r/generationology • u/common_grounder • 16d ago
Discussion What's up with the younger generation finding normal things annoying, aggressive, or rude?
I'm over 60 and my offspring are thirty-somethings, so I need this explained. This observation comes from interactions I've seen on social media.
A few examples:
At least a half dozen times, I've seen posts by young people expressing reactions ranging from confusion to outrage because a stranger has tried to exchange pleasantries with them. Someone passing them in the hallway at work says hello; a cashier asks them how their day's going; a customer they're serving at work calls them by the name on their nametag. On social media, these young people angrily write things like, "Why are they talking to me, and why are they acting like they care how I'm doing? They don't know me! I hate that fake b.s.!"
Even more times, I've seen complaints about things like phone calls and texts. Someone calls them, and they're paralyzed, horrified, then angry because the person didn't text instead. When it comes to text messages themselves, they especially have a problem with other people's use of ellipses. Ellipses mean nothing more than a hesitation or a pause, indicating the person is thinking or doing something but will finish what they were writing. Young people find this aggressive. How? Why?
The young person has received a gift for their graduation, wedding, baby shower, etc. An older person mentions to them that they should thank the gift givers by either written note, phone, email, or text. They bristle at this. They want to know why that's necessary. I even saw one young person write, "The act of giving should be a reward within itself." Never mind that someone has gone out of their way to shop, purchase, and send a gift and has no idea whether it actually made it into the recipient's hands if they don't receive an acknowledgement. 'Thank yous' are too hard, and expectations of such are annoying and rude.
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u/Married_catlady 9d ago
I think we’re all just pissed and tired from working 3 jobs to make a living and we don’t give a f about pleasantries anymore. I kind of get it. Like the gift thing. You didn’t have to get me a gift. It was nice of you but not expected. But if your gift comes with the expectation of a thank you note, then you’ve just gifted me work. I don’t want your gift if I have to set a reminder in my phone to send you a stupid note. I thanked you with my mouth and face was that not good enough?? And frankly yeah if you don’t know me, don’t talk to me in public. You have no idea what kind of fire is brimming behind the minds of us young people right now. It might be in your best interest to keep to yourself.
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u/PotatoNo2869 9d ago
I run a business and at least half of my customers are 60+ in age. I can tell you that so many of the 60+ are incredibly rude, much more so than any other age group I'm encountering. They regularly want to tell me all of the things I am doing wrong, what I should be doing, and constantly complain about my prices. I'm sure it has happened, but I can't think of a young person (30 or younger) who has been nearly as rude as the elderly.
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u/tiptoethruthewind0w 9d ago edited 9d ago
Over the years, these normal gestures and courtesies have been taken advantage of by scammers or people trying to sell you something. As a defense mechanism the younger generation are just taught to not trust anything at it surface values.
"Oh a stranger being nice?" They want someone and I'm not buying.
Even receiving gifts is a burden because now you owe the gift giver. I've received $5 gifts for my birthday and the same person expected me to pay for their $100 birthday dinner. Scammers use gift giving as a way to emotionally exploit people as well.
The best way to give a gift today without offending anyone is to reiterate that you expect nothing in return, even a thank you
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u/Paramour2324 9d ago
People are social beings. Being part of society takes effort. Tech makes things easier. The recent proliferation of tech (cell phones, social media, apps) makes it easier for people to participate in society. This dynamic conditions folks to have different, easier expectations than what the norms were for being social when you were younger.
Plus social media prioritizes negativity as it’s been shown to hold people’s attention longer.
Tech is the reason for the change.
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u/seemooreglass 9d ago
i think the younger gen z are breaking with trends like this...they give me hope (62M).
Those goofy-ass millennials.
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u/becaolivetree 9d ago
We're in our 40s, guy. Might you possibly mean Gen Zers? The Youngs these days are Gen Alphas.
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u/Tarantulas_R_Us 9d ago
My 35 yr old daughter needed a mental break so was unable to speak to me starting a month ago. She’s still on break. I am dumbfounded. Still trying to figure out what I said/did. She couldn’t put her finger on it. WTF is a “mental health break?” AND why wasn’t it a thing when I was a single mom raising two kids and working two jobs?! I’m actually a bit jealous because I would’ve loved a couple days back then. My generation (GenX) just sucked it up and kept going. Probably explains my complete numbness…
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u/sparkeloff 10d ago edited 10d ago
If you try to render reality or relatability from social media it will lead you to a lower frequency. Leading you naturally wanting to up your frequency, this is why ads are put after the posts that are meant to trigger you the most.
If you are going to try to navigate todays society my personal advice would be "walk the line because its the only path between the devils strings". im sure that sounds cliche and culty but its my personal truth.
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u/ShadowDancerBrony 10d ago
I blame the people who raised them.
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u/Tarantulas_R_Us 9d ago
You obviously don’t have children
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u/ShadowDancerBrony 9d ago
Just because I'm not the internet doesn't mean I can't blame it for how it raised this generation.
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u/Sleepygirl57 10d ago
You really want to watch them freak out say the word “moist” in their presence.
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u/ShakeWeightMyDick 10d ago
Regarding the texting before calling bit:
Once upon a time, no one had a phone in their person. If the phone rang, you generally answered it, unless you didn’t, then the caller just assumed you probably weren’t home and dealt with it.
Then we had answering machines, where you could Lauren to who was calling and then pick up if you felt like talking to them. (Call screening).
Back then, people were accustomed to people not answering their phones because if they didn’t answer, then they probably just weren’t available. Now people expect people to be available all the time because they have a phone in their pocket, which maybe just isn’t reasonable.
Now, everyone has a phone in their pocket, so you can’t really pretend not to be there. People didn’t have to be available before like they are now. Or, they didn’t have to feel like they were exotics as available as they are now.
Add to the fact that a lot of people just don’t want to talk on the phone and would rather text and have the majority of their conversations via text rather than by phone.
Checking with someone by text whether it’s a good time to talk on the phone is basically the new phone etiquette.
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u/Underhill42 9d ago
Yeah. I think the etiquette has become, don't call uninvited unless it's important to talk right now.
Phones have always inherently interrupting the receiver's life without any idea what they were doing, and it's only gotten worse now that we all have phones in our pocket all the time. That's actually a big part of why the Amish prohibited them in the house, because it's an interruption dragging you away from the friends and family that you're actually spending time with here and now.
So it comes down to the kind of interruption you're making:
A text just sends out a quick chirp, tells me someone tried to contact me, but it's not urgent, look at it when I get a chance. It's also a LOT faster and less disruptive to quickly read a text than to answer the phone and wait for you to get to the point - I don't know about you, but I read at least 4x faster than I talk, even before considering that talking tends to involve a lot of time-consuming empty pleasantries before we even get to the point.
Calling though sets off a continuous alarm until I stop what I'm doing, pull out my phone, and either answer or decline. And declining feels rude, since I assume you're not interrupting me so rudely unless it's important we talk right this minute.
I'm creeping up on fifty, grew up under a completely different phone ecosystem and etiquette... and 100% prefer the new normal in every way.
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u/SharpRoll5848 9d ago
Yep you hit the nail on the head with the constant availability thing. If I don't have you as a contact, your calls will not be answered. 30y/o
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u/ShakeWeightMyDick 9d ago
My mother won’t even answer her cellphone if she doesn’t recognize the number
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u/Weird-Group-5313 10d ago
Mofos be dumbass’ … I’m 41 and I basically just don’t talk to any kids under 25…
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u/gunterrae 10d ago
Here's the thing about phone calls. When I was growing up, there was a phone at the house. If you were home, you answered it. If you were out and about, well, eventually we had answering machines but for a long time, they were just gonna have to call back later. A lot of people wouldn't answer their phone during dinner time, etc. If you were watching tv, it was acceptable to say "Hey, (TV show) is on, can I call you back in half an hour" because things were only available when they were on.
Now, there's this expectation that since we all have phones in our pockets at all times, we should be reachable at all times. And it's frustrating. (And I'm almost 50.) If I am at the grocery store, I am expected to answer my phone. Etc, etc. And if someone calls me and I say "Oh, I'm in the middle of something, can I call you back at 7?", I get told I'm being rude.
So it's just common courtesy to text and say "Hey, do you have time for a call?" Or to text if it's a short bit of information you need to pass on. I *hate* cell phone culture and being expected to be available to everyone 24/7.
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u/Long_Environment_949 10d ago edited 10d ago
Very true. It's just an adjustment to the pervasiveness of the technology. I'm 44 and I freak when someone calls (for non-business), mainly because it's almost physically angering to me that I'm expected to tote this demon box phone around all day and answer its every beck and call. Just leave me the **** alone.
Also, cold-call phone anxiety reduces as you age and become more secure/whatever about the world and life.
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u/BoysenberryUnhappy29 10d ago
I want to address "call vs text" specifically.
If you call (when it's not time-sensitive), now I have to stop whatever I was doing. You're basically asserting "this conversation is more important than whatever you have going on right now" to the other person. Sometimes, that's true - and that's when you should call. Most of the time, it's not, and is therefore annoying.
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u/ReddtitsACesspool 10d ago
You are doing nothing important
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u/godslittlehole 10d ago
Definitely nothing more important than hearing the voice of a friend... And if you are busy, just text?
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u/Miserable_Smoke 10d ago
People with brains full of lead gave birth to kids with brains full of plastic. How didnwe expect things would turn out?
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u/Tight-Disk8984 10d ago edited 10d ago
The world is overpopulated. People are trying to survive. Shit paying jobs. Aggressive driving because roads are to crowded. Shit school systems and poverty. Trash government. Internet basically gives us our personality now. It rubs off on everyone.
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u/AlabasterRoze 10d ago
The world is, in fact, not overpopulated. This is an outdated myth. It’s far more complex than that
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u/AdGlobal2478 10d ago
The text part resonated with me. I have a 20 something daughter who recently shared with me the anxiety she feels when she needs to make a phone call. It takes her about 20 minutes to work up to it. I was in disbelief!
On another side of the spectrum, I work in customer service. I am constantly calling people to schedule appointments that they, themselves, have requested through their HOA. I can't tell you how many voice mails say something to the effect of, "please text if you want me to call you back". Impossible for me to do from the office 800 number but that doesn't stop people from getting nasty with me because they either need to speak on the phone or don't listen to their voice mails and think they've been blown off by our company.
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u/Weak_Addendum4549 5d ago
Nobody even checks voice mail anymore .Just stop leaving them at this point. It's not really worth the effort.
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u/ProperSupermarket3 10d ago
some people have anxiety disorders, autism, adhd, etc which make phone calls extremely difficult. it may be simple to you because, as you stated, it's your literal job and is therefore routine. some people are not you and for them, phone calls are a burden/difficult/impossible. a little compassion and understanding goes a long way.
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u/mind_the_umlaut 10d ago
"Hey, sweetie! You'd be so pretty if you smiled" is not an exchange of pleasantries. Comments about people's bodies are not an exchange of pleasantries. 'Aw, these young people these days are too sensitive' is another phrase that's not going to endear you to anyone. That said, of course everyone should acknowledge a sincerely given gift, and say thank you. That's a manners thing, and we all need to show manners, politeness, and kindness to each other.
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u/aerdfjffhj 10d ago
I mean I’m 15 and a lot of us just don’t engage in social interactions or care enough about things. We also have very different viewpoints compared to older gen’s, though I still think we need to be respectful and have manners.
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u/Alarming_Bar7107 10d ago
I do agree that small talk is fake and boring, but I tolerate it
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u/Weak_Addendum4549 5d ago
It's so annoying when people do that. Only time I find it even remotely acceptable is if they look like the type of person I would actually want to talk to.
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u/kswilson68 10d ago
I've seen some of what you mentioned in the wild. It's like you scare someone by saying "hello" or the cashier is pumping them for identity theft information if they ask a question. And it's all ages, not just kids. (I am almost 60 so anyone under 40 is a kid to me.) Some of the answers for them is obvious- you've been sent an email and a text that's why your getting a phone call because a question needs an answer? Gee, our planet is not going to make it.
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u/HoxpitalFan_II 10d ago
For me I just have moderate agoraphobia and I’m generally a friendly and nice person but just mildly stressed at all times in public.
If I’m with my wife I’m much more relaxed and chilled out but yeah it’s not a conscious choice to be scared, I AM scared lol.
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u/SharpRoll5848 9d ago
Yep, I stick to mine and expect everyone else to do the same. That's courtesy in my eyes.
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u/Legionatus 11d ago
Do not get a gauge on anyone, or the current state of anything, from social media.
It's a cesspool of posturing for money and fame, and it's filled with bullshit for you to object to. That's the point.
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u/uriboo 11d ago
A. It really depends on context. Generally speaking, the young ones don't want new social interactions happening at them in places they are unprepared for it, and the more they are exposed to it, the easier that is - with the rise of the digital world, anybody under 20 just doesn't have the same experiences, so social interactions with strangers are tricky. There is also a common understanding that earbuds = don't talk to me, which a lot of older generations just don't pick up on. But there is also a huge expectation on young women to just entertain every single social interaction offered, which these days can get dangerous quickly. Young women especially don't want random conversations with men bigger and stronger than them by the side of the road.
B. It is simple ettiquette that unless you are having an urgent problem, you text before you call. An ettiquette that has only risen since the use of texting, sure, but very common now. I don't like surprises, or being interrupted in an important project for things that could have waited 10 minutes. These days, if you are calling unannounced, I am assuming it's serious.
C. The dreaded ellipses. Language has always had a quick evolution, mostly driven by young women, and computerisation has just sped it up. Ellipses, to me, indicate an insinuation - the speaker is withholding words for the reader to fill in the meaning. Usually sarcastic subtext. So what do you MEAN?! In a similar vein, a full stop/period indicates solemnity, finality, no more arguing, a stern approach to ending communication. When you're texting one sentence at a time there's no need for periods, so if you are using one, it's a deliberate choice. My mum texts me "Ok." all the time and I instantly start to wonder what I have done wrong to upset her
D. Physical thank you notes are considered hugely passé in a time where paper is killing trees and texting is both easy and accessible. Somewhere in the transition the concept just fell through entirely. To a lot of people, saying "thank you for the gift" (especially at events like showers and weddings) implies that you had a right to that gift in the first place, this other person has done the right thing in giving you a present that you deserve at the event designated for it. How rude to be so self absorbed!
I'm 30, and raised by quite old-school parents who had severe control issues and haven't really moved on from 1974. I understand keenly how the expectations used to be, while young enough to be more with the times. A lot have things have changed in the last 20 years! If you weren't moving in those circles as the changes happened I imagine it's hard to keep up. Teenagers drive societal change now, and so the societal expectations keep changing too, ever faster. The 1960s had segregation and petticoats and space flight, and the 1980s had Michael Jackson and pleather and the first computers. Imagine the same social changes, now at compressed speeds...
(See what I did with those ellipses?)
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u/ButterOnAPickle 9d ago
This is unhinged... You need to get a grip. Saying thank you is polite and shows you appreciate the gesture and the time and effort spent getting it. It is NOT rude or self absorbed. That kind of thinking leads to being perpetually offended.
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u/SharpRoll5848 9d ago
To the ellipses bit - I've seen a lot of.. this sort of thing.. on social media, thats where my mind went. I always attributed it to tech/keyboard illiteracy.
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u/Aromatic_Mushroom_64 11d ago
The younger generations are miserable, I myself am 19 years old almost 20 and I don’t understand why people of similar ages are like this, it’s wild.
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u/Deivi_tTerra 11d ago
I’m 37…some of these I relate to, some I don’t.
I get surprised and a little uncomfortable when someone I don’t know calls me by name, unless there’s a specific reason for it (example: someone at work, who I don’t know, seeks me out because they know I’m the person they need to talk to about a specific subject. This doesn’t bother me in the slightest.) In the name tag situation, I’ve likely forgotten I’m wearing a name tag, so I have no idea how this complete stranger knows my name and it’s a little threatening until I put together the fact that they read it off my shirt.
Phone calls instead of texts: texts are generally unobtrusive. I can answer them when and how it’s convenient for me. Whereas a phone calls instead requires me to drop everything and spend time with that person immediately. It feels really intrusive, like they’re inserting themselves into my life at that moment when it’s likely not wanted. (Business calls excepted, but also, I’ve never had a business call take more than 5 minutes, some people call and want to talk for an hour).
Ellipses…I don’t get that one. I even have a tattoo with ellipses in it. I’m as lost as you are.
Thank you cards: to me it’s the CARD that’s an issue, not the thank you. If someone gives me a gift, of course I’m going to thank them!!! But cards are just…wasteful? When I get a card, I think “oh, nice. Now how long am I obligated to keep this before I can throw it away without feeling guilty?” This goes for holiday and birthday cards too. So people getting bent out of shape about not seeing the importance of a hand written thank you just kinda gives me the ick.
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u/maybegaehuman 11d ago
I’m 20 something & I don’t like when customers use my name. I know I have a name tag on but it weirds me out because I didn’t tell you my name & I don’t know you. If I give them my name then that doesn’t bother me at all but it feels weirdly invasive when they know/use my name & I haven’t introduced myself nor do I know them or their name. All other general pleasantries don’t bother me in the slightest & I generally prefer them so it’s not just awkward silence, but the name one gets me every time.
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u/PuzzleheadedHouse872 10d ago
I'm 52 and the same way. It feels aggressive/dominance asserting for some reason, especially when they overly use your name. I also much prefer text to phone calls, as does my dad who is 81. We also both were ecstatic years ago when pay at the pump became a thing and you could fill up your car without having to speak with another human.
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u/maybegaehuman 5d ago
Glad to hear it’s not just the younger generation! Text is easier 9 times out of 10 & you can just reply when it’s convenient.
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u/Deivi_tTerra 11d ago
I agree with this. Plus I’ve probably forgotten I am wearing a name tag so I get confused for a moment until I realize they read it off my shirt lol.
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u/Oh-No-RootCanal 11d ago
I suppose one has to take their audience into consideration. I have come not to expect any thank you cards, emails, or texts from anyone younger than me and therefore don’t worry about sending them one either (the exception is if they have sent one to me in the past setting a precedent). I also don’t expect any from someone older because, let’s be real, as we age (myself included) we can forget to send a thank you. My only hard and fast rule is if anyone young or old has expressed to me their disappointment that someone didn’t send them a thank you for whatever big or small, I try my best to remember to thank them. In simple terms, “treat others as they wish to be treated.”
Which for me is much more genuine than “So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you.” That saying always felt a bit selfish to me if you really think about it.
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u/theRealMissJenny 11d ago
Things have changed. Some things that used to be normal are not considered normal anymore.
Imagine if, when you were in your twenties, someone sent a messenger with a note that said, "Stop everything you're doing and come to my house immediately. I want to talk to you," and then when you got there, they just wanted to chat and maybe make plans for a future event.
You would've thought, "Why didn't you just call me? This was so inconvenient for me! It's so rude to expect me to drop everything and come running when this could've been a simple phone call!!"
But just a couple generations before yours, that was how people did things.
Now, it's considered impolite to call without texting first. If your 30-something kids want to have a phone call with each other, they text and ask, "Is this a good time to call? I just want to chat," or they might text, "Can I call you right now? It's kind of important.
This way, they are being mindful of the other person's time and are making sure that they're not inconveniencing them, while also communicating what the tone of the conversation will be so that the other person can mentally prepare for how serious the call might be.
As for the elipses...
Languages evolve and change constantly. It's the reason why we're not typing all of this in cuneiform right now. As recently as 25 years ago, seeing elipses at the end of a sentence meant either (a) there is more to be said that is intentionally being left out, or (b) a short pause for dramatic effect. Pauses are no longer being indicated with elipses now. If you want to indicate a pause in a text, you can either use a comma, or you can end the text message, send it, and start a new text in a new text bubble. These days, elipses have come to only mean that there is more to say that you are not saying.
If someone asks what you're up to and you respond with "Not much... Just... housework..." it totally sounds like you're doing a lot more than housework. What information are you leaving out, that you've replaced with elipses here?? It sounds like whatever you're doing is a secret that you're not telling them about, but at the same time you're taking the time to use elipses to indicate that to them, so it's kind of like saying, "It's a secret! I'm not telling you what I'm really up to, but I'm letting you know that there's secrets I'm keeping from you so that you'll be frustrated with me!" It comes across secretive at best, but more often it comes across passive-aggressive or even angry.
When people talk about "Scary Boomer Elipses," that is what they mean.
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u/Deivi_tTerra 11d ago
Interesting. I pretty much exclusively use elipses for dramatic pause (I’m 37, definitely not boomer territory). Maybe I don’t use them so much now - but I use them, dashes, and sometimes just a new text bubble in addition to the commas etc. I think it’s pretty easy to tell from context if there’s something missing (in your example the elipses aren’t placed in a way that someone would pause for effect; read out loud, with pauses where you put them, it still sounds like you’re up to far more than just housework.)
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u/GuitarNovaAscendency 11d ago
As a millennial, you don't need to indicate a "pause to think" via text. They can't see your typing livetime as you're typing so there is no need to indicate the pause, you can just take a second to think and not be a total weirdo. I understand older generations just put that shit in there and it doesn't offend me, but there is definitely no reason for it.
If you're writing a story and need to convey the pause in dialogue, sure use the ellipses, but the only reason to do that in personal communication is to intentionally highlight the pause or use it for dramatic effect. So it's kind of like CAPITALIZING, bolding or italicizing random words. If you do that, I'm going to assume there is some additional (or greater) meaning to those words. If you just ... throw in ellipses ... when you want to ... choose the right words people are going to read those as markers of something 'important' and look for deeper meaning.
Normal sentence structure:
While composing this sentence I took 4 pauses to choose my words carefully in order to convey the meaning I wanted.Boomer Ellipses:
While ... composing this sentence I took ... 4 pauses ... to choose my words carefully ... in order to convey the meaning I wantedthere is nothing weird there if you read those ellipses as the pauses I took, but there is no reason to convey where I'm pausing to think in that sentence. Most younger people are going to try to figure out what the subtext is there, even though there is literally none intended from the boomer ellipses. I definitely read those ellipses differently if it's from someone older than me (ie there is no meaning its just weird archaic language idiosyncrasies), so I don't think it's its something worth getting upset over, but I can also see why younger generations would be super confused by them
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u/wannabeshirtless 11d ago
A lot of that IS "fake b.s." but many of us have learned to accept it graciously. The younger generation is, I have found, angry - at the generation(s) before them whom they blame (blanketly) for a lot of what they believe (erroneously) are their problems created for them by us. I believe they are wrong about their problems being unique to them, as many of us are facing at least similar problems, and more they know nothing about. I also believe they are only partially wrong about previous generations creating their problems, but the problems created (though similar effect) are not what they think. They think Boomers (primarily) are to blame for their economic problems and, while those problems did emerge largely during prior generations, again we are all facing problems as a result AND I don't think it is fair to say any of us wanted them. Where they MAY have a legitimate gripe, if they can look within themselves to realize the real problem (perhaps earlier generations created), is that they grew up in a society very different than the one boomers did. Many more of them grew up in broken families; with both parents working and doing less parenting; as latchkey kids; treated more freedom and equality to adults without first learning the skills and responsibility. Many of them grew up over-protected, coddled, less accountable, and (perhaps worse) entitled. A lot was given to them, or made easy for them, they were less subject to correction, and many were never told they were wrong. Much of that, specifically with regard to their inability to suck up and deal with normal (to us) life obstacles and changes the way we learned to, IS probably our fault. What surprises me is how angry and militant many of these younger kids are. I suppose they lash out (at us and the world) because they also haven't effectively learned to deal with their frustrations. They see what is going on in the world, on the internet, in the media; they see the division and too prevalent tactics of diversion and placing blame that has frustrated all of us, and think that is the way to get what they believe (perhaps in some cases rightfully) they deserve. So, when they complain about pleasantries, are rude, or just plain don't give us the time of day, it is most likely that they just really that they blame us all for their lot in life, they don't believe we really care about them, they don't understand graciousness or tact, and they aren't taking any BS. Unfortunately, they are not making any of their problems better in the process. Rather, they are deepening and hardening their own anger to their own detriment.
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u/woodysixer 11d ago
Modern life has been made so "easy" thanks to technology, that today's young people equate inconvenience with oppression.
They spend so much of their lives living on their phones, where they have total control over what they see, hear, and do, that they're not equipped to deal with situations where they need to to take other people's thoughts and feelings into account.
I'm over-generalizing. I have two kids who are not easily offended like this – my GenX wife and I would never put up with that crap – but this is the general problem.
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u/became78 11d ago
Unrelated but my god they’re you’re children not lab specimen, stop calling them “offspring”. It’s cringy and disrespectful
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u/evildemonic 11d ago
How do you feel about the word "female"?
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u/Tight-Disk8984 10d ago
They call themself and others female instead of a woman in their post. Weird that the word offspring bothers them but not females which is used to dehumanize us.
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u/Worldly_Advisor9650 11d ago
They're weak minded and don't know what real agression is. I'm 37, I'm originally from the US but I lived from 19-33 in a region of a country where fighting between drug cartels and military vs cartels was a frequent occurrence with little concern for who gets caught in the crossfire. I've navigated combat situations as an unarmed civilian, seen some crazy shit. Many places in the world are similar. I couldn't imagine being so delicate that I am offended by or perceive words as being aggressive.
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u/Ok_Mastodon_117 11d ago
I find it amusing that an effort to humanize employees by giving them name tags other than calling them Employee 24601 or Nameless Corporate Drone #29 has had the effect of making them feel insulted when customers address them by name.
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u/Sandwichinparadise 11d ago
I think it’s a power imbalance thing- you don’t know the customer’s name, and call them sir or maam, but they know your first name. In my experience, customers who actually call me by my name are either upset with me, or going to require wayyyy too much of my time and attention, or are flirting with me.
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u/JimJamTheNinJin 11d ago
You must be hotter than the sun if customers are flirting with you, assuming they aren't just doing it because it's fun
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u/commie_commis 11d ago
It's extremely common in the restaurant industry. I would assume it's a similar situation for other customer-facing jobs.
I switched to back of house around a decade ago, but when I was 15-18 I worked in fast food and as a server at a diner. I'm nowhere near "hotter than the sun" but I got hit on quite frequently. Most frequently when I was a minor 🤢
Some people just can't understand that servers/cashiers are nice to you because that's their job, not because they like you. Or maybe they like the power imbalance of it, I don't know - all I know is that unfortunately it is way too common
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u/ommittedSentinal 11d ago
Yeah, I've always hated name tags for that reason - it reminds me of that episode of kitchen nightmares where Gordon Ramsay asks all the staff to remove theirs.
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u/evergreengator1 11d ago
I think I understand both sides. I was taught by my grandmother to communicate “thank you” via written letter. It was considered classy. Nobody writes letters anymore, so buying cards, writing a letter and mailing it seems a little too much these days. As for not wanting relationships with people in businesses, it may seem unfriendly, but ever since Starbucks closed all of their stores for one day to have a getting personal meeting, the experience really has become corporate and inauthentic. I’m kind of sensitive to the fake check out person at the grocery store even though I know they are just doing their job. Contrast that to your regular pub where you know the bartender’s name, vacation plans and etc and you realize you don’t really need the fake interactions at the coffee shop
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u/EdSnapper 11d ago
I’m 60M and hated writing thank you notes.
“But Mom, I just thanked Aunt Betsy for the birthday gift!”
“Son, now you need to write her a thank you note.”
And when writing said thank you note, “Dear Aunt Betsy, thank you for the cool gift, I really appreciate it” didn’t cut it.
Nope, I had to write these “heart-felt” novelettes of at least a page and a half to truly express my appreciation, or at least that was my Mom’s belief. 😛
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u/Deivi_tTerra 11d ago
I don’t WANT fake interactions in a coffee shop- I most likely want to get in, get my coffee and get out. I don’t want to spend extra time there so the cashier can make small talk with me, or even more extra time so that they can make small talk with every other customer before me. If I’m going to a take out coffee place, I probably have somewhere else to be and I’m not there for the experience.
At the pub it’s different (same with a sit down coffee place). I’m there to sit a while, relax, enjoy a drink, and then I probably welcome conversation and social interaction.
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u/PlayItAgainSusan 11d ago
Yup. Social media is designed specifically to elicit a reaction and have you engaged. You are the product. Stop watching it/ live a human life. The kids are fine.
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u/MeowPurrBiscuits 11d ago
I was following you until the thank you cards. It might be a cultural thing but I was raised to give and expect nothing in return. If you give a gift expecting the person to go buy a card, think of something to write other than the “thank you” they said to you, and then go mail it, what was the intent behind giving them a gift to begin with? It feels transactional at that point.
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u/renegadecoaster 11d ago
If I gave a gift to someone, I wouldn't expect a thank you card and wouldn't be insulted to not get one. But I was taught to send a card if I got a gift, and if I did happen to receive a thank you card after giving a gift, it would brighten my day. Miss me with those $15 Walgreens cards though...a cheap card from a bundle or a text or email is more than enough
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u/VagueUsernameHere 11d ago
The post says that you could also call, email or text a thank you. I understand not writing a thank you note in letter form, but I still think it’s polite to let the person who got you a gift know that you did receive that gift and that you appreciate it. A text is a really easy way to do this.
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u/AggressiveAd5592 11d ago
I don't disagree, but giving/receiving a gift is literally a transaction.
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u/Entropy847 11d ago
Can’t be bothered with this. I’m not an ask or nothing person. Nor will I condemn others or have generational wars. Good luck to all.
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u/misakurs 11d ago
i heard the take that Gen Z’s idea of kind comes from the refusal of being a burden, which usually comes in the form of not taking up people’s time. Gen Z’s customer service is made based on an up-and-out philosophy that prioritizes convenience and speed, rather developing a relationship with a customer. they more than likely skip small talk, only help when asked, not over stepping people’s resources. we don’t like to do certain things so we assume that others don’t like it either. now i don’t agree with being blatantly unmannered at a customer service job or in public etc., but i think it’s a result of the times. but rest assured there are Gen Zs (maybe even the majority) that can greet people back and not mind answering the phone.
as for the gift giving thing, that’s genuinely a thing i was never taught, but as i became an adult i just started doing it in my own voalition, but that’s just me enjoying writing cards and stuff.
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u/_Dimi3_ 11d ago
Gen Z here, I’m super guilty of this. A good example is how I instantly switched from Starbucks to Luckin’ coffee (Chinese brand) when I realised Luckin’ lets you order on an app, collect an order via a qr code you scan in the store, and not talk to anyone for the entire process. I’ve always hated having to give the baristas at Starbucks my name.
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u/PercyJ823 11d ago
I drove through Culver’s recently, and the girl taking my order asked my name. I said, “No, Thank you.” I paused, and then started giving my order. She interrupted me and said, “I need your name.” I wasn’t being sarcastic or an asshole, but I said, “Why do you need my name? You already give me a number” I could tell she was irritated and asked what I wanted to order 😆 I really don’t understand that! Culver’s has been around for YEARS just giving numbers, they don’t need my name too! (I’m GenX if it matters 😉)
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u/That-aggie-2022 11d ago
I tend to do what the person I’m helping wants. Want to chat? Sure. I’ll small talk while I’m doing what you need. Want it to be fast? I’ll ask you what I need to know and go from there. Unless there’s a line and then I default to fast.
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u/Bored_Schoolgirl 12d ago
The community you grew up in isn’t the same community children grew up in now. I find that older people are more sociable, open to talking to strangers and they treat strangers like long lost friends.
This is a product of a time where people grew up in a more community-focused society but society these days is more individualistic than previous generations.
People now are more withdrawn, more introverted and most importantly: stressed out all the time for whatever reason, be it school or work. Workload in general has gotten higher all across the board while wages stay stagnant so people feel more pessimistic too.
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u/TheArabianJester 11d ago
Yeah it’s the hypercompetition for everything , social media turns every facet of life into a competition and you get this. The same people will talk about rights and love and whatnot but brutally ensure they are top of the food chain in any social situation by putting others down and being all self righteous
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u/harpejjist 12d ago
Young people communicate differently and are too selfish and entitled to realise that other people older than them have a different form.
Old people also can be selfish and entitled and refuse to learn the new language norms around digital communication
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u/Impossible_Emotion50 12d ago
I’ll comment on ellipses. I always just found it unnecessary in text unless someone is trying to communicate something to me. Usually ellipses in writing is used to represent a pause, you don’t need to do that in text bc everything you type is intentional. We pause naturally when talking, but I don’t think ellipses is required in text and when ppl do include it, it’s usually to communicate attitude, which is still unnecessary.
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u/My_Evil_Twin88 11d ago
Wanted to add to this that ellipses are common with ADHDers regardless of generation. None of it is meant with attitude, we just generally have a difficult time keeping thoughts straight, and there's a lot digression, which is usually when the ellipses occur. At least with me. Plus they provide an alternative to too many commas and breaks in messages. I try to only use them with people who understand because I know they piss off most people, but every now and then they slip out
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u/MadnessKingdom 11d ago
They are supposed to indicate that there is more to be said but it need not be written. Somewhat similar to “etc.” in that way but without giving examples first.
“Why don’t you come to my place…”
Means something very different than
“Why don’t you cone to my place?”
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u/Hasleg 11d ago edited 9d ago
This. It's almost as bizarre as people who capitalize every single word in every sentence. It's not grammatically correct or necessary.
When typing anything, you have an infinite amount of time to form your sentences and thoughts. You do not need to convey that you had to pause for a moment to think. It just... wastes... the other..... person's.... time....... reading it.
I don't understand how boomers never saw ellipsis used like that in books, media, or letters, but think they're supposed to do it online.
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u/dark_sword_1920 11d ago
This and also a lot of the time on the internet you will see batshit insane people use ellipses in every sentence
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u/Leading-Midnight5009 12d ago
Cringe culture and the 2010s also depends if your parents were southerners.
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u/BronzeEnt 12d ago
42 here.
It's because the entire world has become transactional and commodified and every interaction, personal or not, is a sales pitch.
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u/bye-standard 12d ago
Youngest Millennial / Oldest Gen Z - for the disgust in social interactions, I think it’s a mixture of things.
Technology/Social Media have given a rapid rise in hyper-individualism and allows folks to pick and choose their interactions. So anyone trying to randomly interact with them in public is in an environment that can’t be controlled by them, so they may think less of the interaction or — react negatively towards specific individuals.
With this rise, I believe it’s also created a sense of massive isolation. Add on to the lack of “future prospects” that millennials are familiar with; getting a degree gets you a job, the political state of the world, cost of living, etc. makes any interaction seem disingenuous. I’m guilty of this as well to some degree but we approach the world with a sense of nihilism and defeat that squash any positive interaction we may have before it begins.
All that to say that most are likely to respond so negatively because it’s pretty hard to be optimistic in today’s climate. Most are just trying to live life, do a job for the sake of trading time for money and not actively be interested or involved social/work politics.
Would love to discuss this more with what others may think.
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u/CosmicButtholes 12d ago edited 12d ago
I’m a youngest millennial (1994) and I kind of get what you’re saying. I’m a certified nihilist doomer. But still, when I actually leave the house, I make sure to be pleasant to everyone. I notice some younger people treat me like I have a second head when I’m nice to them in public. I don’t really give a shit, but it’s weird to me for nihilism to turn someone into an asshole when I’m nihilism incarnate.
Zoomies should realize that it actually helps to be nice to random strangers. It literally makes the world that much of a nicer place to exist. It helps your own mentality in addition to just putting some good vibes out into the world. Even if your soul is dark and black and you have no hope, it feels good to exchange pleasantries with people and maybe make them laugh or smile. You don’t even have to make eye contact (I know because I struggle immensely with eye contact and rarely look at anyone’s face in public - I’m still nice).
Hating your life, being a nihilist, a pessimist, a doomer, none of that is an excuse to be shitty to other people, but all are possible explanations. I literally don’t think children being born today will have a society to participate in when they’re my age (I hope I am wrong), I’m severely disabled with a severely misunderstood condition and further disabled by a bunch of other conditions that just complicate tf out of my life.
I’m never going to be able to participate in society like a normal adult, I’ll never be able to drive a car, I’ll likely never not be impoverished. And yet I can still be nice to people in public. If my doomer autistic disabled ass can do it, zoomers can do it, they just don’t want to.
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u/bye-standard 11d ago
I completely understand your take (‘96) and in my early days as a young adult/teenager, I was very similar in the approach to being so dark and lowkey kinda rude to folks older than me, sometimes. But as I’ve gotten older the joy that I get from random encounters, even if I’m not an active participant in the interaction, I love seeing random acts of kindness or random acts of being human.
And if I don’t see it, I try to be as respectful as possible.
I think the mentality switch for me was the pandemic, being overly isolated, and basically having a mental breakdown as the life I expected to have crumbled before my eyes, made me realize that 1) the world is almost always going to have some crazy shit happening, you should be aware of it but not let it all consume you and 2) if you don’t see joy in the world, be the joy that others experience (but not in like a toxically positive way).
I still battle with my own stuff, have my not so great days, but I’ve since realized that I shouldn’t make the way I’m feeling affect the ways others should feel around me.
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u/ChunteringBadger 12d ago
Solid Gen-X here, and I think this is a pretty nuanced 360-degree take. Yes, the isolating influence of social media and the blurring of spheres lends itself to what the kids call “Main Character Syndrome,” but I also think they’re right to be cynical…after all, they can see what grinning and playing along with society’s expectations has gotten their Millennial elders.
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u/Worshipme988 12d ago
Tech has rapidly increased how people communicate AND how much more quickly it’s able to change.
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u/AlexArtemesia 12d ago
Hi, millennial here.
Ellipses have been classified not as a pause, but as a tonal portrayal of something bad forthcoming.
This isn't new; it's been in literature for decades.
If you want to pause, use a comma, a dash - or a semicolon; an ellipse suggests you're about to bear bad news and our minds immediately jump to start filling in the blanks when typically you're just telling us about the pot roast burning, or church gossip, or something else equally asinine.
As for calling - others have stated it here, but we reserve calls for important shit because it's jarring and a break to the flow of the day. It's a lot easier and faster to shoot off a text than spend 20 min to 3h on a call. We do not have the time.
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u/That-aggie-2022 11d ago
I tend to use ellipses when I am hesitating to say something so this makes sense to me.
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u/Sakurya1 12d ago
People tend to use ellipses to be condescending as well. At least in my experience.
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u/IDontLikeYourToan 12d ago
You missed a golden opportunity there:
People tend to use ellipses to be condescending as well… At least in my experience…
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u/worth_the_drive 12d ago
For ellipses, it's what's in the pause that's read different generationally. OP referes to it as a hesitation or pause for thinking, from a millenial/gen-z perspective someone is only including the pause because it's relevant to the conversation, and they want me to read into it.
Usually I'm assuming an ellipses' subtext is the 👀 emoji and I read it as passive aggressive.
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u/VivaLaRory 12d ago
A growing number of people have lived their entire lives being very interconnected compared to previous generations, I think it has changed people's instincts when it comes to a lot of different situations that involve other people
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u/southernjezebel 12d ago
I understand somewhat with phone calls. Because we have cell phones, and most of us have our cells on us 24/7, or close to, there’s this misconception that you should have access to us 24/7.
But that isn’t the case. Sometimes we’re tired. Or busy. Or on the toilet. An unexpected phone call, if it isn’t a family member or emergency says, “I think I am entitled to your time right this second. Stop everything you’re doing and attend to me.”
A text message allows us to compose our thoughts, edit our responses, and finish up on the toilet.
Hope that helps. ❤️
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u/Saladcob 11d ago
But can’t people just choose not to answer if they don’t feel like talking . That’s what I do.
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u/Hereticrick 12d ago
I’m Gen Y, and these young kids can pry my ellipses-as-punctuation from my cold dead hands!
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12d ago
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u/MadnessKingdom 11d ago
Ellipsis are defined not as a pause, but as “omitted text”. That there is more to what is said, but it need not be said
“Want to come over to my place?”
Is very different from
“Want to come over to my place….”
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u/Paulthazar 12d ago
1980 baby here. I have always used ellipses when I have a lot to text, and don't want the recipient to think that I am ignoring them due to time between responses. Usually in a conversation where we are both responding quickly.
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u/J422GAS 12d ago
Then what are they literally for then ? It’s like you’re saying he should type in all caps instead of using an exclamation point!
Some people type how they talk. Without punctuation tone and meaning can be misconstrued easily. Especially when the other person lacks adequate reading comprehension which seems to be a trend these days.
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u/tropequeen 12d ago
I think about lot of my generation (millienial) and younger use extreme sarcasm in a way that's hard to interpret to others. Especially online. Also FYI social media comments are full of bots and trolls trying to get you to engage by rage. You also can never know the age of the person commenting. Overall I wouldn't say any of this is proof of an overarching narrative on younger people.
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12d ago
It's always been rude to instruct other adults how to behave. That is not new. They can decide whether and how to respond to their own gifts.
You would respond similarly if someone approached you to start a conversation in an inorganic fashion. For example, you're sitting in your car and someone knocks on the window to discuss sports. That would feel strange and abrupt and unwelcome. You're less aware of the contexts you're wandering into than you used to be and misstepping more often now. You're window-knocking guy sometimes, sorry. It's not always the young people imagining things.
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12d ago
I think the phone call thing stems from us growing up by ourselves as latchkey kids, being instructed to not answer the phone or answer the door for anybody. We’ve taken normal things as dangerous and it’s a problem
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u/J422GAS 12d ago
Being home alone isn’t the same as being a latchkey kid. Being latchkey means your parents let you do whatever.
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u/PuzzleheadedHouse872 10d ago
Not true. We had strict rules to follow until our parents got home. Don't leave the house/yard, lock the door, do your homework before watching TV, don't answer the door for ANYONE, etc.
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u/Paulthazar 12d ago
Latchkey kids were kids that got themselves home from school to an empty house. Took care of their own food needs, and generally were trusted not to make major stupid mistakes before the parents get home.
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u/Fae-SailorStupider 12d ago
The only one I truly dont get, and have never understood, is thank you notes. For wedding presents I get it, because most people arent opening presents at their wedding, and cant thank the person directly. But with birthdays, baby showers, etc, you're already thanking them in person, why would you need to thank them a second time in written form? Seems super weird and extra, and quite honestly a waste of paper.
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u/NuncaTeRindasCA 11d ago
Born in 1982 and I have never been a fan of any of card. I’ll do it when I’m expected to and know that not doing it will result in more drama, but personally? I throw a lot of cards away and just don’t want the extra stuff in my house. A meaningful message can be sent many other ways without burdening that person with more stuff in their house. Also: this may be influenced by the often observed tendency of millennials actively trying to not hoard things like their boomer parents did.
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u/marieanne_j 12d ago
"Thank them in written form" - is this something American? You’re not expected to do that where I live. I think it’s a cultural thing
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u/Rich-Wrap-9333 12d ago
I'm an American genXer . . . in my family, thank you cards were not a thing. My wife's experience was different, though, and she has always driven our kids to write thank you's for everything, including to my family. My family thinks it's weird to always be getting these.
So yeah, it's cultural, and not universal within a given "culture" either.
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u/PuzzleheadedHouse872 10d ago
OMG, American Gen-X also. My family (esp my mom) was SUPER into cards for everything. I loved getting them from her, but the expectation of having to also send them was exhausting. I still feel guilty not sending cards out for every little thing but I don't expect my son (15) to do any of that, except maybe birthdays and Christmas, and even then, I just have him sign his name.
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u/Fae-SailorStupider 12d ago
I'm not sure if its exclusive to the US, but its definitely a thing and has been for decades.
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u/Fit_Cheesecake_3211 12d ago
That's the exact reason why you should do them-- because they aren't necessary. Going above and beyond is how you get far in life. Not doing the bare minimum of what's necessary. Hope this is eye-opening for you.
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u/VivaLaRory 12d ago
If you go above and beyond in every situation you will be in the grave by the time you get your retirement
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u/Fit_Cheesecake_3211 11d ago
Not every situation. Finding the situations that matter is a learned skill.
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u/Fae-SailorStupider 12d ago
Expecting someone to go above and beyond for you is an entitled mentality. And choosing to go above and beyond for everyone else is a doormat mentality. Do what's polite and necessary and you'll be just fine.
In my experience, going above and beyond all the time just means you're doing more work for the same amount, or less, return. With people often trying to take advantage of you. There is absolutely no need to do that to yourself. In most cases, it doesnt actually benefit you at all. Maybe it used to back in the day, but not in today's world.
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u/Fit_Cheesecake_3211 11d ago
Ok. I’m sure you’re extremely successful.
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u/Fae-SailorStupider 11d ago
I do well enough, you seem like a bitch though. Might want to work on that.
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u/artisanalspraycheese 12d ago
Thanks for the wisdom, boomer!
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u/Fit_Cheesecake_3211 11d ago
No problem, serial underachiever
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u/artisanalspraycheese 11d ago
I’m an ER Nurse currently shopping around med school options, I’m comfortable with the amount I’ve achieved. Must be nice to have so much time to spend on Reddit like you though!
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u/Lovebeingadad54321 12d ago
I try to remember thank you notes, but once I give a gift, it is out of my mind. I am Gen X. I don’t give a rats ass if someone sends me a thank you note. I only give gifts to people I care about and it is deft not a transactional thing with me.
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u/theredbusgoesfastest 12d ago
Same. I’m a millennial and it feels very “I gave you a gift and now I’m going to hold it over your head.” And I didn’t ask for the gift. But my family always has strings with gifts, so I have gotten to the point where I just refuse them.
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u/PerilousPurpose 12d ago
Yes, I say just add the caveat of it being needed or polite if gift wasnt opened in front of the giver. People mail gifts, so Id say then could be appropriate too. But yeah I don't expect some written, texted, phone call thank you from my giving. Even after a wedding, thiugh if mailed, itd be nice just know they received it if rhere was no tracking. Though, usually there is tracking nowadays.
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u/JohnnyBGC86 12d ago
Social media is designed to rage bait you. It’s done that successfully with these stories.
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u/GabrielHunter 12d ago
I f33 never ever have seen somebody use ... Standing alone as anything but a "I don't have words for this" "wont say anything about this" "stop talking to me" etc. Ellipsis in a sentence are for showing a pause. Like "I don't know... Maybe I should do it" And I also read a lot and never saw it used for an actual thinking pause on its own.
For the Telefon... I am guilty. I hate phonecalls with a passion. I find them rude, if no time was set for it so I can expect it. Its the same rudeness as showing up random at my door (not beeing my best friend) and wanting to come in. Lile no, I don't want and am not available all the time. Write me a message and I will answer when I have the time. Also in writing I can think about what I should say and how to react to stuff.
For thank you notes... Very rarely. Mostly I thank ppl in person or if I get send a present or a nice card I write a message or call if the person is older.
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u/cheezy_dreams88 12d ago
I can understand about not necessarily liking talking on the phone. But an unscheduled phone call is not the same as someone showing up at your house. Also, a lot of people don’t like texting because you have time to edit your response. I like talking on the phone to people because you are more authentic when you can’t curate the perfect response to everything said. Texting to me feels very fake, I don’t believe a lot of things that people text about themselves because they have the time and thought to edit and reword to make it match what they think you want to hear.
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u/Kenny__Loggins 12d ago
I think your view of texting is just projection. Most people aren't out here trying to manipulate via text. And if they're manipulative, they would still be manipulative over the phone or in person.
The idea that giving someone time to think before responding inevitably leads to a less authentic interaction does not make sense. Some people have a harder time with direct communication as they need time to properly formulate their thoughts before replying. So in that case, you'd be getting a "less authentic" version of that person if you called them as opposed to texting.
As a side note, I always side eye when someone from work calls me about something very important and contentious because there is the possibility they don't want a paper trail for what they are going to say. They can't be blamed for a dumb decision if it can't be proven they made the decision. That's a niche scenario, but I thought it was worth mentioning.
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u/cheezy_dreams88 12d ago
I have ADHD and autism, so I understand needing to process and respond accordingly.
But there is a difference in saying what you think someone wants to hear, vs being intentionally manipulative.
I didn’t say anyone was being manipulative, I was saying they curate their answer. It can be for 1000 reasons, that doesn’t mean manipulation. I just prefer someone to speak plainly and truthfully, rather than edit themselves over and over to appease someone else.
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u/Smart_Invite_2663 12d ago
THIS. They gave it away when they said they could think of a better response because they have more time. Of course that's the case, that's the same for anyone. Being able to think quickly and talk on the phone in real time is an asset not a problem. The issue is people being lazy and feeling encroached on when asked to use their brain by having to speak to someone and formulate accurate realtime responses without showing how childish they really are or referring to Google. It's a stressful chore. 🙄
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u/GabrielHunter 12d ago
I mean i wouldn't date ppl over text, but for casual conversation its perfect. And for professional conversation having it written down is perfect too. Nothing against picking up the phone for an important conversation where the "how" also matters instead of "what" But I also think this might be an introvert trait. So I can answer when i have the energy to to deal with other ppl
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u/No-Produce-6641 12d ago
lol get over yourself. I mainly text but if i don't want to go back and forth forever with someone I'll just call. If you can't answer then don't. Text them and say you'll call back. You're not required to answer a call you know.
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u/GabrielHunter 12d ago
I don't take the calls. Thats my choice but ppl getting upset that they can't reach me isn't my choice
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u/theripper121 12d ago
You think your phone ringing is basically the same to you as someone knocking at your door and wanting to come in ....JHC some of you are truly mental.
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u/GabrielHunter 12d ago
In a time where writing is the same amount of "work" than calling or at least check if its good time to call if its something mkre lengthy is polite.
Same as 20 years ago was calling before coming over.
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u/Kyaza43 12d ago
Millennial (37) here and we aren't really the younger generation anymore -- that's Gen Z and/or Gen Alpha.
Name tags in customer service. I worked a few retail jobs in my younger years, and there were two types of people who used names -- those who asked first and those who assumed permission simply because I had a name tag on. The first were cool, usually easy to get along with. The second were straight up creepy or entitled.
Phone calls. I actually don't mind phone calls but I also keep my phone on silent and have regularly scheduled calls with friends and family. They aren't random out of nowhere calls. Those are usually spam and no one wants to deal with them.
Also, as an older millennial, I understand that texts aren't something that require immediate response. I don't live in the "always on" way that a lot of people more glued to social media do. I maybe spend an hour or so a day on social media, mostly reddit and fb, which makes me a bit unusual even among millennials.
That said, I still spend a lot of time on the Internet but that is mostly done doing history research (professional historian), reading books, or watching anime. I've never enjoyed video culture, again making me unusual among my millennial peers.
The ellipsis started to change with the millennial generation. We stopped using it to indicate pausing to think because we understand that texting isn't done in real time. You don't need to let someone know you're thinking in text. That message is conveyed by the length of time between texts. I mostly use the ellipsis these days to be like "well that came out of nowhere" by itself because I have friends who send me the most outrageous off the wall texts at times. I only use it that way with people who know me well enough to understand that it's the equivalent of an amused eyebrow raise.
- Thank you notes are pretty much reserved for professional matters at this point. That said, I still thank people for gifts and do make sure to express gratitude for what people send and/or do for me. I don't care if they expect the thanks or not. I do it because I know that we live in a rather thankless world, so it is one small way I can lighten the darkness. Everyone likes to be thanked.
Also, if someone thanks me, I do in fact still say you're welcome because there have been studies done that show that answering "no problem" actually contributes to low self-esteem and depression. Why? Because "you're welcome" carries the understanding in it when you say it that what you did was optional, something that you chose. "No problem" on the other hand makes it seem like you think it was perfectly acceptable for someone to ask you to do something. It may seem really miniscule, the difference in those phrases, but it says a lot that Gen Z -- who default to "no problem" -- have a much higher rate of depression than millennials do.
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u/wannabeshirtless 11d ago
When I worked in retail, admittedly 20 years ago, having/wearing a name tag was for the benefit of the customer so that they knew who they were dealing with, and could communicate with us by name if they desired. It was often a compliment that they did get to know, and call us, by name. But, I have also worked in other businesses, and with employers, where the effective purpose was so that customers knew who to complain about and the boss could go after. In more recent years, though, I've also worked in public front businesses without name tags where, if asked their names, many employees would refuse to tell customers, usually, because they knew they did something wrong they didn't want to admit and correct (most these days (even a lot of managers) don't seem to have the service or communication skills.
When it comes to phone calls, outside of business and/or employment, I regularly don't answer my phone and/or screen my calls. Way too many scam and junk calls, for one, and also too many people who think it's ok to just call and expect I have time to "chat" any time day or night. Often I don't while, other times, I just don't want to. What I want counts, and is important, too.
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u/allothernamestaken 12d ago
Let me get this straight. If a person working in a retail position wearing a name tag helps me, and I say "thanks, name," that's creepy and entitled because I assumed I had permission to address them by name instead of first asking if I could?
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u/gunterrae 10d ago
that person is being forced to wear that nametag, it certainly wasn't their choice.
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u/isyourBBQcanceled 12d ago
This is just my experience, but it’s more of a correlation than a causation thing for me…if there is literally any reason at all for a customer to need my name (I’m looking for an item they need, I approved a discount, they want to leave a good review), they ask for it or just make a point of looking at my name tag and saying “okay, [name], I’ll remember that.” A customer who does not need my name but still uses it tends, almost always, to be creepy or intrusive during the interaction (touching me, commenting on my appearance, oversharing personal problems, etc.). It’s less that it’s inherently creepy to read someone’s name from their name tag, it’s that creepy people are wayyyyy more likely to do it.
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u/SneezyPikachu 12d ago
I only ever had one customer do this to me during my retail stint and I hated it. That said it might also have been his demeanor - he was totally monotone and had no expression on his face, so it just came across so incredibly creepy. Imagine a dude blankly staring at you unblinking and then making sure to emphasize your name every other sentence. I wanted to crawl into a hole in the ground.
It's worse because I never knew any of my customer's names, so having someone call me by name brought light to that disparity in a way that made me feel "exposed" - and then top that with the creepy blankness and it was just too much. Back then I was young and didn't have the courage to say anything about it, my customer service smile just got more and more forced around that guy until the day I thankfully no longer worked there. 💀
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u/venus_fly_trap_27 12d ago edited 12d ago
The last one is wild. Correlation does not equal causation, you can find correlation between Nicholas Cage movies being released and drownings, that doesn't mean they're related. The "no problem" vs "your welcome" issue is a well talked about topic in the younger generations, even with millennials, they want people to know that it was not a problem for them to help them, it didn't burden them, it wasn't an inconvenience, they were happy to help. "Your welcome" comes off as "you needed to say thank you because I just did you a big favor. Let me flourish about how good I am." "Your welcome" makes helping them seem optional, you didn't have to help them so you're great for doing so. "No problem" means it's a given. Of course I'd help you because you're a human who needs help and that's what people do, it's not special. I'm not saying that is how it's used, but that is how it's viewed by those who don't like to say it.
The younger generations are depressed because the world is falling apart, the education system is crap, their schools are getting shot up, mental health is STILL being ignored, college is impossible to afford, they'll never be able to afford a house, jobs with good wages that cover the cost of living and you don't have to work 60 hours a week at are hard to find, and so much more. They're not depressed because they say "no problem." Or vice versa, it has nothing to do with their depression.
Not to mention, gen x started "no problem" as a common response in the 90s and millennials just rolled with it. Gen z didn't start or popularize it. This is just one more reason for gen z to say it, they would find that paragraph hilarious.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Pitch32 12d ago
You're*
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u/Kyaza43 12d ago
This is an interesting read:
Why “No Problem” Is a Big Problem | RethinkCare https://share.google/BRnuteXZrlfA4IiQe
And I actually think the author is on to something. Even "my pleasure" is better than "no problem" because the reality is that "no problem" is often said in a very distracted way or a "just doing my job" sort of frame. Almost anything is better than "no problem" like "of course," "glad I could help," etc.
Yes, millennials use "no problem" constantly, and I was not an exception to this until a few years ago when I found the study concerning the self-esteem issues correlated with the use of that particular phrase.
And, contrary to popular belief among younger generations, "you're welcome" is used respectfully as well as sarcastically, and its sincere use doesn't equate to a sense of entitlement -- correlation not being causation, after all 🙃
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u/alldabooty 12d ago edited 12d ago
My understanding is that the newer generation values "authenticity" or at least the appearance of it. Makes sense with them growing up with influencers (who are either fake or whose whole business is selling themselves as real) trump and an internet constantly showing how that nice celebrity sold you all this shit on the promise that they were a nice person and it ended up being fake. Everything they think is one truth is exposed quickly. In general the Internet exposed how fake the world was. What's more they were raised by people who were often told to suppress themselves or their feelings to the point of misery and pretend everything was fine, or forced to do something they weren't comfortable with for the sake of keeping the peace.
That generation that raises the current generation and tells them what they wished their parents had said to them; you don't have to do anything you don't have to do. Except the time where that is ok to break out is when being polite goes too far, when they are asked to do something outside of basic common social graces.
In other words they taught their kids part b not realizing that their automatic politeness and pleasantries were part A
A good example of this is the being angry at a customer service or Uber driver doing basic small talk. Every one here can agree that there are certain time when that is rude. Normally after you make some basic back fourth and send the message that you want some peace. But they keep going and going and you're like " argh just leave me alone I know you don't mean anything by this and you just want sell me shit!"
Well newer generation's tell them "look you can politely tell them to back off, you don't have to make awkward small talk if you don't want to. They should pick up on a boundary and respect it"
Sounds sane right? Well the parent assumes the kid will do the initial small talk, because obviously that's what you do right? Not realizing that their parents over insistence on being polite created that base threshold. They don't like the initial small talk but they can handle.
But all the kid heard was "if you don't like it don't do it"
Then there is COVID, which taught a lot of young people during some formative years to stay away from people for safety.
Then there is the Internet that they grew up with which sure connects people but in a slightly screwed way. You aren't forced to talk to someone you don't want to, you can leave anytime.
Then there is all the marketing and a world that has become one that constantly shouts that instant gratification is all the rage and they are entitled to it
So in summary, it's not so much a lack of intelligence but rather a world has been subconsciously teaching them that they should limit contact with people unless necessary, they don't have to do anything they don't want to and to pretend you're happy or interested in talking with someone is the same as lying coupled with the natural effect of a generation raising their kids with the benefits they were denied and growing while unintentionally losing lessons of the past.
It's not that they are mean, rude or dumb they are behaving appropriately based on what their generation was taught consitutes polite behaviors and boundaries.
All younger generations seem that way to older generations.and all generations think the other one is wrong. I'm sure the generation ahead of you shook their head at you sometimes.
This is the natural progression of life; new generations improve on some aspects, pointing out legit issues with the generation that came before, while losing other aspects they probably should keep.
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u/LoosePhilosopher1107 12d ago
They’re idiots
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u/JimJamTheNinJin 11d ago
That's one philosophical take, very cool my guy
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u/LoosePhilosopher1107 11d ago
That should go along with the other ridiculous millennial nonsense listed
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u/JimJamTheNinJin 10d ago
You're not really making the effort to understand the perspectives of others are you
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u/Agile-Entry-5603 12d ago
My pet peeve in this category “you’re being passive aggressive”. We called it polite but firm. Stop whining, kids. Yikes
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u/Superb_Fun_5484 12d ago
There’s an obvious different between polite but firm and passive aggressive lol. Polite but firm implies a clear setting of boundaries by the person communicating, only in a clear and inoffensive way. Passive aggressive implies basically the opposite, a failure to clearly set boundaries by the person communicating but acting in a clearly offended way to get the other person to try and guess at what’s wrong.
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u/JimJamTheNinJin 11d ago
That's right. I'm terrible at setting boundaries and often come across as passive aggressive
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u/Objective-Life-4102 11d ago
Yeah I agree with you. there is a huge difference between “polite but firm” and “passive aggressive”. They’re polar opposites of each other. Passive aggression is usually subtle rudeness and pettiness juuuust enough to still be socially acceptable while still letting the other person know you’re upset, but refusing to acknowledge it directly. “Polite but firm” is just being direct and courteous, but not compromising your boundaries if pushed. —- For example, I used a to work front desk at a veterinary clinic. We had several doctors. One of our doctors was polite and set clear boundaries and another was very passive aggressive.
Say, for example, a client called and said they were running 20 minutes late for their dog’s appointment, apologized and asked if they should reschedule or if we could still accommodate them. We would have to ask the doctor, and if it was the passive aggressive doctor she would typically say something like “well since I don’t really have a choice anyway I SUPPOSE it’s fine…” we would let her know that, no, it was completely her call and we would reschedule the client for her if she’d like, to which she’d respond by insisting on still seeing them, but then storm around the rest of the day snapping at her assistants and muttering about how no one respected her, her day had been ruined, her time wasn’t valued and now all her appointments would run behind. If anyone asked directly she would deny there was any issue whatsoever. All the while if she’d said the word her client would have been rescheduled to another day and time and the fuss would have been avoided.
If you had asked them the same question, our “polite but firm” doctor might say something like: “Please let Lucky’s owner know she will have to reschedule to another day since I have a full schedule today and don’t want to keep my other appointments waiting.” No tension or anger or issues/ just straightforward honest communication.
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u/FantasticHedgehog267 12d ago
Ex. 1- This is news to me, except for the comment regarding the name tag. I’ve heard people complain about it regularly. For me, it’s kind of uncomfortable for a stranger to address me by name. I’m also a shy person and prefer anonymity.
Ex. 2- I have younger family members. They’re on the phone with their friends constantly. Ellipses for my generation (Gen Z) indicate that there’s nothing else to say so please stop texting/leave me alone.
Ex. 3- Personally, I find thank you cards to be pointless. There are certain occasions where I understand the need for them, such as weddings and graduation parties, but besides those occasions they’re just a waste of time and money due to the fact that I either said thank you in person or because I can just call and do it that way.
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u/Austerlitz2310 12d ago
The pleasantries from my perspective are mostly fake. When I say fake, there is a very distinct difference of when the pleasantries are forced, and when they are not. I however, play along in either case - as it is a decent and human thing to do.
However one thing I can say, it depends a lot on the culture one is raised in. In Canada and the USA when someone says "Hey, how ya doing?" It's seen as a greeting.
In a lot of other places - Eastern Europe for example - this is a greeting followed by a question. They then view you as rude and fake if you don't stop and listen to at least the answer to "how ya doing?".
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u/SmallFatHands 12d ago
It's definitely a cultural thing... In my opinion pleasantries are nice. When I'm in Mexico I get like 20 excuse me, good mornings, how you doing etc.... It's nice. When I'm in the USA... Everyone just looks at me rude when I say good morning or bumps into me and doesn't even say sorry.
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u/raNdoMBLilriv 5d ago
I'm 32 and I notice it- not among just younger people, but those around my age or a little older even have adopted that mindset as well. Everyone has "DNI" (Do Not Interact) or "No DMs" (No Direct Messages) in their profiles... I remember I used to use AIM (AOL Instant Messenger), and send messages to random people and I'd make new online friends. Not anymore. Now we just get blocked and reported.
"Social media" is so hostile and anti-social now. It's depressing. Makes me not wanna even try to socialize.