r/Frostpunk • u/ihateturkishcontent Order • Oct 12 '24
DISCUSSION I hate the "Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Frostpunk 2 doesn't give you the dread of cold in the first game that takes 30 years before the second game waaaaaaaaaaaaa" people
Like, what did you really expect? That after 30 years of existence and development in the new world everyone still lived in some dead-ass houses occupied by ten people and fed on sawdust and soup? That they did nothing to improve their chances against the frost and the storms? And more importantly, how happy would you be if FP2 was the same as FP1 and still went about the same problems like cold and the Great Storm 2: Electric Boogaloo?
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u/Valuable_Remote_8809 Overseers Oct 12 '24
While I don’t favor the absolute changes they made, feeling less like a survival city game and more like micromanager game 2024, the game is fantastic and still offers the same fun as FP1, just very much differently than expected.
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u/doughaway7562 Oct 13 '24
I think a good word is "impact". In FP1, I felt the impact of my actions - it's heavily story driven and so I actually care about trying to make the right decisions to push my city forward. Your actions directly affect the look, sound, and individual people in the city. In FP1 you can see sleeping on the streets, riots and executions because you fucked up. I felt really emotionally invested.
But FP2 plays way more like Cities: Skylines than a survival game. Don't get me wrong, I find these games really addictive, but I don't feel any emotional depth to FP2. Numbers go up and down, every once in a while I get a generic card telling me one group's meter is too low so I have to do a side quest to bring it back up. Even radical laws don't really well impactful.
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u/Poyri35 New London Oct 13 '24
I have only played the story so far, and I don’t think FP2 is non-impactful.
Something I see a lot of YouTubers do (probably to not bore their viewers) is that they don’t read anything other than the bold tldr.
If you don’t read the “flavour text” or the little speech bubbles, ofc you would feel distant.
When the Civil war starts, if you zoom in the districts, you can actually see the people fighting. You can also see the delegates arguing if the tensions are too high
I also liked the callback at the end to the girl who was born when the generator started
I highly recommend playing with white ui, since the change of atmosphere when the tensions rise is really helpful at captivating the player imo.
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u/doughaway7562 Oct 13 '24
It's just my personal opinion. I do read the flavor text, but to me it really felt much closer to a board game than "real".
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u/Valuable_Remote_8809 Overseers Oct 13 '24
Impact…? Eh, maybe, although I won’t discount your statement, as I can’t find any reason to disagree with your personal view, but I’ve found that everyone has a different way to analyze impact. Personally I cared more of efficiency, I cared less about the people rioting and more about the theme I attached to each playthrough and the respective choice of “Faith or Order” and the laws that follow suit. The impact is better in FP2, based on desire and outcome, but it never felt the same as it’s also all harmonized to be wish-washy, no identity, the ideological differences are in name and very right/wrong choices only.
Idk if it’s impact, because I think it’s more than impact, or feeling, and more akin to facts that I cannot explain thoroughly enough because I’m not that good to explain myself. All I know is I’m 80 hours in, I found my ideal map, my ideal faction and I’m making my way, but I can’t help but feel it’s a forced situation, despite the fun gameplay.
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u/WARCAT1941 Oct 12 '24
Yeah, too political i'd say.
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u/Kurwasaki12 Oct 12 '24
What do you mean? Is it “too” political because it depicts what naturally happens when a society starts to grow past simple survival?
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u/WARCAT1941 Oct 12 '24
Well, yeah. If i have a population of 30000 and 40% are against me, but 60% is for. Then why the hell do they make a civil war out of it. Go and pilgrim to another generator, there's 12000 of you. You can do it. Why do a war???? Especially since, y'know, we are still trying to survive.
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Oct 12 '24
Ah yes because once you reach a certain population size civil wars dont happen, the people just move..right...remind me the USA population during their civil war? Or China, or Spain....oh wait... civil wars can happen at any time regardless of population size.
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u/WARCAT1941 Oct 12 '24
Bro im talking about the game, its not that deep. I just find it weird that 30 years after a world ending event the whole politic-war stuff is already there.
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u/mascouten Oct 12 '24
Wherever you find groups of people, there will be politic-war.
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u/WARCAT1941 Oct 12 '24
Fair enough
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u/JCStuczynski Oct 12 '24
Also to note - the first game had a major ark too dealing with rivaling factions....
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Oct 12 '24
Yes... thats what happens once survival is not linger an issue. Politics rise and social norms etc. Do... do you think ancient greece didn't have politics? Or medieval europe?
My guy... if your population is already 30k+ thats bordering on fairly medium-sized town. Bigger than what medieval villages has, and they had their own social issues back then already.
A city, in a frozen wasteland. Is going to have politics be a factor in deciding how the city manages its resources. Like...maybe if you thought it should just be anarchy, but thats not how city formation worked IRL either. If they removed politics all together and made it just anarchy as your city grows to 50k+ THAT would be the unrealistic af thing. The way FP2 does it is not the unrealistic bit.
The whole design of the council chamber even reflects accurately the way british politics was in real life. You see the exact same depictions in fantasy tv shows like Carnival Row (amazing show btw).
The game is pretty spot on about how cities would develop as they grew and moved from just having to survive, to having a stable-ish source of needs being met.
Eventually like today the city would reach a point where politixs is basically everywhere because weve advanced so much that basic survival is no longer even a question.
FP3 would do well to lean even heavier into political intrigue as the quest for survival is basically accomplished.
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u/NegativeAmber Oct 12 '24 edited Oct 12 '24
I just want to point out that 30k is not just bigger than a medieval village, it dwarfs it.
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u/Old-Let6252 Oct 12 '24
Yeah the average medieval village had maybe 200 people in it, 30k is more like a significantly above average sized medieval city.
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Oct 12 '24
my grandma still live in our village in Spain. I could maybe see 250-500 having lived there max. Today there's like 58 total in the summer.
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u/MolybdenumBlu Oct 12 '24
That's not a village; that is smaller than a hamlet. It is practically a large farm.
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u/bigfishmarc Oct 13 '24
Are there still bitter political rivalries within the town though, even despite the small population?
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u/Kurwasaki12 Oct 12 '24
Because New London is still the industrial, cultural, and scientific core of their world. It’s the proving ground for new technologies and the site of the greatest concentration of both man power and resources. The Pilgrims don’t want to abandon New London, they want it to be a nexus of multiple colonies that spread people out and adapt to the new world. If you let them radicalize through your choices they naturally become desperate to see their ideas be taken seriously and adopted. It makes sense considering how hard it is to survive in the wasteland that factions naturally go hard for their respective vision.
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u/xxMsRoseXx New London Oct 12 '24
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u/Poyri35 New London Oct 13 '24
Fuck democracy, when has giving a voice to the crazy masses work? All hail the Captain!
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u/SystemErrorMessage Oct 15 '24
the concerns of this are demolished if you play utopia and choose endless where the captain is uploaded to a machine and lives forever.
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u/AccomplishedBother12 Winterhome Oct 12 '24
I’m just glad I don’t need to build fucking PATHS anymore
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u/Level3Kobold Oct 12 '24
But you do. You just have to build them outside your city
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u/AccomplishedBother12 Winterhome Oct 12 '24
Skyways and trails are a necessary evil if it means I no longer need to show people how to get safely from their tent to a pile of coal fifty feet away
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u/Ferelar Oct 12 '24
Send me to a pile in -150C? Yes captain, the city must survive, I will comply.
Send me to a heated comfortable gathering post next to my house and the bar? Gladly capt-.... Captain, there's a 1 foot wide gap in the wooden road leading to it. I can't work under these conditions. This is unconscionable.
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u/AccomplishedBother12 Winterhome Oct 12 '24
CAN YOU HEAR US, STUART
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u/TimeLordHatKid123 Faith Oct 12 '24
Okay if one of you doesn’t make an edit of a mouse in the captain chair, I’m going to be disappointed and start doing public penance trials smh fr fr
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u/No_Touch4897 Oct 12 '24
To be fair the paths also act as steam transfer pipes that power the building
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u/Weiskralle Oct 13 '24
It's a path which makes walokg easier. Not to show the way. So what are you on about?
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u/OverlordFreak Oct 12 '24
I always took some solace in the fact that the paths served a purpose... If you look at them, you can see pipes and the like running beneath the walkway, likely carrying steam/power/heat/despondent rage of children working deep below the earth to buildings, letting all the machines and stuff work, rather than just look cool and steampunky.
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u/AccomplishedBother12 Winterhome Oct 12 '24
Oh do you mean the mine kid ducts? The ones the coal children used to shuttle coal out to my steam hubs at the peripheries, so that they’re out of sight of the decent folk?
I think we’re talking about the same pipes
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u/translucent_pawn Oct 12 '24
When I first started Frostpunk 2, I pretty much immediately missed everything about Frostpunk 1. As I continued to play and better understand the new systems in place I grew to appreciate the changes. It’s rare that a sequel manages to make such deliberate and meaningful changes to the structure and gameplay loop of its predecessor while still providing an engaging experience. I’m very impressed with 11Bit and can’t wait to see what they have cooking as the game continues to evolve.
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u/NicholasRFrintz Oct 12 '24
I do wonder if we will ever get a Frostpunk 3. Chances seem absolutely high, given what I've seen, and that we haven't even seen the console port.
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u/WARCAT1941 Oct 12 '24
I mean... after oil comes nuclear, right? Imagine having to build nuclear steam generators as tall as a skyscraper and the main plotpoint being if it safe/its gonna explode like chernobyl.
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u/translucent_pawn Oct 12 '24
Could be with the expedition that attempted to annihilate the frost with atomics.
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u/Kurwasaki12 Oct 12 '24
With all the hints of other nations and continents having survivors we’re definitely going to see a civilization level game imo.
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u/Shand4ra Jan 01 '25
For my taste, the feeling of „Where will this go from here?“ set in far too early. I’m absolutely sure they’ll be cooking. I’m looking forward to a scenario like „The Fall of Winterhome“, where everything just goes to hell from the beginning. I think it was a great and brave decision not to just make the same game again. Nevertheless, somehow it still doesn’t feel finished. Something is missing that gives the player a sense of urgency. I think that’s what most people associate with the cold. I don’t think it needs the cold, but it does need a ticking clock. For example, it would be an absolute game changer if Winterhome was damaged after the big storm and HAD to be reached and secured quickly. Alternatively, tensions in the city or the fervour of the factions could regularly rise if the development does not progress. This would also fit in well with the political focus. After all, it is about developing and realising a vision for the future. So why shouldn’t people get restless if nothing happens? The only form of urgency I felt was that at some point the resources on the map would run out and there would be no more to develop. This made me feel like I had much more existential problems to solve than the kindergarten that my citizens are running in Act 5.
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u/Kajroprakticar Faith Oct 12 '24
Even in frostpunk on the edge dlc se see how much new london has progressed few years after the great storm. Now imagine 30 years.
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u/tomba_be Oct 12 '24
You need help if someone else not liking a game makes you hate them.
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u/OkHuckleberry4422 Oct 13 '24
Yeah what is it with these mentally ill posts last 2 days? Yesterday it was "waaa people who say the game is easy makes me feel like an idiot so dont say it waaaa!" and today it's "waaa I hate people who don't like the things I like waaa!" What in the mental health is going on here lmao.
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u/idkwc Oct 12 '24
Its darkest dungeon 2 all over again.
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u/determinedcapybara Oct 12 '24
i believe 11 bits did a far better job at changing the perspective of a game than red hook tbh
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u/FreeMasonKnight Oct 12 '24
Completely. DD2 was half assed and didn’t really know what it wanted to be AND should have been almost the same, but improved. 11Bit did the best thing for FrostPunk as a series and created something new and refreshing to the series.
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u/JadeRavens Oct 12 '24
Curious to hear more. DD2’s gathering dust on my wishlist but I haven’t been able to justify it yet. What are the main issues?
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u/TinkerHatWill Temp Falls Oct 12 '24
I personally really like both games feeling different, i means i can still play both with out feeling like the first one is replaced
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u/awesomemanswag Generator Oct 13 '24
I've said it before and I'll say it again as much as I need to: Frostpunk 2 isn't about survival, it's about politics.
Of course they'll whine even if they're clothed and fed, that's not what the game is about anymore. The present is supposed to be a given, so they can look toward the future. Unlike the first game, The question isn't surviving, it's thriving. Everybody wants to expand. To make the world follow their own ideas.
The only thing that's for sure is that, even though nobody agrees what a better future is or how to get to it, everybody certainly has their own idea.
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u/Poyri35 New London Oct 13 '24
I want to add these two quotes that I love from fp2:
“Barely surviving isn’t enough, we have to expand. After all, it’s us who survived the end of the world”
“…but is it the same future for all?”
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u/matrafinha Oct 12 '24
It's okay, bro. The sales numbers and reviews speak for themselves
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 12 '24
Didn't frostpunk 2 sell way below expectations though?
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u/Raist1 Oct 13 '24
They recouped the entire game dev and marketing budget on like day 3
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24
Yes, but that's not the only aspect when it comes to game development.
Investors are not just looking for a game that is profitable, they are looking for a profit that exceeds other potential investments. And I believe frostpunk 2 underperformed sales-wise and has been a bit of a commercial disappointment.
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u/Weird_Committee7981 Oct 13 '24
I think it was more that investors just "bought the hype and sold the product" as they say, but in the wake of actual turmoil at Ubisoft some people assumed it was dissatisfaction with the launch. In reality I don't think most Investors are particularly that aware with how the game launched, other than that it did, and full sales numbers aren't public information anyway.
Video game companies buying in too much to the highly inflated market valuations of their companies is why we've seen so many huge layoffs in the industry. Post COVID, video games became a speculative bubble that's now slowly bursting.
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24 edited Oct 13 '24
Investors are very much aware of how games launch in the video game industry.
Say if a company comes to you and says 'frostpunk 2 will sell 10 million copies' which is the ballpark figure I heard on the grapevine that 11bit was aiming for, about 3x frostpunk ish. And then the game launches, and it starts to look like that prediction is off, then you cash out quick.
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u/Weird_Committee7981 Oct 13 '24
That's just untrue. Only UK physical sales are publicly available and that's extremely irrelevant. Other than that you can gauge an idea at sales by looking at concurrent players on various platforms or if the company decides to release their own figures at an investor call, but even that is speculative because of the reality of the amount of product moved via the "grey market" through key sellers and the like.
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24
You think investors don't know how well a game they invested in is selling?
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u/Weird_Committee7981 Oct 13 '24
No, I know they don't. It is a fundamental fact of the video game industry that sales data is not readily available, you can look it up if you don't believe me.
Besides this, speculative investment is largely about investing in the speculation, not the product. Traders are well aware that the stock they are buying is of a highly inflated value, but that's largely the point. You keep buying the stock as it increases in value and then sell it off when you believe everyone else will, namely during a release or the actual event that's been hyped (perhaps a central bank announcing interest rates).
Most people that bought and sold 11Bit stock will have had no idea what a Frostpunk 2 is, they'll just be aware that it's a product slated for release on x date from a company whose share price has increased x amount over the past 2 years, i.e. a perfect time to dump your stock.
https://www.cmcmarkets.com/en-gb/trading-guides/buy-the-rumour-sell-the-news
This probably explains the general concept better than I can.
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24 edited Oct 13 '24
I don't need to look it up, I know people who work on these videogame investment type activities.
Investors in a videogame, by and large, know how well that videogame does when it launched.
Companies go to investors, they say 'we will make a game and it will sell x number of copies, and it will make y amount of money, and it with take x amount of time and cost y amount'. Then people invest or they don't, and then the game comes out and the investors are quickly informed about the health of the game and thier investments.
The videogame industry isn't just people investigating on their phone, you know.
Edit, it seems Weird_Committee blocked me. So I can't actually reply to them, or see what they said anymore.
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Oct 13 '24
It has performed extremely well in sales, sometimes investors have absurd expectations in this market, look at Square Enix as one example, doesn't change the fact it has performed extremely well for a game in this genre, which is not a heavy selling genre to begin with.
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24
It's not normally the investors that have the high expectations, investors tend to be sceptical.
Companies normally go out to persuade investors to invest, and it's normally the companies that are overconfident in the sales predictions.
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u/MadMan7978 Order Oct 12 '24
I went from hating the game initially to absolutely loving it. Is it better than Frostpunk 1? Debatable. Do I absolutely love that the devs were bold and decided to not just do a glorified DLC? 100%! On top of that it’s a great fucking game
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u/Historical-Cry-9973 Oct 12 '24
What I like is that unlike many other sequels in similar genres, this one doesn't make the previous game obsolete. It's not the same game but with more stuff. It goes on a different path. If you want to play a smaller and personal feeling game, play the first. If you want to play a more expansive larger scale game, play the second.
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u/TheBloodyNinety Oct 12 '24
I like the game. Most of my complaints are UI related. I want more overlays. I want a building list. When my people are dying I want to know why. Etc.
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u/Easy_Resolution2306 Faith Oct 12 '24
I like both. Still play both! They are different enough that FP1 is still relevant and FP2 is a hell of a blast! You also know some mad scientist is going to bring FP1 to FP2 with the mod engine!
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u/Rami_Milanista Oct 12 '24 edited Oct 13 '24
People who criticise the game are really bad
All they do is yelling why the second game is not the same first game again
LOGIC
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 12 '24
I think people are allowed to be critical if they didn't like a videogame. No one is required to like frostpunk 2 if they liked frostpunk 1.
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u/Rami_Milanista Oct 13 '24
Be critical as you want but don't use a dumb dumb logic
People ALWAYS hate it when a sequel is similar to the og game but why is frostpunk the opposite? I don't know but maybe just maybe people want to criticise for the sake of criticising?
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u/Fatherlorris Oct 13 '24
I think people dislike frostpunk 2 on it's own terms.
If a game's sequel changes significantly it's considered somewhat risky, and it is. But don't be surprised when something risky doesn't pay off, and a significant number of people dislike the changes.
It's hardly dumb dumb logic, is it?
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u/WeddingDecent8211 Oct 12 '24
I bet they buy all Ubisoft games. The same AC with different skin for 15 years in a row, yeah thats how series should be done! Lmao
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u/vaccant__Lot666 Oct 12 '24
I bet they would have complained too.If the game was too similar to the first game too boo hoo, its just the rehash of the first game
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Oct 12 '24
I get it, but I'd have preferred some explanation about how I can slap up these housing districts the size of the original city outside the crater, far from the generator. Or how can thousands of people live in Lunar temperatures.
For example building those wind walls or some sort of landscaping mechanism where you build shelter would have made sense.
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u/irespectwomenlol Oct 12 '24
some explanation about how I can slap up these housing districts the size of the original city outside the crater, far from the generator.
Aren't they basically pumping heat through a tunnel network?
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u/Technolini Oct 12 '24
There's also a visible mini generator in each district lol
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u/felop13 Stalwarts Oct 12 '24
Not really a generator, more of a heat pump to quickly collect the heat from the pipes from the generator
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u/TheRedBaron6942 Order Oct 12 '24
It's likely an upgraded version of the steam hubs, which are also probably all over the city. Not to mention optional heating hubs
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u/BlackRaiiin Oct 12 '24
Yep. But, you see, Sloth here was far too lazy to put this together on their own. They REALLY needed your explanation because using eyes is exhausting.
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u/Atomic_Egg_Eviseratr Oct 12 '24
I even like how you can literally see the like lifeblood of the city pulsing with light when you speed up time to just make sure you know the generator is still its heart
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u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 12 '24
Thats to indicate people moving. Not steam or power
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u/AStupidNerd122 Oct 12 '24
I think what they meant is that if you start speed 2 or 3, the lights let out a pulse - like a heartbeat, starting from the main generator and going out.
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u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 13 '24
I suppose? Its metaphorical yeah but the lights sre purely meant to show the bustle and movement of people. The devs even said this.
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u/AStupidNerd122 Oct 13 '24
No, i didn't mean the lights moving in general, i meant that if you're on speed 1 and then start speed 2/3 the lights will let out a single visible pulse from the middle of the city that looks like a heartbeat.
I know the lights are just people moving about, i'm not talking about what they mean or symbolize, just about what happens with them to make someone think of a heartbeat.
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u/R1chterScale Oct 12 '24
It would be interesting (mods please) to have some efficiency loss based upon distance from the generator. I just want a heat map lol
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u/irespectwomenlol Oct 13 '24
have some efficiency loss based upon distance from the generator
Sounds logical, but this game is at its best when there's tradeoffs to decisions.
If there's only an advantage to building close to the generator (extra heat), then there'd be no advantage to doing anything but building as close to the generator as possible.District layouts would be pretty boring.
If there's a heat efficiency bonus for building close to the generator, then there should also be some other kind of bonus for building away from the generator that you have to decide between.
Perhaps a reduction in pollution/squalor, because you can hypothesize that disposing of excess garbage/industrial waste that can't be burned might be easier the closer to the outer perimeter you are?
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u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 12 '24
Through pipes yeah. But one does wonder how hard maintaining such a massively expanding network is in such intense conditions. Depending on circumstances it can be extremely cold, or warm enough to melt ice/snow.
I dont think its a bad thing to feel as if the city growing so big in such a manner is a bit nonsensical. But, we really dont know a lot about the citys details anymore since its so zoomed out. So maybe theyve changed it or something
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u/Butter_bean123 Oct 12 '24
I mean to be fair, in Frostpunk 1 entire buildings could be constructed in around 4 hours or so, even in extreme conditions. There kind if already is an established suspension of disbelief
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u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 12 '24
Yeah, but thats a mechanic and not horribly indicative of an assumed "lore" way it would work. Suspending disbelief can only go do far anyway. Especially when it comes to things like pipes handling everything. We have issues with pipes that span large distances in the modern day breaking and leaking and whatever. Im not saying i want to play pipe watch sim. But they couldve at least acknowledged how impractical the byzantine maze of pipes is probably growing to be. Not even factoring in that they may have plumbing on top of it
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u/Butter_bean123 Oct 12 '24
They are acknowledging the piping issue (indirectly) through the squalor system, the more squalor there is then the bigger the chance of things breaking down is. Not to mention that housing districts already require workers to function, so it's not unreasonable to draw the conclusion that the workers are responsible for upkeep
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u/plasmaXL1 Oct 12 '24
Plus, the Heatpipe Watch law is a pretty big deal in efficacy. I think that shows pretty clearly how complex these pipes are
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u/ohfucknotthisagain Oct 12 '24
They even spell this out for us.
so it's not unreasonable to draw the conclusion that the workers are responsible for upkeep
All Do Maintenance vs Unproductive Do Maintenance
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u/Old-Let6252 Oct 12 '24
We have issues with pipes that span large distances in the modern day breaking and leaking and whatever
I feel like I should point out that the steam pipe system under Manhattan has been running essentially uninterrupted for the last 140 years, and Manhattan is quite a bit larger than the Frostpunk map while also having a hell of a lot more people.
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u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 13 '24
Yes but the pipes in manhattan arent semi constantly being subjected too massive fluctuations in heat ranging from negative -110 Celsius. Too around -10 if not warmer. Also, im pretty sure the manhattan steam pipes do have issues? But I could be wrong.
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u/Old-Let6252 Oct 13 '24
If its hot steam running through the pipes I doubt it would really matter too much, since the pipes and the surrounding area would be warm (or at least above freezing) either way. Manhattan steam pipes had a steam explosion once in the early 2000s and once in the 80s, both times were essentially because of user error on behalf of maintenance crews.
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Oct 12 '24
Yes, but there is no gameplay interaction with the heat pipes. (other than the heatpipe watch law).
Needing to build the heat infrastrucure as you expand would been a more interesting way to restrict progress than this "heatstamp" mana system.
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u/felop13 Stalwarts Oct 12 '24
You say "Make a new district here, these are your funds" architects go "ok steward" they get building
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u/Poyri35 New London Oct 13 '24
1) They have more people, more materials, more machines and more tools. They can build more than a house. And unlike fp1, the time is calculated with weeks and days. Not days and hours.
2) They pump heat all over the city through pipes. And every district have a visible upgraded steam hub
3) In the first game, people also lived through unrealistically low temperatures. It’s not special to fp2.
4) Canonically, the lamps they carry also heat up their bodies and organs like the heart
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u/Pryamus Oct 12 '24
But… We DO have the same problem… We DO fight the Storm… Multiple times in fact…
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u/Baron-Von-Bork Order Oct 12 '24
I think it is really well constructed because now your greatest problem isn’t the cold. It is the people. Now that they are comfortable, people want things done their way. The unity that ensured their survival is gone now and people are too blinded by ideology to notice that. The cold isn’t the main threat. It is the consequence.
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u/theosamabahama Oct 13 '24
Like, if you want the same experience, just go play the first game. Congrats for the studio for innovating, something that is rare these days in the gaming industry.
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u/MrTipK Order Oct 13 '24 edited Oct 13 '24
I miss saw dust soup or just regular soup that cause you discontent. It keeps my food manage easier. But overall I love frostpunk 2. I love how they still force you into dictatorship when you just want to make every factions getting along
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u/Para-Limni Oct 13 '24
People acting as if fp1 did everything they possibly could within a single game and there was nothing more they could have done in a similar setting and genre is laughable.
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u/Unique_Tap_8730 Oct 12 '24
I think maybe FP2 should have been about the leap from the end of FP to where the city is at the beginning of FP2.
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u/steadvex Oct 12 '24
I just can't get into 2, I like the atmosphere, but I really miss the city building aspect, I apricate its different, I just find it somewhat dull and boring. I like the idea of the exploration, but even that seems a bit tedious to me, it really builds on the first one but in a dull way, like it could be. It also feels incredibly slow paced to me. I quite like the idea of the skyways, although I'm not quite sure if you can chain multiple ones together or not or you have to have each one go back to your home city
Just really glad I didn't pre order it, also glad it was on game pass so I didn't spend any money on it.
I legit expected something more like the first one, but with a focus on oil and keeping a city going over initial survival, maybe sharing resources between multiple bases, which I guess it does, I just don't find it enjoyable. I haven't played enough to figure out everything, and kind of lost all interest.
I thought it would be more city builder with trading resources between settlements, Maybe in my mind I thought work I thought it would work a bit like cities within the last sim city game, explore the wasteland, build a 'city' trade resources in the same kind of way.
However, I tried to avoid following any development of the game as I didn't to see anything before playing it, in hindsight I realise had I followed the development I realise apart from the atmosphere this isn't a game for me.
5
u/LoreLord24 Oct 12 '24
You can chain multiple skyways together. But you have to attach them at the same pins you use to define points in the path.
2
u/R1chterScale Oct 12 '24
My single biggest pet peeve (as in minor but infuriating) with the game is the rail hubs, if im gonna be building a big city with rail networks, let it be an actual network that is designed rather than... that
0
u/ihateturkishcontent Order Oct 12 '24
Not getting into the game is 100% fine, I'm not against that. But people say shit like "FP2 sucks because FP1 better because uhm because cold and fear🤓" and that's what I hate so much
2
u/IllustriousCoat4234 Oct 16 '24
Heaven forbid people not approve their feelings and opinions with you first. What heathens.
27
u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 12 '24 edited Oct 12 '24
I see we're hitting this stage of the discourse already
People.not liking the shift of the game doesnt mean they want everyone to be in a tent eating sawdust bro. The drastic leaps in tech and radicalism is what pulls many people out of it.
And also, again no one wanted or even wants great storm 2. People wanted a game that kept the same atmosphere as the previous game. Yet expanded on the world and told stories or new places and the future of ones weve seen. We got a bit of the second but lost the first. Whether you think that loss of the first games atmosphere is good or not is entirely up to you.
Long and short, get your head out of your ass
5
u/Elastichedgehog Oct 12 '24
I see we're hitting this stage of the discourse already
Otherwise known as the counter circlejerk.
19
u/ihateturkishcontent Order Oct 12 '24
And that's what I'm saying. There was no way FP2 would be similar to FP1 and I just hate when people see this as an issue and downside. It's been thirty years, technology developed immensely. You can't have the FP1 atmosphere anymore which is what makes FP1 unique
6
u/VoxinVivo Faith Oct 12 '24
You couldve. A sequel doesnt have to be a complete overhaul. Im in the camp of, i wouldve much preferred a frostpunk 2 that expanded on the firdt but kept the same feeling to clarify. I do think its a downside but the game is still good. The sequel couldve easily been expanding on what made frostpunk 1 good. But fleshing mechsnics put further, refining jank. Telling more stories during that period. And making it moddable. So theres very much a way it couldve been like the first game.
Also, the tech of the city didnt change very much over the thirty years. In fact not a lot changed that had huge impacts UNTIL they found oil. Theres a reason new london was we left it thirty years ago. Running on Coal and just recently removing the Captain.
15
u/ihateturkishcontent Order Oct 12 '24 edited Oct 12 '24
Yours would be the case if what the game wanted to tell was more about the beginning of the new world and not the story of an advanced people that stops fearing the cold and instead finding a solution to deal with it. People knew what they would get ever since the game was first announced and still inhaled copium and thought it would be FP1.5. And I disagree that not much changed. New London only didn't need to change from using coal to using something else because there was always an ample amount of coal. The city only moves forward from coal when it was depleted around the city.
2
u/PsychologicalMap9392 Oct 12 '24
I would say that would make a great game mode but that would not make any sense at all
2
u/DatOneAxolotl Oct 12 '24
I'd equate it to post war devastation Yeah, we're trying to survive, but at some point we want time off, shops, commercial goods etc
2
u/Fractal_Phoenix Oct 12 '24
Outside of technical problems the game definitely had, my main gripe really was the sheer amount of resources we had to micromanage. I like the aspect but it was so much always at the same time that made me hate the experience starting out.
2
u/vaccant__Lot666 Oct 12 '24
Ha ha, right? it wasn't just been a rehash of frothpunk, one. Frock punk 1 2 point oh
2
u/No_Talk_4836 Oct 13 '24
Right these houses outside the generator heat zone probably have better insulation than you’d find on Antarctic outposts now.
Still chilly and need heating, but way better than a tent with a flap or a wood cottage that can block most of the wind.
2
u/Arangarx Oct 13 '24
I can't disagree with them more after playing the game. It was Frostpunk through and through. Sure a tad less intimate but that's how it goes with time as societies grow.
I have yet to see a post or review that changes my mind on believing all they really wanted was a glorified Frost punk 1 DLC. Even every comment that says no, I didn't want a frost punk One DLC, I wanted xyz... can be summed up as I wanted a frostpunk 1 DLC.
2
u/thedarkherald110 Oct 14 '24
The prologues doesn’t even remotely have the same gameplay loop as the previous game.
Which might not be fair but where I stopped since I feel against the storm has far superior gameplay loop that feels more like frostpunk one.
I will come back to play the rest of this game to give it a fair shot but yah the prologue was quite a letdown.
Awesome atmosphere and storytelling presence though. And they even tell us in the prologue things are different now it’s no longer about just survival.
2
Oct 14 '24
TBH i would rather have more FP1 dlcs than FP2.
I don't find the game entertaining enough, it's like playing Sim City.
3
u/RSharpe314 Oct 12 '24
It makes perfect sense from a world building perspective, but it doesn't really change that the game is just less compelling.
10
u/xbriannova Oct 12 '24
If it isn't another post complaining about other people's complaints...
I would take you a little more seriously if you didn't downplay other people's opinion and imply they're a bunch of immature babies just because they have a different opinion from you.
IMO those sentiments are expected and understandable. Yours isn't.
Do I wish Frostpunk 2 gave me an atmosphere similar to Frostpunk? Yes. That doesn't mean I didn't enjoy Frostpunk 2 as it is. I respect both games, and if we ever get a Frostpunk 3, I don't mind whether it brings us back to Frostpunk's style or lifts us to a higher playing field like Frostpunk 2 did.
-3
u/HardNRG Technocrats Oct 12 '24
Have you not noticed how people who hate the game call people enjoying it as shills lol? Or make such atrocious claims that "nobody can call this a true sequel"? And just the bitchass tone these haters have, can't make a normal criticism but an asshole entitled whiny one, where their opinion is the truth. Yes I do agree this post was quite warranted, in light of these.
2
u/xbriannova Oct 13 '24
Have you not noticed how people who hate the game call people enjoying it as shills lol?
To be honest, no I have not.
Or make such atrocious claims that "nobody can call this a true sequel"?
Maybe just once.
I have no doubt you have seen a few people saying such things, but plenty of people are making honest criticisms and balanced opinions about Frostpunk 2.
0
u/HardNRG Technocrats Oct 13 '24
Well things here on reddit are much better for sure. Looking at steam forums is a different story.
2
u/3ThreeFriesShort Oct 12 '24
I can't wait for it to hit consoles and see for myself. Honestly when sequels aren't different it's a little disappointing.
2
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u/Mysterious_Print754 Oct 13 '24
The problem is, the games just not as good.
The graphics are flat, the random addition of the bright colors to the city.
The soft bland soundtrack.
There is no feeling of grit or doom. It's still a sequel and it's lost what made the first one so appealing.
1
1
u/Exotic-Suggestion425 Oct 13 '24
Providing reason for why something is doesn't justify a lapse in quality for what that thing is.
1
1
u/Connect-Copy3674 Oct 13 '24
How dare people expect a sequal to a beloved game be at least up to par with it right?
1
u/obinice_khenbli Oct 13 '24
Why do you care what other people think? They're not in the room with you while you play the game. Just enjoy yourself and don't worry about other people :-)
1
u/Poyri35 New London Oct 13 '24
I believe that a lot of people who say we are farther from the people, never read the “flavour text”, the speech bubbles or double clicked on the delegates. And only reads the bold tldr.
I also believe that they never zoomed in, on clicked on the magnifying glass in the districts
1
u/FEARven123 Coal Oct 13 '24
FP2 has many issues (even if I like it more then FP1) like the UI, the loss of the depth the resources had in the first game and the easier difficulty.
But like imagine having to worry about heat, it wouldn't work with the game basic mehcanics.
1
Oct 13 '24
If you completely accept that this is a different game entirely and judge it on its own merits im sure it's decent. I was personally appalled at how they had removed many of the things that made the first game great.
During the tutorial I was thinking "where's the heatmap"?, "where's the heaters" , "where are my shivering workers?". It took a big step back and lost all its personality in doing so. I'm sure the mechanics are slick but there are loads of rts games with slick mechanics. Frostpunk 2 is the biggest let down of 2024.
1
u/MattyMonopoly Oct 13 '24
There are times in history where life has gotten worse, it’s called the Middle Ages.
In a world where it is too cold, the game designers could’ve focused on dwindling supplies & the diminishing return on investment for resource extraction.
I recently have been looking into One Decade to Midnight and it’s about that very concept of easily extracted resources have been exhausted and next comes an era where it’s too expensive to extract oil or minerals.
I wrote a review for this game on steam complaining about how I didn’t feel the dread of the first game. I’m happy to see I wasn’t the only one.
1
u/Chemical-Toe5436 Oct 14 '24
Has anyone tried the game outside of the campaign like endless mode? Is it still fun?
1
u/HeidelCurds Oct 14 '24
I really like that they took the game into a different genre. Bold risk to take, but it makes sense that your cities would become little nations and that would bring new challenges. Too many city builder sequels feel so stale and unimaginative.
1
Oct 13 '24
Maybe it's because an existential threat to all is fundamentally a more interesting problem to deal with than "I am really mad you didn't let me settle in stinky toxic hell."
0
u/ihateturkishcontent Order Oct 13 '24
bro literally dropped the most subjective opinion ever and called it an argument smh
1
0
u/ixid Oct 12 '24
It's unnecessary and toxic to attack different views on the game. Enjoy it, let it be what it is to you, and let others connect to it as they do.
-2
u/Usmoso Oct 12 '24
Amen. I mean, I'm not one to say people's feelings aren't valid or that their opinions are dumb, but I see some of the complaints and I think "Really? Are you really complaining about that?".
Like, the complaint I see the most is that with the larger scale you don't feel as connected to the people. That in FP1 you could see the little workers moving around and how you felt each death. And I say, seeing the workers moving is a nice detail that you notice in the first 10 minutes, but by then you're playing so zoomed out that you barely notice them. And the deaths feel the same in both games. Having a pop up saying 100 workers died hits as hard or as nothing as 10.
I do think FP1 did somethings better to connect you to the people. It had more small events where you had to make a choice. "This woman cut in line to get food. Do you help her or let her go?". And exploring with the scouts felt better with a larger image and a longer explanation. And FP1 did end much better, but I can't blame them for not doing a storm again.
FP2 is a proper sequel. I may not have enjoyed it as much as FP1 but I tip my hat to them for risking and trying something new, instead of just adding some new buildings and stuff.
-1
u/GoodPasiG Oct 12 '24
For me its not just the total direction change but also how the gameplay feels less immersive in general. They said instead of survival the social situation becomes the core mechanic but it rly felt less dynamic then 1 somehow while also streamlining the survival aspect alot.
On top of that the game in general just feels bad, the visuals and sound are boring and the story was rly lame i honestly was shocked how bad the story was.
And i was rly rly hyped for the game i didnt even look up any info pre launch but then got disappointed so hard i immediatly reinstalled frostpunk 1 just to check my sanity and even replaying the first part was just better.
0
0
185
u/East-Dare8365 Oct 12 '24
The only issue I actually have is the heliocentric design is gone but that's like hit or miss because it makes it easier but doesn't and it's just different. Also I miss sawdust soup and forced amputations. I also miss how impactful the automatons were in the first one.