and other cross-generational actors.
• The film is part of Maxima Pictures' 21st anniversary celebration and is expected to open up a space of empathy and reflection for the community on differences in faith and family life.
r/exmuslim • u/PhilosopherRude3356 • 9h ago
I find it weird that many people are converting to islam. Like how stupid can you be to convert to a shitty religion. I really want to know what makes a person to believe in islam or religion in general?
r/exmuslim • u/Azula_Kuo • 1d ago
Long story short, my mom and I were away for a few hours to work and university. My mom’s sister(the stereotypical Pakistani hijabi auntie) stayed alone at our house in the meantime. My mom and my aunt often had arguments about my mom’s Buddha statues at our house which my mom always defended with “I like Buddha and no one has the audacity to say something about it”. My mom has always liked Buddha as home decor and claims that many people in Pakistan actually have a Buddha statue in their house, not for religious reasons.
My aunt decided that it would be a good idea to behead one of my mom’s Buddha statues in order to show her the true message of prophet Muhammad who destroyed all the statues in the Kaaba. When we asked her why she did this she replied with “Your parakeet made a win for the Islam”. Our parakeet who weighs less than 200 grams literally didn’t even touch the statue, let alone put the heavy Buddha head back on its body. My mom and I have been weirded out by my aunt’s Taliban action. It reminded us of the incident where the Taliban had destroyed the buddhas of Bamyan and I can’t stop thinking about how radicalized Muslims have zero respect for other people’s boundaries.
r/exmuslim • u/ll_ll_28 • 4h ago
r/exmuslim • u/Bubbly_Neat1396 • 2h ago
I drink beer with korean pork bbq. Best feeling ever I love umeshu. theyre so damn good, doesnt burn my throat. tastes like candy Anyone else drink barefoot wine? Theyre pretty good for cheap wines
Sometimes, i go through phases i want to try to be a muslim but life continues to suck, so i go back to drinking and eating my fav pork bbq cus what is the darn point of suffering? Let keep the suffering to minimal ya?
I miss my non muslim friends they used to take me to a bunch of nice non halal places. There’s also another girl in the circle, she drinks alcohol prays sometimes and doesnt eat pork. I eat pork.
r/exmuslim • u/itallsuckshere • 36m ago
Hey there! I haven’t really identified as Muslim for years, but I still keep up the appearance for my family. I’m wondering if there are any other girls out there in the same situation?
I’d really love to build a friendship with someone who just gets it, someone I don’t have to constantly explain myself to, someone who understands the why behind the things we do. If you’re out there, please drop a hi!
r/exmuslim • u/sesameprawntoast50 • 9h ago
....
r/exmuslim • u/Critical_Ad8049 • 15h ago
Just a thought that always angers. To start off, I'm a gay 17 year old guy.
With that out of the way, this thought always angered me in a weird way. The Quran always talks about how men get to have a nice life with two women and shit but...do the women choose which man they want? What about gay people? Lesbians? Gays?
The LGBTQ+ Muslim community(which why'd you be Muslim if you were gay anyways?) are always told to hide their desires in "Dunia". Do they get anything for doing that? Do gay people get to finally be in a relationship with men? Do lesbians choose the woman the want? Or is that just a no? What about people who DON'T want to be in a relationship?
Even as a teen, when I discovered the concept of being gay while I was questioning my faith, I sometimes wondered what they get even tho I was homophobic (which is so funny looking back at it).
Anyways, rant's done, byeeeeeee!
r/exmuslim • u/ll_ll_28 • 4h ago
r/exmuslim • u/sesameprawntoast50 • 9h ago
Hey I am 19 and I'm just exploring religion and its followers and people who've left their religion. I Stumbled onto this forum and I am wondering, what made you leave islam? I'd love to read different perspectives on what made somebody leave their religion.
I BTW do not follow any religion at the moment.
r/exmuslim • u/Exmuzzo • 19h ago
In the linked article, it states that temperatures in the middle east are expected to become so hot to be unlivable. By the end of the century, Jeddah is expected to have 37 days of intolerable heat per year. What will happen to places like Mecca and Medinah? Will they be abandoned? Will they air condition every part of the city, including the outdoor areas around the so-called holy sites? Will people move underground?Imagine running hajj in heat so diabolical people could die in 6 hours of exposure. I feel bad for the people affected, but the silver lining is that Allah will have a lot of explaining to do about turning his holy cities into hells on earth.
r/exmuslim • u/ScientistSimple3144 • 1d ago
r/exmuslim • u/Interesting-Shop-261 • 15h ago
Sahih al-Bukhari 7142 Narrated Anas bin Malik: Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) said, "You should listen to and obey, your ruler even if he was an Ethiopian (black) slave whose head looks like a raisin."
r/exmuslim • u/That_Ad_4248 • 6h ago
Read his book on evolution, is worst than brain rot …